Thousands march for Gaza in London, clashes in Paris over Israeli onslaught

[kblaze]

 

 

 

Just because their aim is crap doesn't mean the intent is any less barbaric. Terrorist scum is what they are.

No spin required and I regard Wikipedia as a joke, not a source of solid information.

The pause is after the s. if that's too complicated for you then use the full name. Not a request.
 

 
Apologies for misstating your name.
 
So the IDF Blog, Jerusalem Post, and Ynet News are all jokes? Because those are the exact sources for the rocket attacks posted in Wikipedia.
 
Now I don't know what to believe...

No I said Wikipedia is the joke. Full of misinformation.

However does it or any of those sources mention hamas arresting the scum who murdered those three teenagers? I know the Israel authorities arrested/detained the scum who murdered the Palestinian boy.

 

 

Wikipedia is only as good as the sources it references. The sources it references in the link I posted are all Israeli. Thus your brushing aside the Wikipedia link as a joke, means you are brushing aside Israeli sources as a joke. Hence, my confusion.

[kblaze]

Total garbage. Israel drops leaflets to warn civilians to vacate targeted areas, Hamas stop them leaving. Every Palestinian death is greeted as a propaganda op by Hamas, eagerly lapped up by guillible and ignorant western leftists. Incidentally people are taking to the streets of western cities because of uncontrolled mass immigration from the largely anti-Semitic third world. Even the socialist French government can see this and are now clamping down on demos in support of a totalitarian foreign ideology. Incidentally the foreign culture enrichers let into France have been persecuting it's Jewish population for years prior to Gaza even being handed over so don't confuse motive with pretext, but then again leftists with an agenda knowingly do so.


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"Hamas stop them leaving."

 

Ok so it sounds like Hamas is holding the people of Gaza hostage? 

 

So Israel is killing 3+ hostages to kill one hostage-taker?

 

Interesting

[wigantojapan]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/t1.0-9/q71/s720x720/10482593_10204149238799006_2879680280067631484_n.jpg

[Bluespunk]

 

 

 Just because their aim is crap doesn't mean the intent is any less barbaric. Terrorist scum is what they are.

No spin required and I regard Wikipedia as a joke, not a source of solid information.

The pause is after the s. if that's too complicated for you then use the full name. Not a request.
 

 
Apologies for misstating your name.
 
So the IDF Blog, Jerusalem Post, and Ynet News are all jokes? Because those are the exact sources for the rocket attacks posted in Wikipedia.
 
Now I don't know what to believe...

No I said Wikipedia is the joke. Full of misinformation.

However does it or any of those sources mention hamas arresting the scum who murdered those three teenagers? I know the Israel authorities arrested/detained the scum who murdered the Palestinian boy.
 

 
Wikipedia is only as good as the sources it references. The sources it references in the link I posted are all Israeli. Thus your brushing aside the Wikipedia link as a joke, means you are brushing aside Israeli sources as a joke. Hence, my confusion.

As we are way off topic last from me on this. I don't trust, use or respect Wikipedia because it is full of misinformation and outright lies as well as accurate information. Unreliable.

However back to topic, has hamas made any move to detain its members alleged to be behind the murder of the Israeli teens? Any attempt being made to investigate this hate fuelled act of terrorism and bigotry? Any protests in Europe over this act of terror? Or anywhere for that matter?

[dexterm]

 

 

Anyone marching to protest against terrorist scum indiscriminately firing missiles into civilian areas in Israel?

 
 
Civilian areas? Open fields are Civilian areas? Enough with the spin...
 
Have a look here Mr. Spunk. 
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2014

Just because their aim is crap doesn't mean the intent is any less barbaric. Terrorist scum is what they are.

No spin required and I regard Wikipedia as a joke, not a source of solid information.

The pause is after the s. Still when your point is so weak you resort to abuse and wikipedia why should I worry.

