Lite Beer Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 If he is on an Extension from Immigration based on his job he is probably on overstay already. If his work permit is now cancelled.If he is on a Non Imm Visa obtained from a Consulate then he will still be ok on the Visa side of things. He can also get a 60 day extension from Immigration to visit his family. If he needs a stop gap. Really..can i get a 60 day extension without leaving the country and without having to get 7 day??how woul di get that and how much does it cost?? I am sorry about the fix you are in. You really have to sort out your immediate Visa situation. This all assumes that your Wife is Thai as you do not say. This is the new Police Order dealing with Extensions of stay. You need to look at 2.24. Also later you can get 12 month extensions to stay with your wife. Extensions are 1,900 Baht. You really do need to have a chat with Immigration as you will be on overstay if your Work Permit is now cancelled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 (edited) If he is on an Extension from Immigration based on his job he is probably on overstay already. If his work permit is now cancelled.If he is on a Non Imm Visa obtained from a Consulate then he will still be ok on the Visa side of things. He can also get a 60 day extension from Immigration to visit his family. If he needs a stop gap. Really..can i get a 60 day extension without leaving the country and without having to get 7 day??how woul di get that and how much does it cost?? I am sorry about the fix you are in. You really have to sort out your immediate Visa situation. This all assumes that your Wife is Thai as you do not say. This is the new Police Order dealing with Extensions of stay. You need to look at 2.24. Also later you can get 12 month extensions to stay with your wife. Extensions are 1,900 Baht. You really do need to have a chat with Immigration as you will be on overstay if your Work Permit is now cancelled. Every cloud has a silver lining hey..thanks for tha PDF Lite Beer, it is very helpful, yes both my wife and baby are Thai so i fit into 2.24..that is a relief that i can get the 60 day extension without leaving the country, in the unlikely event that i have not found a job by then can i renew that after 60 days or is it just a one off do you know??? i recieved the email from the MD on Saturday AM does that count as overstay as the One-Stop place isnt open on a sunday Alos does anybody know where i stand on if i dont return company property because they havent paid me my salarly, i will be pig sick if i have to return property knowing full well they havent paid me... Edited December 14, 2008 by 2008bangkok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lite Beer Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 It appears that your Wife is Thai. You need , Passport, Application Form, Marriage Certificate, Wife's ID Card and House Registration. Passport size photo. 1,900 Baht. Good idea to take the Wife and Child for a bit of sympathy. Application Form . Depending what has happened you may or may not have to pay an Overstay Fine. Have a talk with them. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lite Beer Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 i recieved the email from the MD on Saturday AM does that count as overstay as the One-Stop place isnt open on a sunday The rule was that you had to leave on the day that your job finished. But it looks like you now get 7 days. In the new Police Order. Anyway, overstay is 500 Baht a day. The 60 days appears to be a one time thing, but you never know. If you can, in the future get your Annual Extensions based on your family. Not your employment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuketRam Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 Dear Bangkok, Very interesting post and alot of good advice. Your letter of termination, valid, and the word "hereby" means instant termination, but it is missing the word "forthwith", the two words together means you quit instantly and waive your contractual rights. The way I interpret this is: You have resigned... which then means you must refer to your contract of employment. If you do not have a contract of employment then everyone is right, you get nothing... otherwise you will be entitled to your contractual rights, ie 2 weeks pay, etc. the company is bankrupt? multi national or thai company? this will make a difference if you wish to persue this further. But i believe whether you are right or not, you will not get paid anything. your visa, if you were on a multi entry b visa, everything should be ok, you have an exit date in your passport, ie every 90 days, then you exit on that day and provided you have time left on your visa then you will get another 90 days. if you did not leave every 90 days, then it will be revoked and you must leave under the laws already stated by other people. (i have not encountered this before so i can not comment) work permit, will be revoked which goes without saying.. Personnally I would have read the warning signs, when a boss would have handed me an open resignation letter, I would have looked for a new job instantly, because as sure as anything, as soon as you <deleted>..ed up, you were gone. in your case, the company gets in trouble and your gone the same. Unfortunate but reality. Summary: 1. sort your visa asap 2. get a new job 3. forget about persuing this further, even though you may have case. (Thai Law is better than say Singapore Law, but not as good as Europe when dealing with Foreign employment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 Sunday must be a day for the knowledable and helpful forum members..i must mate a note of this.. PhuketRam Lite beer thank you, i knew this was coming and even in September i had mentioned to my boss that i wanted to change my status from work to marrige, i wasnt very comfortable having that way but the boss was the type that was 'always right ' and even though i knew it wasnt the case he insisted that i couldnt work with a 'marrige status', so as i already had a fragile relationship with him i left it at that..i myself have told others on the forum to try and go for marrige before work, as far as the visa situation is concerend after Lite beers very helpful info and files i am cool with that. I know everybody should say just leave it it isnt worth it and they are right but there just is something not right about turning up for work one day to be told the company has liquidated and cannot pay last months salary, then one of the directors jets of to sunny Dubai while you then worry about paying for the babys food, i woul say that the very least they could do is at a minimum honor salarys, thats what people rely on more so when you live month to month like we do as a young family, that is why people work for an employer so they can have the security of wages/notice period/severance otherwise we would all work for ourselves. If anything i am very guilty and pig sick for not thinking ahead and have that rainy day saved especially as i am in Thailand. I do have a contract so i will do i upmost to just get what i am entilted to without jepadising my position. its a right crap timing aswell not onl y because of Xmas but also not many people employ over xmas.. Everything will come good but i hate core nasty people and belive me this guy is..