Pattaya police seize booze, Aston Martin and alleged tax dodger

[chickenrunCM]

I'm just curious. I know it's possible to track that import duties weren't paid on a car, such as a VIN but how could they tell that they weren't paid on the alcohol? Who knows where he bought the bottles? Isn't the burden of proof on the police, if they asked him to prove where he bought them from wouldn't that illegally put the burden of proof on the suspect?

Something sounds not quite right. Or maybe I'm just being pessimistic.

Alcohol has a little label on it to say that the tax has been paid.

Can the label not be removed? Is it considered illegal to remove the label? I don't drink often....

I have no idea if removing the labels is illegal, but removing more than 1000 of them and then leaving them in your house with an untaxed Aston Martin parked outside might not be a good idea.

you can have a many bottles of untaxed bottles in your house and on your parties, only in bars, shops, aso they are not allowed, everybody can buy a bottle when come from outside, can be gifts from friends, collection over years .... as long this is a private party nobody can touch this private property,

only the car is a problem

[MTH]

This is a good opportunity to alert wine drinkers in Thailand to "blended" wines! See https://surathai.wordpress.com/2015/01/29/imported-not-wine/

Just to proof to you that the article you linked to is WRONG.

Included a picture from a blended wine at Friendshp supermarket, and look at the color of the label. By the way I looked through their stock of blended and "real" wine, and couldn't find a single bottle or box that didn't have a blue label, and they had many fruit wines.

20150829_001147.jpg

Just to prove to you that you did not bother to read the whole article before making assumptions.

"But from now on, orange or blue stamps cannot help us anymore......."

I admit I didn't see that lasy line, but have now read the whole article over and over again. and have come to the conclusion that the whole article states exactly nothing.

So it must have been someone with too much time on his hands, and looked for his 5 minutes of fame, who has written it.

Well crunch it again would ya, and maybe you will figure it as the rest of us did.

Not that hard, but requires some reading capabilities.

[umbanda]

1.200.000 THB tax in a $240,000 Aston Martin? Good deal!!!

[umbanda]

Wow...would have been fun to be invited to one of those parties! At least on a night with no police raid....LOL

With over 30 foreign men but only 20 Thai women it is not the sort of ratio I find fun.

Some men only can have I cup of "whiskey" a day.....and go sleep after....women can have many....

[gemguy]

Hmmmm....how did the police immediately know, at the time of the raid, that all the items they confiscated did not have the duties paid for.

If the Wife can not produce any documents showing the duties were paid then the police are correct while a person should be given some time to produce those documents.

I would not doubt that some or nearly all of the items in question were obtained and imported on the sly....someway ....some how......but maybe the police are a little pre-mature here.

Meantime...."sexy" house parties where the men out number the women is definitely a crime and needs the full attention of the authorities.....lol

Cheers

[TheCruncher]

Just to proof to you that the article you linked to is WRONG.

Included a picture from a blended wine at Friendshp supermarket, and look at the color of the label. By the way I looked through their stock of blended and "real" wine, and couldn't find a single bottle or box that didn't have a blue label, and they had many fruit wines.

20150829_001147.jpg

Just to prove to you that you did not bother to read the whole article before making assumptions.

"But from now on, orange or blue stamps cannot help us anymore......."

I admit I didn't see that lasy line, but have now read the whole article over and over again. and have come to the conclusion that the whole article states exactly nothing.

So it must have been someone with too much time on his hands, and looked for his 5 minutes of fame, who has written it.

Well crunch it again would ya, and maybe you will figure it as the rest of us did.

Not that hard, but requires some reading capabilities.

Sorry to break it for you but I learned reading at a very young age, something that may not apply to yourself.

Let me help you a litlle.

This is what the site says

It is so disappointing to learn that, instead of discouraging the other company not to confuse consumers with misleading labels showing famous wine countries such as Australia on the front, this company chose to follow suit by selling affordable wine using Australian name but in reality blend it with passion fruit wine.

Indicating that by hiding the real contents of the product, wine importers bypass the law and get a blue tax label issued.

