Buying a condo as a long term rental

[Toby1947]

10 hours ago, mrblonde said:

My plan is to move out to Thailand permanently within the next 4 years, I’m currently 46.  I did have a buy to let flat in the U.K. (in South East) for a few years but the combination of increasing interest rates and the government targeting landlords I chose to sell up.
The way non-paying tenants are so protected in the U.K. was also a genuine concern.

I’m considering buying a couple of condos in Pattaya (outright) to rent out long term.  ROI am looking at 8% in most cases.  
When I move out to Thailand, I’ll move into one of them. 
With the way the West seems to be going, I’d imagine more people wanting to head East as they near retirement, keeping property prices stable (at worst).

 

I’ve seen other posts on here advising the stock market for an income but I have a SIPP and do not want all my future income (my Thailand retirement fund) tied to a potentially turbulent market.
 

are there any things to consider?  Anything to avoid?  

 

Don't do it they're not worth a carrot. Thousand & Thousands up for rental they can't give them away. Old adages never put into Thailand what you can't afford to lose. How to become a millionaire in Thailand start with 5 million 

[Toby1947]

Think your user name should be mrdumblonde 🤣😂

10 hours ago, mrblonde said:

My plan is to move out to Thailand permanently within the next 4 years, I’m currently 46.  I did have a buy to let flat in the U.K. (in South East) for a few years but the combination of increasing interest rates and the government targeting landlords I chose to sell up.
The way non-paying tenants are so protected in the U.K. was also a genuine concern.

I’m considering buying a couple of condos in Pattaya (outright) to rent out long term.  ROI am looking at 8% in most cases.  
When I move out to Thailand, I’ll move into one of them. 
With the way the West seems to be going, I’d imagine more people wanting to head East as they near retirement, keeping property prices stable (at worst).

 

I’ve seen other posts on here advising the stock market for an income but I have a SIPP and do not want all my future income (my Thailand retirement fund) tied to a potentially turbulent market.
 

are there any things to consider?  Anything to avoid?  

 

Don't do it they're not worth a carrot. Thousand & Thousands up for rental they can't give them away. Old adages never put into Thailand what you can't afford to lose. How to become a millionaire in Thailand start with 5 million 

[pomchop]

2 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Those VT6 48m studios are usually around 15k a month, common fees are low hence why they can't afford new lifts, about 500 baht a month. If it's a low floor and or facing Central festival and ACs maybe 10k is possible

I can not imagine finding a vt6 studio for 10 k a month....if it is truly available then it would likely be the worst unit in the building... VT 6 is basically ruled by airbnb types particularly in peak season with six or seven rental agents with offices in the lobby.  I assume VT6 has a hotel license to make all the short term rentals legal though i am not sure.  Also the big empty lot next door is going to be home to two pretty big new  hotel towers ....There is a sign in thai hanging on the fence on beach road with pics of what is to come. 

 

VT6 overall is a good building with a good staff and good maintenance and likely the best overall central location in pattaya.  I notice when all the airbnb types show up the elevator service gets slow and sometimes breaks down as there are a lot more people riding up and down 24/7 then during off season when it is long term residents and overall much more pleasant place to live....IMO owners who rent out daily should have to pay more in HOA fees as their clients turn it into a hotel and a hotel requires more maintenance, more security, more everything than long term residents.  Sooner or later they will have to raise the HOA fee to cover the extra wear and tear.

[JeffersLos]

Other than apartments near universities. You'd be better off buying townhouses, and renting them out longterm to local families.

 

Cheaper up front, easier to get longterm tenants. 

 

If you can find a way to be secure in the ownership. 
Company or usufruct. 

[noobexpat]

11 hours ago, mrblonde said:

 

 

I’ve seen other posts on here advising the stock market for an income but I have a SIPP and do not want all my future income (my Thailand retirement fund) tied to a potentially turbulent market.

 

 

You are 46 and i'm 48 (already here).

Talking about turbulent markets at our age is a bit short-sighted.

You probably don't understand investing very well or know how to generate income.

 

I wouldn't be coming here at 50, as you plan, without sizeable funds.

I bet number 1 reason for expat failure is £££

 

 

[quake]

Op. You should have kept the flat in the uk.

Would always have been,  a bolt hole if this place  or you go down hill.

plus rental income and asset appreciation  you would have got over the long term. 

 

Ps Don't buy condos, unless you want to loose  a lot of money in years to come.

