5 hours ago, luckyblock token said:

both ways are nonsense and useless

 

Your unsourced and unsubstantiated anti-masking claim notwithstanding, the science and research shows you're wrong:

 

Face mask effectiveness: What science knows now

October 29, 2023

 

"Linsey Marr, a Virginia Tech university professor specializing in aerosol science.

 

"They are very helpful in reducing the chances that the person will get COVID because it's reducing the amount of virus that you would inhale from the air around you," Marr said about masks.

 

No mask is 100% effective. An N95, for example, is named as such because it is at least 95% efficient at blocking airborne particles when used properly. But even if a mask has an 80% efficiency, Marr said, it still offers meaningful protection."

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/face-mask-effectiveness-what-science-knows-now-60-minutes/

 

AND

 

Masks During Pandemics Caused by Respiratory Pathogens—Evidence and Implications for Action

 

October 31, 2023

 

" Well-designed observational studies have demonstrated the association of mask use with reduced transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in community settings, and rigorous evaluations of mask mandates have found substantial protection."

...

Conclusions and Relevance  During the next epidemic or pandemic caused by a respiratory pathogen, decision-makers will need to rely on existing evidence as they implement interventions. High-quality studies have shown that use of face masks in the community is associated with reduced transmission of SARS-CoV-2 and is likely to be an important component of an effective response to a future respiratory threat."

 

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2811136

 

22 hours ago, dinsdale said:

It would seem that the preventative jabs in this case may well have been detrimental to some staying alive and well.

Says who?

Link please.

You're grinding a very old axe here and a bit more substantiation  is necessary, if you can find it.

I suspect it's no more than your personal opinion. Which is fine, but doesn't qualify as fact.

5 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Says who?

Link please.

You're grinding a very old axe here and a bit more substantiation  is necessary, if you can find it.

I suspect it's no more than your personal opinion. Which is fine, but doesn't qualify as fact.

If you haven't yet seen anything on covid-19 vaccine harm you must have your eyes closed.

6 hours ago, luckyblock token said:

both ways are nonsense and useless

Opinions don't qualify as fact unless they are substantiated.

Please do so, if you can find such support from anywhere except the lunatic fringe.

The facts are that this ship sailed long ago and sank quickly.

But carry on anyway, just don't expect rational folks to be impressed with your folk wisdom.

15 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

If you haven't yet seen anything on civid vaccine harm you must have your eyes closed.

 

The documented injuries associated with COVID vaccines -- as opposed to loads of documented false info on the subject spread on the internet -- have been extraordinarily tiny, considering more than 12 BILLION doses have been administered worldwide...

 

The lives saved and illnesses averted, on the other hand, have been huge:

 

COVID vaccines saved 20M lives in 1st year, scientists say

June 24, 2022

 

"Nearly 20 million lives were saved by COVID-19 vaccines during their first year, but even more deaths could have been prevented if international targets for the shots had been reached, researchers reported Thursday.

...

The researchers used data from 185 countries to estimate that vaccines prevented 4.2 million COVID-19 deaths in India, 1.9 million in the United States, 1 million in Brazil, 631,000 in France and 507,000 in the United Kingdom.

 

An additional 600,000 deaths would have been prevented if the World Health Organization target of 40% vaccination coverage by the end of 2021 had been met, according to the study published Thursday in the journal Lancet Infectious Diseases."

 

https://apnews.com/article/covid-science-health-england-54d29ae3af5c700f15d704c14ee224b5

 

 

Just now, dinsdale said:

If you haven't yet seen anything on covid-19 vaccine harm you must have your eyes closed.

If you have seen such evidence it just means that you've fallen prey to confirmation bias. Look it up.

Since I'm sure you have many respected sources that support your statements kindly supply a few.

Consider it a service to the ignorant/blind (such as me) of our community. It can only enhance your standing here. 🤣😏

21 hours ago, RobU said:

The risk may be higher but it is still extremely small hence it is worthwhile taking that risk. More people died from COVID than died from the vaccination 

Really, Can you post me the numbers from some countries that show deaths from covid and with covid deaths?

