Government concerned with foreigners being ripped off by Thai hospitals

[chilli42]

The greed and rip off pales in comparison to the U.S. The medical business is just that - a business and not a charity. When the choice is life or death the wallet opens no questions asked

[Keesters]

It is not only the sometimes highly inflated costs that happen at many private hospitals it is the prolonging of proper diagnosis and treatment that should be looked into. I was ill and in my own mind was sure it was dengue. Visited Bangkok Pattaya hospital. Tests were made, answer inconclusive. A few days later more tests again inconclusive. After a few more days doctor says better to check for dengue. Need to send blood to Bangkok for analysis as BPH can't do it. Will take a week. Week later confirmed dengue. Total outpatient cost over 9000 baht. Soon after friend was not feeling well and went to Memorial hospital. After an hour dengue fever confirmed and sent home with instructions on how to care for himself. Cost baht 500. BPH deliberately in my opinion prolonged diagnosis, lied about blood test all to make the bill as high as possible. On another occasion Memorial charged me baht 900 for eye drops available at Fascino for baht 25. Have yet to try new Pattaya city hospital but have heard good reports. Will most certainly boycott the two previously mentioned private hospitals.

[ghworker2010]

Bumrungrad should be investigated by the government. Its been overcharging customers for years..

[lapd]

Not long ago I went to a major hospital in Pattaya (I suppose I can't say the name due to some bizarre rules in this country) for a zona (herpes zoster). The doctor was extremely unpleasant (not the point here I know) but he diagnosed it right away (good on him) and checked with an immediate lab test. So far so good (almost).

Then I was sent to pay the bill and get the medicine, which is acyclovir 800 made in Thailand by Vilerm.

- Physician's evaluation : 800. Not cheap but similar to other places.

- Laboratory : 200. I'd say very reasonable.

- As for the medicine itself... they sold me 30 tablets at 2250 bahts. That's 75 bahts a pop. I paid because I didn't know but next time I went to my favourite pharmacy in Jomtien I asked her if she sold that drug too. Yes she does, it's exactly the same brand, same dosage, same everything ... except she sells it for 26 bahts a pill.

So clearly the hospital ripped me off by selling me a drug at three times its normal price.

The thing is we foreigners tend to not imagine for one second that a hospital would do that, which turns us into ideal cash cows : we pay without giving it a second thought. But hospitals here can rip you off big time, especially in tourist areas, and they will, so my advice is keep your eyes open and compare prices whenever you can.

Never buy your meds from any hospital. Demand name and dosage of med from doc and buy from pharmacy. Have you seen what they charge for Tylenol? Prescribed for everything.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the prescription. If you get prescription meds and then travel back home you better have an official prescription if you get searched. So that is probably worth the hospital visit and overpaying for the pills You can ask but I don't think they will give you an offical prescription if you plan to go buy it over the counter at a pharmacy.

I went to Pattaya memorial for an ear infection and got prescribed an antibiotic and ear drops complete with an official receipt/prescription document. Pills and drops properly labelled with my name on them etc.but yea a fair bit more than what I would pay at a pharmacy. Went back home to N. America and got searched. They checked all my pills and checked the prescription for the antibiotics. Without that they probably would have taken them away at a minimum. They could do more than that and it's totally at their discretion depending on their mood and how many pills you have and what kind they are etc..

Edited May 11, 2015 by lapd

[NoshowJones]

Everyone else in Thailand is ripping of foreigners!!

So why not the hospitals??

As we all are aware "health-care" in Thailand is all about money!!

Just read BP today, cover story about the local Florence Nightingales ripping of their own senior citizens!!

No limits to the greed!!

Everything, and not just in Thailand, is all about money. Your last sentence is spot on.

[NoshowJones]

Headline should read '' Government concerned with Foreigner's being ripped off by Thai's ''

Of course there are some ripoff merchants here in Thailand, but no more than in any other countries, and probably not as much as most.

Where do the Thais learn a lot of their ripoffs from? Countries like the UK and America.

[NoshowJones]

I have gone to Bumrungrad for four times this year and found that everything cost me 20% more than last year. That's a big increase. Has anyone else noticed this? Maybe I should ask them for a discount. I have no idea what they are charging other patients or if their charges are standardized for everyone.

