Called at the Chonburi Taxation office

[Delight]

This office is located in Jomtien.

Just called in for information 

The 1st stage is to obtain a TIN (Taxation Identity  Number)

 

For this copies of passport entries are required plus a TM30

 

English -it seems is not spoken here.

 

 

[billd766]

3 hours ago, Delight said:

This office is located in Jomtien.

Just called in for information 

The 1st stage is to obtain a TIN (Taxation Identity  Number)

 

For this copies of passport entries are required plus a TM30

 

English -it seems is not spoken here.

 

 

I went to the tax office in Kamphaeng Phet yesterday with my Thai wife on a similar task.

 

That office said to come back after January 1st with a 12 month bank statement and they coud proceed from there.

 

As my wife did all the talking, I have no idea if they speak English.

[Stocky]

I got my TIN from the Hat Yai revenue office today. They were somewhat confused when I didn't have a work permit. After some explaining and about 15 minutes of the clerk looking on the internet, I got a nod of the head and my application was processed. I submitted a completed application form, copy of passport ID page and current extension, plus a copy of the TM30. Friendly office, no queues, no English spoken.

[topt]

7 hours ago, Delight said:

English -it seems is not spoken here.

 

Used to be very limited when I last went 4/5 years ago but some could certainly speak and understand enough to get things done.

Was a more confident English speaker in the back office on the 4th Floor where I had to go once to confirm no income before they would process my tax withholding reclaim.

 

[Moonlover]

I'm waiting, with baited breath to hear how many others are rushing to TRD offices around the country.

 

This taxation business came up, for the very first time on a local forum up here in NE Issan last week. Nobody knew anything about it! So I'm guessing there won't be a stampede around here.

 

Edited Wednesday at 11:17 AM by Moonlover

[DrJoy]

3 hours ago, billd766 said:

I have no idea if they speak English

They dont.

Just speak English so fast, they will start <deleted>tin their pants, they will forget about the tax

[Jingthing]

Just for laughs, perhaps organize a super fun FLASH MOB where tens of thousands of local non -Thai speaking retired folks (do not bring Thai parners!), many in wheelchairs, some wheezing and coughing (no masks), all in beach wear, the vast majority will end up owing no tax anyway, to show up on one special day to demand their TINs! When they make it clear they don't speak English -- no promlema -- speak English MUCH LOUDER. Make incoherent hand gestures. Be sure the press including the INTERNATIONAL PRESS is notified. Good idea?

Edited Wednesday at 11:24 AM by Jingthing

[billd766]

3 hours ago, Moonlover said:

I'm waiting, with baited breath to hear how many others are rushing to TRD offices around the country.

 

This taxation business came up, for the very first time on a local forum up here in NE Issan last week. Nobody knew anything about it! So I'm guessing there won't be a stampede around here.

 

I first read about it on AN months ago when Mike Lister first started the thread.

[CallumWK]

I have dealt with the Jomtien revenue office for a few years already, to claim back withholding taxes and other things.

My documents for claim back withholding taxes are filled in by the staff on the ground floor, and on other occasions I had to go to the legal department and the department that handles the returns, both are located on the 4th floor.
I have always been served in English. Same for the tax revenue office in the Amphur Banglamung building, they speak English

[Celsius]

Can you imagine a Chinese or Russian posting something like this? He would be shot on the spot.

[Jingthing]

For the record, for those of us who are tax resident, don't work here or have a business in Thailand, who haven't filed a tax return before in Thailand, I personally think it's a massive folly and basically asking for trouble to go out of your way to get into the tax system here by applying for a TIN at this time.

At a later date, perhaps years from now, things might be different but that's my opinion for NOW and yes I know that many people will vehemently disagree with me. 

Edited Wednesday at 04:07 PM by Jingthing

[JimTripper]

Fuk 'em. Lay low until you are forced to go in. That way at least you will have the satisfaction of knowing they are doing something right.

Edited Wednesday at 04:12 PM by JimTripper

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, JimTripper said:

Fuk 'em. Lay low until you are forced to go in. That way at least you will have the satisfaction of knowing they are doing something right.

I'm taking that as a kind of sarcasm.

[Moonlover]

11 hours ago, billd766 said:

I first read about it on AN months ago when Mike Lister first started the thread.