 

 

 

 

[advancebooking]

12 hours ago, mrblonde said:

Anything to avoid?  

Only your proposal to buy 2 condos to rent them out. 8% yield??? Where did you get that from. Probably less than half that. 

 

My opinion is to follow these steps:

1. Register with a crypto exchange and wire funds there

2. Buy BTC, Eth and Solana

3. Buy a trezor hardware wallet and send all crypto to your wallet

4. Wait for 5 yrs and do the reverse to sell and fund back to fiat

[advancebooking]

10 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

What is the rental return on bitcoin ?

150% up in 2023. Best performing asset class actually. Anything else to say on this??

[khunPer]

13 hours ago, mrblonde said:

My plan is to move out to Thailand permanently within the next 4 years, I’m currently 46.  I did have a buy to let flat in the U.K. (in South East) for a few years but the combination of increasing interest rates and the government targeting landlords I chose to sell up.
The way non-paying tenants are so protected in the U.K. was also a genuine concern.

I’m considering buying a couple of condos in Pattaya (outright) to rent out long term.  ROI am looking at 8% in most cases.  
When I move out to Thailand, I’ll move into one of them. 
With the way the West seems to be going, I’d imagine more people wanting to head East as they near retirement, keeping property prices stable (at worst).

 

I’ve seen other posts on here advising the stock market for an income but I have a SIPP and do not want all my future income (my Thailand retirement fund) tied to a potentially turbulent market.
 

are there any things to consider?  Anything to avoid?  

 

If you are making a business with more than one condo, you might need to do it from a Thai company limited. You shall pay tax of the income.

I wouldn't do that, just buy the one condo I need for myself. There are (plenty) of other ways to make an income from savings with lower risk factor risk than property in Thailand, when looked at as an investment.

[CryptoMark]

Crazy idea.

 

1. You won't achieve the rental yield you may be expecting.

 

2. Property managers will not "manage" your property. They will find a tenant (for a fee, usually one month's rent) and collect the rent on your behalf. They will do absolutely nothing else. It's not the same as having a property manager in the west, forget inspections....repairs ect

[kinyara]

If you are sure you want to live here long-term I see nothing wrong with buying your own home, I've always preferred being an owner rather than a renter as I'm in control of my own place.  I rented my own condo out for 4 years when I was on work contracts and got 50% of my purchase price back but that was back when rental prices were double what I could achieve now, less supply and right company client, and my purchase price per sqm for my newly built unit was significantly less than today's market - 30k per sqm compared to 80k-100k per sqm typically these days from what I see.

 

Buying an additional unit to rent is not something I'd recommend these days due to the supply level/rental rate and purchase price balance. I don't think any extra marginal unguaranteed return you might possibly get over safer less hassle investments is worth it. I took advantage of the high interest rates on offer in the summer and locked in cash in fixed rates deposits over 1, 2 and 3 year terms at 6%, I feel I sleep easier at night than if I were in the rental game here.

[AlexRich]

10 hours ago, JeffersLos said:

 

Please go into more detail, with specific bonds. Thanks. 

 

I'd consider a 3 year Post Office Growth Bond at 5%?

 

It is likely that as inflation falls so will interest rates, so this is a decent return over a 3 year period with the guarantee of return of principal. 

 

There are foreign banks that may offer more, but this one feels more secure to me. 

[AlexRich]

6 hours ago, advancebooking said:

150% up in 2023. Best performing asset class actually. Anything else to say on this??

 

That it goes up and down like a whore's drawers? I own a little myself, but it is just fun money for speculation.

[JoseThailand]

13 hours ago, Celsius said:

Just checked view talay 6 out of curiosity.

 

4mil baht condos being rented for 10,000b a month.

 

That is just 3% ROI. Ridiculous 

[Peterw42]

12 hours ago, advancebooking said:

150% up in 2023. Best performing asset class actually. Anything else to say on this??

Maybe you dont know the difference between yield/roi and gain. (the OP is asking about return on investment on real property, not speculative gains on a ponzi scheme).

Its currently up 150% because it was down 200%, so many people are still 50% down, good financial advice, lol.

[ChipButty]

I don't know about Pattaya but here in Phuket condo blocks come out of the ground overnight all I see is a massive over supply who's renting them I don't know. 

