Junta wants sweeping reforms before election

[FangFerang]

It seems incongruous that when a PM is selected, a Royal Decree is necessary before they officially take office. However, when a junta takes control no such mandate is necessary.

?

[FangFerang]

One other thing.

The only reform that would be level-handed is a Charter amendment that requires a super-majority -- 70% -- to sign off on major economic bills, amendments to the charter and other major expenditures. That would prevent future midnight legislation, rice scheming, and major rip-offs.

But they will not do that. Never. Both sides reserve the right for total control when elected.

The only reforms we are going to see is a permanent redistricting that guarantees that the Democrats always win.

[Emster23]

If the group for "maintaining peace and order" actually meant what they profess to be, first place you'd think they would start have to be PDRC and all those who vowed to shut down Bangkok, have final showdowns, etc. THEY were the ones disturbing peace and order. The reds showed remarkable restraint (as pointed out in international news before that was cut off) but it still didn't stop PDRC sympathizers (the army) from having coup. What kind of reform will be required so that Dems can win election? Each of their votes counts for 3?

Junta wants sweeping reforms before election

This is the good news. Sidewalks and beaches would make a pig blush. Get real trash off the public areas.

[Artisi]

It seems incongruous that when a PM is selected, a Royal Decree is necessary before they officially take office. However, when a junta takes control no such mandate is necessary.

?

Funny that, seems that's the difference between a junta as you like to call it and a corrupt government clinging onto power at any costs - allowing the corrupt politicians to carry-on lining their pockets - at the cost of the people and businesses of Thailand.

So get over it - currently its past history, gone as well as not necessary.

[stickyrice2000]

It's funny how some commenters here criticize the leaders from other countries for having no knowledges about Thailand. You are reading and knowing the facts from the news and surfaces of events. Some may be true and some are not. These leaders have experiences and know the politician games better than you do. They have insider's scoops. Is it a violation of human rights? Yes, it is. You may support the Junta and not mind about your right restrainted. Other citizens do not. They are suppressed and restraints from their freedom rights.

[Publicus]

From the OP:

The military believes underground movements would soon surface to oppose the coup.

The military dictators and the ammart are deeper into it than they had ever been for a hundred years yet they're still digging.

Good on US Ambassador Kristie Kenney and German Ambassador Rolf Schulze among others for not attending the meeting because, as they said, they want nothing to do with the Thai military as dictators ruling over Thailand. That's an excellent posture by Prez Obama and Chancellor Angela Merkel.

Waiting also for the sanctions coming that were referenced in the OP, by the United States and the European Union. I see the State Department has now issued a travel warning against travel to Thailand, which throws the marker down to begin the international processes to isolate the military dictatorship. Military mutiny coup d'état is already passe' in civilized society but this one is beyond the pale.

has only just begun to begin for the militarists, the military dictators, the ammart. There's a severe shitstorm headed their way.

Security Message for U.S. Citizens: Security Situation in Thailand

Thailand Travel Alert

Last Updated: May 23, 2014

The U.S. Department of State recommends that U.S. citizens reconsider any non-essential travel to Thailand, particularly Bangkok, due to ongoing political and social unrest and restrictions on internal movements, including an indefinite nighttime curfew throughout Thailand. The Department of State has advised official U.S. government travelers to defer all non-essential travel to Thailand until further notice. This Travel Alert supersedes the Travel Alert issued on May 16, 2014.

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/service.html

I love to see posts that are straight out of the Robert Amsterdam/Thaksin/Red PR book. Well done Publicus. However, most of the decent and normal working class people I have spoken to would not agree with you and stand squarely behind the army. The ammart are a fiction, blown out of all proportion such as your boss' claim to be a democrat. Role on Thaksin: the ultimate Autocrat!

Given your ignorance, of Thai society, culture, politics, government, I'll enlighten you here and now, for which I'm sure you'd be grateful because now you can have some notional awareness of things you hadn't ever known about Thailand: I am most pleased to educate you in this matter from your non-base of zero knowledge. You believe anything you're told concerning Thailand, so why not believe myself or others over on this side.