Just now, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

The documented injuries associated with COVID vaccines have been extraordinarily tiny, considering more than 12 BILLION doses have been administered worldwide...

 

The lives saved and illnesses averted, on the other hand, have been huge:

 

COVID vaccines saved 20M lives in 1st year, scientists say

June 24, 2022

 

"Nearly 20 million lives were saved by COVID-19 vaccines during their first year, but even more deaths could have been prevented if international targets for the shots had been reached, researchers reported Thursday.

...

The researchers used data from 185 countries to estimate that vaccines prevented 4.2 million COVID-19 deaths in India, 1.9 million in the United States, 1 million in Brazil, 631,000 in France and 507,000 in the United Kingdom.

 

An additional 600,000 deaths would have been prevented if the World Health Organization target of 40% vaccination coverage by the end of 2021 had been met, according to the study published Thursday in the journal Lancet Infectious Diseases."

 

https://apnews.com/article/covid-science-health-england-54d29ae3af5c700f15d704c14ee224b5

 

 

Don't confuse us with the facts.

We prefer to believe what we believe. It shows what rugged individuals we are.

 

After all, it's just such defiance in the face of overwhelming evidence that distinguishes us as deep thinkers from the seething masses of sheeple.

A massive point of pride for us.

Just now, Startmeup said:

Really, Can you post me the numbers from some countries that show deaths from covid and with covid deaths?

Typical clarity of reason;

Very persuasive reply.

Thanks so much.

9 minutes ago, Startmeup said:

Really, Can you post me the numbers from some countries that show deaths from covid and with covid deaths?

I don't understand what you are asking for

10 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Typical clarity of reason;

Very persuasive reply.

Thanks so much.

A Pharma company just wants to help everybody be healthy so their shareholders go broke and they can all be out of the job and close their doors.

No vested interested whatsoever.

As the late Charlie Munger always used to say, "show me the incentives and ill show you the outcome"  RIP 

https://denvergazette.com/news/new-zealand-man-who-died-of-gunshot-wound-to-be-recorded-as-covid-19-death/article_f33fe779-8294-5e91-96c6-a5cb00923a5e.html


 

A New Zealand man who died of a gunshot wound is reportedly being tallied as a coronavirus-related death until an investigation is completed.

 

Robert Hart, the 40-year-old who died on Nov. 5 after allegedly being shot in Auckland, tested positive for the coronavirus, according to a report that cited police.


"Health authorities may test a deceased person for COVID-19 if their cause of death is not clear and if there is some concern that COVID-19 may have been involved, for example, where there is a link to a known case, or considering symptoms prior to death," a Ministry of Health spokesperson told the New Zealand Herald. "A deceased person testing positive for COVID-19 may also assist public health officials in identifying close contacts and taking any further action if needed."


 

 

The key to the above report is the phrase at the end of the first paragraph -- "until an investigation is completed."

 

And if you read the ensuing report, you'll see it explains:

 

""We will be now publicly reporting confirmed deaths as those where the death documents or an investigation has shown that the cause was COVID-19, and we will report other deaths where the cause of death is not certain but the person has COVID-19. We will report them separately, and the latter group will be classified as 'under investigation' while we await further information from clinicians or a coroner's follow-up."

 

So, the article doesn't actually report how the man's death was classified in the end at the conclusion of the inquiry.....  But given he died of a gunshot wound, it seems pretty clear that's where the end finding would have gone.

 

 

 

 

12 minutes ago, Startmeup said:

A Pharma company just wants to help everybody be healthy so their shareholders go broke and they can all be out of the job and close their doors.

No vested interested whatsoever.

As the late Charlie Munger always used to say, "show me the incentives and ill show you the outcome"  RIP 

https://denvergazette.com/news/new-zealand-man-who-died-of-gunshot-wound-to-be-recorded-as-covid-19-death/article_f33fe779-8294-5e91-96c6-a5cb00923a5e.html


 

A New Zealand man who died of a gunshot wound is reportedly being tallied as a coronavirus-related death until an investigation is completed.

