Gallbladder Surgery

[narcisus]

Has anyone had laproscopic gallbladder surgery lately in CM? Need names of qualified surgeons either in Ram 1 or Maharaj?

[PeaceBlondie]

C'mon, guys, don't let this lady down. I told her you would have some ideas.

[photojourn]

Can't help with any doctors in Thailand. I had it done in Australia about five years ago at Royal Darwin Hospital after crawling my way on to a plane and declining to have the procedure done in Indonesia.

Doctors at Royal Darwin first cut the duct to let the 12mm stone pass. Then they decided a couple of days later that the gall bladder may as well come out too.

I was told to expect a three day hospital stay. I spent 25 days in Royal Darwin with a suction bag sucking between .5 and 1l of blood a day out of me. The Gall bag had lesions attaching it to the liver and various other bits that it shouldn't and the surgery was more complicated than the scans showed.

Had a huge haematoma for about six weeks post-surgery.

The surgery is normally a fairly simple procedure but like any, complications can arise.

dam_n painful complaint too. Even morphine tablets didn't do much to stop the pain from the blocked duct prior to the surgery.

[narcisus]

Can't help with any doctors in Thailand. I had it done in Australia about five years ago at Royal Darwin Hospital after crawling my way on to a plane and declining to have the procedure done in Indonesia.

Doctors at Royal Darwin first cut the duct to let the 12mm stone pass. Then they decided a couple of days later that the gall bladder may as well come out too.

I was told to expect a three day hospital stay. I spent 25 days in Royal Darwin with a suction bag sucking between .5 and 1l of blood a day out of me. The Gall bag had lesions attaching it to the liver and various other bits that it shouldn't and the surgery was more complicated than the scans showed.

Had a huge haematoma for about six weeks post-surgery.

The surgery is normally a fairly simple procedure but like any, complications can arise.

dam_n painful complaint too. Even morphine tablets didn't do much to stop the pain from the blocked duct prior to the surgery.

Thanks for the headsup on what to expect if things go wrong. Now I am really nervous but I need the surgery so I will have to go ahead with it one way or another. Once it's over it, I guess I will be the expert.

[PeaceBlondie]

Hey Chiang Mai people - please, let's not leave narcissus fearing for her life. We know that CM Ram and Maharaj each have some great surgeons, but where does the better surgeon practice?

[SwaziBird]

Has anyone had laproscopic gallbladder surgery lately in CM? Need names of qualified surgeons either in Ram 1 or Maharaj?

Hi Narcisus

Dr Ekachai Paiboonworachat ( happy to be called by his first name ) is a general & laparoscopic surgeon at Ram 1 hospital.

Removed my gall-bladder, laparscopcally, about 3 years ago under emergency conditions.

Great surgeon, VERY attentive post-surgery and one of God's great gentlemen. Speaks perfect English too !

Ram 1, itself, was a good place to be hospitalised.

Chock dee !

Cheers

Edited May 3, 2008 by SwaziBird

[Ta22]

I too suffer from the same pain , here a few way how i deal with it . I know the attack come after a bad meal of oily of hard to digest food , so i stay off sticky rice and roasted oily stuff . The attack cycle usually last 4 to 6 hour . Which is a pain right at the lower right chest . I had done nature treatment . Drinking oliver oil with lime juice and cider . And pill . But the best way is still understand the cycle and relax . I found that a warm pack on the gall spot help alot as well as taking some fish liver oil . Laying down on you right side . It help alot if someone is beside you . Let share some info on how you deal with your gall . And what you take .

