Liverpool F.c.

[StevieH]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

[smokie36]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

That mostly shows just how skewed the league has become by free spending multi billionaire owners.

[StevieH]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

That mostly shows just how skewed the league has become by free spending multi billionaire owners.

not really. we finished below newcastle and everton, chelsea finished three places behind arsenal.

[smokie36]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

That mostly shows just how skewed the league has become by free spending multi billionaire owners.

not really. we finished below newcastle and everton, chelsea finished three places behind arsenal.

Fair point. Just bad management then.

[StevieH]

Fair point. Just bad management then.

nope, not 'just' bad management. that was a factor, yeah, but only one and not by any stretch the largest imo. talking about systemic problems and issues here as mentioned above.

[smokie36]

The Comolli factor....

[MrRed]

That Liverpool in decline thread was justified then Stevie

[Penkoprod]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

The worrying thing here though is, the fact that the Boston Red Sox haven't won anything since 2007. No World Series, no titles............nothing!!!!

But i bet they sell lots of merchandise to the fans, though

Penkoprod

[carmine]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

The worrying thing here though is, the fact that the Boston Red Sox haven't won anything since 2007. No World Series, no titles............nothing!!!!

But i bet they sell lots of merchandise to the fans, though

Penkoprod

You guys took a helluva beating on saturday. West Brom are going to be tough to stop this season

[StevieH]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

The worrying thing here though is, the fact that the Boston Red Sox haven't won anything since 2007. No World Series, no titles............nothing!!!!

But i bet they sell lots of merchandise to the fans, though

Penkoprod

we were in the european cup final in 2005 and 2007 and finished second in the league in 2009. since then we've regressed hugely. we shift about 250m quid a year worth of commercial stuff around the world. owners bought a 'brand' and don't necessarily see it as a football club.

[carmine]

Focus and spending on the Boston Red Sox and using Liverpool as a cash cow is how its starting to look. Unfortunately Liverpools global appeal make it very attractive to these types.

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

The worrying thing here though is, the fact that the Boston Red Sox haven't won anything since 2007. No World Series, no titles............nothing!!!!

But i bet they sell lots of merchandise to the fans, though

Penkoprod

we were in the european cup final in 2005 and 2007 and finished second in the league in 2009. since then we've regressed hugely. we shift about 250m quid a year worth of commercial stuff around the world. owners bought a 'brand' and don't necessarily see it as a football club.

Interesting if you put aside the Torres 50m that was reinvested in players. What else have they spent? Not much. Theres that and also the statement made by Henry about a new stadium not being a valid commercial idea.

Only a minor point but i also thought it strange that neither Henry of Werner bothered to turn up to the Everton semi. That was a big city of Liverpool occasion and atleast one of them should have been there.

Edited August 20, 2012 by carmine

[Penkoprod]

[

The worrying thing here though is, the fact that the Boston Red Sox haven't won anything since 2007. No World Series, no titles............nothing!!!!

But i bet they sell lots of merchandise to the fans, though

Penkoprod

we were in the european cup final in 2005 and 2007 and finished second in the league in 2009. since then we've regressed hugely. we shift about 250m quid a year worth of commercial stuff around the world. owners bought a 'brand' and don't necessarily see it as a football club.

Thats exactly what i'm saying, and have been saying for a while

These owners care nothing for the fans

And we've been regressing a lot longer than since 2009, if we were honest

Gone from bobbing along, with the occasional mouthfull of water, to the full scale looking up at the surface of the water, panicking.

And, lets be honest, here. We spunked a windfall of cash from the sales of Torres, Meireles, and Babel on the likes of Carrol, Downing and Henderson, where we could have bought better, cheaper.

Penkoprod

[StevieH]

Interesting if you put aside the Torres 50m that was reinvested in players. What else have they spent? Not much. Theres that and also the statement made by Henry about a new stadium not being a valid commercial idea.