The following descriptions are sourced from Michael H Nelson of the Southeast Asia Research Center of the City University of Hong Kong, who was also a Visiting Scholar on the Faculty of Political Science, Chulalongkorn University, in his work, The Electoral Rules Concerning The House of Representatives in the 2007 Thai Constitution. The URL is posted at the conclusion of the post.

*** The informal socio-political networks (categorized as ammart) of leading bureaucrats, technocrats, and academics involved in politics and administration, who claim to possess superior knowledge as well as morality and thus consider themselves to have special rights in guiding the country's social, political and economic directions (this group is Thailand's version of Plato's true navigators).

*** The military as a self-interested and closed organization that also poses as the self-appointed guardian of national unity and survival, protector of the monarchy, and final arbiter about who is allowed to govern the country.

*** The politicians with their vast informal and exclusionary networks at the provincial, regional, and national levels (including their factions and political parties), who claim that they represent the people, and that constitutionally produced electoral success provides them with the democratic legitimacy to govern the country and dominate the other groups and models in terms of policy making.

Not the ammart, but indeed a core essence of Thailand are :

*** The people themselves, who are the supposed sovereign of the democratic political system. Their involvement in politics as citizens,voters, party members, target group of policies, civil society groups, protestors, and social movements has had a rather mixed record, but it has recently been put into focus by a substantial increase in politicization.

Mr Nelson also includes a description of the Thai monarchy which I omit from this post, not because there is anything controversial about it - it is a straightforward factual account by Mr Nelson - but because I personally prefer to exclude the mention or description of the monarchy from the contentious tones of this particular thread and topic.

http://www.academia....ai_Constitution

[esprit]

Wonder what they think an acceptable body count will be this time. It was 90 last time, 58 shot in the back by those so brave soldiers. Maybe 500 - 1000 or higher. How long before the generals amuse themselves with a bit of ethnic cleansing up North. After all even if they can not all afford cars up there many have old pick-ups which just get in the way of the general's Mercedes or BMWs ( yes he has several on his 105,000 THB/month salary ). Hopefully the UN will then step in, but given their record they will take action too late after thousands have been killed. This lot will make the Burma military Junta look like angels I suspect. World and public condemnation of their exploitation of the Royhinga sadly seems to have given this mottly excuse for professional military men, extra confidence.

From the OP:

The military believes underground movements would soon surface to oppose the coup.

The military dictators and the ammart are deeper into it than they had ever been for a hundred years yet they're still digging.

Good on US Ambassador Kristie Kenney and German Ambassador Rolf Schulze among others for not attending the meeting because, as they said, they want nothing to do with the Thai military as dictators ruling over Thailand. That's an excellent posture by Prez Obama and Chancellor Angela Merkel.

Waiting also for the sanctions coming that were referenced in the OP, by the United States and the European Union. I see the State Department has now issued a travel warning against travel to Thailand, which throws the marker down to begin the international processes to isolate the military dictatorship. Military mutiny coup d'état is already passe' in civilized society but this one is beyond the pale.

has only just begun to begin for the militarists, the military dictators, the ammart. There's a severe shitstorm headed their way.

Security Message for U.S. Citizens: Security Situation in Thailand

Thailand Travel Alert

Last Updated: May 23, 2014

The U.S. Department of State recommends that U.S. citizens reconsider any non-essential travel to Thailand, particularly Bangkok, due to ongoing political and social unrest and restrictions on internal movements, including an indefinite nighttime curfew throughout Thailand. The Department of State has advised official U.S. government travelers to defer all non-essential travel to Thailand until further notice. This Travel Alert supersedes the Travel Alert issued on May 16, 2014.

