Empty Condo Units In Bangkok

[Komerican]

I live in a new buildng in Sukhumvit area and when I bought my unit, close to the completion, I was informed that only handful of units were available. It has been almost 6 month since the completion but only about 100 units are either occupied or being fitted to move in. There are almost 260 units that are still vacant. I don't know, for sure, whether these units are sold or not.

I was wondering how other buildings in Bangkok are faring and if the 2/3 of units are not selling what happens to the value of the building?

Edited April 1, 2009 by Komerican

[trogers]

I was wondering how other buildings in Bangkok are faring and if the 2/3 of units are not selling what happens to the value of the building?

Just take a drive down Sukhumvit Soi 24 at 9pm and see how many units of the many high end condos/apartments are lit. Go to their front offices and ask how much rental rates are, and you know why.

Value will only fall when the project owner has no holding power - more likely, the unsold units of your condo will be sold later fully fitted but at the same price that you have paid. Thus, it is a fall in value cloaked as price as before but with 'themp' or extras being offered.

In the mean time, take care the project owner is not siphoning the sinking fund you have paid to pay for maintenance due to the many unsold units.

[MJo]

I guess the units are all "sold". Meaning small deposit has been paid couple of years ago off plan. However the units are not likely to be transferred to the buyers meaning final balance of the purchase price has not been paid to the developer.

Many possible reasons:

- speculators not able to sell the contract prior completion, no intention or no means to transfer it in their own name

- buyer does not qualify for bank loan with more strick control nowdays

- all units transferred but with the slow rental market thais are not in a hurry to fit them out to be ready to rent

- .....

Ask your developer how many units are transferred (fully paid) and how many of those have paid their maintenance fees. As trogers said be aware that they might spend the sinking fund to compensate lacking maintenance and management fees.

Also you might want to ask how many transferred units actually have tenants registered and living in the premises. Gives you indication on how many of the transferred units are sitting empty and for rent or sale. Thais are notorious not to pay single baht on maintenance fees if the units are not rented out and making money.

IMO it is interesting situation, if the global depression drags on. How long it takes for developers to call it quits and when they do what are their actions ?

- repo units failing to transfer and try to rent them out ?

- repo units failing to transfer and trying to sell them at discount ?

- give people a break and maintain the property and hope the market picks up before they go bust ?

- ....

Zorro and Midas, try to behave

[midas]

Gives you indication on how many of the transferred units are sitting empty and for rent or sale. Thais are notorious not to pay single baht on maintenance fees if the units are not rented out and making money.

Spot on !

Condominium buildings here can hardly be described as being built to an excellent standard

anyway so why couldn't values of condominiums fall if the majority of maintenance payments

are unable to be collected? There were so many examples dotted around the city

after the 1997 crisis where large numbers of empty shell units were locked up for six or seven years in some cases.

Over time -these buildings then started to look quite shoddy as standards fell.

When trogers comes up with statements like " more likely, the unsold units of your condo will be sold

later fully fitted but at the same price that you have paid ". Don't hold your breath

Ask yourself who are likely to be the buyers in the foreseeable future? Thai's -when the economy

is still getting weaker every month......... Foreigners ? - if by some miracle farangs have

money to invest why what they want to continue looking to Thailand necessarily when there

are now just as many condominiums available for sale in other neighbouring countries

-Singapore, China, Malaysia Vietnam -there is nothing to suggest Bangkok is a "must have "destination?

Edited April 1, 2009 by midas

[quiksilva]

Gives you indication on how many of the transferred units are sitting empty and for rent or sale. Thais are notorious not to pay single baht on maintenance fees if the units are not rented out and making money.

Spot on !

Condominium buildings here can hardly be described as being built to an excellent standard

anyway so why couldn't values of condominiums fall if the majority of maintenance payments

are unable to be collected? There were so many examples dotted around the city

after the 1997 crisis where large numbers of empty shell units were locked up for six or seven years in some cases.

Over time -these buildings then started to look quite shoddy as standards fell.

Agreed.

Its also worth noting that Thais can take an absolute age to decorate their units. For example I was the first to move into my house in the street of my estate, we were there for two years before the other owners finished their decoration and moved in, we have been there three years and now its fully occupied all by the original purchasers. This is not an uncommon occurrence, which is why I dont hold much value in these lights at night guestimates, that so many refer to.