There is a project near me and I know people who own units in there, so 7 years ago they were 5.9 million baht very nice units 1 bedroom 57 sqm, I see units for sale 6.3 to 6.5 they cant sell them,

In that same project there is some 2 bedroom units they were 12 million baht, they would be lucky to get 9 million for them,

A good friend of ours owns one unit and she decided to do LTR the tenant brought a cat in, now she cant get rid of the smell so she cant rent it out, look like she might have to take up the floor, expensive job, she's trying to sue the tenants how many years will that take? 

 

[HighPriority]

14 hours ago, advancebooking said:

150% up in 2023. Best performing asset class actually. Anything else to say on this??

Horse 7 in race 4 at Randwick on Saturday 👍🏼

[advancebooking]

8 hours ago, JoseThailand said:

 

That is just 3% ROI. Ridiculous 

Its wrong. its 28k a month at VT6. Check honey coffee shop property management./ 

[JoseThailand]

2 hours ago, advancebooking said:

Its wrong. its 28k a month at VT6. Check honey coffee shop property management./ 

 

Then it's a decent 9%. Not bad

[Hanuman2547]

If you want to buy a condo for you to live in that might be ok.  Make sure it is a newer unit in a desirable location.  Then, if for some reason you have to sell, you MIGHT be able to sell it for near what you paid for it.  As far as buying condos to rent out.  I would advise against it.  Personally, I would just be a renter here in Thailand.  It's much easier and less headache.

[Mark Nothing]

If your objective is the pursuit of pain and low returns then you have found nirvana.

 

Your low rent tenants will feel obligated to  destroy your already depreciating property to get full value of rents paid requiring you to pour more money into the deep black abyss of losses.

 

My recommendation would be to drop your proposal and find a new strategy.

[JimTripper]

56 minutes ago, JoseThailand said:

Then it's a decent 9%. Not bad

Don't forget to deduct a month or two in rent each year off that %. Even if you are lucky to get an annual lease the units typically are vacant between tenants. Even if you get a tenant immediately they rarely move in immediately. Usually they are at another unit and want to move in at the end of the month, that's another month loss.

 

You can also deduct another month every year for agent commissions. So you are up to 2-3 months now in missed payments even with consistent yearly leases and no other issues.

[scubascuba3]

3 hours ago, advancebooking said:

Its wrong. its 28k a month at VT6. Check honey coffee shop property management./ 

28k for what? a friend rents a 48m condo there for 14k a month

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, JoseThailand said:

 

Then it's a decent 9%. Not bad

28k totally wrong for a 48m condo there

[PJ71]

On 1/6/2024 at 7:22 AM, JeffersLos said:

 

Which UK bank is paying 6%?

 

Thanks. 

Bank of scotland pays about 5.5%.

[yankee99]

From my experience 5% roi is realistic

[Paris333]

Millions of Chinese have been investing in the real estate market for many years. The constantly rising prices for apartments have attracted them and led to apartments being bought with the knowledge that they can later be resold at a higher price. These speculations gave real estate developers a boom - which has become a boomerang. The government also had the hot real estate industry on its radar and curbed lending out of fear of overheating.   Suddenly the real estate developers no longer received as much money or as steadily - which caused their model to falter. Current projects could no longer be financed with fresh money. This left invoices unpaid and projects not completed. The hype was broken and the cracks in the structure became visible

 

The Secret behind China's Ghost Cities

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/6/2024 at 11:36 AM, DrJack54 said:

Crazy idea. 

You beat me to it. Seems like another newbie to LOS wearing the saffron glasses and no idea of reality in LOS.

He's better off keeping the money and using it to finance a pleasant life in LOS.

[thaibeachlovers]

I had a quick look through the thread and it seems that it's universally a very bad idea that the OP has.

Will he take the advice offered, or just do it anyway? If he does that he'll be joining a very long list of guys that ended up older and wiser, but poorer.

[newnative]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I had a quick look through the thread and it seems that it's universally a very bad idea that the OP has.

Will he take the advice offered, or just do it anyway? If he does that he'll be joining a very long list of guys that ended up older and wiser, but poorer.

     But, on the bright side, if they bought a property in Thailand they always had a roof they owned over their heads, come what may, as long as they paid the condo fees and utiities.  Not a bad thing if one is planning to be here for the duration. 

    The last condo my spouse and I owned, in a higher-end project, had fairly high condo fees of about 5000 baht a month and our electric and water was, I don't think, ever more than 3000 baht.  So, around 8,000 baht a month, or less.  About $229 American dollars.  Very cheap to be living in a very nice ocean-front condo in Pattaya.