News on visa detentions

[DaveYo]

I seem to sense that targeting Britons is just a start here, as they kick this off and will expand as more resources are made available.  

Question -" immigrations" mentioned visa stamps a lot,  I wonder how to tell the difference of current stamp considered legit vs old stamp that might be of question?  Did they change the looks of this stamp or what is it that catches their attention?  

I don't think this only involves Britons, this involves all of us regardless of what country we are from.  Good question brought up from a member here, what about the borders when we make the visa runs, are these stamps fake or not?  How can we tell if they are recording our stays correctly and such is in their immigration system?

My question where does one go if such stamp may be of question to have it verified if legit or not without such harsh repurcussions brought upon us when one wants to get it straight without this fear of being arrested, so we can have a peace of mind knowing it is the real mcCoy stamp!

Whew, problems - problems

:blues:  ???

[pschef]

Yes know exactly what you mean, how can we tell if the stamp is real or not. How can we go and say, dear khun Immi officer is my stamp good, without fear of being locked up?

I must say and I think I said before, must last run was not so easy. The guy took ages to process me, even my wife comments why he take so long this time???? Okay maybe its a general thing, check all? This is not a problem, but fear of deportation or jail or worse IS. Great posts coming in on this subject, look forward to all views. :cool:

[DaveYo]

Oh I forgot to add also to this topic.   Why cannot the Government of Thailand have some amnesty program to run for so many days and make such announcement to all foreigners via, radio, T.V., and to all the Embassies there to allow all foreigners to have their stamps checked and if found to be bad, can get the right ones applied on but be told to leave in two weeks or so.

This way all foreigners will be given a chance to get their passports with their stamps corrected without fear of being arrested.

My suggestion.   I think some Amnesty program is the best way to go.

Any comments, and how can we get this idea to the PM Thaskin?

:blues:   ???

[pschef]

I think you just sent him that message Dave, if he answer I would be very surprised. I think we are all a bit touchy about these stamps, but I did say before. If you are the genuine article, don’t worry too much. I have asked many times how to identify the dodgy stamps, no one has answered that question either. Better dress very well, next time you go out. No shorts and sandals and definitely no backpack or earring.

[MaiChai]

I called my wife earlier (she's in LOS), she had heard something about it on the news about the foreigners and the fake visa stamps.

I wonder how they used to deal with "have stamp but not in computer" when you used to exit at Don Mueung? I suppose they would just stamp you out, so thus everyone must have known about the whole scheme (that is everyone doing the stamping out)? So not exactly a big secret in the immigration service?

[singa-traz]

Oh I forgot to add also to this topic.   Why cannot the Government of Thailand have some amnesty program to run for so many days and make such announcement to all foreigners via, radio, T.V., and to all the Embassies there to allow all foreigners to have their stamps checked and if found to be bad, can get the right ones applied on but be told to leave in two weeks or so.

This way all foreigners will be given a chance to get their passports with their stamps corrected without fear of being arrested.

My suggestion.   I think some Amnesty program is the best way to go.

Any comments, and how can we get this idea to the PM Thaskin?

:blues:   ???

And why not suggest the Thai Government, in order to recover the cost of such operation, to charge a premium for providing this service to those F*cking I*iots Passport holder of fake stamp !

Something in the range of ... 20 to 40K THB ... or you get to go to jail ...

[Spellbound]

http://www.rakang.thaigov.go.th/guest_e.htm

Heres is a link to Email The Primister Of Thailand

(How about we all post a copy of what we send here)

My suggestion.   I think some Amnesty program is the best way to go.

Any comments, and how can we get this idea to the PM Thaskin?

Link To Taskin's Email

[Maigo6]

Dave unfortunate as it is, the Thai Authorities are not gonna give Forgieners with fake stamps a break. I know that many people have used agents, i was fortunate enough to be out of the country when the shit hit the fan, i was able to get a new book.

I also think that as these agents where doing this for years, and many people where sent by the immigration Police to the agencies, there should be a stern warning issued, But....as many immigration Police have been nicked for involvement in this business, i cant see there being any quarter given to the recipients of the stamps given by the arrested Immigration Police. Its just an unfortunate situation, wash the Passport is my advice if the offending stamp is an old one, photocopy the latest stamp if its a legally obtained one before washing the passport though.

[ovenman]

I wonder how they used to deal with "have stamp but not in computer" when you used to exit at Don Mueung? I suppose they would just stamp you out, so thus everyone must have known about the whole scheme (that is everyone doing the stamping out)? So not exactly a big secret in the immigration service?

I've been curious about this myself.  Could it be that sometimes it takes a while for the information from each TM card to get entered into the immigrations computer making this missing computer data a somewhat common occurrence?