When trogers comes up with statements like " more likely, the unsold units of your condo will be sold

later fully fitted but at the same price that you have paid ". Don't hold your breath

Ask yourself who are likely to be the buyers in the foreseeable future? Thai's -when the economy is still getting weaker every month......... Foreigners ? - if by some miracle farangs have money to invest why what they want to continue looking to Thailand necessarily when there

are now just as many condominiums available for sale in other neighbouring countries

-Singapore, China, Malaysia Vietnam -there is nothing to suggest Bangkok is a "must have "destination?

You could equally say that there is nothing special about any of those countries, unless you had some interest there...

Midas, I know you believe the economy will take decades to recover, if ever, and that's fine, we will have to agree to disagree on that point. I am firmly in the opposite camp. I accept that the economy is weak now and will get weaker still, but I also believe that we will emerge from this quicker than you expect, and the actual realisation will most probably emerge somewhere between our views.

[Komerican]

Just informed by the management company that of the vacant units about 200 of them are arlready transferred. I guess that is a good news.

I bought the condo to live in full time. So I am not really concerned about how the real estate market is effected by worldside recession.

But I am worried about how the management or the co-owners will maintain the building. I was told most of the Thai that purchased the units did so for the investment purpose and if they are not rented out and owners are not willing to pay the maintenance fee or association fee, then, I am worried that the building will not be maintained properly and loose the value in long-term.

[Komerican]

Just take a drive down Sukhumvit Soi 24 at 9pm and see how many units of the many high end condos/apartments are lit.

I can see all the empty units on soi 24 from my window. Some nights it looks like a gost town.

[mark5335]

Just informed by the management company that of the vacant units about 200 of them are arlready transferred. I guess that is a good news.

I bought the condo to live in full time. So I am not really concerned about how the real estate market is effected by worldside recession.

But I am worried about how the management or the co-owners will maintain the building. I was told most of the Thai that purchased the units did so for the investment purpose and if they are not rented out and owners are not willing to pay the maintenance fee or association fee, then, I am worried that the building will not be maintained properly and loose the value in long-term.

Try to get onto your condo's Co-Owners Committee which should provide you with an avenue to monitor these concerns. All the co-owners would have paid their first year's common charges upfront so it would be interesting to check status of payments after the second year's common charges become due & payable.

My condo just entered it's second year. We have 108 units in total (all transferred, about 50% occupied by co-owners, 40% tenanted and 10% vacant). At our Co-Owners AGM last month, there was only 6 units out 108 who had not paid their second year's common charges. I guess that some of the slow payers would be the owners of the 10 vacant units. We mentioned during the AGM that, in accordance with the Condo Act, interest will be charged on the arrears, and common services to those units curtailed...since then I think the arrears has been paid up.

Edited April 1, 2009 by mark5335

[namoo]

I can see all the empty units on soi 24 from my window. Some nights it looks like a gost town.

Actually I dont think thats a good indication. Over the last couple of weeks Ive looked to rent a condo in the newer builds and a couple of the older buildings in soi 24 and to be honest on the rental market there are not that many available on that soi.

According to the agent most are bought cash and left empty by the owners who intend to sell them for profit in the future rather than live there or indeed rent them out.

[midas]

You could equally say that there is nothing special about any of those countries, unless you had some interest there...

Midas, I know you believe the economy will take decades to recover, if ever, and that's fine, we will have to agree to disagree on that point. I am firmly in the opposite camp. I accept that the economy is weak now and will get weaker still, but I also believe that we will emerge from this quicker than you expect, and the actual realisation will most probably emerge somewhere between our views.

quicksilva you are supposed to be a real estate expert and yet you have such tunnel vision regarding your " product "

in Thailand. I'm just pointing out even since the last downturn in 1997 there are now equally attractive investment

destinations in other nearby countries. There is nothing so special about Thailand either to buy real estate

and in fact some of those other countries are not affected by such political uncertainty.

I really don't know if the economy will take decades to recover but I do

believe even if it does recover more quickly, the financial conditions we are left with will be so dramatically different

that the Bangkok condominium market will still be subdued for a long time. The condominium market

in Bangkok benefited from an extreme relaxation of lending standards globally. When I start seeing a tangible increase

in real wages in Thailand and around the world so once again there can be a more sensible relationship between income

levels that now appear to be effectively frozen and affordability- only then will I concede there can

be a chance for things to settle down. Right now I only see things continuing to slip further

as you indeed admit yourself.

Can you explain your rationale behind your statement " but I also believe that we will emerge from this quicker than you expect "

Why an how ?

[sorensen]

There is actually rock solid statistics available for "empty" condo units in Bangkok. It is based on electric consumption and compiled by EGAT. Say, if the electric consumption is zero for a set period of time, then the unit is counted as empty.