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 Does anybody know how i stand regarding handing company property back if they havent paid me??? Does that become theft Think you find yourself in a bit of a mexican stand off on this one... Company will say...wont pay you till you return the company property, you say, wont return property until they pay you... Supose legally could be seen as theft, but seeing as the company is wrapping up, you could argue you are holding the property as part of a possible "settlement" Whether this becomes a case of theft or not wholly depends on the company if they choose to persue this with the police, if you where trying to play the moral high ground in light of a future court case to claim against the company for monies owed, you would of course return the property... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lite Beer Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 Get your Immigration Status sorted out first. Then have a go at the rest of the stuff if you want to. Personally I think you had good advise on Saturday as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 Does anybody know how i stand regarding handing company property back if they havent paid me??? Does that become theft Think you find yourself in a bit of a mexican stand off on this one... Company will say...wont pay you till you return the company property, you say, wont return property until they pay you... Supose legally could be seen as theft, but seeing as the company is wrapping up, you could argue you are holding the property as part of a possible "settlement" Whether this becomes a case of theft or not wholly depends on the company if they choose to persue this with the police, if you where trying to play the moral high ground in light of a future court case to claim against the company for monies owed, you would of course return the property... Hey Soutpeel I hear throught the grapevine that the threatning with police if not return letter is already in the post... it does make me laugh, i have sent 3 or 4 reply emails stating that when my final cheque is ready i will return the stuff no problem.... there is no way that i will hand the laptop and phone back without a cheque..especially as True have just put up one of those ' green wifi routers' close enough for me to get free internet in my bedroom! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 Get your Immigration Status sorted out first. Then have a go at the rest of the stuff if you want to.Personally I think you had good advise on Saturday as well. i Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuketRam Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 With regards the office equipment.. I understand that your immediate boss and directors are no longer in Thailand... Who would you return your company property to? If the company is no longer would you return it to an empty office? No... Express to your line of communication that you require someone to sign for the equipment in person... (this may cause them to say keep it), then you have not stolen it. e mails did not used to be admissable in court, a fax is a legal document, so i would fax a letter to the MD saying the equipment is in my possession and you wish a member of authority to sign for it in person. (then you may be able to discus your severance) keeping it as ransom is illegal, and so is the data held in the PC, databases etc. Honestly it is a tricky situation between morals, principles and business ethics, but keep yourself LEGAL. i would want to keep it as well, but it will bite you eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 Hey Soutpeel I hear throught the grapevine that the threatning with police if not return letter is already in the post... it does make me laugh, i have sent 3 or 4 reply emails stating that when my final cheque is ready i will return the stuff no problem.... there is no way that i will hand the laptop and phone back without a cheque..especially as True have just put up one of those ' green wifi routers' close enough for me to get free internet in my bedroom! If I was you I wouldnt be laughing if the letter is in the post, if this has or will be reported to the police, I would take this very seriously, as the situation is already complicated and you dont need it complicated further with the BiB, not trying to scare you but basically dealing with the BiB in Thailand, you are gulity until proven innocent and if the company has "encouraged" the BiB to get their property back, they are going to do their bit to either get the property back or put you in the monkey house Think of this in the BiB's eyes, you have resigned from the company, the proof is there -your letter, and you have "stolen" company property on leaving If you are on an overstay you better get your visa sorted out tomorrow..poste haste Yes you are in a bad situation, and contray to what you think, I do feel for you and what you are going through and am trying to help....dont make things possibly worse by than they already are by playing mexican stand off with the BIB, if you happen to get called for a face to face with the BiB at the cop shop and employer..turn up and discuss, dont ignore it as they can have an arrest warrant on you so quickly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 With regards the office equipment..I understand that your immediate boss and directors are no longer in Thailand... Who would you return your company property to? If the company is no longer would you return it to an empty office? No... Express to your line of communication that you require someone to sign for the equipment in person... (this may cause them to say keep it), then you have not stolen it. e mails did not used to be admissable in court, a fax is a legal document, so i would fax a letter to the MD saying the equipment is in my possession and you wish a member of authority to sign for it in person. (then you may be able to discus your severance) keeping