Flight OG269: At Least 88 Bodies Found At Phuket Airport Crash Site

[TAWP]

Only way it would take 3 years is if they waited 2 years and 10 months to pay the fee...

[Jai Dee]

Air Transport Authority of Thailand insists Thai aviation is up to standard

The Director-General of the Air Transport Authority of Thailand, Mr. Chaisak Angsuwan (ชัยศักดิ์ อังค์สุวรรณ), stands firm that Thailand’s aviation management is up to par with the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO)’s standard.

There have been criticisms on Thailand’s substandard aviation management following the recent air crash at Phuket International Airport where 90 passengers were killed and many others injured on September 16th. In response, Mr. Chaisak says his organization has periodically conducted inspection to ensure the readiness of pilots and other officials before every flight.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 05 October 2007

[Supaporn]

Air Transport Authority of Thailand insists Thai aviation is up to standard

The Director-General of the Air Transport Authority of Thailand, Mr. Chaisak Angsuwan (ชัยศักดิ์ อังค์สุวรรณ), stands firm that Thailand's aviation management is up to par with the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO)'s standard.

There have been criticisms on Thailand's substandard aviation management following the recent air crash at Phuket International Airport where 90 passengers were killed and many others injured on September 16th. In response, Mr. Chaisak says his organization has periodically conducted inspection to ensure the readiness of pilots and other officials before every flight.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 05 October 2007

[Mid]

^

ya want fries with that .......................................

[Bobegraves]

Today we received a forward from a work colleague, a series of pictures from the crash site along with pictures from the building where the bodies were taken.The pictures show bodies in the wreckage, burnt remains and full body close ups, too gruesome to describe. I am disgusted and shocked that these pictures are being circulated, next they'll be making a dvd like they did of the Tsunami.... What is wrong with these people?. I would be grateful for any advice on where or who to complain to about this, it's a disgrace.

[thaiman]

What is wrong with these people?.

They are Thai.

[mrtoad]

Just been having a beer with a Captain (Thai) of a reputable airline this evening, and he was suggesting that Udom has a lot to answear for. His comment was basically that the air crew were on their 5th flight of the day, the captain who had exceeded his hours had been forced to work and that maintainace on One-Two-Go is substandard. I can't verify this, but he also alluded that a lot of money had been going under the table with the authorities.

As I have said, these are all allegations, but will we ever know the truth on this?

[baabaabobo]

Try complaining to your consulate who should pass on the message to the Thai authorities. I agree it is sick to peddle such pictures.

[MrOzark]

I certainly don't condone it, but looky-loo's are everywhere. It is part of human nature.

The Chinese especially will crowd around anything and stare. Anything uncommon.

In the USA, I was constantly stuck in traffic behind looky-loo's after an accident had been

moved to the side of the road. People looking for blood or who knows what. I would

always speed ahead as soon as possible to speed up traffic.

If I were a doctor, I'd stop to help if needed. I'm not. So, I give the people their dignity

and respect the flow of traffic.

Of course these people deserve their dignity, but undeveloped countries ('developing' is vague)

have more looky-loos than the rest. I was in La Jolla San Diego - a posh area - and my friends

insisted on staring at a girl with a broken nose sitting on a curb talking to the police. Even they

refused to give the girl her dignity. They stopped and stared for several minutes. So, even in 'developed'

countries this type of thing happens.

The middle schools in China often will have mutilated bodies hanging out of cars (accident photos)

displayed on a kiosk on the playground/sidewalk for all the kids to see. I can tell you, it has NO real impact

on helping them drive more safely or cross the street according to traffic OR signals.

This isn't unique to Thailand or undeveloped countries. It is unfortunately something

that I don't think you can control directly. Like 'rudeness' or 'ignorance'.

I do agree however that it is a tragedy if the photos are being circulated. Chalk one more

up for the crudeness of humanity and our inhumanity to each other.

Today we received a forward from a work colleague, a series of pictures from the crash site along with pictures from the building where the bodies were taken.The pictures show bodies in the wreckage, burnt remains and full body close ups, too gruesome to describe. I am disgusted and shocked that these pictures are being circulated, next they'll be making a dvd like they did of the Tsunami.... What is wrong with these people?. I would be grateful for any advice on where or who to complain to about this, it's a disgrace.

