Australian Aged Pension

[Olmate]

2 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

You have no credibility or authority to inform anybody about anything.

Crawl back under your rock and stay there.

Your between a rock and senility, give up or come to Thailand😭

[Olmate]

8 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

I've provided many links to relevant government policy, or their intention to pass new legislation. 

 

You, and others, have come up with things like "That's only for guys like Paul Hogan" and "Forget about Article 19."   Too funny. 

Paul, s been flogged  by.you for years, just no comparison is there, kicked all.your cans now  the elections done anddusted... Dont stub  thar big toe anymore KH.lol

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, Olmate said:

Paul, s been flogged  by.you for years, just no comparison is there, kicked all.your cans now  the elections done anddusted... Dont stub  thar big toe anymore KH.lol

Not likely he will stub his toe, he's had foot in mouth for years.

[KhunHeineken]

On 5/5/2025 at 6:11 AM, Olmate said:

the elections done anddusted

Didn't matter who won the election, Australia was still heading down the same path. 

 

Major reform is needed in many sectors, but none of our politicians have the political will to tackle the difficult jobs, thus, nothing changes. 

[RJRS1301]

21 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Didn't matter who won the election, Australia was still heading down the same path. 

 

Major reform is needed in many sectors, but none of our politicians have the political will to tackle the difficult jobs, thus, nothing changes. 

no because the   LNP remain in opposition, and Labor have stated no changes mooted for this term

 

[scorecard]

24 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

no because the   LNP remain in opposition, and Labor have stated no changes mooted for this term

 

And in any case I strongly doubt that any government would 'reduce' benefits in any way. 

[KhunHeineken]

On 5/8/2025 at 6:10 AM, RJRS1301 said:

no because the   LNP remain in opposition, and Labor have stated no changes mooted for this term

 

Australia desperately needs tax reform, housing reform, and electricity reform, just to name a few, but these would be at the top. 

 

In relation to tax reform, implementing more of the Henry Review would be a good start. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Tax_Review

 

"Rudd endorsed and implemented only 3 of the 138 recommendations." 

 

In relation to housing reform, negative gearing has to be rolled back, back politicians from both major parties and many smaller parties have investment properties.  

 

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/the-feed/article/politicians-and-their-property-portfolios-how-many-do-they-own/udjlx1qle

 

In relation to electricity, it should never had been privatized.  In 30 years, Australia went from having one of the cheapest electricity prices in the world, to having the most expensive electricity prices in the world.  

 

https://www.leadingedgeenergy.com.au/blog/highest-electricity-prices-world/

 

"Australian households and businesses are paying the highest electricity prices in the world, a drastic reversal from the 1990s when energy bills in the country were the cheapest in the world."

 

It's that bad that Australia's electricity prices are causing what's left of Australia's manufacturing industry to go offshore. 

 

 

Neither the ALP or LNP have done anything of substance to change the above issues that have a big impact on every Australian citizen, thus, it didn't really matter who won the election, Australia will still continue down the same path to record debt, so much so, S&P issued a warning that Australia could lose its AAA rating, and if / when that happens, it's 15 baht to $1AUD. 

[KhunHeineken]

On 5/8/2025 at 6:36 AM, scorecard said:

And in any case I strongly doubt that any government would 'reduce' benefits in any way. 

It's got to the point that there are now millions of welfare recipients in Australia.  Any political party looking to take a dollar off a welfare recipient would never be voted in, that's how many are on the Centerlink gravy train.

 

  https://ipa.org.au/publications-ipa/media-releases/growing-welfare-dependency-requires-honest-debate-and-urgent-action

 

"Approximately 2.1 million Australians (aged 15+) are currently receiving welfare through either the NDIS, Disability Support Pension (DSP), Jobseeker, or Youth Allowance."

 

"Many Australians receive welfare for valid reasons, however there is a rapidly growing cohort who could work, but do not. This is placing an enormous burden on our nation’s stretched finances and ballooning debt levels,” said Mr Wild."

 

[RJRS1301]

12 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

It's got to the point that there are now millions of welfare recipients in Australia.  Any political party looking to take a dollar off a welfare recipient would never be voted in, that's how many are on the Centerlink gravy train.

 

  https://ipa.org.au/publications-ipa/media-releases/growing-welfare-dependency-requires-honest-debate-and-urgent-action

 

"Approximately 2.1 million Australians (aged 15+) are currently receiving welfare through either the NDIS, Disability Support Pension (DSP), Jobseeker, or Youth Allowance."

 

"Many Australians receive welfare for valid reasons, however there is a rapidly growing cohort who could work, but do not. This is placing an enormous burden on our nation’s stretched finances and ballooning debt levels,” said Mr Wild."

