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Posted (edited)

It seems this panel of academics forgot a small item - if parliament has been dissolved for over five months, and if the election was nullified, and if the 30 days to convene parliament expired, and if the 30 days to nominate a prime minister from it expired, and if the prime minister was removed, and if nine other cabinet ministers were removed - exactly how do you justify the authority of whatever is left of a caretaker cabinet, whose public mandate constitutionally expired on March 5 ? The argument is awfully selective ! One of the three points the Senate cited in their address on Friday is that they believe that there is no fully functioning prime minister and fully functioning cabinet. Now. It's not exactly a novel point of conjecture. They're right ! The EC has a very good point indeed when it comes to the question of Niwattumrong. He was selected through a process completely outside of precedent, let alone the constitution. These particular academics think otherwise. Fine, take it to the Constitutional Court. It is inevitable that they'll rule on this at some point, in any event. In the meantime, the EC can't just simply assume it.

Edited by Scamper
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Posted

Worajet said the PDRC and its allies were like a pack of wolves surrounding the government, adding that the Kingdom had reached a dead-end because people did not want to stick to the law. He also said the selection of a new Senate speaker was illegitimate as the charter clearly states that the upper House cannot convene when there is no Parliament.

What is this nutjob on about?

The kingdom has reached a dead end because the GOVERNMENT don't want to stick to the law. They reject and ignore every court order they don't agree with even from the highest courts applying nothing but the law.

The new senate speaker was selected legitimately, they are the only functioning wing of parliament, and the GOVERNMENT actually convened a special session which is withing the charter.

Cherry picking through the constitution as usual and quoting articles out of their context... same old, same old.

Posted (edited)

This is the start right here , yes wait for it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..

"A Bring back Yingluck campaign"

Edited by jollyman
Posted

Thos posters advocating the election of senators should pause to think after it was revealed some flew to meet Thaksin in Singapore.

Senators are supposed to be neutral, a check and balance on governmental power.

So what do some do? Fly to seek advice from their master.

Disgusting.

Some just stay in Bangkok to obey their masters, Disgusting, Isn't it.............

Appointed senator Somchai Sawaengkarn said the voting patterns of appointed senators show that 60 of the 73 appointed senators are in the anti-government camp.

The remaining 13 are believed to be aligned with the government, Mr Somchai said.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/121241/the-reason-why-the-thai-establishment-likes-appointed-senators/

Posted

Perhaps they don't particularly like the PT government for various reasons and they would not be the only ones but the EC commissioners have two particular concerns:

1. They could be charged with malfeasance for wasting taxpayers' money, if they organised another election that ended up being annulled. This could also be a civil case for damages that could bankrupt them.

2. They are concerned about legal ramifications of being involved in submitting a royal decree, if it were to turn out that an acting PM had no authority to countersign one.

These seem to be rather prudent concerns, given that Thai politics has become more litigious than the US medical profession but professional indemnity insurance is not yet available to the same extent.

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This post is revealing especially when you consider that various PTP MP's have threatened law suites for NOT doing the election even after the government was warned it needed to find a compromise then after elections were held which failed they were threatened that THEY the EC should pay 3.8 billion for the failed election .. PTP logic for you!

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  • Like 2
Posted

It seems this panel of academics forgot a small item - if parliament has been dissolved for over five months, and if the election was nullified, and if the 30 days to convene parliament expired, and if the 30 days to nominate a prime minister from it expired, and if the prime minister was removed, and if nine other cabinet ministers were removed - exactly how do you justify the authority of whatever is left of a caretaker cabinet, whose public mandate constitutionally expired on March 5 ? The argument is awfully selective ! One of the three points the Senate cited in their address on Friday is that they believe that there is no fully functioning prime minister and fully functioning cabinet. Now. It's not exactly a novel point of conjecture. They're right ! The EC has a very good point indeed when it comes to the question of Niwattumrong. He was selected through a process completely outside of precedent, let alone the constitution. These particular academics think otherwise. Fine, take it to the Constitutional Court. It is inevitable that they'll rule on this at some point, in any event. In the meantime, the EC can't just simply assume it.

Yada yada yada. Just one small thing scamper. It's called a Constitution. Section 181 refers. Now, what were you saying?

Posted

Thos posters advocating the election of senators should pause to think after it was revealed some flew to meet Thaksin in Singapore.

Senators are supposed to be neutral, a check and balance on governmental power.

