So Long And Thanks For All The Fish - Ukraine bombs Russian Nuclear Bombers

[ExpatOilWorker]

1 hour ago, jas007 said:

Didn't Putin suspend their agreement a few years ago? 

Nope, that was INF (Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty). Russia violated the agreement and the US withdrew in 2019.

[dinsdale]

36 minutes ago, BLMFem said:

"It won't change what's happening on the ground. Jets hit aren't frontline bombers/attack bombers."

Wrong. See attached reply from ChatGPT where I asked it "Were the strategic bombers that Ukraine just attacked used by the Russians in the war against Ukraine?"

 

[BLMFem]

2 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

Sooo predictable. You've been heading downhill for a while now, buddy. I wish you the best of luck with your recovery!

[jas007]

9 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

Nope, that was INF (Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty). Russia violated the agreement and the US withdrew in 2019.

I just looked it up. From Perplexity:

 

Vladimir Putin suspended Russia’s participation in the New START treaty on February 21, 2023, during his Presidential Address to the Federal Assembly. He announced that Russia would no longer allow the United States and NATO to inspect its nuclear facilities, citing concerns over U.S. development of new nuclear weapons and NATO’s involvement in Ukraine. Putin also criticized the treaty for not covering French and British nuclear weapons.

 

Following the suspension announcement, Russia initially stated it would continue to adhere to the treaty’s warhead limits but later ceased the notification process related to missile launches under the treaty by the end of March 2023. The suspension marked a significant setback for nuclear arms control between the U.S. and Russia, as New START was the last remaining treaty limiting their strategic nuclear arsenals.

[dinsdale]

7 minutes ago, BLMFem said:

Sooo predictable. You've been heading downhill for a while now, buddy. I wish you the best of luck with your recovery!

If you have to ask ChatGPT about what's going on in this war well that's up to you. Why don't you ask ChatGPT if this will change the direction of the war. Take a screen shot an post it.

[frank83628]

7 hours ago, Mavideol said:

did you include yourself 

I can't see the comment, so no idea

[tomazbodner]

23 hours ago, frank83628 said:

I challenge all the war mongers here to my gym, for a Putin is bad sparring session

IS that going to be Putin style?

 

You're Ukraine, visitors are Russia. A gang comes in with batons, knives and guns, but you are only allowed to use fists and rubber bands, and if anyone gives you a rock, he's accused of prolonging the conflict?

[BLMFem]

1 minute ago, dinsdale said:

If you have to ask ChatGPT about what's going on in this war well that's up to you. Why don't you ask ChatGPT if this will change the direction of the war. Take a screen shot an post it.

You would do well to use ChatGPT or any other source of information to get updated on the facts so you could have avoided al that albumen on your face. You got owned, but instead of taking it like a grown-up you deflect and back-pedal, thereby making an even bigger fool of yourself. Now run along and get cleaned up.

[dinsdale]

2 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

USA and Russia don’t park their strategic bombers like this out of complacency. This is a requirement of the Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty (New START), which was signed in 2010 between USA and Russia and extends to 4th February 2026. The treaty demands both parties base ALL deployed strategic bombers equipped for nuclear armament at air bases where they are visible to National Technical Means of verification (satellite surveillance). No hangers, no nets. This is so the strategic deterrent systems can be counted and verified, by each counterparty

100% correct. It would seem though ECM wasn't in place. They will be now.

[BLMFem]

4 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

100% correct. It would seem though ECM wasn't in place. They will be now.

Wrong. Vladimir Putin suspended Russia’s participation in the New START treaty on February 21, 2023.

[liddelljohn]

Until Putin dies there is zero chance of any peace in Ukraine or an end to the proxy attacks all over Europe ,, we need to give Ukraine  better longer range weapons  so they can shower the kremlin with explosions 

[jas007]

1 hour ago, bubblegum said:

Wow and you get all this info straight from... huuuhhh?

 

I got all this information from my brain. I've been to school. 

 

In another thread on April 30, in a conversation with Dinsdale, I tried to explain how diplomacy is important and why, in the context of game theory.  If you can find that thread, go back in read it.  Maybe I made more sense that day. 

 

"It absolutely does matter. The point is that the last thing the world needs is a destabilized situation in that part of the world.  MAD only makes sense if both "players"  possess an equal ability to attack and destroy the other. 

Do some research on game theory and why and how MAD works. 

In game theory, MAD is a situation where the only way to win is to not play the game. Correct? 