The message on this topic is "stay away from Bumrungrad".

[soalbundy]

Headline should read '' Government concerned with Foreigner's being ripped off by Thai's ''

Of course there are some ripoff merchants here in Thailand, but no more than in any other countries, and probably not as much as most.

Where do the Thais learn a lot of their ripoffs from? Countries like the UK and America.

Thais need absolutely no help when it comes to rip offs.

[robblok]

Great.. the general cares at least, can't say I ever seen the previous government care about us.

He must understand that most guys that live here prefer him over the old government (except a vocal minority).

Of course hospitals rip of foreigners its common knowledge. Part of the reason why i got insurance.

With Costas on "medical leave" (there goes half of the "majority") someone has to speak for the general!!

Even you Mr One Eye Robbie must realize the Mr P's support here on Thaivisa is dwindling by the minute.

But I will give you 10 for effort..................

That explains why the topics that are ant redshirt get loads of likes and your post never come close to them.

But tell me in all seriousness what has the previous government ever tried to to for us foreigners ?

This is the first time I ever see us getting a helping hand.

Actually this government has done so much more governing this country then the previous government ever did. Sure the guy has a short fuse (real bad thing) and I don't agree with everything but all in all this is a blessing for this country. All the dirt of the Shins gets dug up and action is taken onto so many fronts its amazing. Now I agree that there should be more follow up.. its a Thai thing not to follow up I guess.

Taxi's are finally held accountable (or at least a lot more as before) many other things too while the previous government was only busy getting Mr T back and stealing from Thailand with all their scrams.

Now this.. foreigners on the agenda.. During dr T his reign the 90 days reporting got instated again.. we all hate that. Prayut made sure we can do it online.. who do you prefer.. the guy that makes it harder for us .. or the one that makes it better.

You know, it is easy to say you care or you are concerned here. Every time a Thai runs me over he/she says they are sorry. I doubt they know the meaning of the word. Someone once told me it isn't what you say, it is what you DO. Hope the good general knows the difference but I wouldn't hold my breath. This is LOS (S doesn't mean smiles fools) LOL

You get run over often by Thais ? are you serious.

You are right actions speak louder as words.. but still far more positive actions are started by this government as the previous one.

This is just an other example, others are the taxi problem and now the online 90 days reports.

I cant remember anything good for us done by the previous one.

But sure I agree lets wait and see.. because ALL goverments always have crackdowns without too much follow up. Though they seem to follow up on the taxis.

[cumgranosalum]

Most of the comments here are simply subjective or anecdotal. if the Thai authorities actually do a proper investigation it would of course be helpful as it is quite clear that no-one actually knows what the whole picture is in Thailand - this in itself is a very damning indictment of the way the Thai healthcare system is run.

however, as I said before it remains to be seen if a reliable report will be the outcome...on previous form, this would look doubtful.

Members may remember a few years back that the Abhisit government tried to bring in some customer rights legislation ...... this was greeted by a protest of doctors who wore black armbands suggesting it would restrict their ability to work effectively.......despite the fact that the regulations were similar to most successful healthcare systems in Europe.

If this is anything to go by, any inquiry into how hospitals are run - especially the lucrative private sector - will be met with stonewalling and lack of transparency.

I think all health care systems in Europe lose money and are supported with tax money. The Bat Tong or 30 Baht system costs the hospitals a lot of money,one way of making up the loss is to charge high prices for private patients so obviously the doctors do't want any changes there which i can understand. I have heard good reports from farangs who have gone to government hospitals, very cheap.

i don't actually see the relevance of your comments to my post - however you seem to have an unusual way of looking at healthcare financing and I'm unable to determine your implications.

Healthcare systems finances are usually expressed as cost per capita. The Euro-systems regardless of how they are financed are constantly the most cost -effective in the world with the highest standards of care.

whether the money is paid by insurance or tax the people still end up paying - unfortunately time and again private insurance based systems turn out to be more expensive and less universal.

