Motorcycle Accident In Nakhonsawon

[dotcom]

Mate. It's a trumped up case.

Fake.

The guy didn't do anything wrong.

Wrong place wrong time.

He is getting butt raped with no Vasoline.

Welcome to land of scams.

[dotcom]

It is the age we live in. I fell down a flight of stairs & I need to blame someone else for my stupidity.

In the usa you can say "Land of Lawyers"

The Eagles wrote a song about this.

Some nitwit commits suicide but the family wants someone to pay.

About 10 lifetimes of wages.

Have you never heard stories of foreigners killing camels in Dubai? A $1000 camel is suddenly worth $50,000.

[BigBikeBKK]

Mate. It's a trumped up case.

Fake.

The guy didn't do anything wrong.

Wrong place wrong time.

He is getting butt raped with no Vasoline.

Welcome to land of scams.

Wow DotCom, all those spaces really add to your post... NOT! More likely they reflect the big empty spaces in your geriatric cranium... "butt raped with no Vasoline"... Um, ok- sounds like you're talking from experience there- lovely image. If you hate the "Land of scams" so much why are you still here? Just wonderin'...

[dotcom]

So good to see you little bike Bangkok.

I'm here & you are NOT !!!! As it should be.

[CroBiker]

d) Get your passport, get out, change you ID and re-enter, it's not that well checked.

This scheme doesn't work anymore. I entered Thailand on 2 different passports (dual citizenship) and they figured me out through date of birth records in computer.

Crobiker is 100% correct, they have total control now with the system they got in place so forget it.

Cheers Bard

Its not true guys.. I am not going to go into details but have direct personal experience..

Go home, change name, fresh passport.. return.. Works !!

Of course you need to have a separation from your old addresses, associations and whatnot.. Its complex.

Of course it is possible if you come up with brand new identity, not disputing that.

I came with another passport and immigration officer asked me what happened with other passport? Didn't deny it but asked him how he knows and he showed me on his PC screen: identical name and date of birth but different nationality. It happened at Sadao/Bukit Kayu Hitam border crossing of all places....

[mickba]

d) Get your passport, get out, change you ID and re-enter, it's not that well checked.

This scheme doesn't work anymore. I entered Thailand on 2 different passports (dual citizenship) and they figured me out through date of birth records in computer.

Crobiker is 100% correct, they have total control now with the system they got in place so forget it.Cheers Bard

Its not true guys.. I am not going to go into details but have direct personal experience..

Go home, change name, fresh passport.. return.. Works !!

Of course it is possible if you come up with brand new identity, not disputing that.

I came with another passport and immigration officer asked me what happened with other passport? Didn't deny it but asked him how he knows and he showed me on his PC screen: identical name and date of birth but different nationality...........

Possible today maybe, but not for much longer with the RFID chip embedded in new passports and due for completion UK and most western countries around 2010. I doubt Thailand will be far behind but in any case the readers will be available to them. Bar codes have been running for about 5 years but the chips will contain photo', fingerprints maybe and anything else they have on you.

[Briggsy]

............I don't understand why the post has been moved to from general to this forum, the post is more about the court system and the legal implications than about motorbikes................

I agree. I didn't spot the post that said this had been moved. Which moderator speed read this and shifted it. With respect, it is much too important a topic to be restricted to the m/bike forum.

Seconded. Don't ban me please.

[Macx]

And third-ed.

Back to General Forum, please.

[Lite Beer]

And third-ed.

Back to General Forum, please.

Granted.

[Maigo6]

Bar codes have been running for about 5 years but the chips will contain photo', fingerprints maybe and anything else they have on you.

You will get fingerprinted and photographed at immigration in Japan.

I can see that becoming the norm for all countries in the future.

[yabaaaa]

Apart from skipping country, which i would have done along time ago! have you got your embassy involved ? is this a civil or criminal matter? Why not get the press involved? this could work in 2 ways, 1 way would publicse your case showing that you have done nothing wrong and it was not your fault and now you are being extorted which would not look good on thailands image, which we all know they do not like that!!. Or it could have a negative effect and have people queing up at the road waiting for a farang to drive past!. Also would have thought it would have been a good idea to get your lawyer to go through previous cases, thai on thai for the same situation to see what was paid, alot less i bet! Use these files and cases as ethier a defence in your case or a counter offer to the family! Best of luck and will be waiting to see what happens! This could happen to any of us! What about sueing the insurer??