But, once the situation is destabilized by the introduction of short and intermediate range missiles close to Russia's western border and to critical parts of their early warning systems, that would give the West an advantage and make war more likely.  In other words, it would be stupid to create such a situation in the first place.  MAD needs a level playing field to be effective.   And so yes, it really does matter where missiles are placed."

[gamb00ler]

On 6/1/2025 at 8:42 PM, frank83628 said:

I challenge all the war mongers here to my gym, for a Putin is bad sparring session

 

12 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

IS that going to be Putin style?

 

You're Ukraine, visitors are Russia. A gang comes in with batons, knives and guns, but you are only allowed to use fists and rubber bands, and if anyone gives you a rock, he's accused of prolonging the conflict?

Watch out... he'll have either polonium-20 or novichok on his gloves!

[dinsdale]

1 minute ago, BLMFem said:

You would do well to use ChatGPT or any other source of information to get updated on the facts so you could have avoided al that albumen on your face. You got owned, but instead of taking it like a grown-up you deflect and back-pedal, thereby making an even bigger fool of yourself. Now run along and get cleaned up.

Got owned.  Grow up mate. Again this will not make any difference.

[frank83628]

5 minutes ago, liddelljohn said:

Until Putin dies there is zero chance of any peace in Ukraine or an end to the proxy attacks all over Europe ,, we need to give Ukraine  better longer range weapons  so they can shower the kremlin with explosions 

All over Europe...jeez, youre brainwashing is top level

[BLMFem]

3 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

Got owned.  Grow up mate. Again this will not make any difference.

Oh, so you're down to this not making any difference now.

Absolute textbook example of  starting with a bang, ending with a whimper - well done!👍

 

[connda]

Under treaties signed during the SALT (Strategic Arms Limitation Talks) and START (Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty) both the US and Russia must keep their strategic bombers outside and viewable from satellites. But now that Ukraine, probably via guidance by their NATO handlers, decided to destroy those planes - this is going to add a whole new dimension to those treaties as they currently stand.  Which in turn makes the chance of nuclear war just that more probably.  Why?  If Peter can play that game, so can Paul.  And now that the genie is out of the bottle and the use of drones loaded into a semi-container rig, well, my guess is that's the new game in town.  And considering that the US strategic nuclear bombers are sitting on their runways too.  See why this was a stupid idea.  <AN war mongers cheer and rejoice>  "The Ruskies Got A Bloody Nose, Hee Hee Hee."  

No you fools - the entire world just became that much closer to nuclear war.  

Even at my somewhat advanced age, I fully expect to be around when the first nukes fly.  And the last.  I find the idiocy of you fools cheering this insanity onwards to simply be like cheering for your own suicide.  Ya'll really are morons.  

"But the Ruskies Got A Bloody Nose, Hee Hee Hee."  

Just keep repeating that when you see that big, white flash.  Your collective attitudes are beyond stupid. I'll tell ya'll something.  Ukraine isn't worth a nuclear war, or a world war, or even a regional war.  

 

 

[Jingthing]

21 minutes ago, liddelljohn said:

Until Putin dies there is zero chance of any peace in Ukraine or an end to the proxy attacks all over Europe ,, we need to give Ukraine  better longer range weapons  so they can shower the kremlin with explosions 

Yes, Putin won't even can't even EVER agree to an end to this war short of Russian victory or total surrender by Ukraine. Why? Because this is existential for Putin the man. An end of this war short of MAXIMALIST Russian goals would be Putin's end as the leader and more than likely end as a living man. People that fail to get this basic fact really have no credibility in commenting on this war.  To be clear, it wouldn't necessarily need to mean Russia literally taking over all of Ukraine. A situation where they could install a puppet would be fine, perhaps arguably even preferable. Putin will never offer any kind of "deal" short of positioning Russia to do at least that.

 

As far as "peace talks" in Istanbul or Timbuktu for that matter, that is all a show to please the moronic Putin poodle Trump in which only minor agreements are even possible, such as prisoner exchanges. etc. Those minor things are worth doing of course but people don't delude yourselves that there is any space for actual substantive agreement between the two sides!

[Dan O]

11 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

Of course, it was a cowardly attack with drones. More like a terrorist attack.

 

The usual sneaky underhand terrorism Ukraine excels in.

But its ok for russia to launch missile strikes into cities in Ukraine?   You probably think Ukraine started this war too right?