 

 

Israel deliberately fires sophisticated powerful weapons directly at apartment blocks which they know will kill hundreds of innocent children.

 

Now that is definitely a war crime.

[jacky54]

 

Which ever side your on does not matter, at the moment there is a wholesale slaughter of innocents in Gazza, who have nothing to do with the rockets being fired, or can do anything to stop them

Look at the pictures of dead innocent women and children on tv and in the newspapers and tell me that is fair in a modern world.

 

The Turkish Prime Minister made some interesting comments yesterday.

 

 

 

Of course it's not 'fair' it's not a game, but a struggle for Israeli survival since the country was founded against constant attacks and several times all out war against it by Arab armies. This has been rocket attacks by Hamas who then when Israel defends itself starts to cry out casualties and international law, well they should have thought of this before they started it. Hamas would be very disappointed if there had been no civilian casualties to parade before the cameras, they love playing the victim card. Israel, keep calm and carry on!

[kblaze]

 

 

Which ever side your on does not matter, at the moment there is a wholesale slaughter of innocents in Gazza, who have nothing to do with the rockets being fired, or can do anything to stop them

Look at the pictures of dead innocent women and children on tv and in the newspapers and tell me that is fair in a modern world.

 

The Turkish Prime Minister made some interesting comments yesterday.

 

 

 

Of course it's not 'fair' it's not a game, but a struggle for Israeli survival since the country was founded against constant attacks and several times all out war against it by Arab armies. This has been rocket attacks by Hamas who then when Israel defends itself starts to cry out casualties and international law, well they should have thought of this before they started it. Hamas would be very disappointed if there had been no civilian casualties to parade before the cameras, they love playing the victim card. Israel, keep calm and carry on!

 

 

I'm curious, in your view Jacky what would it take for Operation Protective Edge to cross the line from "defensive" to "offensive"?

 

i think its a legitimate question

[Morch]

 

 

 
No I said Wikipedia is the joke. Full of misinformation.

However does it or any of those sources mention hamas arresting the scum who murdered those three teenagers? I know the Israel authorities arrested/detained the scum who murdered the Palestinian boy.
 

 
Hamas is in no position to arrest them, relevant security forces in the area are either Israeli or PA.
The kidnapping and murder took place in the West Bank, while Hamas controls the Gaza Strip.
 

Did the scum responsible not crawl back to hamas controlled territory? They have been identified. Granted they may be innocent but should be questioned.

 

 

Not very likely, as covered extensively in one of the earlier topics.  They would have to flee undetected though the West Bank, cross the security barrier, travel across Israel to the Gaza security barrier, and somehow pass that. All of the above with a lot of troops and police on alert. If they do manage to pull this one, the implications would be far worse than the kidnapping and killing of the three Israelis.
 

[Morch]

 

 

 

Anyone marching to protest against terrorist scum indiscriminately firing missiles into civilian areas in Israel?

 
 
Civilian areas? Open fields are Civilian areas? Enough with the spin...
 
Have a look here Mr. Spunk. 
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2014

Just because their aim is crap doesn't mean the intent is any less barbaric. Terrorist scum is what they are.

No spin required and I regard Wikipedia as a joke, not a source of solid information.

The pause is after the s. Still when your point is so weak you resort to abuse and wikipedia why should I worry.

 

 

Israel deliberately fires sophisticated powerful weapons directly at apartment blocks which they know will kill hundreds of innocent children.

 

Now that is definitely a war crime.

 

 

Do you have ANY clear support for the above claim? That basically Israel targeted hundreds of children? Mind, I'm not

talking about casualty figures, but specifically about the claim that it was intentional.
 

[Morch]

 

 

 

Which ever side your on does not matter, at the moment there is a wholesale slaughter of innocents in Gazza, who have nothing to do with the rockets being fired, or can do anything to stop them

Look at the pictures of dead innocent women and children on tv and in the newspapers and tell me that is fair in a modern world.

