Where to hold and manage funds UK - Thailand?

[noobexpat]

53 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

 What is to stop you transferring an amount of GBP to Wise and keeping it there until you may want to transfer some of it to your Thai bank account. I am not saying it is the best thing to do, it would depend on your own circumstances. Wise handles all sorts of foreign money.

 

1 hour ago, Chivas said:

Yes you can

 

Yes i see the value now that Chivas has confirmed you can.

 

[Stocky]

6 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Well, your post suggested that HSBC in the UK may be doing something untoward that HSBC Sing isn't

I was suggesting nothing of the sort, just highlighting the fact that de-banking in the UK is a possibility; something banking in Singapore obviates. 

[NoshowJones]

29 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What protection does Wise give to deposited funds?

That's a good question, and I would need an answer before I deposit anything.

[dayo202]

5 hours ago, helloagain said:

Don't forget starting 1st Jan 2024 if you here for 180 days you become a tax resident and pay thai tax next year on what you send here. Google it.

All speculation at the moment, nobody really knows 

[Liverpool Lou]

5 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

36 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What protection does Wise give to deposited funds?

That's a good question, and I would need an answer before I deposit anything.

Yet you suggested it to the OP!

[NoshowJones]

7 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Yet you suggested it to the OP!

So what?? Suggesting and recommending something are two different things. I suggested it because In all my years dealing with Wise I have always had good service. Is this you back to your old self trying to stir up problems where none exist.

[DrJoy]

22 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

Sure, but inside 12 months the rates will be fairly similar.

Getting free interest without even moving your finger, isnt it good?

Singaporean, British banks are far more stable than Thai banks

[Liverpool Lou]

6 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

19 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Yet you suggested it to the OP!

So what?? Suggesting and recommending something are two different things. I suggested it because In all my years dealing with Wise I have always had good service. Is this you back to your old self trying to stir up problems where none exist.

"...back to your old self trying to stir up problems where none exist".

Suggesting to the OP that putting funds in an entity that does not provide any deposit protection  isn't exactly suggesting something that couldn't have problems.

 

"Suggesting and recommending something are two different things.  I suggested it because In all my years dealing with Wise I have always had good service".

Dealing with Wise's money transfer services and depositing large amounts unprotected are two different things also. 

[Liverpool Lou]

6 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

Singaporean, British banks are far more stable than Thai banks

Really?  What do you base that on, I'm guessing that you must have something empirical?

[Mike Lister]

12 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

Getting free interest without even moving your finger, isnt it good?

Singaporean, British banks are far more stable than Thai banks

Interest rates are only one part of the picture, they change and can equalise very quickly. The other part of the picture is the exchange rate. Being able to get 5% interest on Sterling savings in the UK is pointless if the exchange rate changes in the meantime and wipes out that 5% and then some. I personally would go for currency appreciation over daily interest rates, every time. GBP/THB has traded in the range of 38 to 45 in recent years, it can be very volatile at times. That range represents a 15% movement whereas the interest rate premium on the UK vs Thailand is only 5.25% minus 2.5% of 3% net.

 

Also, bank stability doesn't really feature in the equation, neither sets of banks are even close to failure.

[noobexpat]

24 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"...back to your old self trying to stir up problems where none exist".

Suggesting to the OP that putting funds in an entity that does not provide any deposit protection 

 

A google search tells you.

Also tells you why they don't have FSCS like uk bank accounts.

Why not explain the pro's and con's ...if you understand the differences.

Implying its either good or bad is showing little understanding.

 

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, noobexpat said:

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

...back to your old self trying to stir up problems where none exist".

Suggesting to the OP that putting funds in an entity that does not provide any deposit protection 

 

A google search tells you.  

Also tells you why they don't have FSCS like uk bank accounts.

Why not explain the pro's and con's ...if you understand the differences.

Implying its either good or bad is showing little understanding.

A Google search tells me what...that Wise offers no deposit protection?  I already know that. 

I don't need to explain the pros and cons of Wise offering no deposit protection but maybe you could come up with just one "pro" for depositing large amounts with no protection when there are perfectly acceptable alternatives with deposit protection?  Your implying that that could be anything but a bad idea confirms your lack of understanding of the specific subject to which I was responding.

[khunPer]

On 2/27/2024 at 7:58 AM, mja1906 said:

For an older couple planning to permanently move from UK to Thailand, what is the best way to manage money between UK and Thailand? I don't think holding large sums in a Thai bank account is a good idea. I think holding just enough for living here (and a bit extra maybe), then holding the rest in a UK or other bank account is a safer idea. Any suggestions of where to hold remaining funds? They plan to use an HSBC online account, but prefer to diversify and have another account they can access money from.  Also, they might buy a condo so would need to transfer a lump sum for that. Thanks !