I don't have a link handy, but just read it a few years back in BKK Post's yearly financial report.

Robert

[TexasRanger]

Since building the house I wanted to move to a cheaper condo as I only use it a few days a month, found one and rang my landlady to give notice and straight away she matched the price of the cheaper condo just to keep us in there.

A renters market to be sure and i saved about 10K a month. Nice

[midas]

Actually I dont think thats a good indication. Over the last couple of weeks Ive looked to rent a condo in the newer builds and a couple of the older buildings in soi 24 and to be honest on the rental market there are not that many available on that soi.

According to the agent most are bought cash and left empty by the owners who intend to sell them for profit in the future rather than live there or indeed rent them out.

Here we go again! Similar reaction to what happened after 1997. But how long can these owners wait this time before they realise the credit fueled

growth of earlier years is not going to come back for for longtime .

Edited April 1, 2009 by midas

[trogers]

Since building the house I wanted to move to a cheaper condo as I only use it a few days a month, found one and rang my landlady to give notice and straight away she matched the price of the cheaper condo just to keep us in there.

A renters market to be sure and i saved about 10K a month. Nice

Older properties (building of over 3 years) are more sensitive to tenants vacating the premises, and can offer higher discounts as their investment costs are lower (by 30% or more) than those that were transferred within the last year. But at the same time, you will not be getting a well furbished unit, as the owner will be counting pennies.

New properties (transferred within the last year) are more resilient, as mentioned, many are paid for with cash and not through a mortgage. Many of these owners will have a minimum rental value in mind, below which they rather leave it vacant than to have someone depreciate its interior and fittings. Thus, the reason why many high end condo units are not occupied.

[cclub75]

I live in a new buildng in Sukhumvit area and when I bought my unit, close to the completion, I was informed that only handful of units were available. It has been almost 6 month since the completion but only about 100 units are either occupied or being fitted to move in. There are almost 260 units that are still vacant. I don't know, for sure, whether these units are sold or not.

I was wondering how other buildings in Bangkok are faring and if the 2/3 of units are not selling what happens to the value of the building?

Welcome to the thai property Wonderland.

What you describe could be (should be!) shared by anyone living in Bangkok with an ounce of common sense.

And the solution to this mystery is easy : those "empty-no-light-at-night" units are sold. No doubt about that !

-Rich thai who don't give a hoot (for them a condo is a mere "bank account")

-Delusional people who think they would be able to rent their unit finger in the nose (bad luck : 234435448 other people are thinking exactly the same with their own units)

-gamblers who are waiting for suckers (PC = "good luck") who will buy their units with price times 2

etc. etc. etc.

The causes are not really important if you think about it.

What matters is that the condo market in Bangkok is definitely not what we can call a "healthy market".

Of course, many people will deny this.

But I stick to my point : to build condos who will not be used (rented out or owner living inside) doesn't make any sense.

Eventually, all the "healthy markets" of this kind.... collapse.

We don't like it, we refuse it, but it's just what history teaches us... Difficult to fight history.

Ah of course, I should apologize... I forgot the official motto : "no problem, because this time it's different".

The suckers had exactly the same motto for : stock markets, GM, Lehman, AIG, debt markets you name it. "This time it's different".

Edited April 1, 2009 by cclub75

[midas]

Ah of course, I should apologize... I forgot the official motto : "no problem, because this time it's different".

The suckers had exactly the same motto for : stock markets, GM, Lehman, AIG, debt markets you name it. "This time it's different".

A bit like Jim Cramer telling people to keep buying Bear Stearns - it will not go broke !

[midas]

New properties (transferred within the last year) are more resilient, as mentioned, many are paid for with cash and not through a mortgage. Many of these owners will have a minimum rental value in mind, below which they rather leave it vacant than to have someone depreciate its interior and fittings. Thus, the reason why many high end condo units are not occupied.

BUT for how long can they be " resilient " this time around?

A minimum rental value from Japanese or other expat executives on huge company packages -oh yeah -I wonder when they are going to come back?

I cannot think of any other country in which investors totally ignore the income potential from an asset and concentrate

soley on the hope of capital gain ................

[trogers]

I cannot think of any other country in which investors totally ignore the income potential from an asset and concentrate

soley on the hope of capital gain ................

Try Singapore and HK. What are the prices of their high end condos and the rental value? What kind of property tax do they charge? I know property tax in Singapore is at 19% of annual value, irregardless of whether it is rented out or left vacant.