 

Robert Hart, the 40-year-old who died on Nov. 5 after allegedly being shot in Auckland, tested positive for the coronavirus, according to a report that cited police.


"Health authorities may test a deceased person for COVID-19 if their cause of death is not clear and if there is some concern that COVID-19 may have been involved, for example, where there is a link to a known case, or considering symptoms prior to death," a Ministry of Health spokesperson told the New Zealand Herald. "A deceased person testing positive for COVID-19 may also assist public health officials in identifying close contacts and taking any further action if needed."


 

 

OK. Now I understand your previously incoherent statement.

However, though I have no doubt such mistakes happen, I am even more sure that the vast majority of the people reported to have died from Covid did indeed do so.

In which case you are gagging on gnats. Elevating such isolated cases to relevance adds nothing significant to  the issues; as in 'statistically insignificant'.

I will not be taking any more covid or booster shots now or at any time in the future. I've already had covid and it was no big deal. I'm going to depend on my body's immune system rather than continuing to support Big Pharma, in their quest to earn additional tens of billions of dollars. No thanks. I don't need it. 

If you are fearful of contracting and dying of The Covid Plague - the I urge you - get your shots as frequently as Pfizer and Moderna release them to the public.  "Safe and Effective!"

500 in a population of 60 million is hardly anything to get over excited about and of course the weather has changed so a rise in colds is inevitable.

Regardless of the above report, numerous studies have shown that the actual official counts of deaths due to COVID around the world have been UNDER counted.... not overcounted.

 

Global COVID-19 Death Toll May Be Triple the Reported Deaths

April 19, 2022

 

"More than 3 times as many people may have died around the world due to direct and indirect effects of the COVID-19 pandemic than officially reported, according to an estimate of excess mortality by the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation at the University of Washington."

 

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2791213

 

AND

Actual death figures are likely to be higher than confirmed deaths

"What we know is the number of confirmed deaths due to COVID-19 to date. Limited testing and challenges in the attribution of the cause of death means that the number of confirmed deaths may not be an accurate count of the actual number of deaths from COVID-19."

 

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths

 

 

 

 

29 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I will not be taking any more covid or booster shots now or at any time in the future. I've already had covid and it was no big deal. I'm going to depend on my body's immune system rather than continuing to support Big Pharma, in their quest to earn additional tens of billions of dollars. No thanks. I don't need it. 

 

Proud of you for bravely ignoring the COVID vaccine guidance of virtually every major public health and medical organization around the world...

 

“Given that COVID-19 infections, hospitalizations and deaths continue to impact the U.S. population and an increase in infections is expected this fall and winter, the updated COVID-19 vaccines increase the immune response against the currently circulating variants,” said Sandra Fryhofer, MD, an Atlanta general internist and immediate past chair of the AMA Board of Trustees."

 

https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/updated-covid-19-vaccine-here-what-physicians-need-know

 

 

 

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Your unsourced and unsubstantiated anti-masking claim notwithstanding, the science and research shows you're wrong:

 

Face mask effectiveness: What science knows now

October 29, 2023

 

"Linsey Marr, a Virginia Tech university professor specializing in aerosol science.

 

"They are very helpful in reducing the chances that the person will get COVID because it's reducing the amount of virus that you would inhale from the air around you," Marr said about masks.

 

No mask is 100% effective. An N95, for example, is named as such because it is at least 95% efficient at blocking airborne particles when used properly. But even if a mask has an 80% efficiency, Marr said, it still offers meaningful protection."

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/face-mask-effectiveness-what-science-knows-now-60-minutes/

 

AND

 

Masks During Pandemics Caused by Respiratory Pathogens—Evidence and Implications for Action

 

October 31, 2023

 

" Well-designed observational studies have demonstrated the association of mask use with reduced transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in community settings, and rigorous evaluations of mask mandates have found substantial protection."