So what do some do? Fly to seek advice from their master.

Disgusting.

Some just stay in Bangkok to obey their masters, Disgusting, Isn't it.............

Appointed senator Somchai Sawaengkarn said the voting patterns of appointed senators show that 60 of the 73 appointed senators are in the anti-government camp.

The remaining 13 are believed to be aligned with the government, Mr Somchai said.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/121241/the-reason-why-the-thai-establishment-likes-appointed-senators/

Or you could say some just stay in Bangkok to try and ensure the important job of finding a resolution to this mess rather than fly to Singapore for talks with a convicted on the run criminal and financier of a militia wing of government!

"Appointed senator Somchai Sawaengkarn said the voting patterns of appointed senators show that 60 of the 73 appointed senators are in the lets find a way out of this mess camp"

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  • Like 1
Posted

And if elections are held now, and if the PTP regain power, we will be back in this exact same situitation in another 2-3 years. So how exactly does that benefit Thailand or it's people?

The PTP will never enact meaningful reforms, and you know it. They will simply continue to gut the system, install their own puppets into places of power and bring Thaksin back a free man.

Thaksin and the PTP must really be licking their chops at the thought of getting stuck into that 2.2 TRILLION baht infrastructure money. You know, that ever so necessary high speed train project.

"Its" people should be able to vote for whomever they want. Other people can spend their energy campaigning.

  • Like 1
Posted

And if elections are held now, and if the PTP regain power, we will be back in this exact same situitation in another 2-3 years. So how exactly does that benefit Thailand or it's people?

The PTP will never enact meaningful reforms, and you know it. They will simply continue to gut the system, install their own puppets into places of power and bring Thaksin back a free man.

Thaksin and the PTP must really be licking their chops at the thought of getting stuck into that 2.2 TRILLION baht infrastructure money. You know, that ever so necessary high speed train project.

"Its" people should be able to vote for whomever they want. Other people can spend their energy campaigning.

So you don't believe Thailand's political landscape needs reforms?

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Posted

Whats with this Government anyway ?

We have 26 caretaker cabinet ministers some of whom if not all who have been appointed to the job for services rendered to one political party or another.

Most of those 26 we never hear of or from.

How many of then have been democratically elected to the job of MP's in the PT administration, including the coalition partners, that is actually faced a constituency in a general election ?

I know that at least one is a come back from being banned from politics for 5 years for election fraud and was appointed in one of the 6 cabinet reshuffles.

In reality they have all been appointed even if they were at one time MP's, and who has appointed them ?

Could it be the one who we heard of that groups and individuals were flying of to see to lobby for a cabinet post ?

For sure it is.

So what we have is a group of appointees who were appointed to the job they previously held (cabinet ministers and deputies) by the a convicted criminal on the run who has a 2 year jail sentence and multiple criminal charges awaiting him if he ever comes back to the country.

Is this a Government or is it a coup by appointment ?

So what, no system is perfect? The most important thing is that people will be able to decide for themselves.

Look at the so-called Greatest Nation on Earth, which represents itself as a beacon of democracy for the rest of the world, which is a complete farce when you see how the lobby groups operate there by greasing palms and with a president that is answerable to a handful of banker puppet masters.

the u.k. doesnt have a president..biggrin.png

Posted (edited)

So you don't believe Thailand's political landscape needs reforms?

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

From elected officials, yes.

Outside of my country, I'm not going to tell people for whom they should vote.

Edited by dukeandduke
Posted (edited)

Worajet suggested that acting Prime Minister Niwattumrong Boonsongpaisan continue pushing for a fresh election even if it ends up being nullified again by the Constitutional Court due to obstruction by the anti-government People's Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC).

Does it means that they themselves are not confident about the validity of a new election but they just want a election hurriedly even though the political crisis is ongoing?

So if the election fail again, does they need to be accountable for anything even though they already knew the election may not be valid as they knew it will ends up nullified again by the CC due to the political crisis?

And if this time , the pdrc didn't obstruct the election and election result ended with majority of no-vote and absent. What should the govt do? Does it signal to the govt that the people do not want this election process at the moment?

Just for thoughts..

Edited by Smokemachine
  • Like 1
Posted

I am surprised at the activists and academic's endorsing this as they know full well the PTP up country support of bribes, intimidation, physical violence etc , I would have thought they would have supported reforms before elections to nullify these problems at election times and also any hidden agenda's the PTP seem to be indicating they have up there sleave, the academic's should know by now that to trust the PTP is not a great option. bah.gif

  • Like 2
Posted

So you don't believe Thailand's political landscape needs reforms?