Only a minor point but i also thought it strange that neither Henry of Werner bothered to turn up to the Everton semi. That was a big city of Liverpool occasion and atleast one of them should have been there.

well yeah, even stranger when you consider it was the hillsborough anniversary weekend as well. but apparently it was the red sox first home game of the season or something. some commitment that fellas.

and you're right, they haven't spent much else. the stadium appears to be a non-priority to them while they can trade on the history of anfield's name.

Thats exactly what i'm saying, and have been saying for a while

These owners care nothing for the fans

And we've been regressing a lot longer than since 2009, if we were honest

Gone from bobbing along, with the occasional mouthfull of water, to the full scale looking up at the surface of the water, panicking.

And, lets be honest, here. We spunked a windfall of cash from the sales of Torres, Meireles, and Babel on the likes of Carrol, Downing and Henderson, where we could have bought better, cheaper.

Penkoprod

maybe. benitez managed to keep it going with spit and sticky tape for a while but it's well known that he was asking for greater investment in the playing staff from the morning after the 2007 champions league final onwards. but we still finished second to a stupidly good united in 2009 and since then it's been plummet all the way.

[Penkoprod]

maybe. benitez managed to keep it going with spit and sticky tape for a while but it's well known that he was asking for greater investment in the playing staff from the morning after the 2007 champions league final onwards. but we still finished second to a stupidly good united in 2009 and since then it's been plummet all the way.

Well, i see those "triumphs" as the blips, sad to say, as we sink further and further. What you see as a "plummet all the way since 2009" was an acceleration of the sinking that begun a long time before then. Even Houllier was papering over the cracks by throwing money at the problem towards the end of his tenure. Four managers in TWO years, BTW doesnt help matters any either. Especially when they want their brand of football imposing on the squad. No stability, no cohesion with all the players coming and going. No wonder its accelerarted like it has. All to be put firmly at Fenways' door

Being honest, we are no more than what we are. An upper mid table side, and it will take time to put right. Whether Rodgers is the man that will be afforded that time is another matter. What we MUST stop is ths revolving door policy with players and managers.

I have a theory about Benitez's sacking:

He was too confrontational for what was at the time, the only viable buyers for the club...Fenway Sports

The man had to go, or Fenway would walk, and the club would have gone broke, or limped on with another load of debt placed on it by the previous Yanks. So we got lumbered with another load of Americans at the helm that run it by remote control.

Penkoprod

[carmine]

maybe. benitez managed to keep it going with spit and sticky tape for a while but it's well known that he was asking for greater investment in the playing staff from the morning after the 2007 champions league final onwards. but we still finished second to a stupidly good united in 2009 and since then it's been plummet all the way.

Well, i see those "triumphs" as the blips, sad to say, as we sink further and further. What you see as a "plummet all the way since 2009" was an acceleration of the sinking that begun a long time before then. Even Houllier was papering over the cracks by throwing money at the problem towards the end of his tenure. Four managers in TWO years, BTW doesnt help matters any either. Especially when they want their brand of football imposing on the squad. No stability, no cohesion with all the players coming and going. No wonder its accelerarted like it has. All to be put firmly at Fenways' door

Being honest, we are no more than what we are. An upper mid table side, and it will take time to put right. Whether Rodgers is the man that will be afforded that time is another matter. What we MUST stop is ths revolving door policy with players and managers.

I have a theory about Benitez's sacking:

He was too confrontational for what was at the time, the only viable buyers for the club...Fenway Sports

The man had to go, or Fenway would walk, and the club would have gone broke, or limped on with another load of debt placed on it by the previous Yanks. So we got lumbered with another load of Americans at the helm that run it by remote control.

Penkoprod

Benitez being incumbant would have had nothing to do with it. They could just sack him when they took over if they wanted to.