[taxexile]

things are messy enough already without the pm being bombarded with abusive and ill thought out arguments from visitors in this country who have knowingly or un-knowingly broken the law because they couldnt be bothered to do a visa run.this is not europe or the usa.things work differently here.

it wont help the cause of those caught up in this one bit.

personally i think those arrested will eventually be heavily fined and made to leave the country. it will be done on a case by case basis. those deemed undesirable may not get visas in the future should they wish to return.those deemed to be desirable will be able to return.i think a lot will depend on the attitude of the miscreant towards the authorities.

then again they could all do ten years.

[Whiplash]

where are the Swedes/Germans/Swiss/French etc ?

Well..

One of thoose here.. going to extend my visa om Friday or Monday, maybe this post is one of the last I will make pending on my success with the imm.off. here in ChiangMai..  ???

I have only 2 Sadao stamps, from 2002, not any of them have B008, and no Padang Besar at all..

So I'm just going to dress up good, be clean shaven, be sure to wear a goldnecklace with a buddha image. wai'ing my ass off and use the limited Thai I have learned so far.. and hope for the best..   :cool:

[Nam Kao]

10 years in a Thai Jail.....

I bet they dont make it to year 4....

[taxexile]

and may the good lord have mercy on their souls

[DaveYo]

I do agree on the fact that these experienced individuals knew what they were doing as of getting the stamp and how they went about it over the course of time.  It however is important to note say for example a newbie, who did not really know about it that well, and say others convinced them otherwise that it is safe, is an exception to the mistake as given.  Give those newbies one pass, a max fine, and let them go, and if done again, bye bye.    But to those who have been there for some duration of time and have a few of those stamps over the course etc, knew full well what they were doing.

But doing ten years, whew, or even any time at all,  I think is harsh, and why should Thailand government have to pay for the next ten years or any time at all for their housing and clothes and meds and 3 square meals a day.   I would say set a fine on them, and give them a persona non grata status with their picture on Black List, and information, and notify their embassy and of course Thai Embassies, that they are never to return and escort them to the next plane out to their country.  Done.  No more and no less.  At least they get to go home but are barred for life to ever return to Thailand.  Now if they are really idiots, and do return to Thailand later on, then give them a sentence of life never to get out till dead.

That is saving money Thailand way, and gaining some or should I say.  

:blues: ???

[DaveYo]

oh whiplash, yes may the lord have mercy on your soul.  But before you do that, have your cash on hand ready to pay the fine for bail, and hope you get home.  If any money is in that Thai bank now, draw it out, and send it home bound, and have a plane ticket paid in full.

Other than that, keep your fingers crossed, and bless yourself a thousand times.

Good luck

:blues:

[foolwholaughsatdeath]

what is meant by "wash the passport"? are you talking about just throwing the #### thing in the washing machine and letting the stamps run and blur or what?

[Whiplash]

Heh, Thanks

I'm going for a marriage extention, and have the funds required for it in my Thai bank account.

(Which my wife has access to if problems would occur)

I have to admit to being naive and gullable (when I was new to this country) when I thought the travel agency I used for my stamps did a legal service..

Being the first time I ever set my foot in Thailand and due to my different aches and pains, I thought it would be a good service they could perform for me.

Because I have a 20 year old Whiplash injury + 4 year old arthritis-like condition that makes some travel pretty awkward and painful to me.

I originally went there for a visa to visit Laos for a weekend to get a new stamp. But they told me if I only went to Laos for the stamp, they could do it for me and relieve me of all the hassles involved..

I regret it doing it now, but if I have dubious stamps and are confronted by the imm.officer I will 'come clean' and tell the truth, but I hope that the stamps will prove to be authentic.

Though my actions wasn't..

[DaveYo]

Hmmmmm, you know it is kinda strange that they being the Immigration does not take into consideration of the medical situation of expats, thus forcing them to make these runs.  If we have a heart condition or have arthritis that curtails our activities in going any distance what about we do?  

The immigrations should have some leeway in not forcing the expats to make these runs due to medical reasons, and grant the visas for long term.  

This is my opinion, seeing what the problems can be forthright and coming for the aging cronies.

:blues:

[taxexile]

dave,meet bud

bud,meet dave.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I like that Tax hehehehe

[SoCal]

End of the day- Ignorancia legis non excusat.

The ten years prison, and blacklisting is a bit harsh though.

Me thinks embassies are going to be bombarded with lost passport requests.

[Khun ?]

What about a note from parents.

What about just getting a long term visa if you want to live

in Thailand.

[Maigo6]

Yes washing the passport means that, washing it, get the dog to eat it if you want, let the kids play with it after taking their sweets away, etc, etc,

Other than that, go to immigration confess all, then get 'Bud' to be your lawyer, with Dave yo as a back up.........

[simon43]

I agree with Dr PP. No-one can be so naive to believe that there is nothing dodgy about giving your passport to some guy who whips it out of the country and then back in again - all to get a stamp to confirm that it was actually you who did the trip!!

I never let my passport out of my sight!