[robblok]

Headline should read '' Government concerned with Foreigner's being ripped off by Thai's ''

Of course there are some ripoff merchants here in Thailand, but no more than in any other countries, and probably not as much as most.

Where do the Thais learn a lot of their ripoffs from? Countries like the UK and America.

Thais need absolutely no help when it comes to rip offs.

Depends on what side they are.. the rippers or the ripped

[cumgranosalum]

Most of the comments here are simply subjective or anecdotal. if the Thai authorities actually do a proper investigation it would of course be helpful as it is quite clear that no-one actually knows what the whole picture is in Thailand - this in itself is a very damning indictment of the way the Thai healthcare system is run.

however, as I said before it remains to be seen if a reliable report will be the outcome...on previous form, this would look doubtful.

Members may remember a few years back that the Abhisit government tried to bring in some customer rights legislation ...... this was greeted by a protest of doctors who wore black armbands suggesting it would restrict their ability to work effectively.......despite the fact that the regulations were similar to most successful healthcare systems in Europe.

If this is anything to go by, any inquiry into how hospitals are run - especially the lucrative private sector - will be met with stonewalling and lack of transparency.

Perhaps a few doctors wearing black armbands before a firing squad would collapse those stonewalls?

With all due respect, that seems a rather facile comment in what is in fact a really serious discussion about a serious problem

[NoshowJones]

hospitals is no different from average somchai & bargirl

every farang is rich, let's take as much as we can

specially if he has insurance

Capitalism is rife everywhere, not just in Thailand.

[Liquorice]

When I first came to retire in Thailand, after only 7 days here I came down with severe abdominal pains and diarrhoea.

After 5 days of taking medication to no effect, I went to a local clinic where the GP advised I go immediately to a hospital.

Not even knowing which hospitals were private or government, I went to the nearest.

First question at reception "Do you have any money".

It was a private hospital. Only when I answered yes to the first question did they ask my name, age, and the problem.

[NoshowJones]

If you're a foreigner, and in Chiang Mai, and want to be seriously overcharged for anything medical, simply go to Ram Hospital. You can go to Rajavaj, or McCormick for the same - if not better - treatment, for about half the price. Trust me, I've had the experience and know all about it.

I had a recent hip replacement at one of the two hospitals you recommended and came out with a bill almost a third more than quoted. When I queried the bill I was told one of the reasons it was so high was they had to use a larger replacement hip. I told them I was the same size as when I was given the quote but all to no avail.

You should have refused to pay the extra you mentioned.

[cumgranosalum]

hospitals is no different from average somchai & bargirl

every farang is rich, let's take as much as we can

specially if he has insurance

Capitalism is rife everywhere, not just in Thailand.

I don't think this comment in any way addresses the situation in Thailand. By using the term "capitalism" are you suggesting a regular market economy? in Thailand capital certainly isn't always king - it is those with connections who get to close the deal

In Thailand "market" forces are subject to many influences that other countries don't have. Firstly the all-pervasive presence of graft, nepotism and corruption - if you think this is the same as "western" countries then you need to think again.

Furthermore there is little or no legislation or enforcement to stop or prevent unethical practices in thailand. This would include both the business and practicing sides of healthcare.

To imply that thailand is the same as "everywhere" would seem to me to be a gross misunderstanding of the situation here.

[cumgranosalum]

hospitals is no different from average somchai & bargirl

every farang is rich, let's take as much as we can

specially if he has insurance

Capitalism is rife everywhere, not just in Thailand.

I don't think this comment in any way addresses the situation in Thailand. By using the term "capitalism" are you suggesting a regular market economy? in Thailand capital certainly isn't always king - it is those with connections who get to close the deal

In Thailand "market" forces are subject to many influences that other countries don't have. Firstly the all-pervasive presence of graft, nepotism and corruption - if you think this is the same as "western" countries then you need to think again.

Furthermore there is little or no legislation or enforcement to stop or prevent unethical practices in thailand. This would include both the business and practicing sides of healthcare.

To imply that thailand is the same as "everywhere" would seem to me to be a gross misunderstanding of the situation here.

[NoshowJones]

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Everyone else in Thailand is ripping of foreigners!!

So why not the hospitals??