Speaking as a neutral i don't think its quite as bleak as you think. You have theoretically a very decent starting eleven. The problem lies in the back up, the depth. There isn't anywhere near enough to sustain a long season and with six or seven teams chasing a top four berth and realistically only two places open you have to question the commitment of the owners. You should also question what their true goals for the club are because unless they invest in the squad its totally unrealistic to suggest CL football is achievable and for a club like Liverpool that should be a minimum requirement not an over achievment. What i'm saying is its bleak for as long as the owners let it be. Invest in the squad and give the manager the tools to do the job.

I'm sure they have great knowledge of the balance books but i venture they have not bothered to learn anything about the city and the club. Absense at the semi final, little things like calling the premier league the "EPL"..........how north american franchise is that!

Edited August 20, 2012 by carmine

[SantiSuk]

Not a Scouser in sight eh? Some things never change!

nursing an appalling hangover yesterday.

christ that was bad. ref might not have helped but we didn't help ourselves. basic errors and a general lack of fight after going down to ten men. must do better.

we're still massively lacking depth in the squad though and i still distrust these owners and their motives. brendan may well get plenty of time from the fans and the owners but time alone doesn't get you back to where you want the club to be. still think that the owners will sell players before the window closes and the impact on the wage bill shows in the depth of the squad. without significant investment this squad is a 6th/7th/8th place setup.

You just wait for it.......due to us having new young managers.the scumbag press will be jumping all over Spurs and Liverpool if we have a poor start.

Arsenal were the whipping boys for the press and TV pundits for several months last year. It's so irritating to listen to their cheap lazy parotted drivel, even when it's clear the club is pulling out of a bad phase. My sympathies to any team's supporters that has to put up with it. It was starting big time on Sky in the second half for Liverpool - I was getting irrirated by it all over again.

Commentators should be working each other more on Sky - the question that they should have been addressing was 'what does BR need to do to turn this club around" not "oh deary me this lot were rubbish last year and they are no better this year"

[StevieH]

Arsenal were the whipping boys for the press and TV pundits for several months last year. It's so irritating to listen to their cheap lazy parotted drivel, even when it's clear the club is pulling out of a bad phase. My sympathies to any team's supporters that has to put up with it. It was starting big time on Sky in the second half for Liverpool - I was getting irrirated by it all over again.

Commentators should be working each other more on Sky - the question that they should have been addressing was 'what does BR need to do to turn this club around" not "oh deary me this lot were rubbish last year and they are no better this year"

unfortunately sky and the bbc believe that the vast majority of football fans are unthinking idiots - and unfortunately they're right. that's not an excuse though, they are supposed to be there to inform and entertain and i don't think they do either - the level of football 'analysis' in mainstream media is absolutely abject. there are better options around but you have to seek them out.

[brit1984]

I don't see the big deal about the West Brom game. Strange results / poor performances are not unusual early in the season. The fact that we have a new manager, who is trying to impose an entirely new style of play on the team makes it even less surprising.

Skrtel and Agger obviously had bad games but they are great players and we have a great defence. 3 points dropped may prove to be a small price to pay for keeping our centre-backs if their poor performances were enough to scare off any potential acquirers.

It is too early to say Borini is not a decent striker and we already knew Downing is the weak link in the team so his poor performance can't have been a surprise to anyone. Obviously strengthening the forward line prior to deadline day would be ideal, but we already knew that too.

United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal should be the top 4 unless one of them has a shocking season (like Chelsea did last year) but even if that happens, Newcastle and Spurs will fight us for the other Champions League spot. Hopefully, the West Brom result also leads to some more realistic expectations.

Sent from iPhone; please forgive any typos or violations of forum rules

[Devil]

Adam Johnson 10Mil , anyone think he would be a good buy?

To be honest I have rarely seen him actually play...but always looked a solid players with some good ability when he did.

[MrRed]

I have followed his career and rate him highly,he is one of those players who needs to be loved but has undoubted talent and.....is better than Downing.

[carmine]

I have followed his career and rate him highly,he is one of those players who needs to be loved but has undoubted talent and.....is better than Downing.

If FSG asked very nicely perhaps City will give Liverpool Johnson and keep paying his salary.

