39 minutes ago, Somjot said:

Only in your eyes.

It isn´t even your fault. This agenda has been etched in your mind since childhood. You probably even don´t realize the horrible double standard you are applying.

Maybe you should have someone neutral, whom you trust, read your and @JBChiangRai ´s posts and open your eyes, given they can still be opened.

Seriously, if this is the way the majority of Israelis think, contemplate and judge, they really are doomed to be in armed conflicts forever.

Better in armed conflict than wiped out.

56 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Better in armed conflict than wiped out.

That's exactly the point. There are no people on earth who want to live peacefully than the Jews of Israel, but they have had armed conflict forced on them. If the Arab nations would recognize Israel as the homeland of the world's Jews and allow it to exist in peace, there would be no armed conflict involving Israel.

7 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

He would like to go and visit you .

When can he visit you ?

I volunteer at the local synagogue 1 to 5pm, so anytime after that.

29 minutes ago, Evil Penevil said:

That's exactly the point. There are no people on earth who want to live peacefully than the Jews of Israel, but they have had armed conflict forced on them. If the Arab nations would recognize Israel as the homeland of the world's Jews and allow it to exist in peace, there would be no armed conflict involving Israel.

The Israel demonizers would like to see Israel wiped out such as the fashionable bozo here who says Jews don't deserve" a country. 50 Muslim ones no problem. One tiny Jewish one. Not deserved

Edited May 10May 10 by Jingthing

4 hours ago, Somjot said:

Only in your eyes.

It isn´t even your fault. This agenda has been etched in your mind since childhood. You probably even don´t realize the horrible double standard you are applying.

Seriously, if this is the way the majority of Israelis think, contemplate and judge, they really are doomed to be in armed conflicts forever.

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Better in armed conflict than wiped out.

Thanks for proving my point.

You are only capable of seeing 2 alternatives: kill and steal land or be wiped out.

That is the agenda you have been brainwashed with since childhood.

That plus your horrible double standard seeing Palestinians lesser than stray dogs has turned your army into a genocidal monster, raping detainees, killing unarmed men, women and even intentionally executing children while still believing they are acting morally.

Same as most Israelis support all that and really think of themselves as the most peace loving people on the planet.

Here you go:

2 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

That's exactly the point. There are no people on earth who want to live peacefully than the Jews of Israel, but they have had armed conflict forced on them.

I am sorry but after all I have seen in last 2,5 years this comment of you just sounds like a disgusting and cynical mockery of your victims.

You want the Arabs to accept Israel then maybe you should give back the occupied lands and start seeing them as human beeings equal to you and stop raping and massacring Palestinians while stealing their land as you do right now.

And no, there are no different interpretations of to whom that land belongs. Judea and Samaria have existed Millenia ago and are gone and no legal argument to claim that land.

The UN gave you a huge chunk of land. The Arabs and the Palestinians have clearly stated they would accept an Israel in the pre ´67 borders, but you won´t give back what you stole, keep on stealing and call it self-defense.

No country was condemned by the UN as many times as Israel, that should tell you something.

THAT and that you seem to get away with every crime, no matter how horrible, while the West is protecting you and covering your crimes by silencing and sanctioning every journalist, who dares to write about your doings are the reason for Anti-semitism and not some inherited unexplainable unprovoked hate towards Jews, as you prefer to tell people.

4 minutes ago, Somjot said:

Thanks for proving my point.

You are only capable of seeing 2 alternatives: kill and steal land or be wiped out.

That is the agenda you have been brainwashed with since childhood.

That plus your horrible double standard seeing Palestinians lesser than stray dogs has turned your army into a genocidal monster, raping detainees, killing unarmed men, women and even intentionally executing children while still believing they are acting morally.

Same as most Israelis support all that and really think of themselves as the most peace loving people on the planet.

Here you go:

I am sorry but after all I have seen in last 2,5 years this comment of you just sounds like a disgusting and cynical mockery of your victims.