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

From elected officials, yes.

Outside of my country, I'm not going to tell people for whom they should vote.

Ok. Elected officials like a PM who's party ran for election with slogan "A convicted criminal thinks Phua Thai acts "

Off course they used the words Thaksin instead of convicted criminal. But as they say in Thailand. Same, same.

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post-195835-14003904977519_thumb.jpg

  • Like 1
Posted

Perhaps they don't particularly like the PT government for various reasons and they would not be the only ones but the EC commissioners have two particular concerns:

1. They could be charged with malfeasance for wasting taxpayers' money, if they organised another election that ended up being annulled. This could also be a civil case for damages that could bankrupt them.

2. They are concerned about legal ramifications of being involved in submitting a royal decree, if it were to turn out that an acting PM had no authority to countersign one.

These seem to be rather prudent concerns, given that Thai politics has become more litigious than the US medical profession but professional indemnity insurance is not yet available to the same extent.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

This post is revealing especially when you consider that various PTP MP's have threatened law suites for NOT doing the election even after the government was warned it needed to find a compromise then after elections were held which failed they were threatened that THEY the EC should pay 3.8 billion for the failed election .. PTP logic for you!

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I think the PT threat was just a knee jerk reaction to the auditor-general's demand for the govt to repay the 3.8 billion. So far the AG has failed to clarify how it expects the govt to repay but repaying taxpayers out of taxpayers' money wouldn't make much sense.

Watana Asavahame and his accomplices in the waste water scam were just ordered to repay 21 billion. The governor of the BOT had to spend over 10 years of his retirement fighting a civil case to repay cUS$30 billion of Thailand's international reserves in the futile 1997 defence of the baht.

Ultimately Yingluck, Boonsong, Phum et al will likely face criminal and/or civil claims for up to 300 billion over the rice pledging.

We may think this is crazy but it should instil a sense if caution in commissioners and others.

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Posted

Govt 'has authority' to push for election

What Govt.?

The Govt. that is under investigation, been charged or has charges pending ????

Or the Senate that has just been elected?

The Senate is the only legitimate government in Thailand at this point in time.

Posted

Thos posters advocating the election of senators should pause to think after it was revealed some flew to meet Thaksin in Singapore.

Senators are supposed to be neutral, a check and balance on governmental power.

So what do some do? Fly to seek advice from their master.

Disgusting.

and what do those that have been "appointed" by the Yellows/Dems and Ammart do?

Well they don't fly out of the country to meet their "boss" and ask for instructions for a start.

Posted

Whats with this Government anyway ?

We have 26 caretaker cabinet ministers some of whom if not all who have been appointed to the job for services rendered to one political party or another.

Most of those 26 we never hear of or from.

How many of then have been democratically elected to the job of MP's in the PT administration, including the coalition partners, that is actually faced a constituency in a general election ?

I know that at least one is a come back from being banned from politics for 5 years for election fraud and was appointed in one of the 6 cabinet reshuffles.

In reality they have all been appointed even if they were at one time MP's, and who has appointed them ?

Could it be the one who we heard of that groups and individuals were flying of to see to lobby for a cabinet post ?

For sure it is.

So what we have is a group of appointees who were appointed to the job they previously held (cabinet ministers and deputies) by the a convicted criminal on the run who has a 2 year jail sentence and multiple criminal charges awaiting him if he ever comes back to the country.

Is this a Government or is it a coup by appointment ?

So what, no system is perfect? The most important thing is that people will be able to decide for themselves.

Look at the so-called Greatest Nation on Earth, which represents itself as a beacon of democracy for the rest of the world, which is a complete farce when you see how the lobby groups operate there by greasing palms and with a president that is answerable to a handful of banker puppet masters.

So What.

So its fine that a small group appointed by said convicted criminal are calling themselves a government and saying they have authority, to threaten and push the EC around.

The EC are a legally constituted body that has found itself in the unenviable position of having to make decisions that are way outside its mandate, they are right in being cautious when dealing with 26 people who may or may not have the authority to do anything.

That those 26 are still working for the one who appointed them is without question.

Is this the democracy Jatuporn and his followers are fighting for, sole control of the tattered remnants of a Government by one man, a man who through these 26 and his red army are crying down every attempt to find a reasonable solution to the situation he has created by his lust for power ?