I have absolutely no sympathy for anyone who is caught up with these visa scams.  As previous posts have said 'if you have stuck to the law in Thailand then you have no problems'.

Yes, Thailand seems to have gone puritanical etc, but I'm not surprised when the threat of terroism is evident and there are hordes of farang living and working here with false visa stamps, no work-permits etc.

Would you have sympathy for a crowd of Asians living illegally in England and paying some guy to get false stamps in your passport?  I think not....

If you stick to the rules in Thailand you can still have a great time  

[taxexile]

i do have sympathy for many of those caught up in the scam.

especially when the services of these agents were heavily advertised in national newspapers,and to all intents and purposes seemed to be operated with the knowledge and aid of the authorities.

this was not some underhand operation carried out under the cover of darkness by men in cloaks and masks,but a high street enterprise,out there in the open.some immigration offices actually offered the service as well. it all appeared to be very legal.if the authorities knew about it ,which they did,but now wish to stop it,then they should stop it now and go easy on those caught for using it in the past.the authorities have made their point,everybody will now cross the street when passing the visa agent shop,and the problem will be solved.

[simon43]

Agreed - there is no guarantee but you are far less likely to fall foul of the law if you have not been caught 'playing the system'

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I deleted Rambutan's offensive offering...GO HOME RAMBUTAN tolerate no more.

[Bob Chittie]

I agree with Dr PP. No-one can be so naive to believe that there is nothing dodgy about giving your passport to some guy who whips it out of the country and then back in again - all to get a stamp to confirm that it was actually you who did the trip!!

I have to disagree with you here. People really can be that naive and maybe stupid too. i did it a number of times and I honestly did not realize that it was illegal. i thought it was bending the rules a bit, but if I had been told at any time by anybody that I risked 1-10 years in prison and risked being blacklisted, believe me, I would never have parted with my passport.

Also, in light of the fact that it was implied by the government that the activity would be tolerated, how arrests are made before a widespread warning is beyond me.

i don't know you personally, but how would you feel if you were thrown in jail for watching topless dancing, soliciting prostituion or riding on the back of a motorcycle without a helmet (seems to be okay as long as you are on the back)? You'd have the right to be a little pissed off. No matter what the dusty law books say, the police have watched you go by for a decade without that helmet and then one day you find yourself in jail? i agree that ignorance of the law can't be an excuse, but nevertheless, isn't something wrong with this picture?

[heychay]

Also, in light of the fact that it was implied by the government that the activity would be tolerated, how arrests are made before a widespread warning is beyond me.....

how would you feel if you were thrown in jail for watching topless dancing, soliciting prostituion or riding on the back of a motorcycle without a helmet .....the police have watched you go by for a decade without that helmet and then one day you find yourself in jail?

That says it all. There are so many things that have been not-exactly-illegal in this country for so long, that suddenly arresting and deporting people for something that has been ignored/condoned by the authorities for years sends a bleak message. And whether ture or not, the perception now is that Thailand does not want foreigners, unless they are well-heeled and only here to leave money.

As for suddenly becoming so law and order, how about all the police and army that are warned to clean up their mafia acts or (my god!) be placed in inactive posts. whatever the reason this is going on now, the stamp crackdown, the new visa and business requirements make the appearance is that foreigners are being harrassed.

[twentyfourhoursx7]

WELL GUYS!!! sOME OF YOU MAY HAVE SEEN MY POST A FEW MONTHS AGO ABOUT POLICE CORRUPTION AND SUING POLICE.

SOME PEOPLE SAID GET A LIFE.

WELL NOW MANY ARE ABOUT TO EXPERIENCE WHAT I HAVE GONE THROUGH.

I ESTERMATE ABOUT 20,000 TO 50,000 FOREIGNERS ARE GOING TO GET CAUGHT.

ME AND MY WIFE HAVE BEEN SENTANCED TO 6 YEARS JAIL EACH ON A TRUMPED UP CHARGE. WE ARE OUT ON BAIL PENDING THE APPEAL.

I WILL TELL YOU THIS

IF YOU HAVE A FAKE STAMP IN YOUR PASSPORT NO MATTER HOW YOU GOT IT. MAKE SURE YOU HAVE AT LEAST $US10,000 FOR THE COURT CASE AND FOUR YEARS TO SPARE BEING NOT ALLOWED TO LEAVE THE COUNTRY.

YOUR EMBASSY CAN NOT HELP YOU.

IF YOU CAN GET ACROSS THE BORDER UNDETECTED DO IT NOW.

DONT APPROACH THE tHAI IMMERGRATION WITH ANY FAKE PASSPORT STAMPS.

IF YOU CAN BUY YOUR WAY OUT JUST DO IT DONT MAKE A FUSS

REGARDS

twentyfourhoursx7 that has seen the inside of a Thai Jail and the Corrupt Thai Legal system.