 

Considering the investigations caused by RoboDebt debacle showed very little to no fraud you are incorrect

 

Welfare is demeaning they are Commonwealth Benefits

 

 

[RJRS1301]

1 minute ago, RJRS1301 said:

Considering the investigations caused by RoboDebt debacle showed very little to no fraud you are incorrect

 

Welfare is demeaning they are Commonwealth Benefits

 

 

IPA is a disgusting right wing source thoroughly discredited, as shown in the latest voting

Yes tax reform needed but relying on IPA discredits you

 

[KhunHeineken]

2 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Considering the investigations caused by RoboDebt debacle showed very little to no fraud you are incorrect

Robodebt was a computer automated matching of welfare received v hours worked, and if there was an over payment, debt recovery.  

 

Robodebt didn't do surveillance on individuals claiming the dole or disability, but still working.  Nor did it assess someone on the dole as being able to work but just chosing not to and cutting them off. 

 

Robodebt has nothing to do with the number of Australians receiving welfare. 

 

2 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Welfare is demeaning they are Commonwealth Benefits

 

From one of many online dictionaries. 

 

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/welfare

 

"Welfare is money that is paid by the government to people who are unemployed, poor, or sick."

 

What will YOU call it when Australia becomes a republic? 

[KhunHeineken]

2 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

IPA is a disgusting right wing source thoroughly discredited, as shown in the latest voting

Australian government. (I chose 2019 - pre pandemic) 

 

https://www.aihw.gov.au/reports/australias-welfare/australias-welfare-2019-in-brief/summary

 

"$161 billion was spent on welfare by governments in 2017–18, or $6,482 per person."

 

2 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Yes tax reform needed but relying on IPA discredits you

It gets worse when you add in all the middle class welfare. 

 

This is a good article that fact checks the comments of a Lib politician in 2015. 

 

He said this:

 

"When you’ve got, oh, probably well over half of the population, heading to two-thirds of the population receiving some form of government benefit, it’s pretty easy to identify where that money is going. And a far better option would be to wind back on expenditure, let people look after themselves a little bit more, lower taxes in due course and reduce the size of the government. – Liberal Democratic Party Senator David Leyonhjelm, interview with ABC NewsRadio Breakfast, April 30, 2015."

 

https://theconversation.com/factcheck-is-half-to-two-thirds-of-the-australian-population-receiving-a-government-benefit-41027

 

The verdict from the fact check was this:

 

"It is correct however, that about 50% of Australian households receive a government payment."

 

 

[scorecard]

3 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

IPA is a disgusting right wing source thoroughly discredited, as shown in the latest voting

Yes tax reform needed but relying on IPA discredits you

 

What is IPA?

[RJRS1301]

3 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

Australian government. (I chose 2019 - pre pandemic) 

 

https://www.aihw.gov.au/reports/australias-welfare/australias-welfare-2019-in-brief/summary

 

"$161 billion was spent on welfare by governments in 2017–18, or $6,482 per person."

 

It gets worse when you add in all the middle class welfare. 

 

This is a good article that fact checks the comments of a Lib politician in 2015. 

 

He said this:

 

"When you’ve got, oh, probably well over half of the population, heading to two-thirds of the population receiving some form of government benefit, it’s pretty easy to identify where that money is going. And a far better option would be to wind back on expenditure, let people look after themselves a little bit more, lower taxes in due course and reduce the size of the government. – Liberal Democratic Party Senator David Leyonhjelm, interview with ABC NewsRadio Breakfast, April 30, 2015."

 

https://theconversation.com/factcheck-is-half-to-two-thirds-of-the-australian-population-receiving-a-government-benefit-41027

 

The verdict from the fact check was this:

 

"It is correct however, that about 50% of Australian households receive a government payment."

 

 

Check the facts from the RoBoDebt Royal Commission report from 2022, very little fraud found to have been committed 

[RJRS1301]

Just now, RJRS1301 said:

Check the facts from the RoBoDebt Royal Commission report from 2022, very little fraud found to have been committed 

Commonwealth Benefits /Social Security payments cover Family Benefit payments,(A&B) aged pension, special benefits ,jobseeker, paid parental leave and many more, many recipients are also taxpayers' 

 

[RJRS1301]

2 hours ago, scorecard said:

What is IPA?

Right wing "independent " "think tank" on public policy, training ground for may conservative politicians, and future Murdoch journalists /Sky News presenters 

 

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, RJRS1301 said:

Right wing "independent " "think tank" on public policy, training ground for may conservative politicians, and future Murdoch journalists /Sky News presenters 

 

Understood, thanks.

[KhunHeineken]

1 hour ago, RJRS1301 said:

Check the facts from the RoBoDebt Royal Commission report from 2022, very little fraud found to have been committed 

Robodebt is irrelevant.

 

It's more to do with the ease in which someone can receive welfare in Australia, which has lead to abuse of the system, which now means that the amount of people on welfare must be catered for at election time, and if a political party doesn't, they don't get voted in. 