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/service.html

I love to see posts that are straight out of the Robert Amsterdam/Thaksin/Red PR book. Well done Publicus. However, most of the decent and normal working class people I have spoken to would not agree with you and stand squarely behind the army. The ammart are a fiction, blown out of all proportion such as your boss' claim to be a democrat. Role on Thaksin: the ultimate Autocrat!

Well it didn't take long.

No hesitation on this one.

The squeeze has begun. It won't happen overnight, nor will the United States do it alone and anyway won't have to do it alone. There will be lots of help from both inside and outside of Thailand.

US Cuts Military Aid To Thailand Following Coup

Although the U.S. provides other forms of aid to Thailand, including $1.3 million for narcotics and law-enforcement, there was around $3.5 million requested for specifically military assistance in 2014. Today's announcement wipes out nearly all of it

Yesterday, Joshua Kulantzick, a senior fellow for Southeast Asia at the Council on Foreign Relations, explained to Business Insider that the U.S. has little to gain from the military's moves and every reason to want to isolate the coup's organizers. He says that military rule following the ouster of an elected government will likely erode existing civil institutions and could destabilize a significant southeast Asian country.

"The military is incapable of actually running the country in terms of the policymaking we would need to see with a pretty complex and high-powered economy," he said, adding that "the potential for violence is now higher because the military has intervened." In 2010, 90 protestors were killed in Bangkok during a rash of political violence.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/cutting-military-aid-after-thailands-coup-2014-5#ixzz32aqOl98p

Edited May 24, 2014 by esprit

[ginjag]

Whatever is needed to restore the country back to norm will never be accepted by the 1% of TVF because never a wrong done and everything is politically motivated they say.

This heading --topic-- is exactly what was said all along by our good thinking 99% of TVF. Go for it guys.

[whybother]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

I wouldn't support a coup in my country because my country has a democratic system and checks and balances that basically works.

I am not sure that a coup is the best thing for Thailand, but the direction it was going wasn't that fantastic either.

The problem for Thailand was that the choice was between two extremes. If there was a poll done where people could choose between one of the extreme options of either side and a third middle of the road option, I would guess that a majority (you know, more than 50% ... not the less than 50% "majority" that voted for PTP) would choose the middle of the road option.

Unfortunately, there is no middle of the road option.

[whybother]

Whatever is needed to restore the country back to norm will never be accepted by the 1% of TVF because never a wrong done and everything is politically motivated they say.

This heading --topic-- is exactly what was said all along by our good thinking 99% of TVF. Go for it guys.

"back to norm" ????

Corruption IS normal in Thailand.

[rebelplatoon]

We all KNOW embassy staff have a deluded, secluded and opportunistic view of the countries they live in. They get swopped every four years and don t give a damn. Shame on them! Shame for judging a coup that is supported by 75% of the people! Shame on judging when the system in place absolutely FAILED! Get out of your special moo baans for embassy staff. Get off your asses, out of your shiny air conditioned premises and see what was happening on the streets! Stop interferring with a natural process. Politics failed. The country in tatters. On the verge of a civil war. Weapons were on the way. You guys are so blind in your ivory towers. Get a life! We live here. This is our home. We live this country. We re not journey men. We re here to stay. And the strife and troubles have torn this beautiful place apart. The coup will HEAL. It will take some time, but it WILL!

Shame on you lot!

Great strategies, peace restored, laws will be changed, warring factions stopped, farmers paid, people who care and are knowledgable will be in charge, economists and the likes. Good job. Carry on!

[ginjag]

Whatever is needed to restore the country back to norm will never be accepted by the 1% of TVF because never a wrong done and everything is politically motivated they say.

This heading --topic-- is exactly what was said all along by our good thinking 99% of TVF. Go for it guys.

"back to norm" ????

Corruption IS normal in Thailand.

It should really have said Back to some sort of transparency as and should be the NORM. So we shouldn't take the words I first stated as Thai norm. OK mate.??

[OJAS]

"Navy chief Narong Pipatanasai, another deputy of the junta, is overseeing social psychology works..."