[Tony Clifton]

Movie narrator: "And they're peeling him off the pavement"

Homer Simpson: " He he he! It's funny 'cause I don't know him"

[Bobegraves]

I fully agree with you MrOzark but what angers me is that these pictures must have been taken by a member of the rescue teams, someone who should have known better than to release them to anyone. I pray that no family member of any of the victims has to receive a forward like this, they are truely disturbing.

[TAWP]

Look at some of the pictures linked in this thread and you will disover several rescuepeople taking pictures as the operation is still going on. I pointed it out some pages ago.

[MrOzark]

Perhaps I am a coward about this, but I don't want to look a the links

For 2 reasons.

1) It would further dishonor those people that suffered.

2) I have seen gruesome photos that stayed in my mind for years.

I am all for freedom of expression and open and honest communication,

but some things I don't see any value in sharing. Perhaps for some

people: crash investigators, safety experts, family, there are legitimate

reasons. I don't have one myself, so I won't look.

[ColPyat]

Perhaps I am a coward about this, but I don't want to look a the links

For 2 reasons.

1) It would further dishonor those people that suffered.

2) I have seen gruesome photos that stayed in my mind for years.

Pictorial description of death in all forms has a different position in Thailand than it has in most parts of the modern western world. There is not the taboo of death here existing as it is in present western society. You will find that many people take pictures at funerals of their dead relatives, i have seen people taking photos of corpses of their dead relatives at crime- and accident scenes, and of dead relatives who died in their homes before the rescue transported them to the morgue.

Monks in monasteries are using pictures of corpses in all conditions and stages of decomposition for some of their meditation techniques. Even though now illegal - it is still common practice that monks meditate sitting on and in front of decomposing corpses donated by the dead or their relatives for this purpose, as it has been since thousands of years in Hindu-Buddhist cultures.

Read about practices of India's and Nepal's "Aghori babbas", especially concerning death, and you will see things taken into stages beyond believe.

There are religious festivals of death here in Thailand which even rotten corpses are cleaned off their flesh, photos are taken freely by the participants as proof of the religious merit they have gained.

Also in the west photos of death did in the past not raise the emotions it seems to do today. If you look for example at one of the most famous classic photographers - Wegee - most of his early work were stark images of death and violence. The maybe most famous and respected contemporary photojournalist James Nachtway has in many of his books photographed partly gruesome death.

Basically, coming back to the topic of the pictures taken by rescue workers - within their cultural context - they have done nothing wrong, and would, when faced with these accusations stare at you in utter disbelieve, simply not understand what you find so obscene and disturbing.

Not all cultures have the same norms as the (modern) west has, especially when it comes to pictorial description of death and the treatment of corpses, and this should be taken into consideration here.

[Bobegraves]

What one does with photo's of ones "own relatives" is fine, but to distribute pictures that are no relation to themselves is thoughtless and insensitive in ANY culture!

[simon43]

Here's some sobering news for those who still fly with this airline. I took a walk along the beach by Phuket Airport just now and watched some planes landing. A Nokair and then a Thai Airways and finally a OneTwoGo plane. What was of concern to me was that whilst the first 2 planes were landing, I could see little airport activity. But when the OneTwoGo plane was on approach, a fire-truck stationed itself just near to the beach (30 metres from me), and immediately infront of some entry gates through the perimeter security fence, about 100 metres from the end of the runway. The truck had a guy on the top who was manning the foam jet equipment.

After the plane had safely touched down, the fire-truck drove away...

Now, had the pilot indicated a problem and asked for fire-trucks? I think not, else there would have been a full-scale presence of firecrews. So why was this fire-truck placed 'ready-to-go' just for this OneTwoGo plane and not for the other airlines?

Food for thought?

