Rude To Not Become Fluent In Thai

[thaihome]

I think if you live in Thailand they should make you speak some of the basics, I think you should not be able to get more then a Tourist visa unless you pass a test.

So I am working for an American company in Thailand, all our employees speak English, all our Thai clients speak English, all our contractors, both Thai and international speak English, all our contracts and correspondence is in English and you think I should have to speak Thai to work in Thailand? What is your rational for that?

So if tomorrow I am transferred to China to do the same job I do here, I would have to speak Mandarin in order to go? Sounds to me like you have no knowledge of the realties of the international business world and what language is actually important.

TH

[popshirt]

Blanket assertions regarding what one should or must do in order to live somewhere are pointless I think.

Everyone's case is different.

I am already tri-lingual (in western languages, one being English) and OLD. I am now living in LOS, perhaps not for a very long time as I will either drop dead or move somewhere else.

I have learned a few words and phrases in Thai, but I am simply not willing to invest the amount of time it would take to learn the language.

The most useful language I have ever learned (besides English) is Spanish. That was a good investment of my time as it is the lingua franca of probably more countries than any other modern language. And it enables me to deal with Portuguese and Italian as well.

I learned French whilst living in Montreal and it was easy for me with all the cognates in Spanish and English.

Thai? It is of no use outside of Thailand, even elsewhere in Asia.

Suggesting that knowledge of Thai be a requirement for a retirement visa is Thai-bubble talk.

[seagull]

so i understand that there are obvious benefits to becoming fluent in Thai my question though is do you think it is rude to Thai people if you stay here long term without learning to speak Thai fluently? I think it would be embarrasing to meet your child's teachers and tell them you have lived here X years while not speaking fluent Thai.

I have a hard time making time to learn Thai. For awhile I had it in my IPOD, but then I realized Id much rather listen to music. I would not call it an enjoyable hobby. Yeah, I was thrilled when I went from noob to intermediate, but going from intermediate to fluent seems to have very limited benefits besides face/bragging rights.

For those who have been here many years without speaking fluently, are you embarrassed about it? Is your wife embarrassed about it?

Embarrasing ? A little. Rude ? No. In my 3 years here (Udon & Nongkhai) I learned from the internet for convenience rather than attending classes. You know what I mean ? So, being able to piece together a sentence (finally), I let it loose on my TGF. And she responded with ???????? look on her face. I said "hon, you are Khon Thai, why when I speak Phaa Saa Thai you don't understand ? And she went off with the !!!!!!!!!!.

I would let it rest for a little, before the next attempt to speak Thai.

[wolfmanjack]

hi all i have been a member here for almost 1 year now and this is my first post.

i have been married to a lovey thai lady for 4yrs now and i have had thai family members for 15 yrs but i am tone deaf and my family knows that i have no hope in hel_l of every learning or speaking thai.

But they don't care about this as they know i am a good person that will respect there beliefs even if i can't speak their language. i think thai ppl dont so much care if u can speak to them just so long as u respect them for who they r and that you know ur own limits and dont try to limit them. thai's beleive in freedom not just for ppl but for all living thing. so if u cant speak to them but u r willing too spend ur time and point and make fuuny noises just to communict it is half the fun. my thai friends still try too teach me thai even thow they know i can't learn it but it's part of the fun for them. Just lisening to my mistake makes them happy and the days shorter.

i always think in the back of my head this is the land of smiles and if i can make one person smile today then it was a gooday but that is me .. just say hi on the street and spend 1hr talking to someone u don't know and u will be richer for it as will they . Hope i didn't put u to sleep with that but it's what i wonted to say after 18months here thxs guys brett

If that works for you, then that's great. I assume you've learned a little though, haven't you? Maybe one way to get around the tone deafness issue is to ask them to speak a little slower. If it still isn't right, try again. There's only 5 tones, so one of them has to be right. But I agree, that how you project yourself can be important too. Keep trying! Even learning just a little bit can be rewarding.

Why not take a class?

I have the same problem. I have had my wife pronounce several words in the 5 different tones and i can usually only tell 3 different pronunciations. There is no way i will ever be able to speak thai properly because of this. Even the words i use every day i do not pronounce right but the people around me have learned to know what i am trying to say. The words i do know makes it so that i can guess at what the thais are talking about half the time but i do not get all of the details. As time goes by i gradually learn new words so by the time i die I may be able to carry on a conversation in thai. For now it is up to my limited vocabulary and my dictionary.