[midas]

I cannot think of any other country in which investors totally ignore the income potential from an asset and concentrate

soley on the hope of capital gain ................

Try Singapore and HK. What are the prices of their high end condos and the rental value? What kind of property tax do they charge? I know property tax in Singapore is at 19% of annual value, irregardless of whether it is rented out or left vacant.

I don't think he would find many astute Singaporean

or Hong Kong investors in those two cities prepared to sit on an empty shell property year after year.

Even if the tenants did cause wear and tear you can still refurbish again but at least

in the meantime you are getting an income-to forego that seems illogical

[trogers]

I cannot think of any other country in which investors totally ignore the income potential from an asset and concentrate

soley on the hope of capital gain ................

Try Singapore and HK. What are the prices of their high end condos and the rental value? What kind of property tax do they charge? I know property tax in Singapore is at 19% of annual value, irregardless of whether it is rented out or left vacant.

I don't think he would find many astute Singaporean

or Hong Kong investors in those two cities prepared to sit on an empty shell property year after year.

Even if the tenants did cause wear and tear you can still refurbish again but at least

in the meantime you are getting an income-to forego that seems illogical

I just spent Bt12,000/m2 and 6 months to refurbished my 121 m2 condo for leasing - and it is not high end deluxe finishing. Cost to furbish a high end unit would range from Bt16,000 to Bt20,000/m2.

Depreciate the total cost in 5 years and divide the annual cost by 12. That's just the cost for refurbishment, not counting return of investment. Why would I rent out the unit if offered rent is barely above this cost? The time and effort and lost of potential rent due to time required to refurbish again.

[quiksilva]

You could equally say that there is nothing special about any of those countries, unless you had some interest there...

Midas, I know you believe the economy will take decades to recover, if ever, and that's fine, we will have to agree to disagree on that point. I am firmly in the opposite camp. I accept that the economy is weak now and will get weaker still, but I also believe that we will emerge from this quicker than you expect, and the actual realisation will most probably emerge somewhere between our views.

quicksilva you are supposed to be a real estate expert and yet you have such tunnel vision regarding your " product "

in Thailand. I'm just pointing out even since the last downturn in 1997 there are now equally attractive investment

destinations in other nearby countries. There is nothing so special about Thailand either to buy real estate

and in fact some of those other countries are not affected by such political uncertainty.

I really don't know if the economy will take decades to recover but I do

believe even if it does recover more quickly, the financial conditions we are left with will be so dramatically different

that the Bangkok condominium market will still be subdued for a long time. The condominium market

in Bangkok benefited from an extreme relaxation of lending standards globally. When I start seeing a tangible increase

in real wages in Thailand and around the world so once again there can be a more sensible relationship between income

levels that now appear to be effectively frozen and affordability- only then will I concede there can

be a chance for things to settle down. Right now I only see things continuing to slip further

as you indeed admit yourself.

Can you explain your rationale behind your statement " but I also believe that we will emerge from this quicker than you expect "

Why an how ?

Midas I don't disagree with your premise that there are 'equally' good investment opportunities in those other countries, perhaps even better ones, what I was driving at is that people who have an interest in Thailand, be it work or personal will continue to come to Thailand, and a fair portion of those will buy, understand that I am not saying that hordes are going buy now,or even for the immediate future but at some point. I confirm that it is my belief that the market will slip further, and political stability will play one of the, if not the most important role in Thailand's future.

My rationale for a quicker recovery than you might expect is based on my dealings with major industrial manufacturers (which is where I spend most of my time) who are, even in the current climate, establishing new manufacturing plants in Thailand. I can't disclose who or too many details as its sensitive information right now, but they are proceeding despite all the political problems, and current economic turbulence.

The firms I am dealing with (from Australia and Europe) are struggling with high costs in their home markets, and lagging sales, so they are making the tough decision to off shore.

Shifting operations here in order to reduce their operating expenses, and take advantage of other investment privileges, can result in some drastic savings, and for some it might mean the difference between survival and collapse.

Labour costs are the reasons most often cited, one of these major manufacturers gave me a very vivid example. A trained welder in Denmark costs 150,000 Baht a month, the same can be had here for less than 20,000. The same comparisons can be made in Australia, who also have the benefit of the FTA.

Dont get me wrong, I do believe that exports will continue to weaken in light of weakened western demand and that many existing firms will operate at reduced capacity and some may even close, however I expect that Thailand will attract FDI as an offshoring trend gathers steam. This will help strengthen Thailand's fiscal position, and support export numbers.