it as ransom is illegal, and so is the data held in the PC, databases etc. Honestly it is a tricky situation between morals, principles and business ethics, but keep yourself LEGAL. i would want to keep it as well, but it will bite you eventually. Hey phuket ram.. This is where it is a bit tricky..the company is still technically open..the MD is the only one in the UK and the 2 directors are here in Thailand.. it is the 2 directors that told us they as shareholders (which the MD isnt) were closing the company, all of this crap is coming from the MD..apparently so the directors say it isnt thst easy to remove him from MD status as a BOI, i also think they are still trying to trade while they close the company to minimize their losses and who knows if they get a big order as 1 order can be as much as 2 or 4 million baht each then the directors might thing twice..i doubt it but they might. So therefore they can easily get somebody to collect and sign for the stuff... bear in mind that they promised to pay the poor thai receptionist last week and put the money straight into her bank and they didnt and that was only 15k..i have no chance Nope i think its gonna take the boys in brown to prize it out of my fingers before i hand it over.. the other scenario of course is if they send me a cheque and have taken off the full new amount for the laptop and phone..bear in mind they are knackered anyway, its more of a principal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 Hey Soutpeel I hear throught the grapevine that the threatning with police if not return letter is already in the post... it does make me laugh, i have sent 3 or 4 reply emails stating that when my final cheque is ready i will return the stuff no problem.... there is no way that i will hand the laptop and phone back without a cheque..especially as True have just put up one of those ' green wifi routers' close enough for me to get free internet in my bedroom! If I was you I wouldnt be laughing if the letter is in the post, if this has or will be reported to the police, I would take this very seriously, as the situation is already complicated and you dont need it complicated further with the BiB, not trying to scare you but basically dealing with the BiB in Thailand, you are gulity until proven innocent and if the company has "encouraged" the BiB to get their property back, they are going to do their bit to either get the property back or put you in the monkey house Think of this in the BiB's eyes, you have resigned from the company, the proof is there -your letter, and you have "stolen" company property on leaving If you are on an overstay you better get your visa sorted out tomorrow..poste haste Yes you are in a bad situation, and contray to what you think, I do feel for you and what you are going through and am trying to help....dont make things possibly worse by than they already are by playing mexican stand off with the BIB, if you happen to get called for a face to face with the BiB at the cop shop and employer..turn up and discuss, dont ignore it as they can have an arrest warrant on you so quickly... its a tricky one hey..you are completely right of course ad for the sake of 15k worth of tat its not worth any serious crap to contend with so if it came to it i would give it back... I will get my visa sorted pronto 2mw and take it from there..i suppose it all hinges on whether they can see through the letter and see the con for what it is.. bear in mind that 4 thais out of 7 have already complained to the labour place so there is some weight... I appreciate all help Soutpeel i really do..the truth just bugs sometimes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 Nope i think its gonna take the boys in brown to prize it out of my fingers before i hand it over.. the other scenario of course is if they send me a cheque and have taken off the full new amount for the laptop and phone..bear in mind they are knackered anyway, its more of a principal Dont play the hero, you mention principles, nice sentiment, but think about who may be dealings with, this is not the UK, US etc, there are no morals, principles or integrity.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 Could i ask a question of those who are participating in this thread.. Do you thing morally that they should honor paying salarys and what would you do if you was the director or MD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 Could i ask a question of those who are participating in this thread..Do you thing morally that they should honor paying salarys and what would you do if you was the director or MD? Morally yes....practically, the company is possibly undergoing liquidation therefore they going to minimise "expenditure" as much a possible in order to make sure they come out it ok...sad but true...but ends up in a situation of evey man for himself... Think of the news story from the US regarding the US car industry...the big 3 CEO's turn up in Washington in private jets, do you really think if the business's fail the CEO's are going to suffer the same as the "man" on the shopfloor....no way their "escape packages" are already in place if things do fail, do you really think the begging they are doing to the US congress for bail outs is to save the employees ?.....No way.... its more to do with stock options the CEO's hold in the companys, if the company fails their shares are worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 Could i ask a question of those who are participating in this thread..Do you thing morally that they should honor paying salarys and what would you do if you was the director or MD? Morally yes....practically, the company is possibly undergoing liquidation therefore they going to minimise "expenditure" as much a possible in order to make sure they come out it ok...sad but true...but ends up in a situation of evey man for himself... Think of the news story from the US regarding the US car industry...the big 3 CEO's turn up in Washington in private jets, do you really think if the business's fail the CEO's are going to suffer the same as the "man" on the shopfloor....no way their "escape packages" are already in place if things do fail, do you really think the begging they are doing to the US congress for bail outs is to save the employees ?.....No way.... its more to do with stock options the CEO's hold in the companys, if the company fails their shares are worthless. and this is the problem with limited liability companys.... people can come in run up maases of debt but walk away and still have their 3 or 4 million dollars personal untouched while hardworking joe average looses his house and struggled..aint right but thats another topic.