I note that the supporters of these 26 and their controller are making a big thing of part of the Senate being appointed, according to law I may add, yet accept that those who they support are also appointed.

As you say people should be able to decide for themselves, 'but' without being coerced, intimidated or bribed into making decisions that in a free and fair situation they may not have made.

Oh and this is Thailand, what happens in other countries has no bearing on what is happening here.

  • Like 1
Posted

So you don't believe Thailand's political landscape needs reforms?

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

From elected officials, yes.

Outside of my country, I'm not going to tell people for whom they should vote.

Ok. Elected officials like a PM who's party ran for election with slogan "A convicted criminal thinks Phua Thai acts "

Off course they used the words Thaksin instead of convicted criminal. But as they say in Thailand. Same, same.

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I don't know why you're talking to me about Thaksin. I haven't talked about him.

If you're so passionate about this, why don't you encourage Thai people to vote for someone else?

Posted

I am surprised at the activists and academic's endorsing this as they know full well the PTP up country support of bribes, intimidation, physical violence etc , I would have thought they would have supported reforms before elections to nullify these problems at election times and also any hidden agenda's the PTP seem to be indicating they have up there sleave, the academic's should know by now that to trust the PTP is not a great option. bah.gif

The academics will be familiar with the results of recent studies that show that vote buying was not a significant factor in determining recent Thai general election results. Many of us have posted links to these studies again and again on this forum, but the 'educated' TVF commentators do not seem to want to read them. Anybody familiar with the demographics of the mittlestand won't be surprised.

Posted

Thos posters advocating the election of senators should pause to think after it was revealed some flew to meet Thaksin in Singapore.

Senators are supposed to be neutral, a check and balance on governmental power.

So what do some do? Fly to seek advice from their master.

Disgusting.

and what do those that have been "appointed" by the Yellows/Dems and Ammart do?

Well they don't fly out of the country to meet their "boss" and ask for instructions for a start.

And I wonder how many of them got complimentary seats with TG to contribute to TG's continued loss making.

Posted

I am surprised at the activists and academic's endorsing this as they know full well the PTP up country support of bribes, intimidation, physical violence etc , I would have thought they would have supported reforms before elections to nullify these problems at election times and also any hidden agenda's the PTP seem to be indicating they have up there sleave, the academic's should know by now that to trust the PTP is not a great option. bah.gif

The academics will be familiar with the results of recent studies that show that vote buying was not a significant factor in determining recent Thai general election results. Many of us have posted links to these studies again and again on this forum, but the 'educated' TVF commentators do not seem to want to read them. Anybody familiar with the demographics of the mittlestand won't be surprised.

Much of the vote buying comes with intimidation & coercion & we actually have no idea how these studies were conducted. We all have an opinion on how biased many of the international media groups are or how their reporting is superficial at best so just how well were those studies conducted. Even if the Dems were even allowed near the voters in red heartland most would probably be too fearful to take their money.

  • Like 1
Posted

Yes....let the people vote for who they want, even if it ruins the economy. An who gets ruined the most? The poor and disenfranchised. Then one would hope the poor voters wake up in the next 20 or 30 years to see just what has happened. Maybe they will vote more wisely next time.

Well trying to manipulate them to maybe be wise is a very stupid idea.

Posted

Yes....let the people vote for who they want, even if it ruins the economy. An who gets ruined the most? The poor and disenfranchised. Then one would hope the poor voters wake up in the next 20 or 30 years to see just what has happened. Maybe they will vote more wisely next time.

Well trying to manipulate them to maybe be wise is a very stupid idea.

Posted

Sutep and the prdc have tried all angles to hijack demroracy!

They have be told they have no legal basis to pursue the appointment of a interim PM.

Sutep himself knows now the end is near hence his last desperate final push for the 25tn may.

The elections should now go ahead and let the people decide.

It's a bitter pill for the yellows to swallow because yet another landslide victory is on it's way for the PTP and one of the main reasons for that is that they have been so focused on the peoples medium and the mad monk that abhisit has once again been sidelined.

He should instead been on the front foot laying out positive policies and at least been seen to be a politician instead of letting sutep derail the dems hopes of at least having some chance of winning over the people!

And what have been the success stories of the PTP administration over the past three years?

I think they will be voted back in but will be heavily dependent on the good will of other parties to form a majority. Lets just hope those other parties don't jump ship eh!