 I also first heard about it on AN (or was it TVF back then?) It came up in an article in the Thai Enquirer which included the sentence:

 

'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

This was dismissed by the afore said as ML not being an official statement and so the rumour perpetuated. In the 14 months since that was published, I haven't read one single article that contradicts that sentence, so AFAIC the taxing of us pensioners is still an unsubstantiated rumour.

 

I agree with with earlier posters such as @Jingthing. Stay well away from TRD offices and tax advisers who are seeking to plunder your hard earned retirement pots.

 

Thai Enquirer September 18, 2023

[NanLaew]

20 hours ago, billd766 said:

I went to the tax office in Kamphaeng Phet yesterday with my Thai wife on a similar task.

 

That office said to come back after January 1st with a 12 month bank statement and they coud proceed from there.

 

As my wife did all the talking, I have no idea if they speak English.

 

Similar to Udon Thani except they insisted all paperwork be completed and filed in their office and the TIN would be issued after their assessment and only if any tax owed was paid. If no tax was owed then no TIN would be issued.

 

20 hours ago, Stocky said:

I got my TIN from the Hat Yai revenue office today. They were somewhat confused when I didn't have a work permit. After some explaining and about 15 minutes of the clerk looking on the internet, I got a nod of the head and my application was processed. I submitted a completed application form, copy of passport ID page and current extension, plus a copy of the TM30. Friendly office, no queues, no English spoken.

 

So they had to look at the internet before being able to do what they're trained and paid to do. At least they issued the TIN. Well done.

[garygooner]

As always ...  different offices, different responses.  

[Delight]

13 hours ago, Jingthing said:

For the record, for those of us who are tax resident, don't work here or have a business in Thailand, who haven't filed a tax return before in Thailand, I personally think it's a massive folly and basically asking for trouble to go out of your way to get into the tax system here by applying for a TIN at this time.

At a later date, perhaps years from now, things might be different but that's my opinion for NOW and yes I know that many people will vehemently disagree with me. 

The problem with that approach is that they may prosecute me>

[Jingthing]

17 minutes ago, Delight said:

The problem with that approach is that they may prosecute me>

I might be struck by lightning.

[NanLaew]

14 hours ago, Jingthing said:

For the record, for those of us who are tax resident, don't work here or have a business in Thailand, who haven't filed a tax return before in Thailand, I personally think it's a massive folly and basically asking for trouble to go out of your way to get into the tax system here by applying for a TIN at this time.

At a later date, perhaps years from now, things might be different but that's my opinion for NOW and yes I know that many people will vehemently disagree with me. 

 

For the record, I am married and living but not working in Thailand.

 

My UK offshore bank requires me to prove that I am non-UK tax domiciled by presenting them with a TIN from the revenue department of the country where I claim I am domiciled. The reality of "I am not liable for taxation anywhere" is no longer an option and results in the account being either 'resticted' or closed.

 

The UK offshore bank's KYC (know your customer) regulations are driven by their requirment to comply with the edicts of the US banking industry while Thailand's latest tax grab is driven by their wish to become a full member of the OECD.

 

Catch 22

[Jingthing]

22 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

For the record, I am married and living but not working in Thailand.

 

My UK offshore bank requires me to prove that I am non-UK tax domiciled by presenting them with a TIN from the revenue department of the country where I claim I am domiciled. The reality of "I am not liable for taxation anywhere" is no longer an option and results in the account being either 'resticted' or closed.

 

The UK offshore bank's KYC (know your customer) regulations are driven by their requirment to comply with the edicts of the US banking industry while Thailand's latest tax grab is driven by their wish to become a full member of the OECD.

 

Catch 22

Yes, that would obviously be a reason to get a Thai TIN.

[The Cyclist]

21 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

The UK offshore bank's KYC (know your customer) regulations are driven by their requirment to comply with the edicts of the US banking industry while Thailand's latest tax grab is driven by their wish to become a full member of the OECD.

 

You can still see from the comments above. too many people have no idea where or why this is coming, or where it is  being driven from.

[Captain Flack]

An off topic debate about crypto has been removed. This topic is ‘Called at the Chonburi Taxation office’ 

[anrcaccount]

3 hours ago, NanLaew said:

 

For the record, I am married and living but not working in Thailand.

 

My UK offshore bank requires me to prove that I am non-UK tax domiciled by presenting them with a TIN from the revenue department of the country where I claim I am domiciled. The reality of "I am not liable for taxation anywhere" is no longer an option and results in the account being either 'resticted' or closed.