As we all are aware "health-care" in Thailand is all about money!!

Just read BP today, cover story about the local Florence Nightingales ripping of their own senior citizens!!

No limits to the greed!!

Name a country were it isnt about the money? the costs in Canda are ridiculous. I had a 10 minute chat to fill in a form for a medical there and it cost C$250 (about Baht 7,000). No examination just ticking the boxes

You are off your head for paying it.

[navara]

Yes it is true and not a little bit!!

Once I was at the private hospital at CM with a stomach acid problem in the late evening. The dokter came and gave me an injection.

1500 bt to pay

6 months later the same problem, this time in the night. I went to my local government hospital. Guess what???

50 bt

Same injection, same stuff and a doctor to see me.

I guy who used to be my friend got cancer, he needed a scan and later a huge operation. Private hospital would like to charge him over 1 million baht. He took only the scan for 80k and left to the government hospital, costs 135k

[crazykopite]

I just go to my local Thai hospital if I have a problem after all once the doctors have finished there shift they go off to the Bangkok hospital or the Thai International where the prices charged are absurd !!

[Time Traveller]

The title should read Tourists, not foreigners. There are many foreigners living here that are never ripped off by hospitals.

The only one ever to rip me off was Bamrungrad, but they rip off Thais and foreigners.

Same here. Had major surgery for hernia at St Louis ,,, surgeon and anesthesiologist excellent ... total cost with private room 58,000 baht. Went to Bummer-grad to have a small skin cancer removed in a 30 minute procedure and it cost 30,000 baht. I had insurance in both cases.

Wow, that's the opposite to my experience. St Louis doctors seemed incompetent and interested in running up the bills through unnecesary tests. But Bumrungrad, while trying to upsell a procedure, did seem more knowledgeable and professional, while the costs weren't excessively large.

I've also regularly tried Sametivej formerly Thonburi, and they now seem like they are inflating bills as well compared with previously.

But my point is, if you are being imporperly treated, then no matter what they charged, you are being ripped off.

Thailand medicals standard are less than those found in India, yet they charge many times more - in some cases even approaching western prices. While the medical tourism firms like to project the image that the quality of medical care in Thailand is the same as in developed countries like Singapore or western nations - it isn't.

Not only is thai medical care poor, but the liability in the case of medical malpractice is basically non-existant. People are not aware of this. In thailand something goes wrong, then you live (or die) with the consequences. In a developed country, something goes wrong, there is medical compensation funds and insurance that you would be entitled to.

Edited May 11, 2015 by Time Traveller

[Xonax]

4 years ago I was hospatilized due to food-poisoning and had my appendix removed, as the hospital claimed that it was the problem. The costs was 115000 Baht to be paid by credit card. I did not have insurance, because I considered my health as very good. I have never had any doubt, that my appendix was not causing my illness, and that I was just being ripped off by the hospital.

[xylophone]

Agree with most of what has been said here and these are actual personal examples, not anecdotal:–

– My g/fs Brother had a growth in his neck which was getting larger (was about the size of a tennis ball in the end) and nothing the local hospitals could do, other than to give him iodine pills, seemed to help and his family was just about resigned to the fact that he was going to die. So we took him to Bangkok Phuket hospital, because I could not stand by and watch him die and we needed to get another opinion.

So my g/f accompanied him in to see the specialist, and to cut a long story short, after a couple visits and tests, he was found to have a benign tumour of the thyroid and an operation was suggested and the price given to her was around 80,000 to 100,000 baht.

When I accompanied them on the last visit and the nursing staff saw that a farang was going to foot the bill, it suddenly increased to 160,000 baht and when I queried this, the nurse said that it was because the surgeon had forgot to put their fee on the original quote. However we had the original quote and the surgeon’s fee was certainly on it. It was no more than a rip-off so I demanded the X-rays we had already paid for and went to another hospital and the whole procedure was done for just over 100,000 baht, this because there were unexpected complications.

That was about three years ago and he has been fine ever since.