My advise would be to hold some level of funds in Thailand for both easy access and avoiding currency exchange rate fluctuation. A safe possibility is a "rainy day" 12-month fixed account – funds can be withdrawn without notice, but with loss of interest for the last 12-month period – up to 1 million baht in bank deposit is guaranteed by the government. You can have accounts in more than one bank. Some security money should always be places in a normal extra savings account, preferably with an ATM-card, for easy access in case of emergency; keep it apart for the daily transaction-bank account – where for example retirement pension or whatever other income flows to – so you don't mix up the funds.

 

Another possibility for deposit funds in Thailand is so-called "fund books", which many, if not most, banks offer. It's mutual funds with numerous possibilities. Selecting "fixed income funds" is pretty safe. They are normally accumulating, which means that the interest/outcome is added to the value. When in need of capital you sell out whatever needed. Cash will be available within one to three bank days in the associated savings bank account. There is no loss of interest, as the fund are accumulating. I've been using that in several years for both safety-fund and other long-term savings, for example for the next car or coming major property maintenance. In general the gain is a tiny bit higher than interest from a 12-month fixed account.

 

Investment in the Thai stock market is a bit different story. It's my experience that the Thai stocks lives a bit of their own life, but still partly follows international trend. They are mainly dividend paying stock rather than accumulating value. The dividends however, can easily be in the four to six percent level, or even higher, and with only 10 percent withholding tax it's quite good. Furthermore, you avoid currency exchange rate fluctuation. Capital gains from SET-listed (SET = Stock Exchange of Thailand) stock are income tax free. I have some funds invested in the Thai stock market, but would name is a more risky zone, mainly because it's for a forreigner more difficult to know and follow the game.

 

Investing in one's home country – my major funds savings are in mu home country – has the benefit that you knows better what's going on, than in the Thai stock market. For Western countries the investment also mainly follows the World market and it's sectors. Also in  case of returning to one's home country – for whatever reason – there are some safe fund there. It can of course also be in an offshore account a safe place. The only downside is currency exchange rate fluctuation. Most countries have a Double Taxation Agreement (DTA) with Thailand, including taxation of stock dividends.

 

Any fund transferred into Thailand that are not covered by an DTA or savings from before 1st January 2024, might be eligible for Thai income taxation.

[Stocky]

1 hour ago, Mike Lister said:

Interest rates are only one part of the picture, they change and can equalise very quickly. The other part of the picture is the exchange rate.

Very true.

The Singapore Dollar has appreciated some 20% against the Thai Baht since 2020, which has more than compensated for price rises in Thailand during the same period.

[noobexpat]

4 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

A Google search tells me what...that Wise offers no deposit protection?  I already know that. 

I don't need to explain the pros and cons of Wise offering no deposit protection but maybe you could come up with just one "pro" for depositing large amounts with no protection when there are perfectly acceptable alternatives with deposit protection?  Your implying that that could be anything but a bad idea confirms your lack of understanding of the specific subject to which I was responding.

 

If you understood the difference between a platform and a bank then you would realise why deposit protection isn't an issue.

 

You only know the label, not the how or the why.

As mentioned, problem hunting, where there isn't one 🙄

[Mike Lister]

5 minutes ago, Stocky said:

Very true.

The Singapore Dollar has appreciated some 20% against the Thai Baht since 2020, which has more than compensated for price rises in Thailand during the same period.

That's because SGD is pegged against a basket of currencies  which will include USD.

[Bangkok Barry]

I find the HSBC Singapore idea interesting. There is no sign of HSBC disowning me in the UK despite them knowing I am no longer a UK resident, probably due to 'grandfathering' as I've had the account for many decades. But, if they did, how easy or otherwise is it to open an account with them in Singapore? Minimum deposit and so on.

[Stocky]

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Minimum deposit and so on.

Depends on the type of account.

I have a HSBC Premier account which requires I maintain a minimum total balance of SGD200,000 across all my savings and investment accounts. But if you already have a Premier account in the UK you can simply open an account in Singapore, no need for an additional minimum balance in Singapore. Requirements to open an account are pretty standard, passport and proof of address, details of income and a tax number.

 

 

[DrJoy]

21 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Really?  What do you base that on, I'm guessing that you must have something empirical?

Last month I checked Singapore was a developed country with a stable government and an economy.

 

Their national bank DBS has been awarded the title of the safest Bank in Asia.

 

Never seen such awards and accolades given to a Thai bank

 

 

See here -

 

International Wealth Management by Asia’s safest bank

 

Established and headquartered in Singapore — Asia’s leading financial hub — DBS Bank is a leader in Asian wealth management, and Singapore’s largest bank. DBS Bank’s ‘AA-’ and ‘Aa2’ credit ratings are among the highest in the world. Coupled with Singapore’s strong financial infrastructure, strong governance and stable economic climate make it an ideal place to grow your investments from.