 

You avoided answering the question again. I suspect we already know where you stand on this issue

 

[jas007]

2 minutes ago, connda said:

Under treaties signed during the SALT (Strategic Arms Limitation Talks) both the US and Russia must keep their strategic bombers outside and viewable from satellites. But now that Ukraine, probably via guidance by their NATO handlers, decided to destroy those planes - this is going to add a whole new dimension to those treaties as they currently stand.  Which in turn makes the chance of nuclear war just that more probably.  Why?  If Peter can play that game, so can Paul.  And now that the genie is out of the bottle and the use of drones loaded into a semi-container rig, well, my guess is that's the new game in town.  And considering that the US strategic nuclear bombers are sitting on their runways too.  See why this was a stupid idea.  <AN war mongers cheer and rejoice>  "The Ruskies Got A Bloody Nose, Hee Hee Hee."  

No you fools - the entire world just became that much closer to nuclear war.  

Even at my somewhat advanced age, I fully expect to be around when the first nukes fly.  And the last.  I find the idiocy of you fools cheering this insanity onwards to simply be like cheering for your own suicide.  Ya'll really are morons.  

"But the Ruskies Got A Bloody Nose, Hee Hee Hee."  

Just keep repeating that when you see that big, white flash.  Your collective attitudes are beyond stupid. I'll tell ya'll something.  Ukraine isn't worth a nuclear war, or a world war, or even a regional war.  

 

 

I agree in part.  As I've previously indicated, Putin suspended Russia's participation the New Start Treaty s few yers ago. So I suppose the US is no longer legally obligated.  In any event, you're otherwise absolutely correct.

 

People cheering on this war and its escalation apparently have no clue what's been done or why it matters.  And they certainly don't understand the ramifications of a global thermonuclear war.  They can''t stay in their bunkers forever. 

[freedomnow]

14 minutes ago, connda said:

that big, white flash

in Pattaya Soi 6.

 

Ground zero.

 

The retirees will have to become gogo dancers once their inbound pensions are no more.

[connda]

10 minutes ago, jas007 said:

I agree in part.  As I've previously indicated, Putin suspended Russia's participation the New Start Treaty s few yers ago. So I suppose the US is no longer legally obligated.  In any event, you're otherwise absolutely correct.

 

People cheering on this war and its escalation apparently have no clue what's been done or why it matters.  And they certainly don't understand the ramifications of a global thermonuclear war.  They can''t stay in their bunkers forever. 

"Russia has not formally withdrawn from the New Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty (New START) but announced its suspension of participation on February 21, 2023. President Vladimir Putin stated that Russia would pause its involvement, citing geopolitical tensions and U.S. actions, though the country clarified it would continue to adhere to the treaty’s numerical limits on deployed strategic nuclear warheads (1,550), deployed delivery systems (700), and deployed and non-deployed launchers (800). The suspension followed months of delays and cancellations of inspections and meetings of the Bilateral Consultative Commission, with Russia refusing U.S. access to its strategic facilities. The U.S. State Department had already declared Russia non-compliant on January 31, 2023, due to these refusals. While the suspension complicates verification and dialogue, Russia has not indicated plans to exceed treaty limits or fully exit the agreement, which remains in force until February 5, 2026."

[jas007]

2 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

in Pattaya Soi 6.

 

Ground zero.

 

The retirees will have to become gogo dancers once their inbound pensions are no more.

Surely you jest.  A global thermonuclear war would pretty much end the world as we know it.  Some people really don't need their pension money, but the world certainly needs a functioning grid, a functional internet and someway to transfer money around.  And yet the banking system would be kaput.  

[Yellowtail]

6 minutes ago, jas007 said:

Surely you jest.  A global thermonuclear war would pretty much end the world as we know it.  Some people really don't need their pension money, but the world certainly needs a functioning grid, a functional internet and someway to transfer money around.  And yet the banking system would be kaput.  

The left has already ended the world as I knew it. 

[Cameroni]

27 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

An end of this war short of MAXIMALIST Russian goals would be Putin's end as the leader and more than likely end as a living man. People that fail to get this basic fact really have no credibility in commenting on this war.  To be clear, it wouldn't necessarily need to mean Russia literally taking over all of Ukraine.

 

Ludicrous nonsense.  Russia never had the goal to take "over all of Ukraine". It is neither wanted nor desired. Nor would it even be possible..

 

Far too melodramtaic an assessment, and plain false.