-- At the opening of the Bangkok Phuket hospital colonoscopy unit, I enquired as to the cost of a colonoscopy and was told as an opening "offer" it could be done for 13,000 baht, this after I told them that I would foot the bill. When I turned up for the colonoscopy and the nurse asked if I had insurance, I said that I did and she said she would check to see if they would pay the bill, and this was confirmed. However a new bill was produced for me which exceeded 20,000 baht and after some embarrassing questions, I ascertained that it was loaded because the insurance company was paying.

– Being fair-haired, I am prone to skin cancers, several of which I have had removed over the years and I had one particular "growth" of some description growing in the corner of my eye so I went to Bangkok Phuket hospital and saw the skin specialist who said that she would surgically remove it and I would probably need to see the cosmetic surgeon to get it fixed without scarring and just the initial cost would be 11,000 baht plus the additional for the cosmetic surgeon.

I wasn't satisfied with this so I saw the skin specialist at Phuket International hospital who recommended I use Aldara cream for a period of about a month. So I did and the growth completely disappeared.

Total cost for the visit, inspection and advice, plus a couple of solar keratosis burnt off was 1600 baht.

It seems that all private hospitals will try to rip you off, some more than others.

[yardrunner]

If you're a foreigner, and in Chiang Mai, and want to be seriously overcharged for anything medical, simply go to Ram Hospital. You can go to Rajavaj, or McCormick for the same - if not better - treatment, for about half the price. Trust me, I've had the experience and know all about it.

Same with the Ram hospital in Khonkaen a total rip off, just been to srinakarin hospital at the university to see doctor about my bladder problem, saw a specialist and had a blood test all for 350bt, you do have to waitva bit but they give you a que number and will estimate the time you will be seen, so you can go away and come back later.

could not agree more, recently at srinakarin hospital for emergency admission (appendix) 4 nights in hospital + operation 29000 Baht

[Srikcir]

This should be an argument between the insurance companies and the hospitals.

Only if its Thai-based insurance.

Otherwise many nonThais-based health insurance operates on fee schedules irrespective of hospital charges.

Edited May 11, 2015 by Srikcir

[casindonet]

Only by thai hospital?

[Equalizer]

I had a chest pain. Pattaya Memorial admitted me via an ECG told me i was having an heart attack. Left me in a room all night and just gave me 2 more ECG throughout the duration. They refused to give me food the next day so i kicked up a fuss and they eventually gave me egg on toast. When i swallowed it, what felt like a lump in the back of my throat went down with it. Then all the pain went away. Then i thought to myself WOW has this been some kind of chronic indigestion. I demanded to see the ECG read out they admitted me with to get a second opinion however they somehow had miraculously lost it within the time i was there! 20 grand later i got out.

As luck (bad) would have it my mum collapsed in a restaurant and memorial hospital was over the road. She came around however when she got in there they started smashing her with all kinds of injections. I found it strange that no one was asking me any details about her so i stepped in and said ''SHE HAS INSURANCE'' then it came back. We do not deal with insurance at memorial. 13 grand and 4 grand for an ambulance to take her to an hospital that accepts travel insurance within the blink of an eye. Hospitals are just like anything else here you only stop getting robbed once you have been robbed.

[Srikcir]

The message on this topic is SHOP AROUND.

Get quotes from noninternational hopitals if possible.

[JOC]

Allow me to add a little sunshine among all the rip-off stories here.

Many years ago I cut my foot really badly when moving irrigation on a piece of land in the sticks. It was bleeding rivers, and of course I was alone in the middle of nowhere. Took me half an hour to walk to my motorbike, parked only 200 meters away. Tied my shirt around the foot to limit the bleeding and drove to the nearest rural hospital about 25 kilometers away. In and out of consciousness and bleeding like a pig, I more or less fell through the gates of the hospital.

Staff took very good care of me, cleaned the wound and stopped the bleeding. Called my wife, who picked me up in the car.

When asking for the bill, I got pleasantly surprised: "Emergency Sir, so it is free"

When I picked up my motorbike a week later, I brought them a large cake!!

So there are some good people within the healthcare system here!!

[abitmiffed]

Headline should read '' Government concerned with Foreigner's being ripped off by Thai's ''

Sorry you forgot the ,'Again' and 'Again' at the end.