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuketRam Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 bear in mind that 4 thais out of 7 have already complained to the labour place so there is some weight... Last Comment on this... They did not resign, and technically you did. They are Thai and protected under Thai Law which is president over Contractual Obligations, where as you are a foreign national, you do have some rights but not as strong as a thai. in singapore, foreign nationals have no rights if you are employed in middle management and above, as i found out when i argued with my boss over a fish dinner (I dont eat fish, lol), he fired me over a business lunch where he bought a big fish and i did not eat it. i was out of the country within 24hrs... lost my months money, lost my month in liew and lost 3 months deposit on a flat... so you are not on your own when this shit happens. i can laugh now, but it is an experience i wont forget and vowed never to enter singapore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2008bangkok Posted December 14, 2008 Author Share Posted December 14, 2008 bear in mind that 4 thais out of 7 have already complained to the labour place so there is some weight...Last Comment on this... They did not resign, and technically you did. They are Thai and protected under Thai Law which is president over Contractual Obligations, where as you are a foreign national, you do have some rights but not as strong as a thai. in singapore, foreign nationals have no rights if you are employed in middle management and above, as i found out when i argued with my boss over a fish dinner (I dont eat fish, lol), he fired me over a business lunch where he bought a big fish and i did not eat it. i was out of the country within 24hrs... lost my months money, lost my month in liew and lost 3 months deposit on a flat... so you are not on your own when this shit happens. i can laugh now, but it is an experience i wont forget and vowed never to enter singapore. and it just makes you wonder how secure we are as foreigners in another country..but i still would say its better than coventry!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 and it just makes you wonder how secure we are as foreigners in another country..but i still would say its better than coventry!! Most certainly better than Coventry and most of the other sh*tholes in the UK... ... Glad to say I havent have reason to go back to the UK in the 7 years I have been in Thailand, and if have my way, never want to see the place again if I can help it.. Contray to what a lot of the farangs on TV will try make you believe or believe themselves, Thailand or any other country were a foreigner resides are not secure unless you have citizenship or PR, On the whim of a goverment department everyone could be thrown out...its that simple. The trick I have learnt after 25 years of working all over the world is always have Plan A, Plan B and even possibly a plan C, should the SHTF were you currently are, try and make sure you have enough cash stashed in a bank account away from your current location, ie, outside of Thailand to keep you going for 3-6 months and always keep your options open and dont get too comfortable, because things can change for the worse in a heart beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torrenova Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 The OP is stuffed. Even if he could prove his case in his favour, there is no money to pay him it seems. I suggest he concentrate on his visa situation, accommodation and finances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWPattaya Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 (edited) I know it is a little late but have you cancelled your work permit with the labour department? That is your resposibilty not your ex-employers! You must notify them within one week of resigning, which is effectively what you have done. As regards anything else, let it drop. You are not going to get your job back, nor will you get any money. Hopefully when you cancel your work permit they will not revoke your visa thus enforcing you to leave. Edited December 29, 2008 by BWPattaya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 Since March of this year you do not have to turn in your work permit. It is the employers responsibility to notify the labour department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Hopefully when you cancel your work permit they will not revoke your visa thus enforcing you to leave. The OP is on an extension of stay....his "visa" went the day he "resigned"...24 hours to bail Dodge city, and if you read what he has written looks like he is on an overstay as well.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badbanker Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 (edited) Retention of company property after one has left/resigned/fired from a company is theft and punishable by 3-7 years of imprisonment depending on the value of the property. Do not try to keep the property and us it as a negotiating chip. It doesn't work! Unless all the company directors have fled. Return property ASAP and sue in a labour court and you will win the case easily! Don't put a gun to your own head! BB Edited December 30, 2008 by Badbanker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snuggzzz Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 Some very sound advice, look after yourself and family, get visa sorted. look for new job. Wipe your mouth and return Goods. Never again compromise yourself by signing resignation letter. Do not get involved any further with the firm because it will be costly, both financially and emotionally. Put it down to life's 'rich pattern of experiences'........................................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 And don't get pissed at company do's again!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryLH Posted December 30, 2008 Share Posted December 30, 2008 It's been awhile since the OP has posted. It's been over a week since he was going to contact someone about this. Surely he hasn't forgotten to let us know what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 It's been awhile since the OP has posted. It's been over a week since he was going to contact someone about this. Surely he hasn't forgotten to let us know what happened. Do they have internet cafes in the Bangkok Hilton ??....if he took on the BiB on over the company property guess thats where he could be right now.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
.thumb.jpg.bc523c85a8d558dbc282dca7a2e602c9.jpg)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now