My wife tells me people are already doing accidents like this for money and surely as the economy worsend this year they will increase

[Maigo6]

Back on Topic.....

2 young girls on a motorcycle were killed on a road very near my house, they were only 14 - 15 years old, the girl who was riding the motorcycle was a beginner and apparantly as she came to the main road, went straight out in front of a pick up, both girls dead, one was my neighbour.

The driver of the Pick up was Thai, he has also had to pay the Families of the girls, I don't know exactly how much, but whatever the cost, he still had to pay, even though it was not his fault.

It's the way it is, this could happen to any one of us Farangs who drive in Thailand, or in a case that happened to me, even ride a motorcycle and you hit a pedestrian who staggers into the road in front of you.

This is a great thread that has certainly got my attention and makes me realize how my whole life could change in the blink of an eye.

[yabaaaa]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

[Moonrakers]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

Indeed it is.

I drive myself and this is always in the back of my mind, and is probably one reason why I tend to shout profanities at stupid motorbike drivers so much.

[Scott]

I've been here quite a while and have read too many news articles etc. about accidents and it has scared me into driving decently. I putter along at the speed limit (or close). Stop at pedestrian cross walks--if there are people actually crossing and the traffic isn't going 120 kph behind me. I yield the right-of-way a lot. I know if I hit one of those crazy, stupid, unlicensed bast*rds, I will be the one who has to pay. Even if I am right.

[mickba]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

Don't doubt it for a second! - esp if you drive big car - this is the Thai system.

You may think you're all ticketyboo - Thai licence, fully insured (haha) vehicle in perfect order, driving perfectly etc etc - but as the post says above, your life can change in the blink of an eye.

It really can put you off driving a car once you've had a taste of it. I have car and bike but bike is first choice because there's less risk (of big blame/claim I mean - I know more chance of getting killed but....).

I say again what I was told "big car hit small motorbike - big car can pay" and double it for farang.

[warfie]

I'm still unclear of the circumstances of the original accident... what happened?

Whatever happened, this story, and related stories in this thread and others only increase my feeling of "why bother having any road rules at all?"

I mean, if in the event of an accident, "big pays small" or "rich pays poor" then effectively the motorbike always has right-of-way.

Does this mean that if an unlicensed Thai is riding a un-roadworthy motorbike, in the wrong lane, on the wrong side of the road, at night, no lights, through a red light, drunk, speeding, turns a corner without indicating and crashes into my parked car.... I am at fault? I wonder who would be "at fault" if it was the judges car...

[frtiz]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

I always drive myself in Thailand, doing quite a fair bit of KMs a year, somewhere around 60K a year. Hit a parked motorbike couple of weeks ago, my wife said, drive, beat it, don't stop. No one got hurt, no damage, if they see your white face they'll wreck the bike in a second and you'll end up paying.

It definitely makes you think about the reality of living here in the LOS. Still good but you gotta take precautions.

[Maigo6]

I say again what I was told "big car hit small motorbike - big car can pay" and double it for farang.

I met a woman from Laos, she has a truck in Vientianne.

She was stationary at a junction a motorcycle crashed into the back of her truck and she had to pay as her truck was bigger than his motorcycle, even though she was stationary and he crashed into her through negligence.

[Maigo6]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

I always drive myself in Thailand, doing quite a fair bit of KMs a year, somewhere around 60K a year. Hit a parked motorbike couple of weeks ago, my wife said, drive, beat it, don't stop. No one got hurt, no damage, if they see your white face they'll wreck the bike in a second and you'll end up paying.

It definitely makes you think about the reality of living here in the LOS. Still good but you gotta take precautions.

So it was you who hit my bike and fled the scene !

