Is there an Expats lobby group to help Expats in Thailand

[thhMan]

In every country it's the "local" native resident and the one who can "vote" that changes policy, not the immigrant. Maybe if you spoke to your wife and her relatives and even their friends and encourage them to start a movement to help Ex-pat's who live here and contribute to Thai society. Only then, and a big "maybe" would things get started. We can only provide the idea, they can provided the force behind it. It's their country, they need to be the force behind it. With a new and seemingly more common sense government in place, it may come to being. But....Good luck with that too.

Whould it may be possible to start up electronic patition to show support of such a thing.

That is an option that I am thinking about.

I also have a lawyer in BKK, sympathetic to the plights of expats and will ask him more on this subject.

He has informed me of some international laws, however they are over-ridden by Thai law that makes them non enforceable.

But with that being said, I am sure that if something starts, then others will follow, including Thai nationals who, like my close Thai friends, would like to see some change, if only recognition of the subject. You would be suprised to know how many Thais dont know what an expat has to do to live here. Some are even amazed that we cannot buy land or work without excessive regulation within certain parts of the law.

When my 10 year old asks me, why I have to do this.. its not exactly an easy answer... Is it possible that I may have missed a step at any given time or a circumstance arising and be deported from my family.. That is always a possibility that many of us may have to deal with.

BTW, I adopted my eldest daughter, if anyone finds the maths not working out.

Edited August 23, 2014 by thhMan

[RolandRat]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

[dagobert]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

It,s called legal recognition !

[thhMan]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

Great question - in part.

I am not insecure.. Its about protecting what we have built up for so many years as others have also done.

The rest of your question/comment is irrelevant and not worthy of a reply

Edited August 23, 2014 by thhMan

[HooHaa]

he wants "the right"

rights are for citizens.

my thai ex is in the us right now and she is learning the same thing

[RolandRat]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

Great question - in part.

I am not insecure.. Its about protecting what we have built up for so many years as others have also done.

The rest of your question/comment is irrelevant and not worthy of a reply

How is anything in "your name" protecting thing any better than in your wifes name?

And dont be so damn rude!

[impulse]

I see your point only too well, and I will concede the point that it is a tad unfair, that a Thai can go to the UK ( for example ) and buy a house / land in their name and we cannot do the same in Thailand.

The reality is that a Thai national can go to the US and buy the right to rent some property from the government by paying property taxes on it. I assume the UK also has rent in the form of property taxes?

That is, of course, unless the government needs your little piece of heaven for expanding a road, building a military base (or nowadays- even condemning it and turning it over to a developer who will build something that makes "highest and best use" of the land). In which case, they'll buy back your right to rent it from them.

If you think you own your property back home, stop paying the rent to the government and you'll quickly find out who really owns it.

Some day, Thailand will impose a property tax. And if the politicians don't get lynched, I suspect we'll be invited to participate in their land rental plan, just like back home.

Last place I owned a home, property taxes were 3% of the value of my home per year. That's right, they charged me rent on their land and on my home- that I had already paid for.

Sure makes a 30 year lease on a chunk of Thai land look more attractive...

Edited August 23, 2014 by impulse

[thhMan]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

Great question - in part.

I am not insecure.. Its about protecting what we have built up for so many years as others have also done.

The rest of your question/comment is irrelevant and not worthy of a reply

How is anything in "your name" protecting thing any better than in your wifes name?

And dont be so damn rude!

If that has to be explained, then perhaps you need to read other posts from happily married expats that suddenly had problems and everything taken away from them.

Attacking my ego or insecurity warranted that reply, simply because you are implying things that you suspect, without justification. If you consider that rude... well, I cannot comment further on that.

[RolandRat]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

Great question - in part.

I am not insecure.. Its about protecting what we have built up for so many years as others have also done.

The rest of your question/comment is irrelevant and not worthy of a reply

How is anything in "your name" protecting thing any better than in your wifes name?

And dont be so damn rude!

If that has to be explained, then perhaps you need to read other posts from happily married expats that suddenly had problems and everything taken away from them.