[colino]

Ok i had gall stones , I was working in the UK on my market stall one day when i got this mega pain out of know where i ended up lying on the ground in agony, some one called an ambulance and i was taken to hospital , the doctor took one look and said that i have a gall stone on the move ,

I thought this was something old people got i was only 42 ,Anyway after being put on morphine and having a scan they confirmed that i had two stones that needed to be removed , the surgeon came and talked to me and explained that once your gall bladder makes a stone it doesn't work any more and to avoid future problems its best to take the whole thing out , so i was booked in for a week later, as for the attacks well the best advice the doctor gave me was eat less than 20grams of fat a day so i lived on clear soup white meat boiled spuds and weetibix , when i went in for the OP i had key hole surgery 3 little cuts excellent, went in at 8am had the OP 11am home by 5pm ,

this was the worst pain i had ever had in my life a nurse said that gall stone pain was as bad as child birth

one draw back is that 2 years ago i had a pain return in the same place , so went to the doctors and was sent for a x-ray they found that one of the three staples had fallen off the end of the tube and has some how ended up down near my left hip ?

get well soon narcisus

stay off any fatty or spicy foods and def No milk cheese or any other dairy products

[siam-i-am]

Hey Chiang Mai people - please, let's not leave narcissus fearing for her life. We know that CM Ram and Maharaj each have some great surgeons, but where does the better surgeon practice?

Can't speak for Chiang mai but I had the op done (keyhole surgery) at the Christian hospital in Silom rd BKK they were brilliant out in 4 days I'm sure ram or indeed most of the hospitals here could do the job its no big deal these days.

[Ta22]

The truth is gallstone is not a old man illness . I'm only 31 and i had the attack for about 4 years now . Case vary on what you can eat but the main suspect is oil . To explain it in simple gall need to work to digest oil . And when gall flow out from a small duct . If i stone got stuck, that when the pain come . Is not true that once you gall have stone is no longer working . In fact if it not working you would not suffer pain . The stone is push onto the duct when the gall flow out .

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

I too suffer from the same pain , here a few way how i deal with it . I know the attack come after a bad meal of oily of hard to digest food , so i stay off sticky rice and roasted oily stuff . The attack cycle usually last 4 to 6 hour . Which is a pain right at the lower right chest . I had done nature treatment . Drinking oliver oil with lime juice and cider . And pill . But the best way is still understand the cycle and relax . I found that a warm pack on the gall spot help alot as well as taking some fish liver oil . Laying down on you right side . It help alot if someone is beside you . Let share some info on how you deal with your gall . And what you take .

TA I think the only piece your missing in the recipe is the important part of drinking fresh apple juice for a week or so prior to the flush. The theory behind that is the pectin in the apples helps to soften the stones and helps them pass easier.

The research is mixed on this but for some it has helped and cured and IMO it would take quite a few flushes to really clear things out if you have a lot of stones or very large stones.

I have done it myself and passed some interesting looking stones and pod like creatures but I was never in pain or diagnosed with a problem. I would say consult a doctor like the guy at Tao-garden or another alt medicine type. If you can wait and try it then it costs very little and would not make things worse. If you pass large stones though it could be painful.

The gallbladder is a complex organ and perhaps important for other endocrine functions. I would put up little bit of a fight to keep in the system. Also there is some risk of surgery like infection, malpractice etc.

Here is a recipe if you want to pursue it or try other Google searches

www.road-to-health.com/am/publish/article_21.shtml

[Ta22]

I did the flush twice . Recipe vary . You can also use lime juice . And V8 juice . But i agree that the gall is there for a reason plus a little pain can be a good reminder that we forget to take care of our body .

[narcisus]

Thanks y'all for the info and support. I plan to see Dr. Thaijek (sp?) at Maharaj (who is the head of urology dept. and a professor)on Tuesday and once everything is taken care of I will post my experiences for the next gallbladder patient.

[Ta22]

why not also post a Price Quote for the Operation , so we know how much we need for such a Op.

but i think .. if we stay off oily food and then go on healthy food is a good , choice then cutting it out ..

MOst people who have Gallstone problem .. will also havce FATTY liver problem ..

which is also another problem ..

the best way is still good diet and healthy food ..

which i keep killing myself slowly with .. nice food

[lannarebirth]

Had it done 2 years ago at B-Care Medical center in Bangkok. I day pre-op, 2 days post op. 3 1/2 days total. All tests, meds, room surgeon operating room, all totalled 48k Baht, out the door. Very good experience for a hospitalization. Can't stress enough the importance of adequate post op time for observation.