5000 Baht will cover it mate, no worries.

[frtiz]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

I always drive myself in Thailand, doing quite a fair bit of KMs a year, somewhere around 60K a year. Hit a parked motorbike couple of weeks ago, my wife said, drive, beat it, don't stop. No one got hurt, no damage, if they see your white face they'll wreck the bike in a second and you'll end up paying.

It definitely makes you think about the reality of living here in the LOS. Still good but you gotta take precautions.

So it was you who hit my bike and fled the scene !

5000 Baht will cover it mate, no worries.

Jeezzz you must be a real poor bastard to ride an old crappy bike like the one I hit. I'll give you the 5K so you can afford one without tie rips and duct tape.

[DC1066]

Best of luck to the OP with this one.

I echo the thoughts above about how easily it is to change your life in an instant through this sort of thing.

I guess I'm pretty typical of many who come to Thailand. I've got a full bike license back in the UK, but ride completely differently in Thailand - no helmut, shorts and flip flops and generally spend my time on a bike larking around.

I come home and joke about the rules - minimum of 4 people on a bike; driving on the left is just a suggestion etc, etc.

But the more you are doing it, the more you realise you are playing Russian roulette. Sooner or later it will catch up with you - even if you are riding correctly.

Like most things you do in Thailand, know the rules, understand how the system works and be aware of the potential consequences if things go wrong.

It doesn't mean you never get on a bike, or in a car, or never have fun in Thailand, because you've still got to get on with life, but make sure you know your options if the worst happens.

[G54]

I'm still unclear of the circumstances of the original accident... what happened?

Whatever happened, this story, and related stories in this thread and others only increase my feeling of "why bother having any road rules at all?"

I mean, if in the event of an accident, "big pays small" or "rich pays poor" then effectively the motorbike always has right-of-way.

Does this mean that if an unlicensed Thai is riding a un-roadworthy motorbike, in the wrong lane, on the wrong side of the road, at night, no lights, through a red light, drunk, speeding, turns a corner without indicating and crashes into my parked car.... I am at fault? I wonder who would be "at fault" if it was the judges car...

What rules?

The OP as I said before, is being ripped off in a massive way. Best to him in getting a sensible resolution.

40,000 for a death. No more.

You could always run down and kill all the family. 40k a person has to be cheaper than 14 million for one

[mrtoad]

It seems to me a very scary thread if this IS the reality of life in Thailand.

Indeed it is.

I drive myself and this is always in the back of my mind, and is probably one reason why I tend to shout profanities at stupid motorbike drivers so much.

Like the new name.

On a serious note, tis topic is certainly a scary one, and makes you think twice about getting behind the wheel.

[true blue]

i was sitting in resturant in chan klan rd,chiang mai when drunken thai man on m/cycle, ran up the back of my car parked outside,thai g/f rang insurance guy, he there in 20 min, pulled thai man over the coals, took his id card, gave me report got my car fixed in garage next day. guess i was lucky, having thai with you helps though

[astral]

40,000 for a death. No more.

You could always run down and kill all the family. 40k a person has to be cheaper than 14 million for one

The government set the value at 50,000 as paid by the compulsory insurance.

[Zzinged]

Although I'm not sure how many cases like this happen a year, I think this one is newsworthy. Might wanna try to get the news media in on this perhaps? I'm sure that if you've got the innocence on this case and the details are replayed accurately the public would side with you. =\ Good luck to you though mate, it's a bummer of a thing that dam_n family has done.

[ray23]

Ok I have been involved twice with the Thai legal system, both times I was treated fairly. But I also had an attorney who specialized in working with farrangs

I personally have no fear of the Thai legal system. Others may have had or heard of other things, but these are experiences I have had.

Me I would be very careful in the circumstances you are in. I would want to know I had legal representation, that I could communicate with and fully trust.

Is the lawyer good or bad I have no idea and can not comment about that.

I would also assume right about know you pretty worried, I would talk to my own lawyer, if I didn't trust what I was hearing. I would change simple as that. To much to lose here. Bangkok lawyers are just lawyers, next.

The only thing that bothered me in your comment was your lawyer seeming to be concerned that a Bangkok lawyer was getting involved. What bothers me is sounds like a lack confidence, not what I would want. But you were there not me.