Simon

[meemiathai]

Here's some sobering news for those who still fly with this airline. I took a walk along the beach by Phuket Airport just now and watched some planes landing. A Nokair and then a Thai Airways and finally a OneTwoGo plane. What was of concern to me was that whilst the first 2 planes were landing, I could see little airport activity. But when the OneTwoGo plane was on approach, a fire-truck stationed itself just near to the beach (30 metres from me), and immediately infront of some entry gates through the perimeter security fence, about 100 metres from the end of the runway. The truck had a guy on the top who was manning the foam jet equipment.

After the plane had safely touched down, the fire-truck drove away...

Now, had the pilot indicated a problem and asked for fire-trucks? I think not, else there would have been a full-scale presence of firecrews. So why was this fire-truck placed 'ready-to-go' just for this OneTwoGo plane and not for the other airlines?

Food for thought?

Simon

A local standby?

[mr_hippo]

Nothing sinister - could be for any number of reasons.

Regular practice drill, you may have not noticed it before but with the recent crash in your mind, you saw it.

New driver in training ( not learner driver!) Why did it only appear for the One-Two- Go flight? Possibly co-incidence.

Airport familiarisation.

[simon43]

I cycle past Phuket Airport runway several times every day for the past few years. I have never seen any practice drills by the firecrews. Let's see if they do the same thing today for this airline

Simon

[JetsetBkk]

I cycle past Phuket Airport runway several times every day for the past few years. I have never seen any practice drills by the firecrews. Let's see if they do the same thing today for this airline

Simon

Any news Simon?

Meanwhile, an interesting post on the PPRuNe.org professional pilot's forum:

Phuket: pilot insight sought

All aspects of this disaster (the airline and its safety culture, the crash and pilots involved, the inquiry and its likely results) are being examined by an investigative public affairs TV program. We want to speak with Orient-Thai pilots, past and present. All communications in strictest confidence.

pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3624030#post3624030

[simon43]

In answer to your question:

Yes, the fire-truck only made an appearance when the OneTwoGo flight was landing ....

I think I'll stick to Thai air in the future

Simon

[Supaporn]

In answer to your question:

Yes, the fire-truck only made an appearance when the OneTwoGo flight was landing ....

I think I'll stick to Thai air in the future

Simon

Still? So are we to understand that they roll out the trucks for arriving One -Two-Go flights regularly now? Did they not get the statement by the authorities that...One-Two-Go is safe?

I have heard of safety being dictated but this takes on a WHOLE different meaning!! haha

[JetsetBkk]

In answer to your question:

Yes, the fire-truck only made an appearance when the OneTwoGo flight was landing ....

I think I'll stick to Thai air in the future

Simon

Truly, truly amazing. I wonder what the world's press would make of this?

Thanks Simon.

[A_Traveller]

Bangkok Post

One-Two-Go crash caused by 'wind shear'

(BangkokPost.com) - Results of examination of data recorders of ill-fated One-Two-Go flight together with witnesses and evidence prompted officials to believe that the wind shear is the cause of the horrendous crash that left 90 people dead and more than 40 injured in Phuket last month.

Transport permanent secretary Chaisawat Kittipornpaiboon, who is heading the inquiry into the disaster, said the sudden strong winds cause trouble for a plane landing at the Phuket airport.

The cause of crash is concluded weeks after the black box flight recorder of the airliner was returned from analysis in the United States.

Nation Version

Phuket air crash caused by bad weather : Chief investigator

The fatal crash of One-Two-Go airline at Phuket airport in September was caused by bad weather, Transportation Ministry's permanent secretary Chaisawat Kittipornpaiboon said Friday.

He said the wind shear was a major cause of the crash that made the airline slid off the runaway and slammed into nearby earthwalls.

Chaisawat said the conclusion was made after the US experts examined the black box and voice recording box of the ill-fated airliner.

Chaisawat is chief of investigation committee of the crash.

Ninety passengers were killed, many others injured in the incident.

Note different emphasis, between 'the cause' and 'a major cause'. I believe a full press conference is planned for later today.

Regards

Edited October 12, 2007 by A_Traveller

[baabaabobo]

In answer to your question:

Yes, the fire-truck only made an appearance when the OneTwoGo flight was landing ....