Now start reading, something you claim to be superior at, on the picture I posted and tell me if they are trying to hide in any way that this is a blended product.

To help you a little more, it says clearly in French and German language, Alcoholic beverage with a BASE of wine.

Edited September 26, 2015 by TheCruncher

[Shawn0001]

Wow...would have been fun to be invited to one of those parties! At least on a night with no police raid....LOL

With over 30 foreign men but only 20 Thai women it is not the sort of ratio I find fun.

Some men only can have I cup of "whiskey" a day.....and go sleep after....women can have many....

As true as that is, it doesn't change my opinion on preferred ratios of men to women at parties, thanks but no thanks.

[DPGumbypgh]

No one was arrested or taken into custody. The Aston Martin was legally taxed and was not seized. The whole story is wrong. When did police ever respond to a noise complaint it is a city hall problem. Customs officers never go to noise complaints. The house owner owns hotels not works at one.

[worgeordie]

Wow...would have been fun to be invited to one of those parties! At least on a night with no police raid....LOL

With over 30 foreign men but only 20 Thai women it is not the sort o

10 of the men may have been gay.

regards Worgeordie

[Nick167]

I and my better half take like about 5 trips overseas each a month mostly to Singapore ( we have a branch office there) and each time, we always purchase and bring back duty free Johny Walker blue label whisky or Martell Brandy from Changi Airport as its the cheapests and we have been accumulating a lot....so these do not have any duty free labels....so is it illegal or do I need to keep the receipts from the duty free from now on. This country is turning to be so so stupid day by day and so unliveable.

[Acharn]

I'm just curious. I know it's possible to track that import duties weren't paid on a car, such as a VIN but how could they tell that they weren't paid on the alcohol? Who knows where he bought the bottles? Isn't the burden of proof on the police, if they asked him to prove where he bought them from wouldn't that illegally put the burden of proof on the suspect?

Something sounds not quite right. Or maybe I'm just being pessimistic.

There's a stamp that is supposed to be placed on the bottle when the tax is paid. If the stamp isn't there that's prima facie evidence the tax hasn't been paid. Same in the U.S.

[MTH]

Just to prove to you that you did not bother to read the whole article before making assumptions.

"But from now on, orange or blue stamps cannot help us anymore......."

I admit I didn't see that lasy line, but have now read the whole article over and over again. and have come to the conclusion that the whole article states exactly nothing.

So it must have been someone with too much time on his hands, and looked for his 5 minutes of fame, who has written it.

Well crunch it again would ya, and maybe you will figure it as the rest of us did.

Not that hard, but requires some reading capabilities.

Sorry to break it for you but I learned reading at a very young age, something that may not apply to yourself.

Let me help you a litlle.

This is what the site says

It is so disappointing to learn that, instead of discouraging the other company not to confuse consumers with misleading labels showing famous wine countries such as Australia on the front, this company chose to follow suit by selling affordable wine using Australian name but in reality blend it with passion fruit wine.

Indicating that by hiding the real contents of the product, wine importers bypass the law and get a blue tax label issued.

Now start reading, something you claim to be superior at, on the picture I posted and tell me if they are trying to hide in any way that this is a blended product.

To help you a little more, it says clearly in French and German language, Alcoholic beverage with a BASE of wine.

I appreciate you're trying to help me out, however by the looks of it, it might be you that would require some help.

The article states that previously you could distinguish between wine and blended fruit wines by the blue and orange tax labels. Well that isn't the case anymore, you will now have to read the back label to figure out if the wine has been diluted with fruit wine. And additionally being able to read Thai if you want to know what fruit it has been blended with. I'm not a big wine drinker here in Thailand due to a few reasons, but I thought this was interesting, especially since I wasn't aware of this, hence I read the whole article.