TA 22: Gall bladder flushes only have some positive effect if the gall stone is much smaller than the bile duct. If it is larger (much larger in my case) it will have zero positive effect and could cause the stone to move and cause a blockage of the bile duct. That is then a life threatening situation requiring an immediate emergency operation to remove the gall bladder. If you know you get stones, I encourage you to have an inexpensive sonogram. They will measure any stones present and tell you your options.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Had it done 2 years ago at B-Care Medical center in Bangkok. I day pre-op, 2 days post op. 3 1/2 days total. All tests, meds, room surgeon operating room, all totalled 48k Baht, out the door. Very good experience for a hospitalization. Can't stress enough the importance of adequate post op time for observation.

TA 22: Gall bladder flushes only have some positive effect if the gall stone is much smaller than the bile duct. If it is larger (much larger in my case) it will have zero positive effect and could cause the stone to move and cause a blockage of the bile duct. That is then a life threatening situation requiring an immediate emergency operation to remove the gall bladder. If you know you get stones, I encourage you to have an inexpensive sonogram. They will measure any stones present and tell you your options.

The magnesium sulfate(epsom salt) dilates the bile duct and allows stones far larger to pass.

BTW.. Does anybody know where to get Epsom Salts in CM? I have only been able to find some packages of sweetened EP at a pharmacy. Any sources? I tried the pharmacy supply place on Suthep a while back but they said "no have".

Everyone gets some gallstones but problems arise when the duct becomes clogged. First order of business is try to clear the duct and clogged opening. A person could have golf balls sized stones but that is not necessarily going to obstruct the flow of bile. It's the little ones that form a sludge that close the opening and clog the duct that "usually" causes the symptoms.

I have personally done a cadaver class in Boulder Colorado (digestive series) in 2003 and seen the inside of a gallbladder. It's fascinating and disturbing at the same time.

[lannarebirth]

Had it done 2 years ago at B-Care Medical center in Bangkok. I day pre-op, 2 days post op. 3 1/2 days total. All tests, meds, room surgeon operating room, all totalled 48k Baht, out the door. Very good experience for a hospitalization. Can't stress enough the importance of adequate post op time for observation.

TA 22: Gall bladder flushes only have some positive effect if the gall stone is much smaller than the bile duct. If it is larger (much larger in my case) it will have zero positive effect and could cause the stone to move and cause a blockage of the bile duct. That is then a life threatening situation requiring an immediate emergency operation to remove the gall bladder. If you know you get stones, I encourage you to have an inexpensive sonogram. They will measure any stones present and tell you your options.

The magnesium sulfate(epsom salt) dilates the bile duct and allows stones far larger to pass.

BTW.. Does anybody know where to get Epsom Salts in CM? I have only been able to find some packages of sweetened EP at a pharmacy. Any sources? I tried the pharmacy supply place on Suthep a while back but they said "no have".

Everyone gets some gallstones but problems arise when the duct becomes clogged. First order of business is try to clear the duct and clogged opening. A person could have golf balls sized stones but that is not necessarily going to obstruct the flow of bile. It's the little ones that form a sludge that close the opening and clog the duct that "usually" causes the symptoms.

I have personally done a cadaver class in Boulder Colorado (digestive series) in 2003 and seen the inside of a gallbladder. It's fascinating and disturbing at the same time.

I certainly wouldn't try that if I weren't at a hospital, with an emergency surgical team standing by in case something didn't go according to plan.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

I certainly wouldn't try that if I weren't at a hospital, with an emergency surgical team standing by in case something didn't go according to plan.

I am sure it happens but from my personal research its a fairly rare emergency event with the flush.

It's really worth a try IMO because once a person loses a GB then corrosive bile continually leaks into the duodenum which over time cause a number of undesirable problems. I think what is little discussed is that the liver produces many or sometimes most of the gallstones. If the liver in its many ducts are choked with stones then they are not going anywhere after an GB removal.

