And of course don't forget the GI Bill.

One of the lecturers in Philosophy at Oxford got his start in academic life through the GI Bill.

I am a big fan of the GI Bill and I see it as a just reward an opportunity to improve one's circumstances given their service to their nation. That said, if one studie how much f'ing money is flying out the door in the Defense Dept., in hardware, in service contracts, in salaries and future salary and retirement obligations it's not hard to see that it is draining the American budget and that many people, given lack of other opportunuties are being virtually forced into service. Checked the cost of a college education lately? $100k, easily.

So I'm answering your question and Lao Po's about how we got sidetracked. In war virtually anyone can become what these murderers became. With the increase in people not necessarily fit to serve but just looking for a place to earn a living and maybe build a future the threshold to "snapping" becomes less IMO. That's exascerbated by having no idea <deleted> they are there in the first place. In the absence of these kinds of fundamental supporting mechanisms, all you get is people you can teach to hate and kill and never know why. Just de-personalize everyone that isn't like you. Probably a lot more of this stuff has gone on that we will never hear about.

Another reason I like the draft. Citizen soldiers in the Army for a short period of time, knowing they are not going to make a career out of it.

Way back when there was different markings on dog tags. US and RA. The US was a draftee and the RA was regular army.

Most of the draftees did not associate with the lifers. Different mindset. The draftees were difficult to motivate or scare. Lifers had a vested interest in doing well.

The standard comment when refusing an order was, “What are you going to do? Send me to Vietnam.”

They motivated draftees in the States by threatening to send them to Vietnam.

I don't want to paint a picture of chaos but there was quite a bit of animosity.

I was working 14 hours a day, every day. The General told me to get to work an hour earlier every day. I flat out refused.

Very well said Lanna.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/apr/17/afghanistan-death-squad-killings-fail-get-media-po/

Reports of a U.S. “death squad” in Afghanistan, complete with the publication of gory photographs, have failed to attract the intense political or media attention afforded a previous war scandal — the mistreatment of Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghraib.

---

“I think any assignment editor would think a story about soldiers murdering people is a bigger story than soldiers putting prisoners in a naked pyramid,” said Tim Graham, an analyst at the Media Research Center, which seeks to expose what it says is liberal press bias. “When you reverse those, what you’re seeing is political opportunism.”

Mr. Graham offered an example. Time magazine, which devoted much coverage to Abu Ghraib and the killings of Iraqi civilians in Haditha during the Bush presidency, had a “tiny paragraph in the front of the magazine” a few issues ago on the death squad photos, he said.

That again shows how the media is controlled (by a few) and used to influence public perception.

Been going on for the last 100 years.

Sadly, the sheep will follow and will not ask any questions.

And the loons will continue to make up both questions and answers that have no basis in reality.

And the loons will continue to make up both questions and answers that have no basis in reality.

The reality is that the ones who murdered those innocent civilians are the loons......not the ones who ask questions or searching for answers.

LaoPo

Of course the creeps who murdered those innocent civilians are loons, but some people have a history of making everything into a far-out conspiracy theory where none exists which helps nothing.

That again shows how the media is controlled (by a few) and used to influence public perception.

Been going on for the last 100 years.

Sadly, the sheep will follow and will not ask any questions.

Hope, baaaaa, Change, baaaaaa.

Of course the creeps who murdered those innocent civilians are loons, but some people have a history of making everything into a far-out conspiracy theory where none exists which helps nothing.

I assume you mean my comment saying that the media and efforts to influence public perception is in your opinion a theory?

I have no problems with it if you would be a bit more direct and point out what part is just a theory.

Or should I give some examples that can be simply answered by a yes or no?

Kohee already gave you one....

You assume wrong.

I don't think a lower or higher pay for the military would ever be an excuse to kill people for fun.

I wonder why the discussion about salaries for the military came into this topic; it certainly wasn't a point in the OP and/or a reason nor an excuse for those soldiers to grab innocent civilians and murder them....for FUN.