[StevieH]

I have followed his career and rate him highly,he is one of those players who needs to be loved but has undoubted talent and.....is better than Downing.

don't want adam johnson at all. he's completely overrated, greedy, ineffective against teams who aren't already beaten and is too fond of a drink. we'd find far better value overseas.

[StevieH]

this is pretty painful/infuriating reading for liverpool supporters. does though illustrate what complete and utter cun_ts the club has been run by for the past six years or so.

Tony Barrett

The Times 21 August 2012

At lunchtime on Saturday, April 3, 2010, Joe Cole scored a famous backheel at Old Trafford that helped Chelsea towards their last Premier League title and earned him a place in the folklore of the club.

Even when the ball was making its way into Edwin van der Saar’s goal through the legs of Patrice Evra, though, it had already become clear that Cole’s future lay away from Stamford Bridge regardless of any heroics against Manchester United.

Contract talks had long since become protracted with Chelsea no longer convinced of his worth to the club following a serious knee injury and, according to reports at the time, the club baulked at Cole’s demand for a pay increase that would have taken his weekly wage from £80,000 to £100,000. However, there was someone in football who was willing to offer the England international that kind of deal though and in the minutes that followed Cole’s famous backheel he sent text messages boasting of how he was going to make Cole a Liverpool player.

That man was Christian Purslow, Liverpool’s then chief executive, who accompanied the messages he sent with a request for the information to go no further or else the deal would be jeopardised. So clandestine was Operation Joe Cole that even Rafael Benitez, the then Liverpool manager, was not aware of it.

Benitez had already made his feelings clear on Cole, in public as well. Prior to Liverpool’s defeat by Arsenal at the Emirates on February 10, 2010, the Spaniard had held talks with Purslow at London’s Melia White House Hotel with the pair discussing potential transfer targets for the following summer.

Having sold Robbie Keane the previous winter and being left with only the increasingly injury-prone Fernando Torres and the unproven David Ngog as frontline attackers, Benitez made it plain that his priority when the transfer window opened was to sign a forward. Purslow told Benitez that he had a better idea – Cole was likely to become available in the summer and better still he would be on a free transfer.

Benitez’s angry reaction was such that Purslow was left in no uncertain terms that his manager would not even consider the proposed move. So volcanic was it that guests staying at the luxury hotel were left stunned by the exchange that took place in a reception area that was also open to the public.

As far as Benitez was concerned, if a free transfer was the best that Liverpool – then struggling under the weight of the debts piled onto the club by Tom Hicks and George Gillett Jr – could do then the only position he wanted filling was in attack. His suggestion was to move for Marouane Chamakh who was himself set to become available on a free transfer four months later.

Purslow disagreed with his manager, and with the assessment of the likes of Jose Mourinho, Fabio Capello and Carlo Ancelotti, who all doubted Cole's ongoing ability to cut it at a big club, and continued to pursue the former West Ham United player. Chamakh, meanwhile, joined Arsenal where he remains despite a less than productive spell that seems destined to come to an end as soon as Arsene Wenger can find a new home for the Moroccan.

A similar situation is unfolding at Anfield where Brendan Rodgers has inherited a player who has been taken off injured in the two competitive matches in which he has featured in for his new manager. Rodgers would like to offload Cole but the problem is there isn’t much of a market for a player who has shown precious little to justify Liverpool’s decision to sign him and who, a moderately successful season on loan at Lille notwithstanding, has thus far failed to disprove the opinion of the Chelsea hierarchy that he was past his best.

Even those negatives, though, could probably be overcome if he was not earning astronomical wages and herein lies the problem. Depending on who you listen to, Cole is being paid anything between £90,000-£110,000 by Liverpool every single week. Over the course of the four-year contract he signed when joining the club in July 2010, that equates to a minimum of £18,720,000. In return, Cole has started just nine league games and scored only two goals.

