Thai-China high-speed rail set to boost ASEAN connectivity

[connda]

5 hours ago, Kaopad999 said:

A high speed train in Thailand... 🙃
What could possibly go wrong.. 

Now - imagine a train going 200 kph.  'Nuff said.

[Trip Hop]

8 hours ago, connda said:

Already have while checking out the other numbers.  $200M/km.  They have a lot of "brother-in-laws" to feed in the UK too it seems.

 

Nope, just a load of tree huggers, ecologists and environmentalists to keep happy plus OTT compensation to those affected.  Then there's the contractors that appear to be treating it like an open cheque book with specifications that make you feel like we've all been doing it wrong for the last 40 years and maybe longer.

 

Plus I ain't cheap you know!

[josephbloggs]

49 minutes ago, borderhopper2005 said:

July 23, 2011, Chinese High Speed Train disaster took place.

That accident is named Wenzhou train collision.  And it claimed over 200 lives. 

 

 

 

 

After that case, the government of China said death toll is no more than 35. And promptly buries the whole site including the doomed train.

I can imagine the similar can  happen in Thailand in the future if they introduce Chinese bullet train.

Thai State Rail is struggling to maintain their existing railroad. How can you expect they can handle more complicated  faster trains better?

I certainly will not ride such a suicide toy...

Wenzhou train collision - Wikipedia

"Suicide toy". Dude, that accident happened 13 years ago. How many fatal HSR accidents since? Zero. And this despite the fact that China has more HSR lines (45,000kms) then every single country in the world combined - and by some margin; China has more than two thirds of all the global HSR. 

In fact China is clearly one of the safest high speed railways in the world by accidents vs distance travelled. Try reading about it, you would be impressed. Or try riding on it - you'd be immensely impressed (although I am sure you wouldn't admit it).

[paul1804]

I firmly believe china only does things that will benefit china mostly at the partners expense, Thailand will get shafted!

Also hard to believe that the interconnecting 7.3 km link will cost over USD 400M per kilometer, someone is going to get very rich!

[kickstart]

As has been said that is a lot of money for a 7.3 km stretch ,is that a typo??? AI again.

[NorthernRyland]

4 hours ago, sandyf said:

What about the good old days in Thailand when over 12% of the population were Chinese. Today it is estimated that approximately 40% of the Thai  population have Chinese ancestry.

Whatever the Chinese were going to do to Thailand has already been done, but of coarse McCarthy never really died, the legacy lives on.

BTW I was on the HST last year, very comfortable and efficient. Unlike the UK, Chinese trains sell seats rather than just passage.

you're comparing the average Chinese of today with the historical population in Thailand? Spend some more time around Chinese and tell me how similar they are to Thai people.

[john donson]

who profits from this the most ?  10% to grease the wheels?

[Mr Meeseeks]

6 hours ago, Gknrd said:

Yeah, I was there for 6 months. Drove the whole country of Laos. The good old days are gone for good.  China invaded Laos and took over the whole country without firing a shot. Laos is a good example of what they do to very poor countries that do not know any better. 

 

Cambodia same same.

[jojothai]

8 hours ago, Burma Bill said:

 

Maybe this will be the new section of HST from Vientianne to Nong Khai over a new Mekong Bridge? Linking up with the HST at Korat will be many, many years away.

You seem to know a bit more than the writers of the article. I do not know what section of HSR they are referring to.
There was adjustment of a 7.9 km section in Nakhon Ratchasima. Maybe they are confused.
The bridge is not expected to be complete until 2029.
If allowed on the forum, Refer to 
https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/general/2699271/agency-predicts-completion-of-railway-bridge-by-2029
The 250 km section from Bangkok to Nakhon Ratchasima is well under construction and with the many delays is now expected to be complete in 2028.
IMHO that is not unrealistic now, after so much delay. 
The section from Nakhon Ratchasima to Nong Khai is being designed and likely to be a few years later.
Hua Hin? Supposed to be another few years. Just a guessing game.

[jojothai]

8 hours ago, Srikcir said:

But a good deal for China as it loaned the funds to Thailand at higher than Sovereign interest rate to build the rail line.