[jas007]

9 minutes ago, connda said:

"Russia has not formally withdrawn from the New Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty (New START) but announced its suspension of participation on February 21, 2023. President Vladimir Putin stated that Russia would pause its involvement, citing geopolitical tensions and U.S. actions, though the country clarified it would continue to adhere to the treaty’s numerical limits on deployed strategic nuclear warheads (1,550), deployed delivery systems (700), and deployed and non-deployed launchers (800). The suspension followed months of delays and cancellations of inspections and meetings of the Bilateral Consultative Commission, with Russia refusing U.S. access to its strategic facilities. The U.S. State Department had already declared Russia non-compliant on January 31, 2023, due to these refusals. While the suspension complicates verification and dialogue, Russia has not indicated plans to exceed treaty limits or fully exit the agreement, which remains in force until February 5, 2026."

Yes, both the US and Russia may be legally bound by the terms of the New Salt Treaty, but Russia has a different point of view.

 

Agin, from Perplexity:

 

"Russia’s suspension of the New START Treaty is widely regarded as legally invalid for several reasons rooted in the treaty’s text, international law, and historical precedent:
 

1. Absence of Suspension Provisions in the Treaty
The New START Treaty contains no clause permitting suspension . Article XIV outlines a formal withdrawal process requiring written notice and a six-month waiting period, which Russia has not invoked . By unilaterally suspending participation without following these procedures, Russia violated the treaty’s explicit terms.
 

2. Misapplication of the Vienna Convention
Russia justified its suspension under Article 62 of the Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties (VCLT), which allows suspension due to a “fundamental change of circumstances” . However:
    •    U.S. support for Ukraine does not constitute a “fundamental change” affecting the treaty’s obligations, as arms control is distinct from geopolitical conflicts .
    •    Article 62 cannot be invoked if the suspending party has breached other international obligations (e.g., Russia’s aggression against Ukraine) .
 

3. Continued Treaty Obligations
Suspension does not terminate obligations. Under the VCLT’s Article 72, parties must refrain from acts obstructing the treaty’s resumption . Russia’s refusal to facilitate inspections, share data, or attend consultative meetings directly violates New START’s requirements (Articles VII, IX, and Part Four of the protocol) . The U.S. State Department has documented these violations, confirming Russia’s noncompliance .
 

4. International and Expert Consensus
    •    The U.S. and arms control experts, including treaty negotiators like Rose Gottemoeller, unanimously reject Russia’s suspension as “irresponsible and unlawful” .
    •    Russia’s similar suspension of the Conventional Forces in Europe Treaty (CFE) in 2007 faced comparable legal challenges, establishing a pattern of invalid treaty actions .
 

5. U.S. Countermeasures
While the U.S. has halted data exchanges and inspections in response, these are proportionate countermeasures under international law, not a withdrawal . The U.S. maintains compliance with the treaty’s central limits and remains open to resuming full implementation if Russia returns to compliance .
 

Conclusion
Russia’s suspension lacks legal validity under both New START and the VCLT. Its actions are widely viewed as a politically motivated maneuver to gain leverage, rather than a justified legal step . Until Russia formally withdraws or the treaty expires in 2026, it remains bound by its obligations."

 

Sounds to me like Russia has indicated plans "to exceed treaty limits..." 

 

In any event, ask yourself this:  if you were in charge of the US Air Force and the strategic defense assets of the USA, would you continue to park your bombers and other attack aircraft in nice little rows in the middle of a field somewhere, simply because a treaty that Russia is illegally violating requires it?  Or would you recommend that the United States act in its own best interest?  Do you think adherence to recognized treaty legalities trump the act of self-preservation?   And let's not forget who's in the White House these days.

 

It's a real mess.  

 

 

[3NUMBAS]

Just like the SAS  in ww2 wiping out German airfields at little cost except themselv

[3NUMBAS]

Russia can’t replace their tanks ,all devices are being reduced ,inc ships and planes and T300 and 400 being rendered obsolete against F 35s ,so it’s good news 

[freedomnow]

1 hour ago, jas007 said:

Surely you jest.  A global thermonuclear war would pretty much end the world as we know it.  Some people really don't need their pension money, but the world certainly needs a functioning grid, a functional internet and someway to transfer money around.  And yet the banking system would be kaput.  

Yes, believe it or not, I did not actually think 70-year-olds retirees would be working in pattaya gogo bars after a nuclear exchange to replace their pensions.............................................................

 

 

[bannork]