LaoPo

Certified bigoted members ; usually don't care about the lives of innocent civilians, in the countries they "hate".

You assume wrong.

Then please elaborate.

Sadly, the sheep will follow and will not ask any questions.

Hope, baaaaa, Change, baaaaaa.

Koheesti pretty much has it covered.

That again shows how the media is controlled (by a few) and used to influence public perception.

Been going on for the last 100 years.

Sadly, the sheep will follow and will not ask any questions.

Indeed. And amazingly enough, these sheep appear in a variety of shapes and sizes - not just the model that we expect to view. Surprises, are just that. The fact is that a greater percentage are taken in by the side-show, regardless of perceived knowledge or lack of it. Fools paradise.....crosses all class barriers. The slumber is the same.

Sadly, the sheep will follow and will not ask any questions.

Hope, baaaaa, Change, baaaaaa.

Koheesti pretty much has it covered.

Baaaaaaaa.....baaaaaaa.....You voted for him.

Baaaaaaaa.....baaaaaaa

Indeed.

I don't think a lower or higher pay for the military would ever be an excuse to kill people for fun.

I wonder why the discussion about salaries for the military came into this topic; it certainly wasn't a point in the OP and/or a reason nor an excuse for those soldiers to grab innocent civilians and murder them....for FUN.

LaoPo

Certified bigoted members ; usually don't care about the lives of innocent civilians, in the countries they "hate".

It has been proven time and time again here and in the World News forum that the members who claim to care about civilians in other countries are FOS. They only care when the US and allies are involved in the deaths. Hiding their hatred behind a thin veil of pretending to care. Just awful.

Indeed.

Indeed.

One thing that should be remembered by some of the liberals in this little discussion is...

For every US military person that performs acts such as these, there are thousands that do not.

I would even go so far as to suggest the non-criminal element far, far outnumbers the criminal element in nearly every nations military services.

Indeed.

One thing that should be remembered by some of the liberals in this little discussion is...

For every US military person that performs acts such as these, there are thousands that do not.

I would even go so far as to suggest the non-criminal element far, far outnumbers the criminal element in nearly every nations military services.

I fully agree;

But, that doesn't make the despicable murders less shameful and less horrible.

Of course there are more good than bad people amongst the military and civilians and that's a good thing. If it was the way around most of us wouldn't be on this forum; we would have been murdered.

LaoPo

Indeed.

One thing that should be remembered by some of the liberals in this little discussion is...

For every US military person that performs acts such as these, there are thousands that do not.

I would even go so far as to suggest the non-criminal element far, far outnumbers the criminal element in nearly every nations military services.

It's about perception. I do believe that most of the soldiers go there with good intentions but as I said in earlier discussions the locals might not be so happy with their presence. Can you imagine that?

Winning the hearts and minds of the locals by helping rebuilding a country that already was bombed into the stone age and done once more just to make sure there was no infrastructure left of whatever was left and then facing the threat of being shot to death when you were walking around looking for some wood to put in your stove to prepare a meal for your children that just lost their mother due to a drone attack in which the army apologized for it being a mistake and saying those that died were just collateral damage.

It is no wonder that suicide rates are at almost all times high for those that served once they realized the insanity of this all.

The whistle blower said these were no incidents and their officers just turned a blind eye whenever stuff like this happened.

There is plenty footage available of random killings by soldiers, you just have to look for it.

You just cannot withdraw your soldiers without a clear victory right?

Loss of face and such, where did I hear that before.....

As long as we keep interfering and occupying foreign countries the risk will be that some people that do not agree with it can turn violent and will target soldiers or others that are part of that policy.

And of course don't forget the GI Bill.

One of the lecturers in Philosophy at Oxford got his start in academic life through the GI Bill.

And this translates as......??

War is the acceptable and sanctioned mass murder approved by the state. Guilt by association.