 

Basically, people who receive welfare, many of whom do not work and pay tax, get to decide who governs the country.  Australia never used to be that way, now it is.   

[KhunHeineken]

1 hour ago, RJRS1301 said:

Right wing "independent " "think tank" on public policy, training ground for may conservative politicians, and future Murdoch journalists /Sky News presenters 

 

I thought you meant India Pale Ale. 

[KhunHeineken]

1 hour ago, RJRS1301 said:

and many more

Yeah, too many more. 

 

1 hour ago, RJRS1301 said:

many recipients are also taxpayers

That's correct.  At 50% of households across Australia receiving some form of welfare, many are taxpayers, but then again, many are not. 

 

Question for you.  You seem fine with social security and welfare being the Australian economy's biggest bill at 37% of the budget.  What percent would it have to be before YOU admit there is a problem?  

[RJRS1301]

14 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

Yeah, too many more. 

 

That's correct.  At 50% of households across Australia receiving some form of welfare, many are taxpayers, but then again, many are not. 

 

Question for you.  You seem fine with social security and welfare being the Australian economy's biggest bill at 37% of the budget.  What percent would it have to be before YOU admit there is a problem?  

I do not see  support payments as a "problem" 

I feel it behoves us to life people up and give dignity to those who have qualified , and investigations by both major parties in government have failed to identify fraud as a big issue

Tax reform required and proper mineral resource taxing for all companies, many of which pay little or no tax

 

[RJRS1301]

15 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

Robodebt is irrelevant.

 

It's more to do with the ease in which someone can receive welfare in Australia, which has lead to abuse of the system, which now means that the amount of people on welfare must be catered for at election time, and if a political party doesn't, they don't get voted in. 

 

Basically, people who receive welfare, many of whom do not work and pay tax, get to decide who governs the country.  Australia never used to be that way, now it is.   

RoboDebt is very significant, it put paid to the "fraud" issue,  the govt had to repay billions to those who were accused of debt, which was fraud by government against vulnerable humans

The Australian government has repaid over $751 million in unlawfully claimed debts and $112 million in compensation to approximately 400,000 people impacted by the Robodebt scheme. This brings the total settlement value to $1.2 billion, including debt waivers. The Robodebt scheme, which used income averaging to raise debts, was ruled unlawful by the Federal Court in 2019. 

These were people "accused" of fraud, so your hypothesis seems  disingenuous to say the least

 

[Olmate]

36 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

RoboDebt is very significant, it put paid to the "fraud" issue,  the govt had to repay billions to those who were accused of debt, which was fraud by government against vulnerable humans

The Australian government has repaid over $751 million in unlawfully claimed debts and $112 million in compensation to approximately 400,000 people impacted by the Robodebt scheme. This brings the total settlement value to $1.2 billion, including debt waivers. The Robodebt scheme, which used income averaging to raise debts, was ruled unlawful by the Federal Court in 2019. 

These were people "accused" of fraud, so your hypothesis seems  disingenuous to say the least

 

?? 'disingenuous'!    thats something we might need to expand upon for KH! 🥺

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

RoboDebt is very significant, it put paid to the "fraud" issue,  the govt had to repay billions to those who were accused of debt, which was fraud by government against vulnerable humans

The Australian government has repaid over $751 million in unlawfully claimed debts and $112 million in compensation to approximately 400,000 people impacted by the Robodebt scheme. This brings the total settlement value to $1.2 billion, including debt waivers. The Robodebt scheme, which used income averaging to raise debts, was ruled unlawful by the Federal Court in 2019. 

These were people "accused" of fraud, so your hypothesis seems  disingenuous to say the least

 

The Robodebt fraud was facilitated by senior public servants and several government ministers, who drove several people to suicide.

 

In a world of true accountability, they should be in jail.

[KhunHeineken]

3 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

I do not see  support payments as a "problem" 

It's a simple question. 

 

Social Security and Welfare is currently 37% of Australia's budget.  At what percent do YOU say there is a problem?  The money has to come from somewhere. 

 

We've already borrowed 1 trillion dollars, which shows Australia has more outgoings than income, and as I just posted in another thread, they forecast a decade of budget deficits.   

 

45%, 50%, 55%?  At what percent of the Australian budget do YOU say "Social Security and Welfare" has become a problem? 

 

4 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

I feel it behoves us to life people up and give dignity to those who have qualified ,

Can you clarify your use of the word "qualified?" 

 

Any Australian citizen can walk into a Centerlink office and put their hand out. 

 

4 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

and investigations by both major parties in government have failed to identify fraud as a big issue

Link please. 

 

If you watch this, you will clearly see there is a systemic "problem" with abuse of the system. 

 

Do you think this guy deserves one cent of the tax payers money?  If not, why is he allowed to get it at all?