[wolfmanjack]

Actually I agree with Thedon. I do not think we all need to become fluent in Thai (that's an impossibility). But I do think that visa extensions (for business, family support, retirement etc) should be tied to being able to speak (not read/wite) some simple Thai. So you can stay in LoS for your 1st year without needing this requirement, and that gives you time to learn some Thai. More productive than propping up the bars all night - although many would disagree with my point of view ...

Simon

If we were all conversant in thai many of the higher paid thais would be out of a job. I know my highest paid worker would be if i was conversant in thai. I would replace him with a 5,000 or 6,000 baht non english speaking thai. I have tried to learn so that i could do just that but it is extremely difficult for me. Especially since my wife speaks good english, my children speak good english and one of my workers speaks good english. It is not an absolute must for me to learn thai like those that have a wife that can not communicate in english.

Edited July 21, 2008 by wolfmanjack

[wolfmanjack]

I think if you live in Thailand they should make you speak some of the basics, I think you should not be able to get more then a Tourist visa unless you pass a test.

If they implemented this i could see most of the foreign investment drying up.

[AmeriThai]

I have the same problem. I have had my wife pronounce several words in the 5 different tones and i can usually only tell 3 different pronunciations. There is no way i will ever be able to speak thai properly because of this. Even the words i use every day i do not pronounce right but the people around me have learned to know what i am trying to say. The words i do know makes it so that i can guess at what the thais are talking about half the time but i do not get all of the details. As time goes by i gradually learn new words so by the time i die I may be able to carry on a conversation in thai. For now it is up to my limited vocabulary and my dictionary.

Wolfmanjack, ask your wife to say certain words you're trying to learn slooooowly. You should be able to pick up the tones as long as you remember what those tones are. But I can understand being limited and resorting to a dictionary. Nothing wrong with that. Hopefully, it's a dictionary that that shows the Thai words. phrases in English. I think if you have the desire to learn it, and apply yourself to it, you can. It's not always easy, but it gets a little easier the more you use the language. Hang in there, keep trying, and good luck.

[Naam]

Oz

Edit: typo

rude are your arrogant attitude and your typos

[PeaceBlondie]

Blanket assertions regarding what one should or must do in order to live somewhere are pointless I think.

Everyone's case is different.

I am already tri-lingual (in western languages, one being English) and OLD. I am now living in LOS, perhaps not for a very long time as I will either drop dead or move somewhere else.

I have learned a few words and phrases in Thai, but I am simply not willing to invest the amount of time it would take to learn the language.

The most useful language I have ever learned (besides English) is Spanish. That was a good investment of my time as it is the lingua franca of probably more countries than any other modern language. And it enables me to deal with Portuguese and Italian as well.

I learned French whilst living in Montreal and it was easy for me with all the cognates in Spanish and English.

Thai? It is of no use outside of Thailand, even elsewhere in Asia.

Suggesting that knowledge of Thai be a requirement for a retirement visa is Thai-bubble talk.

I think popshirt makes some good points here.

When Thailand starts issuing five year and ten year IMMIGRANT visas to farang, with real property rights and working rights, Westerners without long-term Thai partners can start coming here in droves, learning Thai. Nobody's visa lasts long enough to become fluent this year.

This country is not very stable, politically. The language is useless outside Thailand except for 201 Thai-Japanese-Mandarin-English translators.

[NotNew2You]

do you think it is rude to Thai people if you stay here long term without learning to speak Thai fluently?

"Fluently" I wouldn't think is necessary as this is very difficult for anyone learning a second language, especially at the age when most foreigners wash-up in Thailand. However, if one is a long-termer or partnered with a Thai, I think one should make a effort to learn to at least speak basic Thai. If for no other reason that it will make one's life much easier.

I know in the USA, immigrants who make no effort to learn English are very much scorned upon. The Thai's may be more easy going but we should still make the effort IMO.

[baanthale]

Blanket assertions regarding what one should or must do in order to live somewhere are pointless I think.

Everyone's case is different.

I am already tri-lingual (in western languages, one being English) and OLD. I am now living in LOS, perhaps not for a very long time as I will either drop dead or move somewhere else.

I have learned a few words and phrases in Thai, but I am simply not willing to invest the amount of time it would take to learn the language.

The most useful language I have ever learned (besides English) is Spanish. That was a good investment of my time as it is the lingua franca of probably more countries than any other modern language. And it enables me to deal with Portuguese and Italian as well.

I learned French whilst living in Montreal and it was easy for me with all the cognates in Spanish and English.