You want the Arabs to accept Israel then maybe you should give back the occupied lands and start seeing them as human beeings equal to you and stop raping and massacring Palestinians while stealing their land as you do right now.

And no, there are no different interpretations of to whom that land belongs. Judea and Samaria have existed Millenia ago and are gone and no legal argument to claim that land.

The UN gave you a huge chunk of land. The Arabs and the Palestinians have clearly stated they would accept an Israel in the pre ´67 borders, but you won´t give back what you stole, keep on stealing and call it self-defense.

No country was condemned by the UN as many times as Israel, that should tell you something.

THAT and that you seem to get away with every crime, no matter how horrible, while the West is protecting you and covering your crimes by silencing and sanctioning every journalist, who dares to write about your doings are the reason for Anti-semitism and not some inherited unexplainable unprovoked hate towards Jews, as you prefer to tell people.

Straw man garbage.

9 hours ago, Somjot said:

To translate your post: "Palestinians never accepted the presence of those who murdered them and stole their land and they don´t accept it now, that´s the reason for the conflict"

9 hours ago, Somjot said:

Maybe you should have someone neutral, whom you trust, read your and @JBChiangRai ´s posts and open your eyes, given they can still be opened.

@Nick Carter icp

I asked you the Palestinians do what they do, and all you could do was describe what they do, waffle and deflect.

In the first quote above, Somjot gives the true answer. Open your eyes and look at the history of the entire conflict. It didn't start in 2023.

5 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

@Nick Carter icp

I asked you the Palestinians do what they do, and all you could do was describe what they do, waffle and deflect.

In the first quote above, Somjot gives the true answer. Open your eyes and look at the history of the entire conflict. It didn't start in 2023.

The answer is because they want an Islamic Palestinian state to replace the Jewish Israeli state .

That is the answer to your question .

Its not waffle or deflection .

14 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

@Nick Carter icp

I asked you the Palestinians do what they do, and all you could do was describe what they do, waffle and deflect.

In the first quote above, Somjot gives the true answer. Open your eyes and look at the history of the entire conflict. It didn't start in 2023.

Oh I see, you wanted to blame the Jews for Palestinisns not wanting an Israeli state .

You wanted to blame Jews for everything, I get it now .

Palestinians reject an Israeli state because Jews are ...........blah blah blah

26 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

"Palestinians never accepted the presence of those who murdered them and stole their land and they don´t accept it now, that´s the reason for the conflict"

@Nick Carter icp do you disagree with this? and why?

15 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

He would like to go and visit you .

When can he visit you ?

It would appear that @Nick Carter icp is having a very hard time wrapping his mind around the possibility that two people of opposing political views could be friends and find things in common. So sorry to hear.

3 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

@Nick Carter icp do you disagree with this? and why?

Again , that topic has been done many times before .

Maybe someone who didn't participate in the previous discussions could reply .

Jews were there first., Jews came from Eastern Europe , Arabs were there first, Arabs went for the prosperity etc etc , Philistines were there 4000 years ago , Philistines have no relation to Palestinians etc etc

Its all been done in previous threads .

Have the same discussion again if you want , but I just wont participte this time

11 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

I am pleased for you both, when are you both meeting up ?

Lunch at the Four Seasons next Tuesday at 12:30. Wanna join? Are you happy now?

11 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Lunch at the Four Seasons next Tuesday at 12:30. Wanna join? Are you happy now?

Do you still qualify as being a Jew friend ?

22 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Again , that topic has been done many times before .

Maybe someone who didn't participate in the previous discussions could reply .

Jews were there first., Jews came from Eastern Europe , Arabs were there first, Arabs went for the prosperity etc etc , Philistines were there 4000 years ago , Philistines have no relation to Palestinians etc etc

Its all been done in previous threads .

Have the same discussion again if you want , but I just wont participte this time

I wouldn’t be happy losing my home because (say) Druids claimed it had been theirs thousands of years ago.

Do you think Palestinians do what they do because in their recent history someone took their families homes and land quoting something thousands of years old?