Sounds to me very much like he's going to be in charge of mass brainwashing North Korea-style, then

[srsv1238]

Well father in law and the guy who rents wifeys paddy have been waiting for their rice payments since October. Hopefully the Junta will be good for their word and pay the poor farmers within 20 days.

how will they do that? With the same money that the caretaker government has been trying to pay the farmers with?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[ginjag]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

MAYBE us guys are not supporting a military coup, but find it is the best option to get rid of your slime party.

The cancerous government shot it's greedy self in the foot and self destructed it's election victory, but by doing that the same old Thaksin story comes to surface.

"WE NEVER DID WRONG" Yingluck Thaksin words, and " it's all politically motivated." You lot make me sick because of your denial.

Fancy being democratically elected and ABUSING the power---that's sick.

[Piichai]

Well father in law and the guy who rents wifeys paddy have been waiting for their rice payments since October. Hopefully the Junta will be good for their word and pay the poor farmers within 20 days.

The problem I see is the country, does not have the money to pay them, if they "find" money then what else suffers.

The country has the money to pay the farmers, but the former government had no means to access it due to their mismanagement of the situation.

One can only hope the farmers will remember this.

[ginjag]

Well father in law and the guy who rents wifeys paddy have been waiting for their rice payments since October. Hopefully the Junta will be good for their word and pay the poor farmers within 20 days.

how will they do that? With the same money that the caretaker government has been trying to pay the farmers with?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

NO not the same money, because the PTP had the money BEFORE the protests. BUT withheld it.

It will be monies from a different source ---will have to be.

[Piichai]

Clever but obvious move to pay the farmers first. The coup ousted government were blocked at every turn when trying to pay them.

The military have no such restriction.

Suthep,sadly, has won hands down as the military are now implementing everything no sane person wanted to see. Unelected government and officials. Where is Suthep by the way?

I think these guys are in it for a long ride, don't think you will see the illiterate great unwashed having an opportunity to express their democratic rights for some time to come.

Thailand is in a very sorry state.

The failed government blocked themselves when they didn't provide for the farmers before dissolving parliament.

With regard to Suthep: Check the Live Feed.

Edited May 24, 2014 by Piichai

[edwinchester]

election..... isn't that a dirty word to the Royal-Elitist ?..... how could the common Thai-people know what is good for them AND the county!

You are right. The common Thai-people do not even know how to vote. That is why they always had to have the village head man (under payment from Dubai) making sure they voted correctly and simultaneously ensured the continued good health of the family buffalo. That changed 2 days ago!!!

Doesn't sound at all like the village I live in. Everyone has always voted exactly the way they want to.

[ginjag]

election..... isn't that a dirty word to the Royal-Elitist ?..... how could the common Thai-people know what is good for them AND the county!

You are right. The common Thai-people do not even know how to vote. That is why they always had to have the village head man (under payment from Dubai) making sure they voted correctly and simultaneously ensured the continued good health of the family buffalo. That changed 2 days ago!!!

Doesn't sound at all like the village I live in. Everyone has always voted exactly the way they want to.

Are you talking about a village near Winchester ????

[scorecard]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Clever but obvious move to pay the farmers first. The coup ousted government were blocked at every turn when trying to pay them.

The military have no such restriction.

Suthep,sadly, has won hands down as the military are now implementing everything no sane person wanted to see. Unelected government and officials. Where is Suthep by the way?

I think these guys are in it for a long ride, don't think you will see the illiterate great unwashed having an opportunity to express their democratic rights for some time to come.

Thailand is in a very sorry state.

The failed government blocked themselves when they didn't provide for the farmers before dissolving parliament.

With regard to Suthep: Check the Live Feed.

'Live Feed'? Please share.

[kimamey]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

I didn't want a coup as I think it will hurt the Democrats but since it's happened let's hope what comes out of it is an improvement even if PTP win the next election as that's not the real problem. It wouldn't happen in my country because the politicians are better but if there were real problems with the government then I might accept it.