Thai? It is of no use outside of Thailand, even elsewhere in Asia.

Suggesting that knowledge of Thai be a requirement for a retirement visa is Thai-bubble talk.

I think popshirt makes some good points here.

When Thailand starts issuing five year and ten year IMMIGRANT visas to farang, with real property rights and working rights, Westerners without long-term Thai partners can start coming here in droves, learning Thai. Nobody's visa lasts long enough to become fluent this year.

This country is not very stable, politically. The language is useless outside Thailand except for 201 Thai-Japanese-Mandarin-English translators.

Exactly. Thai is of no use outside, and when you are inside, you can't plan for a long term life here. To get a PR and citizen ship would be the first step to be sure about you future here, and the requierments are just redicoulus. Social stautus, family, children, lingo ability etc doesn't count much, only how much money you earn each month! As it is right now most people who have a very good reson for PR and citizenship will not have a chance,(if they don't want to bribe them self through the system, or fake their taxible income each month), but people with absolutly no family or other interests in Thailand can quite easy get a permanent residence if the just have a VERY well paid job.

[cloudhopper]

do you think it is rude to Thai people if you stay here long term without learning to speak Thai fluently?

No. But making the attempt is usually appreciated, and communicating in a friendly patient manner using whatever combination of Thai, English and sign will never be considered rude.

For those who have been here many years without speaking fluently, are you embarrassed about it? Is your wife embarrassed about it?

My wife speaks English far better than I will ever speak Thai, but I found myself embarrassed sometimes, totally unnecessarily I imagine, by mistakes she made while we were visiting English speaking countries so I'm sure she must feel the same way here at times when I speak Thai.

[jing jing]

do you think it is rude to Thai people if you stay here long term without learning to speak Thai fluently?

"Fluently" I wouldn't think is necessary as this is very difficult for anyone learning a second language, especially at the age when most foreigners wash-up in Thailand. However, if one is a long-termer or partnered with a Thai, I think one should make a effort to learn to at least speak basic Thai. If for no other reason that it will make one's life much easier.

I know in the USA, immigrants who make no effort to learn English are very much scorned upon. The Thai's may be more easy going but we should still make the effort IMO.

This is true. Americans are seriously annoyed by folks who immigrate and can't be bothered to learn English. I can't imagine living for over a year in any western european country, like Germany, France, Italy, or Spain, without making an effort to learn the language.

I started studying Thai before moving here and took another 90 hours or so of classes in Bankok after my arrival. Far from fluent but functional is where I'd rate myself. My pronunciation is close to spot-on but vocabulary and grammar need improvement. I can read simple things like signs and brochures but the newspaper is still a bit beyond my ability.

To answer the OP, I don't think fluency in Thai should be expected - certainly not in less than 5 years - but learning the basics is very helpful in everyday life if you don't have a translator at your side 24/7, and although I realize having the respect of Thai people doesn't matter at all to many on this forum, speaking at least a decent level of Thai with proper intonation goes a long way if you ever care to stray off the well-trodden tourist tracks.

[GarryP]

Different response for different people. If you come to Thailand on a wonderful expat package working in an international company here where a good majority of the staff speak English and all your time here outside work is spent within the expat community, I don't see the need to learn Thai and rudeness does enter the equation. (apologies for long sentence)

On the other hand I have been here for over 20 years and am sure that I would be thought of as a bit of a prat by the locals if I didn't speak a reasonable amount of the lingo. In fact I don't know how I would survive if I didn't speak Thai. An example is doing repairs around the home which I often do myself. I do not bother going to Home Pro etc as there are a few convenient hardware stores around and the are often cheaper. Without Thai I would not be able to explain what I needed. Not everything being sold is on plain view for you to point at. Just one example but there are many many others.

[ozzydom]

As to the OP, I am annoyed that people immigrating to Australia were not until recently required to undertake any English study. How can a country be on the same page if its citzens, even us temporary or semi-permanent ones don't take the time to communicate with each other in its own language.... now thats rude.

Oz

Edit: typo

Immigration is an entirely different kettle of fish, to residing in a country on a short term Visa.

Only people who intend applying for Australian Citizenship need to pass an English test.

Maybe you could enlighten me regarding which countries in the world require a local language proficiency test to get a temporary visa, which is all 99% of us have here.

After 8 years here,I still feel like a visitor who can be moved on at the whim of new regulation or some nasty official and of what use is Thai language outside Thailand.

When Thailand offers me some sort of permanency commensurate with my investment in family and business ,Then I will undertake to learn Thai.