As to what the court is going to do, no lawyer can tell you that. They have to wait for a ruling and go from there.

You know it is what it is, greedy people are everywhere. They can ask for anything doesn't mean they are going to get it.

I would really like to know the name of the insurance company, sounds like the only thing they did for you was take your premium. I would really like to avoid that company. The arrest concerns me. Might be wrong but I just can't see that if some negligence on your part was not present.

Might be a common practise here I don't know. I know in my accident both vehicles were impounded until a settelement was agreed a upon. So you had no settlement maybe that is why the arrest.

How much bail did you have to come up with?

Personally right about now if I were in your shoes I would be scared whittless at this moment.

A few things to think about.

One being arrested does no mean your guilty, only a court can decide that. You will have a right to an appeal.

On the civil side of the matter, that might take 12 years to go through. On every civil case court fees have to be paid, the first one as I recall the filing is somewhere around 60K. I won on my case the Thai filed an appeal two years ago he paid to file the appeal I don't remember how much but it was more then me. I had to pay to answer. Hasn't been ruled on yet. It's in the Appelate level now. With as busy as these courts are in Thailand today, I don't even expect a ruling this year. Aftre that there is still another level of appeal, he losses agian I fully expect him to appeal and I know I will. In any event both of us will have to pay court fees.

Don't expect things to happen quickly they are not going to.

I won't speak as to anything else it would be conjecture on my part. I know this through personal experience.

Do the best you can for yourself and I wish you ,luck. I would give the attorney's name. But she married a cliente and retired

By the way what I saw in the Thai court system was not really that much different then what I saw in the states.

[mickba]

Ok I have been involved twice with the Thai legal system,

I would really like to know the name of the insurance company, ................................................................................

....How much bail did you have to come up with?

On the civil side of the matter, that might take 12 years to go through. On every civil case court fees have to be paid, ...............................With as busy as these courts are in Thailand today, I don't even expect a ruling this year. Aftre that there is still another level of appeal, he losses agian I fully expect him to appeal and I know I will. In any event both of us will have to pay court fees.

Don't expect things to happen quickly they are not going to.

Thai court system was not really that much different then what I saw in the states.

Hi, you've taken the trouble to provide a long and often interesting post, but apparently you've haven't read through the others and you've missed the OP's other post/s, where the answers to some of your questions are given.

I imagine the OP would be interested in your experiences, though the time frame you suggest is scary considering he suspects the family will try to have him incarserated pending the result. Maybe it's tactics to persuade him to settle, but it's very very scary.

Also I still haven't understood, is there the risk of a penalty for the offence he's charged with, over and above the compensation? One poster quoted Article 209, with a jail sentence of 3 + years! Is that a possibility?

I agree with the poster who suggests getting the western media involved. It might work but I don't know how the Thai courts would react to such pressure.

It's a pity there doesn't seem more that concerned TV members can do.

[kartman]

Can i put my hand up to being in a accident and getting money from the injured motorcyclist, as follows-

About 5 years ago driving with the wife on a semi rural road in Chiang Mai aproaching a blind right hand bend(curve) two motorbikes appeared(125 Sonic type) racing each other, the outer one in a lovley "Rossi" style drift towards my side of the road unfortuently when he saw me coming the other way the Rossi connection disapeared the brakes were hit and a broadside into the front of my vehicle(NV)was the result.

The rider jumped up from the front bumper area and promptly disapeared again i got out and found him rolling about on the verge in intense pain after finding out standing and a broken pelvis are not compatable, a ambulance and Police were called, the first officer on seeing falang driver involved called his superior to attend while doing the white spray outline of the bike imbeded in the wrecked front bumper area. When the Police area chief came the crash scene was appraised and and luckily the gouge from the bikes footrest starting on the other side of the road to the front of the NV noted, details were checked IDP at the time and i was told to report to the police station in two days to sort it all out.

Upon attending the station with the riders wife(he was obviously still in hospital) the decision was that i was completely blameless and the motorcyclist would have to pay for the damage done to my vehicle. I ended up with enough money to replace the front bumper so i must be very lucky .