...

Conclusions and Relevance  During the next epidemic or pandemic caused by a respiratory pathogen, decision-makers will need to rely on existing evidence as they implement interventions. High-quality studies have shown that use of face masks in the community is associated with reduced transmission of SARS-CoV-2 and is likely to be an important component of an effective response to a future respiratory threat."

 

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2811136

 

The science says masks are all but useless. 70% of the air you breath with a mask comes from the sides of the mask. Only 30% actually goes through the mask.

6 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

The science says masks are all but useless. 70% of the air you breath with a mask comes from the sides of the mask. Only 30% actually goes through the mask.

 

You're talking about cheap drugstore paper masks... not the recommended and proven effective N95 and similar effective masks cited above.

 

The cheap drugstore masks do help prevent people from spreading COVID by catching the particles from someone exhaling/coughing...

 

But the N95 respirator masks, meanwhile, do the same in preventing spread but also are very effective in protecting the wearer from catching the virus by inhaling virus particles, since they provide a mostly air-tight seal around the face.

 

 

1 hour ago, RocketDog said:

If you have seen such evidence it just means that you've fallen prey to confirmation bias. Look it up.

Since I'm sure you have many respected sources that support your statements kindly supply a few.

Consider it a service to the ignorant/blind (such as me) of our community. It can only enhance your standing here. 🤣😏

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-suffolk-63960457

2 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

You're talking about cheap drugstore paper masks... not the recommended and proven effective N95 and similar effective masks cited above.

 

The cheap drugstore masks do help prevent people from spreading COVID by catching the particles from someone exhaling/coughing...

 

But the N95 respirator masks, meanwhile, do the same in preventing spread but also are very effective in protecting the wearer from catching the virus by inhaling virus particles, since they provide a mostly air-tight seal around the face.

 

 

No I am talking about all masks except the very high quality ones surgeons use in Operating theatres and the only reason they use masks is in case there is a blood spurt and to stop saliva being put into the atmosphere. These type of masks are not generally available to the public and if they were would be very expensive.

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

You're talking about cheap drugstore paper masks... not the recommended and proven effective N95 and similar effective masks cited above.

 

The cheap drugstore masks do help prevent people from spreading COVID by catching the particles from someone exhaling/coughing...

 

But the N95 respirator masks, meanwhile, do the same in preventing spread but also are very effective in protecting the wearer from catching the virus by inhaling virus particles, since they provide a mostly air-tight seal around the face.

 

 

I have just answered this question for another poster so I wont repeat it. I will say one thing Sweden did not use masks and their infection rate was very low. If you consider this how much good did masking wearing actually do, apart from the people supplying them who made fortunes out of them.

England and Wales, in the years since COVID vaccines were launched, have recorded a few dozen deaths confirmed as related to COVID vaccination out of tens of millions of doses given there...

 

And the UK did worse than most because of its use of the AZ vaccine, which had rare, unexpected blood clotting problems and ultimately was discontinued in the UK (and never approved in the U.S.)

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/deathscausedbyvaccinesintheukin2023

 

But as balanced against that:

 

"Work by the UK Health Security Agency and the University of Cambridge Medical Research Council Biostatistics Unit suggests that roughly 127,500 deaths were prevented by the Covid vaccination programme in England, up to 24 September 2021."

 

https://fullfact.org/health/covid-vaccines-saved-many-lives/

 

The research and results are clear -- the benefits from and lives saved by COVID vaccines VASTLY dwarfed the very rare instances of deaths or injuries related to vaccination.

 

6 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-suffolk-63960457

Yep,  a guy apparently died from the injection. Some people die from peanut allergies too. Tempest in a teapot. Of course I don't expect you to change your opinion.

 

Note how your linked article ends:

Under-30s in the UK were offered an alternative Covid vaccine to the AstraZeneca jab due to evidence linking it to rare blood clots, from the week after Mr Last was vaccinated.

Cases of clots following vaccination are considered extremely rare. A major UK study said the risk of complications was dwarfed by the risks of the virus itself.