[PeaceBlondie]

"Fluently" I wouldn't think is necessary as this is very difficult for anyone learning a second language, especially at the age when most foreigners wash-up in Thailand. However, if one is a long-termer or partnered with a Thai, I think one should make a effort to learn to at least speak basic Thai. If for no other reason that it will make one's life much easier.

I know in the USA, immigrants who make no effort to learn English are very much scorned upon. The Thai's may be more easy going but we should still make the effort IMO.

Some ignorant Americans will scorn immigrants for no reason at all. If anything, I see similarities between the two countries, even though Thailand has no "immigrants." Foreigners who immigrated to the USA after a certain age, can become citizens without speaking more English than what it takes to swear the oath of allegiance. My son-in-law's grandmother lived over 60 years in Texas, speaking as much English as I speak Thai (i.e., none). Another similarity is that she was forever stuck in native-Spanish-speaking circles, and hardly ever met Anglos. She met her first great-grandson, but I never let my racist Anglo father-in-law meet the boy. Farang can be linguistic bigots, too.

[wolfmanjack]

I have the same problem. I have had my wife pronounce several words in the 5 different tones and i can usually only tell 3 different pronunciations. There is no way i will ever be able to speak thai properly because of this. Even the words i use every day i do not pronounce right but the people around me have learned to know what i am trying to say. The words i do know makes it so that i can guess at what the thais are talking about half the time but i do not get all of the details. As time goes by i gradually learn new words so by the time i die I may be able to carry on a conversation in thai. For now it is up to my limited vocabulary and my dictionary.

Wolfmanjack, ask your wife to say certain words you're trying to learn slooooowly. You should be able to pick up the tones as long as you remember what those tones are. But I can understand being limited and resorting to a dictionary. Nothing wrong with that. Hopefully, it's a dictionary that that shows the Thai words. phrases in English. I think if you have the desire to learn it, and apply yourself to it, you can. It's not always easy, but it gets a little easier the more you use the language. Hang in there, keep trying, and good luck.

Thanks for the encouragement but i have resigned myself to learn by osmosis. My kids laughing when i try to speak thai does not help either. As for speaking slowly my wife does not have the patience to help me learn thai nor does she have any inclination to do so. In any case it would not do me too much good unless i could understand people when they spoke at their normal speeds. When i stayed in puerto rico i got to be able to read the newspaper in 3 months with no prior spanish but when people spoke i could not understsnd them due to the speed they spoke. Even though i knew the words and i could properly pronounce most words i could not understand what people were saying. I have the feeling thai would be worse.

[meadish_sweetball]

I do not feel sorry for having learnt the language although I have to admit that to do so is not a business decision, rather something you do to feel more a part of the place and as a personal challenge.

The other night I went to see a three hour show with Note Udom Taepanich, a popular standup comedian. He had me in stitches for 2 hours with brilliant observations of human life in general, Thai life in particular, and even more specifically, Chiang Mai people idiosyncracies. The feeling of getting around 90% of the show without the help of a dictionary was great. But apart from such gems and the obvious comfort of knowing I can get by in everyday situations without using any other language, it is an ego-trip more than anything else.

[petitechevre]

Blanket assertions regarding what one should or must do in order to live somewhere are pointless I think.

Everyone's case is different.

I am already tri-lingual (in western languages, one being English) and OLD. I am now living in LOS, perhaps not for a very long time as I will either drop dead or move somewhere else.

I have learned a few words and phrases in Thai, but I am simply not willing to invest the amount of time it would take to learn the language.

The most useful language I have ever learned (besides English) is Spanish. That was a good investment of my time as it is the lingua franca of probably more countries than any other modern language. And it enables me to deal with Portuguese and Italian as well.

I learned French whilst living in Montreal and it was easy for me with all the cognates in Spanish and English.

Thai? It is of no use outside of Thailand, even elsewhere in Asia.

Suggesting that knowledge of Thai be a requirement for a retirement visa is Thai-bubble talk.

I think popshirt makes some good points here.

When Thailand starts issuing five year and ten year IMMIGRANT visas to farang, with real property rights and working rights, Westerners without long-term Thai partners can start coming here in droves, learning Thai. Nobody's visa lasts long enough to become fluent this year.

This country is not very stable, politically. The language is useless outside Thailand except for 201 Thai-Japanese-Mandarin-English translators.

Good point, i think i would actualy think about getting way better in thai if i could get an actual visa.. or propriety right..