 

The Turkish Prime Minister made some interesting comments yesterday.

 

 

 

Of course it's not 'fair' it's not a game, but a struggle for Israeli survival since the country was founded against constant attacks and several times all out war against it by Arab armies. This has been rocket attacks by Hamas who then when Israel defends itself starts to cry out casualties and international law, well they should have thought of this before they started it. Hamas would be very disappointed if there had been no civilian casualties to parade before the cameras, they love playing the victim card. Israel, keep calm and carry on!

 

 

I'm curious, in your view Jacky what would it take for Operation Protective Edge to cross the line from "defensive" to "offensive"?

 

i think its a legitimate question

 

 

It is not only legitimate, but a good question.  Sadly, ran out of likes.

 

Not sure that I have a good answer for it, though. And furthermore, not sure that the distinction is very clear cut or of high importance by itself, apart from a legal point of view. Probably something that needs more thinking about with more caffeine in the blood stream as well. Guess it would be easier for posters to contribute to this one when things chill down some.
 

[jacky54]

 

 

 

Which ever side your on does not matter, at the moment there is a wholesale slaughter of innocents in Gazza, who have nothing to do with the rockets being fired, or can do anything to stop them

Look at the pictures of dead innocent women and children on tv and in the newspapers and tell me that is fair in a modern world.

 

The Turkish Prime Minister made some interesting comments yesterday.

 

 

 

Of course it's not 'fair' it's not a game, but a struggle for Israeli survival since the country was founded against constant attacks and several times all out war against it by Arab armies. This has been rocket attacks by Hamas who then when Israel defends itself starts to cry out casualties and international law, well they should have thought of this before they started it. Hamas would be very disappointed if there had been no civilian casualties to parade before the cameras, they love playing the victim card. Israel, keep calm and carry on!

 

 

I'm curious, in your view Jacky what would it take for Operation Protective Edge to cross the line from "defensive" to "offensive"?

 

i think its a legitimate question

 

 

 

When it's objectives have been met, the tunnels blown up and the rockets have stopped, then defensive operation has come to an end. 

[Morch]

 

 

 

Anyone marching to protest against terrorist scum indiscriminately firing missiles into civilian areas in Israel?

 
 
Civilian areas? Open fields are Civilian areas? Enough with the spin...
 
Have a look here Mr. Spunk. 
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2014
 

 
Hamas does not aim at open fields. It aims at towns and villages. They even announce where they plan to launch next, on occasion. The open areas designations stands for anything from fields, roads, car parks etc...  Most of the rockets headed directly toward populated areas get intercepted by Iron Dome, but not all.
 
 

settlements that are illegal, not that legality ever bothered Israel thug state sponsored terrorism.




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Not really. Hamas rarely launches at the West Bank, and even more rarely manages to somehow hit one of them

illegal settlements. I was referring to settlements well withing the 1967 borders, and even within the 1947 lines. If

you wish to claim that all Israeli presence in the region is illegal, that's another matter, probably cannot help you

with that. 
 

[bartender100]

500 dead now the BBC is reporting, mostly civilians with nowhere to hide, criminal

[kblaze]

500 dead now the BBC is reporting, mostly civilians with nowhere to hide, criminal

 

Thats because according to UN's OCHA, nearly 50% of Gaza has been declared a "no-go" territory or a territory which Israel has deemed a threat that can be attacked.

 

Important people keep that in mind when they hide behind the defense; "it's the Gazans' fault for not moving to safer places". Where are they supposed to go?

 

[attachment=276095:WSJ.jpg]

[Ulysses G.]

Important people keep that in mind when they hide behind the defense; "it's the Gazans' fault for not moving to safer places". Where are they supposed to go?

Israel is letting Palestinians with foreign passports leave the country and the U.N. refugee agency for Palestinians has set up special shelters set up in 20 United Nations schools in Gaza. That is where they should go, but Hamas is still ordering them not to leave their houses even after they have been warned. The Hamas terrorists want them to die for the PR value. 