14 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

No I am talking about all masks except the very high quality ones surgeons use in Operating theatres and the only reason they use masks is in case there is a blood spurt and to stop saliva being put into the atmosphere. These type of masks are not generally available to the public and if they were would be very expensive.

 

N95 masks are readily available to the public, not especially expensive, and are far more effective than the routine masks doctors wear in surgery. (Though doctors DO wear N95s when dealing with infectious patients or procedures likely to aerosolize stuff.)

 

The regular surgical masks aren't designed or needed to prevent inhalation of viruses. They're intended, as you note, to protect the wearer against things like blood splatter and also to reduce the risk of the wearer spreading any germs they may have in the operating theater.

 

10 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Yep,  a guy apparently died from the injection. Some people die from peanut allergies too. Tempest in a teapot. Of course I don't expect you to change your opinion.

 

Note how your linked article ends:

Under-30s in the UK were offered an alternative Covid vaccine to the AstraZeneca jab due to evidence linking it to rare blood clots, from the week after Mr Last was vaccinated.

Cases of clots following vaccination are considered extremely rare. A major UK study said the risk of complications was dwarfed by the risks of the virus itself.

You wanted a link I gave you one. The person died as a direct result of the AZ vaccine. If you bother to do some looking yourself there is plenty of evidence of vaccine harm. As for "apparently died" I guess you don't believe the coroner's finding. Maybe you could contact that coroner's office and discuss that with them. As for peanut allergies that is just a rediculous comparison. 

1 minute ago, dinsdale said:

You wanted a link I gave you one. The person died as a direct result of the AZ vaccine. If you bother to do some looking yourself there is plenty of evidence of vaccine harm. As for "apparently died" I guess you don't believe the coroner's finding. Maybe you could contact that coroner's office and discuss that with them. As for peanut allergies that is just a rediculous comparison. 

 

You can find all the one death here and one death there vaccine-related cases the internet can provide... But add them all together, and they don't come up to a fraction of the lives saved by COVID vaccines.

 

COVID vaccines saved at least 1 million lives in Europe, experts estimate

April 18, 2023

 

"COVID-19 vaccination directly saved at least 1,004,927 lives across Europe from December 2020 to March 2023, according to new research presented at the European Congress of Clinical Microbiology & Infectious Diseases (ECCMID) annual meeting this week in Copenhagen, Denmark.

 

The study was based on weekly reported deaths and vaccination doses from 26 countries in Europe collected by the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control."

 

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/covid-19/covid-vaccines-saved-least-1-million-lives-europe-experts-estimate

 

For people in high risk groups, probably a good idea to get vaccinations.

 

For everyone else, highly debatable, especially as long as the current 'vaccines' don't stop you either catching Covid or spreading it.

 

Back to the OP: 800 odd deaths this year. Not very many. Of course every death is a tragedy and all that, but more than 10 times that will die this year of TB here in Thailand and I don't see anyone on AN taking much interest in that. And 15 times more will die on the roads.

 

According to DDC Director-General Dr Tares Krassanairawiwong, Thailand is one of the top 30 countries globally with the highest number of active TB cases. Thailand records some 103,000 new TB cases annually, resulting in about 12,000 TB-related deaths.

https://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news/detail/TCATG230912142257755

 

According to data revealed by ThaiRSC on Friday, road accidents claimed 14,737 lives and injured 924,799 in Thailand last year [2022]. Of them, 536 deaths and 7,885 injuries were foreigners.

https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/general/40023780

 

9 minutes ago, BKKBike09 said:

especially as long as the current 'vaccines' don't stop you either catching Covid or spreading it.

 

The current COVID vaccines REDUCE the likelihood of a vaccinated person contracting the virus and thus spreading the virus... especially in the couple months post-vaccination.

 

But they do a much better job of keeping people out of the hospital with COVID illness, and do so on a more enduring basis.

 

Just like the flu vaccine reduces the risks of catching the flu, but doesn't provide 100% protection.