Attacking my ego or insecurity warranted that reply, simply because you are implying things that you suspect, without justification. If you consider that rude... well, I cannot comment further on that.

So someone asks a question and your answer is " if it has to be explained" well in that case in answer to your lobby question.....if it has to be explained, perhaps you should read various posts within this forum.

In reality your reply completely justifies and answrrs the question that you are INSECURE in your relationship and thats why you have referred to others having things takem away. So it is your insecurities pushing it....lol

Edited August 23, 2014 by RolandRat

[krisb]

There are expat groups around the country. We have one in Khon Kaen and regularly speak with local government. But like I said before, most think they are on an extended holiday.

Exactly, and unless you are a Thai citizen, your rites and not much more than those of a tourist.

You can't do any old job, cant own land, cant vote, cant start any business you choose, and even then with business you cant even work in some of them.

You all might live there f/t, but your not much more than a f/t tourist and certainly not made to feel like a citizen with the same rites. I think thats shitty, but that's the deal.

[thailiketoo]

noun: amity

a friendly relationship.

"international amity and goodwill

friendship, friendliness, harmony, harmoniousness, understanding, accord, cooperation, companionship, amicableness, goodwill, cordiality, warmth;

formalconcord

Amity is a good word. You could call it the Treaty of Amity? What do you think?

[thhMan]

Two things never to disscus Religion and politics, "allways ends the same"

Yes, there is always a difference of opinion, but thats what (in this case) its all about.

Should progress be made, im sure all the negative commenting people will applaud the better situations. Even if nothing changes, at least its out there....

[pigeonjake]

your sentiments are fine,but unrealistic.consider yourself lucky they've let you in.Go down to your local bar and sip a chang and enjoy the view!

Unfortunately, that sort of mentality wont solve any issues, neither is the mocking remark prior to your post.

I dont drink, dont play the fields and instead have 2 children in Thailand and have a wonderful wife that I met the first month I was here. That was eight years ago and would like to be able to buy some land and build a house in my name.

I would also like to open up a small business in my name and just build a future for my kids. To this day, my wife still doesnt understand why there is always immigration involved in our lives and neither does a few close Thai friends.

Nothing is for certain and I would like to have land in my name, should something tragic happen to my wife or circumstances change. As a husband, I take care of her and should I meet a tragic end or circumstances change, then she is ok and so are my children.

I am not retired and I have worked those 8 years, slowly building up my families finances and putting my kids into better schools along the way.

I would be very happy to start a small business and have the opportunity to leave it to my children to take over when they are ready. The same goes for a home and everything else we as a family have worked so hard to obtain.

reading this i see you trust your wife big time,

everything in your, or the kids name,,

well done

[RolandRat]

Exactly Jake !

Its his insecurities in his relationship prompting this, nothing more. His honeymoon is probably over, rose colored glasses fallen off a little while later and its suddenly dawned on him its all in her name and he's regretting something.....yeeaaahhh.

Macho crap rules reversed and the precious little man cant handle it.....aawwwwww!

Edited August 23, 2014 by RolandRat

[Chivas]

Your attitude is the one real reason there isn't such a Group......Pathetic mate

[Kudel]

Whats the point of having such groups ?We have al seen and read the opinion of certain Thai politicians be they red or yellow concerning foreigners in Thailand in the English language press even ambassadors to Thailand have so many times been in meetings with Thai officials expressing their concerns about certain incidents with tourists and expats at the end of the day nothing changed.

There are a few right wing nutter politicians and groups in Thailand who would to like see al foreigners out of the country period, saw a television program about said people a few years back and they make some right wing groups in europe look like pussy's after expressing their views scary people.

[thhMan]

If you feel the need to attack me directly, please do so, but dont cloud the issue that this original post was about.

Im off to take my family out for dinner and possibly go to the cinema, if there is a good movie playing...

Its a wonderful day in Chiang Mai... No rain today and super sunny again

Edited August 23, 2014 by thhMan

[lanng khao]

If you feel the need to attack me directly, please do so, but dont cloud the issue that this original post was about.