 

The UK offshore bank's KYC (know your customer) regulations are driven by their requirment to comply with the edicts of the US banking industry while Thailand's latest tax grab is driven by their wish to become a full member of the OECD.

 

Catch 22

 

Not really a Catch 22 , just standard banking KYC. There are multiple ways to approach this. Let me give you 3: 

 

• You can get a TIN ( agents start at 3000 THB for the service or you can try yourself) , and then provide it to your UK offshore Bank. That doesn't mean you need to pay any tax in Thailand, nor that you are liable for any tax. 
• You can give your UK offshore bank any 13 digit number as your TIN. They will not do any validation on it. I'm not recommending this, but I do believe it would be possible, and IMO would be no further questions asked.
• Some foreign banks will also accept 'Am tax resident but do not yet have a Tax number'. Yours may not, but many do. 

 

[Neeranam]

23 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Just for laughs, perhaps organize a super fun FLASH MOB where tens of thousands of local non -Thai speaking retired folks (do not bring Thai parners!), many in wheelchairs, some wheezing and coughing (no masks), all in beach wear, the vast majority will end up owing no tax anyway, to show up on one special day to demand their TINs! When they make it clear they don't speak English -- no promlema -- speak English MUCH LOUDER. Make incoherent hand gestures. Be sure the press including the INTERNATIONAL PRESS is notified. Good idea?

Good idea, and remember to wear wife beaters and sit with legs crossed, pointing the sole to the officers, this is what they hate the most. orput feet on a table.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Good idea, and remember to wear wife beaters and sit with legs crossed, pointing the sole to the officers, this is what they hate the most. orput feet on a table.

Great input but I would draw the line at showing some sack. 

[Pattaya57]

1 hour ago, anrcaccount said:

 

• Some foreign banks will also accept 'Am tax resident but do not yet have a Tax number'. Yours may not, but many do. 

Just to add to this, my friend just switched to being non-resident for tax in Australia. When asked for a TIN he just said he's retired and has no income in Thailand so does not need to be a tax resident of Thailand. His 3 Australian banks all accepted no Thailand TIN required

 

Edited yesterday at 11:36 AM by Pattaya57

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, anrcaccount said:

 

Not really a Catch 22 , just standard banking KYC. There are multiple ways to approach this. Let me give you 3: 

 

• You can get a TIN ( agents start at 3000 THB for the service or you can try yourself) , and then provide it to your UK offshore Bank. That doesn't mean you need to pay any tax in Thailand, nor that you are liable for any tax. 
• You can give your UK offshore bank any 13 digit number as your TIN. They will not do any validation on it. I'm not recommending this, but I do believe it would be possible, and IMO would be no further questions asked.
• Some foreign banks will also accept 'Am tax resident but do not yet have a Tax number'. Yours may not, but many do. 

 

Or use WISE as a bank. 

[The Cyclist]

21 minutes ago, Pattaya57 said:

When asked for a TIN he just said he's retired and has no income in Thailand so does not need to be a tax resident of Thailand.

 

Having no income in Thailand is a red herring, and your friend doesn't get to decide his tax residency.

 

Staying in Thailand for 180 days or more in a tax year makes him a tax resident.

 

Whether he needs a TIN, and file tax returns, will depend on the income he remits to Thailand during any years that he is a tax resident of Thailand.

[0ffshore360]

15 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

 

Having no income in Thailand is a red herring, and your friend doesn't get to decide his tax residency.

 

Staying in Thailand for 180 days or more in a tax year makes him a tax resident.

 

Whether he needs a TIN, and file tax returns, will depend on the income he remits to Thailand during any years that he is a tax resident of Thailand.

Not a red herring !

If  staying in Thailand 180 or more days in a tax year  and remitting funds  that are  taxed at source exempts the need for tax residency declaration. It is only extraneous income that will be of interest to both ends of a DTR .

Immigration systems  may be poorly integrated  but integrated financial systems are constantly being upgraded.

Homicides attract less penalty than tax evasion !

[The Cyclist]

28 minutes ago, 0ffshore360 said:

Not a red herring !

If  staying in Thailand 180 or more days in a tax year 

 

Then you are a tax resident of Thailand.

 

What happens after that regarding income depends on various factors.

 

So as far as Tax Residency goes, income is a red herring.