I will give you one success story. One ministry has been outstanding and delivered with 100% results.

With all the PTP failed policies, the succession talk, the broken promises, the violence perpetrated on the PDRC, the lack of transparency, the nepotism, having an election promise to stamp down on corruption then reduce the NACC budget by 60% and try to absolve 25 000 corruption cases, holding the voters in contempt at every avenue and the focus on 1 principle of democracy while ignoring the other 14 they will still win an election…..maybe….Why? A double pronged attack. The ministry of propaganda and the UDD schools of propaganda set up in the north by 2 accused terrorists that go into hiding when bail revocation hearings come up and an ex communist leader that lived in exile for years to escape persecution. That is there biggest and only success.

Just look at the TVF members. They have become the very thing they purport to hate. Calling police officers speeches "crass" for celebrating terrorist activity and the deaths in Trat. That's it? Crass? Wow. Yet when a monk is fighting for 14 principles of democracy while holding off on one the fangs come out. He is the devil reincarnate. A fascist thug. The worst kind of evil you could imagine apparently. Police officer that promotes death and terrorism. Crass. Monk. Well you get the picture. The ministry of propaganda has worked a treat on that lot. The ministry is sooooo strong that the TVF members cannot even name the principles they are fighting for. They come up with a 200 word reply saying they won't waste their time replying. WOW> The cornerstone of what the PTP purport to adhere too yet they can't be bothered to tell us what that actually is. They harp on elections because that is what the PTP do. They are stuttering parrots. PTP say something then they mimic it. When an OP comes out that shines the PTP in a bad light, they usually hold off on replies until the PTP minister of denial comes out, Prompong Nopparit, and denies everything and gives a swell excuse that is digestible to the supporters of the 1 principle.

But it gets better, just like the 2007 constitution referendum, just like the majority that did not want the amnesty and just like every foreign and local entity and individual and have criticized the PTP or offered wisdom they will ignore it if it does not suit their agenda. Just as they cannot name 1 PTP success they cannot name one entity that the PTP have listened too. yingluck even invited Tony Blair to come and make a speech designed at reconciliation. What did the PTP do in reaction to Blairs wise words? The PTP did the opposite to what Blair suggested!!! They spout elections while ignoring the other principles of democracy because it suits them. Mark my words the excuses will fly if they loose. Just like a wrong decision by the courts that go against the PTP is called a judicial coup the new catch word after a failed election will be an electoral coup. They are fascinated by the word. It is their "get out of jail free" card. Unaccountability in action at its finest.

There greatest success is propaganda and their greatest failures can be witnessed on a daily basis.

the regular halfwits wont reply to your post..incapable of reasoned debate..just ner ner ner.and trolling but hey it hurts them that your right or they would come back at you..

  • Like 1
Posted

Yes....let the people vote for who they want, even if it ruins the economy. An who gets ruined the most? The poor and disenfranchised. Then one would hope the poor voters wake up in the next 20 or 30 years to see just what has happened. Maybe they will vote more wisely next time.

Well trying to manipulate them to maybe be wise is a very stupid idea.

How about it you were to replace manipulate with educate.

Do you thing that would still be stupid ?

Of course that's subjective isn't it ? One persons education can be another's manipulation, example, red schools and re-education groups.

Posted

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

one small detail they have conveniently left out as usual PTP style - there are currently no cabinet ministers or PM

Just a small matter none the less a significant one.

Posted

So you don't believe Thailand's political landscape needs reforms?

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

From elected officials, yes.

Outside of my country, I'm not going to tell people for whom they should vote.

Ok. Elected officials like a PM who's party ran for election with slogan "A convicted criminal thinks Phua Thai acts "

Off course they used the words Thaksin instead of convicted criminal. But as they say in Thailand. Same, same.

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I don't know why you're talking to me about Thaksin. I haven't talked about him.

If you're so passionate about this, why don't you encourage Thai people to vote for someone else?

I do. And just because YOU haven't mentioned him it doesn't mean he not worth mentioning.

As other posters have stated it's not JUST Thaksin that's the problem it's actually the large political families. They are a problem in politics around the world!

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Posted

"In a forum on solutions for the crisis held at Thammasat University's Rangsit Campus yesterday, Worajet Pakeerat said Article 195 of the charter states that only a Cabinet minister has the authority to submit a request for a Royal Decree for a new poll, and not the Election Commission".

A bit difficult actually as there are no cabinet ministers or a PM for that matter!!!

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