Im off to take my family out for dinner and possibly go to the cinema, if there is a good movie playing...

is the film about Donald Duck or Mickey Mouse, coz you have defo been having Disney spells..

[JockPieandBeans]

I see your point only too well, and I will concede the point that it is a tad unfair, that a Thai can go to the UK ( for example ) and buy a house / land in their name and we cannot do the same in Thailand.

The reality is that a Thai national can go to the US and buy the right to rent some property from the government by paying property taxes on it. I assume the UK also has rent in the form of property taxes?

That is, of course, unless the government needs your little piece of heaven for expanding a road, building a military base (or nowadays- even condemning it and turning it over to a developer who will build something that makes "highest and best use" of the land). In which case, they'll buy back your right to rent it from them.

If you think you own your property back home, stop paying the rent to the government and you'll quickly find out who really owns it.

Some day, Thailand will impose a property tax. And if the politicians don't get lynched, I suspect we'll be invited to participate in their land rental plan, just like back home.

Last place I owned a home, property taxes were 3% of the value of my home per year. That's right, they charged me rent on their land and on my home- that I had already paid for.

Sure makes a 30 year lease on a chunk of Thai land look more attractive...

Certainly in Scotland, when you buy a property, the land that the property sits on becomes yours also. You also get a plan outlining the boundaries, just like a landplot. You do not pay a % value of the property to the Government annually. Although their is another tax called Council Tax, it is pretty much the same, however it is disguised as a services charge.

So the Government can not pull it from under you. Except in exceptional circumstances, where they will pay you way over the value under what is called a " compulsary purchase order "

I remember a few years ago sitting with an American colleague, and things got around to prices in relevant homelands, if memory serves me right, it was worked out that a Brit homeowner paid an awful lot more than an American homeowner.

Regardless of what looks good on paper, we are at the mercy of the Thai's and whether we like it or not, they call the shots. We could all be rounded up in the next week and kicked out if they so desired. So to that end, a 30 lease does not look all that appealing to me.

Regardless of how much I want to integrate into Thai Society, I am extremely limited in what I can do. I never ever lose sight of the fact, that as things stand now, I am nothing more than a guest here.

I don't bitch about, I was aware of that when I moved here.

[RolandRat]

If you feel the need to attack me directly, please do so, but dont cloud the issue that this original post was about.

Im off to take my family out for dinner and possibly go to the cinema, if there is a good movie playing...

Its a wonderful day in Chiang Mai... No rain today and super sunny again

The fact that you see any of this as an "attack" speaks again to your "insecurities" as they are merely observations and comments based on and in direct answer to your statements.

You need to look at whats really the issue here, and its nothing more than you feeling vulnerable and looking for a way to recover from your previous decisions, which you are now doubting and looking to ammend.

Edited August 23, 2014 by RolandRat

[willyumiii]

It seems you may already know the answers, but refuse to admit it to yourself.

" cattle to be steered at whim by the government or individuals "

'I'm afraid you hit the nail on the head with that one.

It's not easy to adjust, but you must realize that you do not have the "rights" you had in whatever country you came from.

Those rights do not travel with you.

Some times we give up some things to obtain other things.

In this case you have given up rights in order to live in a country that belongs to someone else!

I am from USA and am constantly finding myself thinking " They can't do that!" and then reminding myself " Yes, they can. I am not in the USA anymore."

I also remind myself that I knew what the situation for farangs was in Thailand before I decided to move here.

It is hard to believe you would decide to move here without being aware of the situation you were bringing yourself and your family into first.

And remember....I decided and you decided to move here.

The government and people of Thailand did not ask us to come here.

They have not and will not ask us to make their country more like the countries we have come from.

I would never tell you to leave if you do not like it here.

I will advise you to find out more about where you have decided to live before you actually live there....next time.

Choke Dee! '

[krisb]

Your attitude is the one real reason there isn't such a Group......Pathetic mate

Well get out there, start the group, make a change, and then I will eat my words.