Recent examples of this trend include Intel moving to India, the relocation of Fisher & Paykel's entire manufacturing operations to Thailand, and just recently Chesty Bond manufacturer announces its move to China, saving 150 million AUS$ a year.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/stor...5001021,00.html

Edited April 2, 2009 by quiksilva

[trogers]

Midas I don't disagree with your premise that there are 'equally' good investment opportunities in those other countries, perhaps even better ones, what I was driving at is that people who have an interest in Thailand, be it work or personal will continue to come to Thailand, and a fair portion of those will buy, understand that I am not saying that hordes are going buy now,or even for the immediate future but at some point. I confirm that it is my belief that the market will slip further, and political stability will play one of the, if not the most important role in Thailand's future.

My rationale for a quicker recovery than you might expect is based on my dealings with major industrial manufacturers (which is where I spend most of my time) who are, even in the current climate, establishing new manufacturing plants in Thailand. I can't disclose who or too many details as its sensitive information right now, but they are proceeding despite all the political problems, and current economic turbulence.

The firms I am dealing with (from Australia and Europe) are struggling with high costs in their home markets, and lagging sales, so they are making the tough decision to off shore.

Shifting operations here in order to reduce their operating expenses, and take advantage of other investment privileges, can result in some drastic savings, and for some it might mean the difference between survival and collapse.

Labour costs are the reasons most often cited, one of these major manufacturers gave me a very vivid example. A trained welder in Denmark costs 150,000 Baht a month, the same can be had here for less than 20,000. The same comparisons can be made in Australia, who also have the benefit of the FTA.

Dont get me wrong, I do believe that exports will continue to weaken in light of weakened western demand and that many existing firms will operate at reduced capacity and some may even close, however I expect that Thailand will attract FDI as an offshoring trend gathers steam. This will help strengthen Thailand's fiscal position, and support export numbers.

Recent examples of this trend include Intel moving to India, the relocation of Fisher & Paykel's entire manufacturing operations to Thailand, and just recently Chesty Bond manufacturer announces its move to China, saving 150 million AUS$ a year.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/stor...5001021,00.html

And thus the Thai Baht will strengthen against EU and US currencies. Buy real properties in Thailand this year while prices are still on the down trend to preserve your wealth that are in these currencies.

[MJo]

I just spent Bt12,000/m2 and 6 months to refurbished my 121 m2 condo for leasing - and it is not high end deluxe finishing. Cost to furbish a high end unit would range from Bt16,000 to Bt20,000/m2.

Depreciate the total cost in 5 years and divide the annual cost by 12. That's just the cost for refurbishment, not counting return of investment. Why would I rent out the unit if offered rent is barely above this cost? The time and effort and lost of potential rent due to time required to refurbish again.

So you are looking what, 3% to 3.5% ROI ? I have to agree with Midas on this, elsewhere in the region, not to mention europe or US you would be making much more than that.

Also seems extremely high cost for refurbishing, you build a quite nice standard house for the same money.

Does your refurbish mean you tear it down to bare shell and redo all interior walls, pipes, cabling etc etc from the scratch ?

[trogers]

Also seems extremely high cost for refurbishing, you build a quite nice standard house for the same money.

Does your refurbish mean you tear it down to bare shell and redo all interior walls, pipes, cabling etc etc from the scratch ?

I did. I bought a condo that is over 20 years old and did a complete refurbishment. Have a look at the final results:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/2-bedroom-2-...um-t245532.html

I did not use high end stuff like deco market kitchen, or imported furnitures, or lots of tempered glass stuff, or Bt150,000 spa baths, etc.

I optimized cost to get a balanced atmosphere. Noticed I used a 6-panel aluminium sliding door which opens out 2/3.

[mjohnson282]

I cannot think of any other country in which investors totally ignore the income potential from an asset and concentrate

soley on the hope of capital gain ................

Try Singapore and HK. What are the prices of their high end condos and the rental value? What kind of property tax do they charge? I know property tax in Singapore is at 19% of annual value, irregardless of whether it is rented out or left vacant.

I don't think he would find many astute Singaporean

or Hong Kong investors in those two cities prepared to sit on an empty shell property year after year.

Even if the tenants did cause wear and tear you can still refurbish again but at least

in the meantime you are getting an income-to forego that seems illogical

I just spent Bt12,000/m2 and 6 months to refurbished my 121 m2 condo for leasing - and it is not high end deluxe finishing. Cost to furbish a high end unit would range from Bt16,000 to Bt20,000/m2.