The majority didn't vote for PP but they won the majority of seats so they formed the government which was accepted by the Democrats. The governing party represents all of Thailand not only it's voters. Those that didn't have a right to be governed by a parliament based on all the parties who won seats and in this case the majority were from PTP that they didn't vote for. They also have a right to have a PM who is up to the job and can stand up and defend with the help of her ministers her governments policies. The shouldn't have to put up with a PM who doesn't know what's going on and rarely goes to parliament or the appernt control of that government by a man who wasn't in the election so gained no votes whatsoever.

Yes the coup is bad and mostly in my view for the Democrats but it's not quite so sickening when you look at things with less bias.

[smedly]

While he is at reforming how about reforming the kangaroo courts that are filled with yellows and hand down bias verdicts time after time!

And reinstate yingluck as PM!

I challenge you to name a few and state your reasons

as usual you are acting like a stuttering parrot

[kimamey]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Clever but obvious move to pay the farmers first. The coup ousted government were blocked at every turn when trying to pay them.

The military have no such restriction.

Suthep,sadly, has won hands down as the military are now implementing everything no sane person wanted to see. Unelected government and officials. Where is Suthep by the way?

I think these guys are in it for a long ride, don't think you will see the illiterate great unwashed having an opportunity to express their democratic rights for some time to come.

Thailand is in a very sorry state.

The failed government blocked themselves when they didn't provide for the farmers before dissolving parliament.

With regard to Suthep: Check the Live Feed.

'Live Feed'? Please share.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/728687-thailand-live-saturday-24-may-2014/

[srsv1238]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

of course, Thai people cannot be trusted to make their own decisions..... :-/

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[badgerbailey]

It is a Shame that the world leaders and embassy personnel do not understand what has been going on in Thailand under the PTT along with the UDD and WHY the Millitary Had to step in to Save the Country.... This is Not a General Suchinda type of Coup{1992} that he ordered his troops to kill protesters... Suchinda was a greedy power crazy General. This General Truly care about Thailand and All it's people.

Rubbish. it has got nothing to do with whether or not they care, but how the country gets itself away from a corrupt government, and tanks and guns are not the answer, can you imagine if they actually approved the use of a coup to get rid of a democratically elected government. Yes you will start bleating out that the whole result of the last election was down to vote buying, that is absolute rubbish and most people here know it. But its your only line of defense so keep on banging that drum, people who are silly enough will listen. People who know the truth know that elections are the only way forward and this is a huge step back in time for Thailand.

[Publicus]

Whatever is needed to restore the country back to norm will never be accepted by the 1% of TVF because never a wrong done and everything is politically motivated they say.

This heading --topic-- is exactly what was said all along by our good thinking 99% of TVF. Go for it guys.

Maybe now you guys are beginning to realize the storm is brewing rather than having past and that the Thailand military have made matters infinitely worse, thus exceeding their massive cock up of a military mutiny coup d'état in 2006.

The 2006 coup was the single most divisive event in the history of Thailand, but that astounding blunder is in the process of being exceeded by this bunch in this time under present circumstances.

The night time curfew is on indefinitely - but you knew that, right? You knew what was coming, right? Tell me you knew. Please tell me you knew.

Douches.

[Piichai]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

A 47% or so majority voted for PTP. A recent Dusit poll said an over 75% majority support martial law.

The message seems clear to me!

[ginjag]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

of course, Thai people cannot be trusted to make their own decisions..... :-/

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

This maybe true, half of them can't. And half of them are monitored by the village head in many of the Redder than red areas.

[Publicus]

Honestly you guys actually supporting a military coup make me sick!

You wouldn't cop it your own country but you support in Thailand.

The thai majority do not want this they wanted yingluck and the PTP and said so at the ballot box in a landslide only to once again have it ripped away by another coup.

Truly bloody sickening!

of course, Thai people cannot be trusted to make their own decisions..... :-/

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yet another sorry statement scribbled out because there's nothing else that can be said over on that side of things.