It is madhouse economics and during a period when Liverpool, who recently paid off Alberto Aquilani just to get the Italian (a £17 million fee followed by weekly wages of £80,000) off their books, are striving desperately to get their finances in order, Cole’s nine-minute cameo at West Bromwich Albion at the weekend could not have been more badly timed.

If the sight of Cole clutching his hamstring shortly after coming off the bench was telling, then even more so was the reaction of his manager when the 30-year-old indicated that he was unsure whether or not he could continue. Unlike Cole, Rodgers had no doubts and replaced him immediately with the out-of-favour Andy Carroll.

The injury means Cole could now be out for the next four weeks, a layoff that would mean the midfield player will only be fit for action once the transfer window has closed. In the meantime, Rodgers is likely to be imploring his physiotherapy team to work some magic, more out of a desire to stand at least an outside chance of moving Cole and his wages on than out of a belief that he can become the first Liverpool manager to extract value for money from him on the pitch.

None of this is the fault of Cole. He merely did what any professional would do when offered such a lucrative contract after realising that his future lay elsewhere. He arrived at Liverpool with the best of intentions and his professionalism and value as a team-mate has never been in question even though his worth to the team and value for money quite clearly are.

In some ways, albeit not in a financial sense, Cole is a victim in all this. His career is stagnating to an alarming extent, so much so that his name is not even mentioned in dispatches when England squads are mentioned. He moved to the wrong club at the wrong time and now appears trapped there by a contract that makes potential buyers run a mile. For someone who has always lived for football and for the joy of playing the game that is a tragedy, even if it is an extortionately well remunerated one.

Somehow, Cole and Liverpool need to be put out of their mutual misery. The past two years have shown that they are not good for one another and Rodgers is now the third Liverpool manager, following on from Roy Hodgson and Kenny Dalglish, who is struggling to find a use for him.

Should Rodgers manage to add to his squad before the transfer window closes at the end of this month then it is almost inconceivable that he will be keen for Cole to remain but for a parting of the ways to occur one of two things must happen. Either Cole must accept that his Liverpool career is over and look for a new club in the knowledge that wherever he goes he will have to accept a significant pay cut, or else Liverpool will have to come up with a pay off to help ease him through the Shankly Gates.

Whatever happens, that backheel at Old Trafford must be starting to feel like it happened in another lifetime for Joe Cole.

[rott]

indeed, as do liverpool's global marketing partnerships and the commercial revenues that come with them. we're the 8th most valuable club in the world yet last season were the 8th best team in england.

That mostly shows just how skewed the league has become by free spending multi billionaire owners.

not really. we finished below newcastle and everton, chelsea finished three places behind arsenal.

Fair point. Just bad management then.

No, you were right in the first place, the league has become skewed by free spending multi billionaire owners. That is a self-evident truth.

How much that is responsible for Liverpool's current fall from grace is another matter.

Edit:-Sorry about this troops, it wouldn't accept my post because there were already too many on, so I removed one and it came out a bit arse about face.

Edited August 22, 2012 by rott

[MrRed]

Is Sahin going to be a replacement for Gerrard?

[mrbojangles]

I have followed his career and rate him highly,he is one of those players who needs to be loved but has undoubted talent and.....is better than Downing.

don't want adam johnson at all. he's completely overrated, greedy, ineffective against teams who aren't already beaten and is too fond of a drink. we'd find far better value overseas.

Which pretty well sums up the reason he isn't getting many starts at City. I liked him at first but then found him to be a bit of a one trick pony who's been found out.

[StevieH]

Is Sahin going to be a replacement for Gerrard?

why, where is gerrard going?

[MrRed]

What has he done that Balotelli or Tevez hasn't done Mr Bo? seems a bit harsh on him as Mancini has never really give him a chance to perform in the team for an extended period.

[brit1984]

Is Sahin going to be a replacement for Gerrard?

That is the way I see it with 1-year for him to prove he has that potential (and for us to demonstrate to him that we have some potential)...

[carmine]

Can someone answer me on this one...has Nuri Sahi signed a loan deal because some on here are talking as if he already has?