[bartender100]

 

Important people keep that in mind when they hide behind the defense; "it's the Gazans' fault for not moving to safer places". Where are they supposed to go?

Israel is letting Palestinians with foreign passports leave the country and the U.N. refugee agency for Palestinians has set up special shelters set up in 20 United Nations schools in Gaza. That is where they should go, but Hamas is still ordering them not to leave their houses even after they have been warned. The Hamas terrorists want them to die for the PR value. 

 

 

Very common for Palestinians to have dual passports then?, I doubt it, please stop defending this slaughter

 

You know I never cared when I see the Middle East killing each other before, but this has touched me, to think these poor children have nowhere to hide, and have to except that they might be dead soon.

 

What mentality bombs civilian homes on purpose. Its a war crime on a massive scale, coming from a race that should know so much better.

 

Your obviously Israeli Ulysses, but put your hand on your heart and tell me you feel proud about what they are doing to these innocents, there has to be a better solution, this is the "final solution" and not exceptable in the 21st century

[Ulysses G.]

Your obviously Israeli Ulysses

That is why my nick is Ulysses Grant. I am neither Israeli nor Jewish and most of the forum knows it, so there goes that nonsense.

[dexterm]

 

Important people keep that in mind when they hide behind the defense; "it's the Gazans' fault for not moving to safer places". Where are they supposed to go?

Israel is letting Palestinians with foreign passports leave the country and the U.N. refugee agency for Palestinians has set up special shelters set up in 20 United Nations schools in Gaza. That is where they should go, but Hamas is still ordering them not to leave their houses even after they have been warned. The Hamas terrorists want them to die for the PR value. 

 

 

Wow, is Israel now issuing passports to over a million Gazans who themselves, their parents or grandparents were actually born in Israel, had their land confiscated  and have been expelled by Jews born in New York?

[Asiantravel]

It doesn't appear that trying to silence the crowd in Paris has worked very well?

 

 

Fears are growing that the Gaza conflict could transfer to the streets of France after Jewish-owned shops were burned and pillaged last night during a second violent pro-Palestinian demo in the space of two days.

 

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-fears-that-violence-could-transfer-to-french-streets-after-night-of-protests-9617950.html

[Jingthing]

Antisemitism in France has become very severe. Nothing new in that. That's why large numbers of French Jews have moved in recent years to the Jewish state.

[dexterm]

Antisemitism in France has become very severe. Nothing new in that. That's why large numbers of French Jews have moved in recent years to the Jewish state.

 

well , the Jewish State handiwork in Gaza killing 380 innocent civilians is not very conducive to reducing anti Semitism is it.

[Jingthing]

Attacking Jewish businesses, temples, and shooting Jewish children in schools in France is without any doubt antisemitic.

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[Scott]

Inflammatory post removed.  

[kblaze]

 

Important people keep that in mind when they hide behind the defense; "it's the Gazans' fault for not moving to safer places". Where are they supposed to go?

Israel is letting Palestinians with foreign passports leave the country and the U.N. refugee agency for Palestinians has set up special shelters set up in 20 United Nations schools in Gaza. That is where they should go, but Hamas is still ordering them not to leave their houses even after they have been warned. The Hamas terrorists want them to die for the PR value. 

 

 

Wow thats so nice of Israel to "let" Palestinians leave, oh wait! just the ones with foreign passports. Gee what is that .00001%? What about Palestinians in Gaza that have family in the West Bank whom would take them in? Give me a reason other than the vague "security" crutch why they shouldn't be allowed to go to another Palestinian land to flee the violence? Seriously, look at what's happening, a 1000x more powerful country locks down a smaller neighbor, keeps the population from leaving, then bombs it to oblivion. Where else has this happened in history..

 

Oh and 20 Schools for 1.8 million. 