 

 

 

4 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Tax reform required and proper mineral resource taxing for all companies, many of which pay little or no tax

I agree, but which political party is going to stand up to the mining giants and big companies, many of whom "donate" to both political parties. 

 

It was tried by Labor and repealed by Liberal. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minerals_Resource_Rent_Tax

[KhunHeineken]

4 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

RoboDebt is very significant, it put paid to the "fraud" issue,  the govt had to repay billions to those who were accused of debt, which was fraud by government against vulnerable humans

The Australian government has repaid over $751 million in unlawfully claimed debts and $112 million in compensation to approximately 400,000 people impacted by the Robodebt scheme. This brings the total settlement value to $1.2 billion, including debt waivers. The Robodebt scheme, which used income averaging to raise debts, was ruled unlawful by the Federal Court in 2019. 

These were people "accused" of fraud, so your hypothesis seems  disingenuous to say the least

 

You keep banging on about "fraud."  It's that easy to get a Centerlink payment that there is no need to commit fraud.  Like another member suggested, Australia has become a nation of bludgers. 

 

I looked at the stats and it's 37% of Australia's budget, and Australia's biggest bill.  50% of households across Australia are receiving some form of welfare.  These stats tend to prove the member's point.

 

I have posted a news video of a guy who clearly is a "bludger." He "qualified" for the dole so Centerlink gives it to him.   Question, is he committing fraud? 

 

Do you see the issue?  He's getting the dole, but isn't viewed as committing fraud because he "qualified" for it, so he doesn't show up in any fraud stats, but clearly he doesn't deserve the dole because he is able bodied and can work. 

[KhunHeineken]

4 hours ago, Olmate said:

?? 'disingenuous'!    thats something we might need to expand upon for KH! 🥺

I think the real disingenuous are those abusing the system.  Those who have not, and never will, work a day in their life, despite being capable of doing so. 

[KhunHeineken]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

The Robodebt fraud was facilitated by senior public servants and several government ministers, who drove several people to suicide.

 

In a world of true accountability, they should be in jail.

I agree.  Robodebt was a disgrace.  It should never have been allowed to happen, yet ultimately, no one was held to account. 

[RJRS1301]

On 5/11/2025 at 3:46 PM, KhunHeineken said:

You keep banging on about "fraud."  It's that easy to get a Centerlink payment that there is no need to commit fraud.  Like another member suggested, Australia has become a nation of bludgers. 

 

I looked at the stats and it's 37% of Australia's budget, and Australia's biggest bill.  50% of households across Australia are receiving some form of welfare.  These stats tend to prove the member's point.

 

I have posted a news video of a guy who clearly is a "bludger." He "qualified" for the dole so Centerlink gives it to him.   Question, is he committing fraud? 

 

Do you see the issue?  He's getting the dole, but isn't viewed as committing fraud because he "qualified" for it, so he doesn't show up in any fraud stats, but clearly he doesn't deserve the dole because he is able bodied and can work. 

You brought up fraud, not me, you cannot move past your preconceived notions.

Look at you sensationalist sources, try looking at research instead of bias

Government & other research came with less than 1% of people having committed fraud on the system over a 5 year period

 

Commercial clickbait TV programs is not research

 

 

[KhunHeineken]

5 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

You brought up fraud, not me, you cannot move past your preconceived notions.

Look at you sensationalist sources, try looking at research instead of bias

Government & other research came with less than 1% of people having committed fraud on the system over a 5 year period

 

Commercial clickbait TV programs is not research

 

 

You are simply deflecting. 

 

An older report, but still relevant. 

 

https://www.9news.com.au/national/dole-bludgers-worst-in-australia-revealed/cf24a1bc-b329-4982-a9ce-5c04ce23acf8

 

"According to the report nearly 50,000 people in Australia that are capable of working did not attend job interviews in the past year, but are still not being penalised."

 

The reports says 50,000, but according to you, very little fraud.  As said, the reason little fraud is found is because the recipient "qualified" but that doesn't mean they can not work.   

 

This woman got away with it for 21 years.  Had over $240,000AUD in cash in her home.  She even instructed others how to defraud the system.  Where's the checks and balances to be able to get away with it for so long, and for so much?   

 

 

You don't comprehend the difference between "fraudsters" and to use your word, "qualified" recipients.  You still don't see it's the ease of obtaining a welfare payment that is the issue. 

 

Here's an example that's closer to home.

 

Say an Aussie expat has been living in Thailand for many years.  He now reaches retirement age.  He goes back to Australia to stay for 2 years to re-establish residency.  He tells Centerlink what they want to hear, that is, his intention is to live in Australia.  After 2 years he achieves portability, and flies back to Thailand a day later.  He had no intention of remaining in Australia at all.  Now, he "qualified" for the welfare, but has he committed "fraud?"