Edited May 11May 11 by JBChiangRai

11 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

That's exactly the point. There are no people on earth who want to live peacefully than the Jews of Israel, but they have had armed conflict forced on them. If the Arab nations would recognize Israel as the homeland of the world's Jews and allow it to exist in peace, there would be no armed conflict involving Israel.

11 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

That's exactly the point. There are no people on earth who want to live peacefully than the Jews of Israel, but they have had armed conflict forced on them. If the Arab nations would recognize Israel as the homeland of the world's Jews and allow it to exist in ,peace, there would be no armed conflict involving Israel.

I can't agree, Ev & Jing. The 100-member HaShoMer began its militancy against Arabs in 1909. Haganah followed, Irgun, Lehi...IDF.

HaShoMer was created to provide "defence" to the new Jewish settlements. Prior to this, there had mostly been individual immigrants.

HaShoMer was a clandestine militia and its aims were to be the nucleus of a future Jewish army.

I have been unable to discover why HaShoMer gave way to Haganah in 1920. However, Haganah with 40k soldiers and an "elite strike force" was more a paramilitary insurgent force. There is a five-volume history in Hebrew.

Haganah bombed bridges, railways, and ships used to deport illegal Jewish immigrants,

Haganah was not militant enough for some so extremist Jews created Irgun and Lehi. These groups actually had a "Hunting Season" on Palestinians.

What have I learned from this? That Jews in Palestine used violence on their neighbours decades before the Holocaust.

The violence perpetrated by Israel is nothing new. The creation of Israel was founded in violence that had nothing to do with the Holocaust.

Though I don't think one can necessarily assign blame, Jewish immigrants started the violence. Hezbollah didn't appear until 1982 and Hamas 1987.

Israeli society was always militarised due to universal conscription but today's Israel is hypermilitarised throughout every aspect.

Is Israel worth saving, and why?

4 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

The answer is because they want an Islamic Palestinian state to replace the Jewish Israeli state .

That is the answer to your question .

Its not waffle or deflection .

And you're telling me that two states could not be accomplished by int'l negotiation and compromise?!? WTF!

13 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

And you're telling me that two states could not be accomplished by int'l negotiation and compromise?!? WTF!

There will be one state within 20 years. And it won't be Israel. Israel won't exist anymore.

As support runs out and Jews become the minority, the beginning of the end. Hopefully lots of Jews can flee to the Russian Jew enclave and not get massacred for what they did to 50,000 Muslim women and children. 🙂

Edited May 11May 11 by Packer

1 minute ago, Packer said:

There will be one state within 20 years. And it won't be Israel. Israel won't exist anymore.

As support runs out and Jews become the minority, the beginning of the end. Hopefully lots of Jews can flee to the Russian Jew enclave and not get massacred for what they did to 50,000 Muslim women and children. 🙂

I see that happening too.

54 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

And you're telling me that two states could not be accomplished by int'l negotiation and compromise?!? WTF!

Thats correct .

The Palestinians rejected the 2 state solution in 1948 and that remains their stance .

The usual reply :

The Palestinians agreed to 2 state solution in 1980?

My usual reply to that

They said they would agree to the 2 state solution, but they didn't agree to it on paper .

The usual reply :Something about Rabin being assassinated

6 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Thats correct .

The Palestinians rejected the 2 state solution in 1948 and that remains their stance .

The usual reply :

The Palestinians agreed to 2 state solution in 1980?

My usual reply to that

They said they would agree to the 2 state solution, but they didn't agree to it on paper .

The usual reply :Something about Rabin being assassinated

Okay. But haven't they recently agreed to a return of the 1967 borders. That's a start. C'mon, Nick, Israel is killing people every day when Israelis are not being killed. This is somehow "defence".

I think settlers out should be part of that 1967 package. Otherwise, those colonisers will keep treating the Arabs as they are now.

2 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Okay. But haven't they recently agreed to a return of the 1967 borders.

Palestinians agreed to the 1967 borders, but crucially, they didn't recognise Israel's right to exist .