As far as I am aware Thailand would not agree to loan terms from China and the potential debt trap, and it is Thai financing.
Well done Thailand.

[jojothai]

7 hours ago, trainman34014 said:

2028 ?   The 'Feasiblity Studies' wlll still be going on by then as they only started ten years ago !

The MOU was ten years ago. After the many studies before that. Things do take an eternity, TIT.

[jojothai]

6 hours ago, Gweiloman said:

This will be good for ASEAN countries, especially when the whole network is completed, connecting all the way down through Malaysia into Singapore. This will really open up trade and tourism for all these countries, especially since China has granted visa exempt status for both Malaysian and Thai citizens.

Not in the near future. The first line will have taken nearly 10 years. Give it 20 to 30 years perhaps?

[spidermike007]

Everybody here is commenting on the political aspects of this, but nobody is really getting the heart of the issue and that is that Thailand is desperately behind when it comes to high speed transport and alternatives to the ridiculously choked highways. They have been ignoring the transport of cargo for 70 years and as a result a highways are chock full of trucks of all sizes blocking all the lanes all day long, so this train is desperately needed and so are significant other lines throughout Thailand.

 

The real question is how are they going to accomplish construction when the Rama 2 project is taking 15 years and is less than a third of the way completed.  

[kwilco]

14 hours ago, Geoffggi said:

Roughly translated into "All the better to flood your markets with substandard Chinese goods" .................LOL

It's far more subtle or insidious than that. Chinese goods are not substandard - however it is all prt of. mega program to spread Chinese influence over S.E.Asia and further. 

THey are making inroads into all aspects of their neighbours lives - industry, communication and even universities and academia. the averge Jo in the west or even Thailand just hasn't a clue to the extent of this infiltration.

 

People who go on about "substandard goods" and the "collapsing" Chinese economy hve got entirely th erong end of the stick. THeir goods are as good as or better than the west's and the economy in the end will be so big it will completely ignore the west.

Edited March 25 by kwilco

[NoDisplayName]

15 hours ago, webfact said:

The project committee is especially keen on accelerating the 7.3-kilometre stretch, estimated to cost around US$3 billion.

 

I'd be keen, too!!!

 

The entire 1000-km from Kunming to Vientianne cost US$6 billion.

[NoDisplayName]

14 hours ago, connda said:

$411M USD per kilometer?  That's a whole bunch of rich "brother-in-laws."

Doing an internet search, HSR ranges from $17-30M in China, $24M in France, and $27M in Spain.¹ 
Thailand?  $$$Cha-Ching$$$

Source:

¹ Lowyinstitute.org

 

Holy kwai, man!

 

That's double the cost of California's high-speed rail!

[NoDisplayName]

5 hours ago, borderhopper2005 said:

July 23, 2011, Chinese High Speed Train disaster took place.

That accident is named Wenzhou train collision.  And it claimed over 200 lives. 

 

 

 

 

After that case, the government of China said death toll is no more than 35. And promptly buries the whole site including the doomed train.

I can imagine the similar can  happen in Thailand in the future if they introduce Chinese bullet train.

Thai State Rail is struggling to maintain their existing railroad. How can you expect they can handle more complicated  faster trains better?

I certainly will not ride such a suicide toy...

Wenzhou train collision - Wikipedia

 

Oh, no!  A train accident 13 years ago?

 

Not for me, thank you very much.  I'ma stick with good old Boeing!

 

[Deserted]

I think he's leaving out important details isn't he? Don't the Thais have to give up some of their land also?

[Peterphuket]

21 hours ago, dyertribe said:

This is the perfect way for China to quickly move tanks, equipment and troops through South East Asia once they fire the starting gun.

I think the only two who gives 'sad' reaction's must be or chinese people or not aware of the dangers

[Peterphuket]

9 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Everybody here is commenting on the political aspects of this, but nobody is really getting the heart of the issue and that is that Thailand is desperately behind when it comes to high speed transport and alternatives to the ridiculously choked highways. They have been ignoring the transport of cargo for 70 years and as a result a highways are chock full of trucks of all sizes blocking all the lanes all day long, so this train is desperately needed and so are significant other lines throughout Thailand.