Thinking about the visa runs is such an extra stress in life here. its also a big old middle finger in the face from the thais

[onethailand]

I do not feel sorry for having learnt the language although I have to admit that to do so is not a business decision, rather something you do to feel more a part of the place and as a personal challenge.

The other night I went to see a three hour show with Note Udom Taepanich, a popular standup comedian. He had me in stitches for 2 hours with brilliant observations of human life in general, Thai life in particular, and even more specifically, Chiang Mai people idiosyncracies. The feeling of getting around 90% of the show without the help of a dictionary was great. But apart from such gems and the obvious comfort of knowing I can get by in everyday situations without using any other language, it is an ego-trip more than anything else.

Note is indeed special - he had me cracking up even when my Thai was barely rudimentary. Today my comprehension of Thai is pretty good, my spoken Thai passable but still a bit problematic with tones and grammar, but I have no problems communicating at all.

There is no need for you to learn Thai if you are visiting - but if you plan to live here, you will find it a lot easier if you do learn at least some Thai. A lot of people I know used to speak English with me, but no longer do so if they aren't comfortable, or equally mix Thai and English together. If anything, it makes them more comfortable knowing that if their English is not up to par at any point, they can fall back on Thai without missing a beat.

However, in response to the OP, it is definitely not rude if you don't or aren't able to speak Thai. My learning to speak Thai was for my convenience, not theirs.

[seancbk]

After 35 years in Hong Kong I don't speak Cantonese (or Mandarin). I know the Cantonese words for a lot of things but have never had lessons, so don't know how to form a sentence. Yes it does sometime embarrass me and I regret not learning when I was much younger, but it isn't an issue as the people I need to speak with all speak English.

However, when I'm living in Bangkok I plan to make a real effort to learn as much Thai as I can.

[egg6447]

I would find it very difficult to live in Thailand if I couldn't communicate with those around me in their language - at least some of the time. I have met Thais on a few occasions who have criticised long-term ex-pats for not making more of an effort to learn the language. The more Thai I learn the more interesting the place appears. I do sympathise with the OP about the move from intermediate to fluent - it isn't easy, but nobody said to me that it would be. I don't see the ability to speak Thai as something to boast about, but more as a means to get by.

the tv posts prove that falangs cant communicate with each other so falang to thai no chance. as another poster pointed out thai on thai cant communicate either. how do you get on with the concept of guarantee here, up to you, never mind ect all lines of b/s. me i communicate very well , a smile does it for me, and a angree face does the rest.lol.

[thairookie]

I've been told the opposite by Thai friends of mine that Thais will find you interesting if you can speak "a little bit" of Thai. This will give the Thai a sense of superiority that you're interested in "their" language but you're nowhere near their standard. In other words, they can be your teacher, and you know the Thais are the most prideful people that I've ever come across. Your learning Thai gives the Thais a sense of pride of themselves.

However, they don't like you to be fluent in your Thai because then the sense of superiority withers, and for most Thais who are always thinking of "exploiting" the farang dollars, it's the end of their business with you.

[wolfmanjack]

I have the same problem. I have had my wife pronounce several words in the 5 different tones and i can usually only tell 3 different pronunciations. There is no way i will ever be able to speak thai properly because of this. Even the words i use every day i do not pronounce right but the people around me have learned to know what i am trying to say. The words i do know makes it so that i can guess at what the thais are talking about half the time but i do not get all of the details. As time goes by i gradually learn new words so by the time i die I may be able to carry on a conversation in thai. For now it is up to my limited vocabulary and my dictionary.

Wolfmanjack, ask your wife to say certain words you're trying to learn slooooowly. You should be able to pick up the tones as long as you remember what those tones are. But I can understand being limited and resorting to a dictionary. Nothing wrong with that. Hopefully, it's a dictionary that that shows the Thai words. phrases in English. I think if you have the desire to learn it, and apply yourself to it, you can. It's not always easy, but it gets a little easier the more you use the language. Hang in there, keep trying, and good luck.

Thanks for the encouragement but i have resigned myself to learn by osmosis. My kids laughing when i try to speak thai does not help either. As for speaking slowly my wife does not have the patience to help me learn thai nor does she have any inclination to do so. In any case it would not do me too much good unless i could understand people when they spoke at their normal speeds. When i stayed in puerto rico i got to be able to read the newspaper in 3 months with no prior spanish but when people spoke i could not understsnd them due to the speed they spoke. Even though i knew the words and i could properly pronounce most words i could not understand what people were saying. I have the feeling thai would be worse.