I think I'll stick to Thai air in the future

Simon

Truly, truly amazing. I wonder what the world's press would make of this?

Thanks Simon.

In the current Phuket Gazette there is an article on page 2 which says that the airport is now doing bi-monthly fire drills

The first of which was on the 26th of September.

[sibeymai]

Bangkok Post

One-Two-Go crash caused by 'wind shear'

(BangkokPost.com) - Results of examination of data recorders of ill-fated One-Two-Go flight together with witnesses and evidence prompted officials to believe that the wind shear is the cause of the horrendous crash that left 90 people dead and more than 40 injured in Phuket last month.

Transport permanent secretary Chaisawat Kittipornpaiboon, who is heading the inquiry into the disaster, said the sudden strong winds cause trouble for a plane landing at the Phuket airport.

The cause of crash is concluded weeks after the black box flight recorder of the airliner was returned from analysis in the United States.

Nation Version

Phuket air crash caused by bad weather : Chief investigator

The fatal crash of One-Two-Go airline at Phuket airport in September was caused by bad weather, Transportation Ministry's permanent secretary Chaisawat Kittipornpaiboon said Friday.

He said the wind shear was a major cause of the crash that made the airline slid off the runaway and slammed into nearby earthwalls.

Chaisawat said the conclusion was made after the US experts examined the black box and voice recording box of the ill-fated airliner.

Chaisawat is chief of investigation committee of the crash.

Ninety passengers were killed, many others injured in the incident.

Note different emphasis, between 'the cause' and 'a major cause'. I believe a full press conference is planned for later today.

Regards

What a load of rubbish. Cause of the crash ? Weather my ar5e. The pilot decides if the weather is suitable for landing and the pilot was informed of wind shear conditions.

Cause of the crash.......error of judgement by the pilot, or to make it really simple, PILOT ERROR, nothing else.

Blaming the weather does produce a very convenient scapegoat though.

Edited October 12, 2007 by sibeymai

[greenwanderer108]

I need to get on the right persons' email lists.. Others talking about getting ab-tai college students, and plane crash corpses, I'd love to see that kind of stuff, anyone want to pm me some links to pics or forward to my email please, see my profile.

Ever since Wat Yan Yao after the Tsunami, I've never been the same... came across one particular large westerner corpse completely rotten and decayed, but the popular brand underwear he was wearing were completely in tact, and all I could think of what a great commercial that would have been for the underwear company...

anyway, seriously about the pics, get me in the loop please. Seeing such pics is the best thing for everyone, no point in living in denial. Reminds me of the lyrics of the Beatles, A Day in the Life....

[Supaporn]

I need to get on the right persons' email lists.. Others talking about getting ab-tai college students, and plane crash corpses, I'd love to see that kind of stuff, anyone want to pm me some links to pics or forward to my email please, see my profile.

Ever since Wat Yan Yao after the Tsunami, I've never been the same... came across one particular large westerner corpse completely rotten and decayed, but the popular brand underwear he was wearing were completely in tact, and all I could think of what a great commercial that would have been for the underwear company...

anyway, seriously about the pics, get me in the loop please. Seeing such pics is the best thing for everyone, no point in living in denial. Reminds me of the lyrics of the Beatles, A Day in the Life....

There are some truely sick people in this world, aren't there.

[Burr]

YUP

[JetsetBkk]

I need to get on the right persons' email lists.. Others talking about getting ab-tai college students, and plane crash corpses, I'd love to see that kind of stuff, anyone want to pm me some links to pics or forward to my email please, see my profile.

Ever since Wat Yan Yao after the Tsunami, I've never been the same... came across one particular large westerner corpse completely rotten and decayed, but the popular brand underwear he was wearing were completely in tact, and all I could think of what a great commercial that would have been for the underwear company...

anyway, seriously about the pics, get me in the loop please. Seeing such pics is the best thing for everyone, no point in living in denial. Reminds me of the lyrics of the Beatles, A Day in the Life....

There are some truely sick people in this world, aren't there.

Yes. Next he'll be posting his 'incredible hulk' photos again.