 

The real question is how are they going to accomplish construction when the Rama 2 project is taking 15 years and is less than a third of the way completed.  

Totally agree that they are years behind in that but why does it always have to be the Chinese, for example the Japanese are the best in the world if you are talking about high-speed trains.

[borderhopper2005]

7 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Oh, no!  A train accident 13 years ago?

 

Not for me, thank you very much.  I'ma stick with good old Boeing!

 

You are also saying that you won't use that Chinese super express LOL.

[borderhopper2005]

11 hours ago, josephbloggs said:

"Suicide toy". Dude, that accident happened 13 years ago. How many fatal HSR accidents since? Zero. And this despite the fact that China has more HSR lines (45,000kms) then every single country in the world combined - and by some margin; China has more than two thirds of all the global HSR. 

In fact China is clearly one of the safest high speed railways in the world by accidents vs distance travelled. Try reading about it, you would be impressed. Or try riding on it - you'd be immensely impressed (although I am sure you wouldn't admit it).

Good to remember one  thing:

In China, information flow is strictly under the govt's control. Anything that does not suits the interest of the ruling Communist Party will be or can be covered up. Easy going might be nice. But if you blindly believe their press release is more reliable than the west, I call it rather naive.

[bamnutsak]

6 minutes ago, borderhopper2005 said:

Good to remember one  thing:

In China, information flow is strictly under the govt's control.

 

Interesting article about the crash...

 

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2012/10/22/boss-rail

 

[Kaopad999]

12 hours ago, connda said:

Now - imagine a train going 200 kph.  'Nuff said.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Bangkok

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Bangkok

 

 

 

 

LMFAO 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[Kaopad999]

16 hours ago, sandyf said:

I didn't realise Pattaya was on the route from Kumning to Singapore.

Learn something new every day.

No, that's part of the special 'Kumning" to Pattaya' Monger express line.. 

[borderhopper2005]

10 hours ago, jojothai said:

the potential debt trap

A good word to describe the way Chinese Communist Party steals other countries' sovereignty. When the 3rd World borrowers cannot repay the money they owed, China technically annexes part of their territory (especially the infrastructure they build in their 'partner' nations). Just like a creditor takes away debtor's valuables.

[dyertribe]

1 hour ago, Peterphuket said:

I think the only two who gives 'sad' reaction's must be or chinese people or not aware of the dangers

People have forgotten the gift from the Russian Government to Afghanistan (A beautiful Super Highway) that was then used in 1979 to invade the country ...  Being able to move troops quickly is vital.

[sandyf]

11 hours ago, NorthernRyland said:

you're comparing the average Chinese of today with the historical population in Thailand? Spend some more time around Chinese and tell me how similar they are to Thai people.

Comparing in what way, are you trying to say the Sino-Thai have no influence on how Thailand is run?

Probably not, for you and many others it will all be about social behaviour, in some distorted belief that your own nation behave impeccably wherever they go.

I have been to China a couple times and accept the fact that as an isolated nation they have developed their own social etiquette which they find perfectly acceptable. It is not to my taste but only the arrogant and racist would condemn their way of life.

 

[sandyf]

4 minutes ago, dyertribe said:

 Being able to move troops quickly is vital.

Why the US has a presence all over the world.

[Sydebolle]

The Lao government gave the green light in 2016 for their high-speed train on an uncharted territory as Laos never had a train system before. The Chinese dug hundreds of tunnels and constructed hundreds of bridges in order to open the link from the Lao-Chinese border in Boten to the Lao-Thai border in Vientiane. 2016 they said, it would be running on 2 December 2021 - in line with the Lao National Day. 

Guess what, the train rolled on 2 December 2021 and since then proved a flawless operation. If the former Thai government - self-assigned since 2014 - would have started then as well, the train link would have been finished in 2021 as well and Bangkok would be connected by rail to the rest of the world. This did not happen and lukewarm excuses came, as the self-elected government finally got out in 2023. The Thai terrain is much easier without all those hinderances of tunnels and bridges - but there was no will. 

Now they finally had to give in and listen to the marching orders from Beijing; I guess the train might run by the end of this decade, unless a political bumper is thrown in - for good measure!