[alantheembalmer]

For me, learning Thai is like resisting temptation. I know they are both worthy and admirable pursuits, but My God, they are both so difficult!

[Samuian]

Don't think it has anything to do with "rude" and it can't be the question really, if anyone lives in any foreign country, for any longer period then just a couple of month, or has decided to even settle, would simply do himself and the people who have to deal with her/him a great favor if one learns to communicate in the given language, doesn't have to be a PhD in linguistics!

But, depending on the Job and livin' circumstances, I feel much better to be able to communicate, in the shop, in the Taxi, with the clerk in an office.... simple communication is a wonderful thing!

It "opens many doors"!

I know many greetings, short phrases in several languages and it's always fun to bump into someone and use these... and look into a smiling face - it's an incredible icebreaker!

But then I like people, love other cultures and love to communicate!

"While in Rome, do as the Romans do!"

Besides it enriches ones own horizons quite a bit!

[garro]

I've been told the opposite by Thai friends of mine that Thais will find you interesting if you can speak "a little bit" of Thai. This will give the Thai a sense of superiority that you're interested in "their" language but you're nowhere near their standard. In other words, they can be your teacher, and you know the Thais are the most prideful people that I've ever come across. Your learning Thai gives the Thais a sense of pride of themselves.

However, they don't like you to be fluent in your Thai because then the sense of superiority withers, and for most Thais who are always thinking of "exploiting" the farang dollars, it's the end of their business with you.

I am guessing that your Thai is far from fluent or why else would you be claiming that all 61 million people all think the same?

[thairookie]

I've been told the opposite by Thai friends of mine that Thais will find you interesting if you can speak "a little bit" of Thai. This will give the Thai a sense of superiority that you're interested in "their" language but you're nowhere near their standard. In other words, they can be your teacher, and you know the Thais are the most prideful people that I've ever come across. Your learning Thai gives the Thais a sense of pride of themselves.

However, they don't like you to be fluent in your Thai because then the sense of superiority withers, and for most Thais who are always thinking of "exploiting" the farang dollars, it's the end of their business with you.

I am guessing that your Thai is far from fluent or why else would you be claiming that all 61 million people all think the same?

I didn't guess. I've been told by very close Thai friends of mine.

As for my fluency, I must admit I'm far from fluent. I can read and write though, enough to shock each and every Thai I've met (probably because they know I've been here for only 6 months) but not good enough for my own consumption.

Edited July 21, 2008 by thairookie

[garro]

I've been told the opposite by Thai friends of mine that Thais will find you interesting if you can speak "a little bit" of Thai. This will give the Thai a sense of superiority that you're interested in "their" language but you're nowhere near their standard. In other words, they can be your teacher, and you know the Thais are the most prideful people that I've ever come across. Your learning Thai gives the Thais a sense of pride of themselves.

However, they don't like you to be fluent in your Thai because then the sense of superiority withers, and for most Thais who are always thinking of "exploiting" the farang dollars, it's the end of their business with you.

I am guessing that your Thai is far from fluent or why else would you be claiming that all 61 million people all think the same?

I didn't guess. I've been told by very close Thai friends of mine.

As for my fluency, I must admit I'm far from fluent. I can read and write though, enough to shock each and every Thai I've met (probably because they know I've been here for only 6 months) but not good enough for my own consumption.

Well, your very close Thai friends have a very cynical attitude towards their own people and they are not representative of the Thais who I live and work with. The Thai people I know are delighted if a westerner takes the trouble to really learn the language. Perhaps you are referring to a certain type of Thai?

[Jingthing]

I thought I would learn Thai. Now I actually know less than when I moved here. Living in Pattaya, I find it useless. I don't need to bargain at markets and the Thai conversations I do understand sound so inane to me I feel the less I know, the happier I will be. To me and countless others, it is not worth the investment.

By the way, those of us on retirement visas are most certainly NOT immigrants to Thailand. We aren't even allowed to entertain that possibility, visa-wise. The suggestion that retirees be forced to learn Thai is ridiculous. I know of no country in the world that offers temporary retirement visas that requires language skills. Now if you are talking about language requirements for RESIDENCY status, yes, of course! Start to offer residency status to retirees here and then we can talk, maybe even in Thai ...

As far as the question, should we be embarrassed? No, you should not. Do so if that pleases you, and leave the rest of us who are not easily embarrassed in peace. Deal?

Another tip, if you are American, just say you are American and that is why you can't speak foreign languages ...

Edited July 21, 2008 by Jingthing