If a person has a GB then its possible to do a liver/GB flush. The flush works on the principle that by not eating any fats for a few days then the bile builds up in the GB and when the large amount of oil is ingested in conjunction with bile duct dilation then the stones are squeezed out like a turkey baster as the body is signaled to release bile to digest the fats.

Once the GB is gone then no way to use accumulated bile to do a flush.. There is no reservoir of bile left and it just dribbles out 24/7. The liver of course cannot be removed or repaired yet.. Hopefully they figure out how to overhaul one in the future.

It's worth trying to keep the GB but it takes perhaps a dozen flushes over a year to really clean things out.. Also its vitally important for a person to make lifestyle changes to slow down the formation of new stones and enlargment of exiting ones.

Hope that helps somebody out there and that I explained it simply enough without too much detail.

Edited May 4, 2008 by CobraSnakeNecktie

[Ta22]

i did a post some while ago looking for epsom salt -- but have little feedback .. someone did offer to give me some for free- but due to travelling i did not met up with that kind person .

would be nice if anyone know where ot get it .

i did the flush twice i found it ok -- but kinda hard to progress -- remeber if you do try -- use good oliver oil cos the after taste is better .

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

i did a post some while ago looking for epsom salt -- but have little feedback .. someone did offer to give me some for free- but due to travelling i did not met up with that kind person .

would be nice if anyone know where ot get it .

i did the flush twice i found it ok -- but kinda hard to progress -- remeber if you do try -- use good oliver oil cos the after taste is better .

I know what you mean. It ruins your desire to ever taste olive oil again. Yuck...

[narcisus]

I have had my gallbladder surgery at the International wing of Maharaj hospital. Went in Thursday morning, had the surgery at 8pm that night and I am back home today, Friday evening. The doctor (Trijek Sandhu) was great, beautiful room and very attentive English speaking nurses - I walked out today with a total bill of 50,009 Baht or approx $1613. I am so glad I did not go to Ram as they really ripped us off when we had our physicals done there - we paid by credit card and they charged us in $$ naming their own exchange rate.

The surgery was laproscopic and I have very minimal discomfort and pain. I definitly would suggest Maharaj over Ram any day for any kind of illness. The staff on the 13th floor of Special Medical Services all speak English even though it is Thai standard English and they are all very helpful.

Thank you all for your input.

[uptheos]

I have had my gallbladder surgery at the International wing of Maharaj hospital. Went in Thursday morning, had the surgery at 8pm that night and I am back home today, Friday evening. The doctor (Trijek Sandhu) was great, beautiful room and very attentive English speaking nurses - I walked out today with a total bill of 50,009 Baht or approx $1613. I am so glad I did not go to Ram as they really ripped us off when we had our physicals done there - we paid by credit card and they charged us in $$ naming their own exchange rate.

The surgery was laproscopic and I have very minimal discomfort and pain. I definitly would suggest Maharaj over Ram any day for any kind of illness. The staff on the 13th floor of Special Medical Services all speak English even though it is Thai standard English and they are all very helpful.

Thank you all for your input.

Glad you had success, I did too, same place. I had it done via lapraroscopy 2 years ago, by Dr Sandhu Trichak. It seems inflation is running up a bit though, my bill 2 years ago was 39,000 for everything.

No matter, as long as you are well.

Keep off the fatty foods and be aware of any pain that could be common bile duct obstruction - it would need immediate attention.

Do you have his mobile number - if not msg me. Good luck.

[mcgriffith]

Very happy thing worked out well for you, narcisus!

I also am a very satisfied patient/client of Maharaj Special Clinic; I go there yearly for my physical exam.

[PeaceBlondie]

Narcissus, so glad to hear you are doing so well. I was going to send you a note today, and you beat me to it. As you well know by now, I think Ram is overpriced and Maharaj is underrated. The only reason I would go to Ram is for something so specialized that it can only be done there.