Until then, I find it a dream and almost comical sadly. Unlike our home countries which are usually happy to give migrant's citizenship, equal rites and allow them to voice their opinions, and even become members of parliament, not forgetting own as much land as you can afford. Sadly in Thailand, Thais look at us lot like outsiders, and made to not feel very welcome.

My wife lives here in Australia now, and in about 1 more year she will have her citizenship.

She already works, gets Medicare, gets credit cards and even a bank loan if she likes. Our Government even gave her $5000 to have our daughter here, and the birth cost not one cent.

Now that's what I call welcoming someone who wants to live in another country.

[I knew this would happen]

How can you be intergrated into a society if you have no rights.

Yeah, my wife has all rights in Germany and only had to sign up for her fkn Visa ONCE and we´ve never ever ever ever ever ever been bothered again with some stupid address reporting or renewing anything. 100% Social security, owning land, working, citizenship, support when studying, whatever a foreigner can hope for is possible

I know this is a dead horse but I can´t stop blameing the Thais for the way they treat foreigners although we´re married to on of their precious Thai citizens

So when I learned "how welcome" I´m in Thailand I´m not very willing to integrate as I´m hardly tolerated. Yes I learned to read and write Thai but only to get to know the enemy I stay away from integrating or trying to feel at home as this isn´t my home and never will be, so why should I care a lot? Waste of my time......

Nothing will change for us, a Lobby? Would be great, but who will listen to these pesky Farangs. Always demanding huamn rights, lol.

l

Edited August 23, 2014 by I knew this would happen

[iancnx]

What is this obsession about "my name" ?

If you are secure in your relationship it shouldnt matter a toss who's name it is in.

Same goes for any husiness, its only ego or insecurity, possibly an inbred condition to "own" in your name.

Great question - in part.

I am not insecure.. Its about protecting what we have built up for so many years as others have also done.

The rest of your question/comment is irrelevant and not worthy of a reply

How is anything in "your name" protecting thing any better than in your wifes name?

And dont be so damn rude!

If that has to be explained, then perhaps you need to read other posts from happily married expats that suddenly had problems and everything taken away from them.

Attacking my ego or insecurity warranted that reply, simply because you are implying things that you suspect, without justification. If you consider that rude... well, I cannot comment further on that.

I totally get. Don't give up just because some that have seen this thread just don't give a flying sh1t. Many will be interested in a more focused approach. Be good to discuss this further next week.

[sustento]

If you want the same rights as a Thai citizen then the answer is to become a Thai citizen. Others on Thaivisa have done it. If you think it's 'too difficult' then you aren't really serious enough about it.

[pigeonjake]

this is an example of what would happen,

there was a village 10 miles or so from our village,

the government wanted to build a new dam, they paid the people around that village big big money for there land,

they didnt want to move far, so a few came to our village and surrounding villages,

the land prices hit the roof, were the young in our village couldnt afford to buy land,

the prices are starting to come down again now,

but the same thing would happen if falang could buy land, more money to buy land,,

its the same in some parts of the uk, just outside london and other big cities were the rich are commuting from villages were now the local young people cant afford to buy houses in the village were maybe there family have lived for years,,

i still dont agree with being able to buy land,

you can own a condo,

im happy with what we have, yes its all in my wifes name, so what,,,

this thread will go on and on,,

i just hope people stay on good terms with each other,

we will all have different opinions,

be good to each other

[CharlieH]

Polite reminder.....

Do not turn this into a political discussion.

5) You will not use Thaivisa as a platform to gather support to effect changes on religious, political, or governmental issues.

[dagobert]

"Yeah your right Charlie" Best just close the thread....

[krisb]

Polite reminder.....

Do not turn this into a political discussion.

5) You will not use Thaivisa as a platform to gather support to effect changes on religious, political, or governmental issues.

I thought rallying members would have been there?

[I knew this would happen]

If you want the same rights as a Thai citizen then the answer is to become a Thai citizen. Others on Thaivisa have done it. If you think it's 'too difficult' then you aren't really serious enough about it.

That´s a big hurdle don´t you think? At least some rights should and must be granted through marriage, which is not the case here. And not every country does allow dual citizenship. And who would want to be Thai only?!