They would use the 67 borders to aquire the rest of the land .

2 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Do you still qualify as being a Jew friend ?

I really can't answer a question like that, you will have to be the judge of that. I was born Jewish but I haven't been a practicing Jew in 56 years. I respect the faith, I have a lot of love for many Jews, I enjoy aspects of the culture, but I don't relate to the religion. And I certainly don't relate to the extremist version of the religion that many practice in Israel, nor do I relate to any of the Orthodox branches of Judaism.

Does that answer your question? Or am I simply being baited?

10 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I really can't answer a question like that, you will have to be the judge of that. I was born Jewish but I haven't been a practicing Jew in 56 years. I respect the faith, I have a lot of love for many Jews, I enjoy aspects of the culture, but I don't relate to the religion. And I certainly don't relate to the extremist version of the religion that many practice in Israel, nor do I relate to any of the Orthodox branches of Judaism.

Does that answer your question? Or am I simply being baited?

Jewish is both a religion and a people.

A people in the TRIBAL sense.

Passed by the MOTHER.

In the ethnoreligious sense. Many atheists are still Jewish PEOPLE.

As you've said your Mama wasn't a Yiddishe Momme, I'm wondering if you consider yourself as an ethnic Jew, or not?

If you do, I'm not questioning your self identity at all. Just curious as you post so massively here representing yourself as Jewish so I think its relevant.

Happy belated Mother's Day --

Edited May 11May 11 by Jingthing

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Jewish is both a religion and a people.

A people in the TRIBAL sense.

Passed by the MOTHER.

In the ethnoreligious sense. Many atheists are still Jewish PEOPLE.

As you've said your Mama wasn't a Yiddishe Momme, I'm wondering if you consider yourself as an ethnic Jew, or not?

If you do, I'm not questioning your self identity at all. Just curious as you post so massively here representing yourself as Jewish so I think its relevant.

Happy belated Mother's Day --

Yes I most certainly do consider myself to be a Jew regardless of the fact that I'm not a practicing Jew. Saying I'm not a Jew would be akin to saying I'm not a black man if I was born to that race.

Just now, spidermike007 said:

Yes I most certainly do consider myself to be a Jew regardless of the fact that I'm not a practicing Jew. Saying I'm not a Jew would be akin to saying I'm not a black man if I was born to that race.

Don't think for one second that I didn't notice that you didn't answer my question regarding ethnicity. You are not required to answer my question, but it should be well noted that you are evading.

Edited May 11May 11 by Jingthing

4 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Palestinians agreed to the 1967 borders, but crucially, they didn't recognise Israel's right to exist .

They would use the 67 borders to aquire the rest of the land .

Nonsense. That's the fear of another Holocaust talking.

9 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Nonsense. That's the fear of another Holocaust talking.

How can you be so clueless ?

Do you remember the Palestinians slogan, From the River to the sea ?

The slogan sung by supporters .

That means to repalce Israel with Palestine .

Once again,as you were told yesterday .

Its in the Palestine charter

The whole of the land to be a Palestine state .

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Yes I most certainly do consider myself to be a Jew regardless of the fact that I'm not a practicing Jew. Saying I'm not a Jew would be akin to saying I'm not a black man if I was born to that race.

A Black man cannot change the colour of his skin , you can stop being Jew by converting to another Religion .

Why don't you do so ?

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Jewish is both a religion and a people.

A people in the TRIBAL sense.

Passed by the MOTHER.

In the ethnoreligious sense. Many atheists are still Jewish PEOPLE.

As you've said your Mama wasn't a Yiddishe Momme, I'm wondering if you consider yourself as an ethnic Jew, or not?

If you do, I'm not questioning your self identity at all. Just curious as you post so massively here representing yourself as Jewish so I think its relevant.

Happy belated Mother's Day --

How did I ever miss The Barry Sisters! This is great & nostalgic stuff, though I'm not a fan (at all!) of klezmer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Barry_Sisters