 

 

https://www.dbs.com/internationalbanking/index.html

 

 

Share the link which shows any Thai Bank having such stable ratings

[DrJoy]

21 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

I personally would go for currency appreciation

Best of Luck

[Liverpool Lou]

6 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

21 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Really?  What do you base that on, I'm guessing that you must have something empirical?

Last month I checked Singapore was a developed country with a stable government and an economy.

 

Their national bank DBS has been awarded the title of the safest Bank in Asia.

You claimed that "Singaporean banks" (i.e. no exceptions) are safer but only referenced one Singaporean bank and that one, DBS, was not the Singaporean bank that was being recommended!

Which Thai banks are you suggesting are unstable or unsafe?

[Phulublub]

On 2/28/2024 at 9:05 AM, helloagain said:

Don't forget starting 1st Jan 2024 if you here for 180 days you become a tax resident and pay thai tax next year on what you send here. Google it.

You MAY have to pay SOME tax, depending on a huge number of variables.  Your statement is dangerously wide of the mark.

 

PH

[helloagain]

On 2/27/2024 at 1:58 PM, mja1906 said:

For an older couple planning to permanently move from UK to Thailand, what is the best way to manage money between UK and Thailand? I don't think holding large sums in a Thai bank account is a good idea. I think holding just enough for living here (and a bit extra maybe), then holding the rest in a UK or other bank account is a safer idea. Any suggestions of where to hold remaining funds? They plan to use an HSBC online account, but prefer to diversify and have another account they can access money from.  Also, they might buy a condo so would need to transfer a lump sum for that. Thanks !

In 20 years I have no problem with Halifax. Or offshore Skipton Gurnesey .

[rickudon]

There are just too many factors to take into account which would be best. Depends on the age of the couple, visa type, how much money or other assets they have, and Inheritance could be an issue, depending in which country the beneficiary/executor lives. I split mine about 50/50. Also, as many have found out, do not burn your boats, keep your options open.

[Celsius]

On 2/28/2024 at 2:40 AM, Mike Lister said:

Interest rates are only one part of the picture, they change and can equalise very quickly. The other part of the picture is the exchange rate. Being able to get 5% interest on Sterling savings in the UK is pointless if the exchange rate changes in the meantime and wipes out that 5% and then some. I personally would go for currency appreciation over daily interest rates, every time. GBP/THB has traded in the range of 38 to 45 in recent years, it can be very volatile at times. That range represents a 15% movement whereas the interest rate premium on the UK vs Thailand is only 5.25% minus 2.5% of 3% net.

 

Also, bank stability doesn't really feature in the equation, neither sets of banks are even close to failure.

 

yeah but no. I will take my 5% interest rate in Canada paid monthly over currency speculation game.

 

Thai baht appreciated in the last 10 years so there is very little room for it to go up.

[Celsius]

On 2/29/2024 at 12:15 AM, Liverpool Lou said:

You claimed that "Singaporean banks" (i.e. no exceptions) are safer but only referenced one Singaporean bank and that one, DBS, was not the Singaporean bank that was being recommended!

Which Thai banks are you suggesting are unstable or unsafe?

 

all of them

[Mike Lister]

8 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

yeah but no. I will take my 5% interest rate in Canada paid monthly over currency speculation game.

 

Thai baht appreciated in the last 10 years so there is very little room for it to go up.

The charts say different:

 

 

https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=THB&to=CAD&view=10Y

[Liverpool Lou]

8 minutes ago, Celsius said:

On 2/29/2024 at 12:15 PM, Liverpool Lou said:

Which Thai banks are you suggesting are unstable or unsafe?

 

all of them

Based on what...anything rational?

[Mike Lister]

10 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

all of them

Nonsense!

 

Thai banks are capitalised to Basel III rules which is more than some western banks are!

 

Plus BOT has classified four Thai banks as systemically vital to Thailand, as s such they will never be allowed to fail.

[Celsius]

13 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

Nonsense!

 

Thai banks are capitalised to Basel III rules which is more than some western banks are!

 

Plus BOT has classified four Thai banks as systemically vital to Thailand, as s such they will never be allowed to fail.

 

I am not talking about bank failures which will of course be saved at the expense of taxpayer just like everywhere else.

 

I am talking about foreigners holding Thai bank accounts having zero rights in this country.

 

I will never forget the ordeal with SCB simply because my Farang passport number changed from the one they had on file.  Bet not many know about this "rule".

 

Coming forward there might be endless KYC's a Farang mug will have if no work permit for the "privilege" of the precious but worthless Thai bank account.