 

90,000 people per "school". (go ahead cut the numbers by 1/10...its still uninhabitable)

 

And what about those Gazans that don't trust the security of the UN buildings? I thought I heard rockets had been found at one recently?

If on another planet you were a Gazan and those reports start buzzing around, wouldn't you be pretty reluctant to go to a UN shelter, knowing what happened in 2009? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7814054.stm

[Ulysses G.]

 

Attacking Jewish businesses, temples, and shooting Jewish children in schools in France is without any doubt antisemitic.

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So what do you call the IDF bombing Palestinian schools, hospitals, mosques etc. in Gaza; which you have defended?

 

The IDF are bombing rocket and ammunition storage facilities and the people are warned to get out first. There is no moral equivalence.  

The UN agency for Palestinian refugees is investigating the discovery of 20 rockets hidden in one of its vacant schools in the Gaza Strip. The UNRWA condemned the incident as a "flagrant violation" of international law, adding that the rockets had been removed and that the relevant parties had been informed.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/17/unrwa-investigating-20-rockets-empty-gaza-school-palestinian

[Ulysses G.]

Give me a reason other than the vague "security" crutch why they shouldn't be allowed to go to another Palestinian land to flee the violence?

Because Hamas would join with them and conduct terrorist attacks elsewhere. They wouldn't need to dig those tunnels to accomplish the same thing, now would they?

[kblaze]

 

Give me a reason other than the vague "security" crutch why they shouldn't be allowed to go to another Palestinian land to flee the violence?

Because Hamas would join with them and conduct terrorist attacks elsewhere. They wouldn't need to dig those tunnels to accomplish the same thing, now would they?

 

 

Oh right, because its impossible for Israeli border guard to tell the difference between Gazans and terrorists. Women, kids, young men...all potential Hamas operatives...

 

They are all the same eh?

[Ulysses G.]

If on another planet you were a Gazan and those reports start buzzing around, wouldn't you be pretty reluctant to go to a UN shelter

 

I would be a lot more reluctant to stay in my home with Israel dropping leaflets and calling me on the phone telling me that they were going to bomb the area. You'd have to be really stupid or held hostage by Hamas not to leave.

[dexterm]

 

 

Attacking Jewish businesses, temples, and shooting Jewish children in schools in France is without any doubt antisemitic.

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So what do you call the IDF bombing Palestinian schools, hospitals, mosques etc. in Gaza; which you have defended?

 

The IDF are bombing rocket and ammunition storage facilities and the people are warned to get out first. There is no moral equivalence.  

The UN agency for Palestinian refugees is investigating the discovery of 20 rockets hidden in one of its vacant schools in the Gaza Strip. The UNRWA condemned the incident as a "flagrant violation" of international law, adding that the rockets had been removed and that the relevant parties had been informed.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/17/unrwa-investigating-20-rockets-empty-gaza-school-palestinian

 

 

This is the way the Israeli propaganda machine works...find one school, one hospital, one mosque, one ambulance...doesn’t have to be true... which then makes every school, hospital, mosque, ambulance a legitimate target and the innocent civilians non people collateral damage.

[zydeco]

I tend to find this endless exchange between Israel and its Arab neighbors futile.  One side needs to win to stop it.  Hamas carries on like this because they know that eventually the US and other countries will step in to save them.  It happens every time.  What I don't understand is why so many people on ThaiVisa are buying into the images and reporting they're seeing on BBC and CNN.  Especially when just a few weeks ago those same networks (and in some cases, same reporters) were rightly being reviled as tools of PTP.  Why would anybody believe them now?  As for the children, it's beyond horrific but not so different from the Red Shirts waving babies in front of their barricades in 2010, when, again, many on this forum found that outrageous and properly so.  "Baby waving" has become something of a tactic on certain movement's behalf.  Baby waving goes on the US everytime illegal immigrants are forced out.  Frankly, for adults to hide behind children and use them as pawns in their own political games is the real war crime.