Depreciate the total cost in 5 years and divide the annual cost by 12. That's just the cost for refurbishment, not counting return of investment. Why would I rent out the unit if offered rent is barely above this cost? The time and effort and lost of potential rent due to time required to refurbish again.

The whole premise of this scenario is flawed. I guess a better questions is why, if you are yield driven, would you refurbish your unit to above market standards. If you did make this mistake, or got caught in a correction, you would further compound it by not renting? To not rent means a zero yield. Add the opportunity cost of the condo purchase price and the additional carrying costs and you have your return is negative. I would think you would seek the best possible return and realizing you over improved in your first renovation you would not make the mistake again. You would rent as is or with a minimal rehab.

By the way I think you mean tax rates in Singapore are 1.9%.

Companies everywhere are contracting, but apparently they are expanding in Thailand with stable political climate and this will drive real estate values. That's a good one I might laugh about this all day and maybe even tomorrow.

[quiksilva]

Companies everywhere are contracting, but apparently they are expanding in Thailand with stable political climate and this will drive real estate values. That's a good one I might laugh about this all day and maybe even tomorrow.

Who said companies are expanding? Who said there was a stable political climate?

You may want to try this website before chortling to yourself too much.

http://www.starfall.com/

[trogers]

The whole premise of this scenario is flawed. I guess a better questions is why, if you are yield driven, would you refurbish your unit to above market standards. If you did make this mistake, or got caught in a correction, you would further compound it by not renting? <br /><br />To not rent means a zero yield. Add the opportunity cost of the condo purchase price and the additional carrying costs and you have your return is negative. I would think you would seek the best possible return and realizing you over improved in your first renovation you would not make the mistake again.<br /><br />You would rent as is or with a minimal rehab.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;By the way I think you mean tax rates in Singapore are 1.9%.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Companies everywhere are contracting, but apparently they are expanding in Thailand with stable political climate and this will drive real estate values. That's a good one I might laugh about this all day and maybe even tomorrow.&lt;br /&gt;

If you were to look at the last post of my thread with the photos, my condo has been let out. I am getting over 6%pa yield after deducting maintenance and taxes. What I said is about some high end units being left vacant.

I have anticipated this since last year and that is why I invested in an old condo in a choice location and refurbished it. My asking rent is only Bt45,000 while a smaller new condo up the soi is asking a min. Bt60,000 with a similar size asking Bt75,000. Property tax in Singapore is at 19%pa of annual value (that's the last figure I know since I was there a decade ago). Annual value is set by the revenue office based on rental value of that locality and similar property and is updated every 3 years.

So if your condo has an annual value of S$30,000, you have to pay 19% a year irregardless if it is rented out or left vacant. And present new 2-bedroom (80m2) apartments over 12 km from the city centre are selling at S$1m. You can calculate the yield after taxes and see if there is strong correlation between rental income and capital value.

Edited April 2, 2009 by trogers

[leonn]

I live in a new buildng in Sukhumvit area and when I bought my unit, close to the completion, I was informed that only handful of units were available. It has been almost 6 month since the completion but only about 100 units are either occupied or being fitted to move in. There are almost 260 units that are still vacant. I don't know, for sure, whether these units are sold or not.

I was wondering how other buildings in Bangkok are faring and if the 2/3 of units are not selling what happens to the value of the building?

It's not only Sukhumvit 24, it's the same where I live ( Sathorn/Silom).

Most condos have between 10 and 20% units lit up at night .

Very clearly, the market is completely distorted by the cashed up Thai Hi So's who buy off plan cash, and will not live in those condos, but expect to flip them at a minimum 100 % profit.

That's why the Thai real estaet market is very much immune to the price decreases that the rest of the real world is now experiencing .

Now the real question is : where does all this cash come from ?

[trogers]

Now the real question is : where does all this cash come from ?

Have you ever encountered a buyer carrying Bt20m cash in a briefcase offering to buy your product? I have, back in 1994.

[MJo]

I did. I bought a condo that is over 20 years old and did a complete refurbishment. Have a look at the final results:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/2-bedroom-2-...um-t245532.html

I did not use high end stuff like deco market kitchen, or imported furnitures, or lots of tempered glass stuff, or Bt150,000 spa baths, etc.

I optimized cost to get a balanced atmosphere. Noticed I used a 6-panel aluminium sliding door which opens out 2/3.

i see, makes much more sense as i was wrongly assuming that the buiding was one of the new ones. Good job with the refurbish, very nice indeed and 6% makes it worth the trouble these days IMO.