I have to admit I'm a bit confused to as where I would have stated that I'm superior at reading. I just stated that the article isn't very well written and that you'd need some reading capabilities. However maybe I should have said that some level of comprehension would be needed, and that's if you'd even bothered to read the whole article before posting your proof that it was wrong, with the following comment from you: By the way I looked through their stock of blended and "real" wine, and couldn't find a single bottle or box that didn't have a blue label, and they had many fruit wines." That I unfortunately had to remove due to nesting of quotes being at a maximum.

Edited September 26, 2015 by MTH

[KittenKong]

I and my better half take like about 5 trips overseas each a month mostly to Singapore ( we have a branch office there) and each time, we always purchase and bring back duty free Johny Walker blue label whisky or Martell Brandy from Changi Airport as its the cheapests and we have been accumulating a lot....so these do not have any duty free labels....so is it illegal or do I need to keep the receipts from the duty free from now on.

You should not need receipts because you will have exit/entry stamps in your passport to prove that you have travelled. Only people who havent travelled would need to be concerned about having untaxed items.

I'll take one of the Martell bottles if you want real peace of mind.

[TheCruncher]

I admit I didn't see that lasy line, but have now read the whole article over and over again. and have come to the conclusion that the whole article states exactly nothing.

So it must have been someone with too much time on his hands, and looked for his 5 minutes of fame, who has written it.

Well crunch it again would ya, and maybe you will figure it as the rest of us did.

Not that hard, but requires some reading capabilities.

Sorry to break it for you but I learned reading at a very young age, something that may not apply to yourself.

Let me help you a litlle.

This is what the site says

It is so disappointing to learn that, instead of discouraging the other company not to confuse consumers with misleading labels showing famous wine countries such as Australia on the front, this company chose to follow suit by selling affordable wine using Australian name but in reality blend it with passion fruit wine.

Indicating that by hiding the real contents of the product, wine importers bypass the law and get a blue tax label issued.

Now start reading, something you claim to be superior at, on the picture I posted and tell me if they are trying to hide in any way that this is a blended product.

To help you a little more, it says clearly in French and German language, Alcoholic beverage with a BASE of wine.

I appreciate you're trying to help me out, however by the looks of it, it might be you that would require some help.

The article states that previously you could distinguish between wine and blended fruit wines by the blue and orange tax labels. Well that isn't the case anymore, you will now have to read the back label to figure out if the wine has been diluted with fruit wine. And additionally being able to read Thai if you want to know what fruit it has been blended with. I'm not a big wine drinker here in Thailand due to a few reasons, but I thought this was interesting, especially since I wasn't aware of this, hence I read the whole article.

I have to admit I'm a bit confused to as where I would have stated that I'm superior at reading. I just stated that the article isn't very well written and that you'd need some reading capabilities. However maybe I should have said that some level of comprehension would be needed, and that's if you'd even bothered to read the whole article before posting your proof that it was wrong, with the following comment from you: By the way I looked through their stock of blended and "real" wine, and couldn't find a single bottle or box that didn't have a blue label, and they had many fruit wines." That I unfortunately had to remove due to nesting of quotes being at a maximum.

So since you claim to understand it all so perfectly, I'm sure you can tell us all which is the basis now on which a blue or orange tax label is issued to a certain beverage.

Since before blended wines were issued an orange label and real wines a blue label, but this has changed according to the article and you, which beverages get now the orange label and under which consideration.

[springheeled jack]

how do they know whether items are taxed or untaxed or is it an excuse to confiscate all the booze just because it belongs to a foreigner is it a case of sour grapes .

[BigBadGeordie]

how do they know whether items are taxed or untaxed or is it an excuse to confiscate all the booze just because it belongs to a foreigner is it a case of sour grapes .

In this case, fermented and distilled grapes.

[MTH]

Well crunch it again would ya, and maybe you will figure it as the rest of us did.

Not that hard, but requires some reading capabilities.

Sorry to break it for you but I learned reading at a very young age, something that may not apply to yourself.

Let me help you a litlle.

This is what the site says

It is so disappointing to learn that, instead of discouraging the other company not to confuse consumers with misleading labels showing famous wine countries such as Australia on the front, this company chose to follow suit by selling affordable wine using Australian name but in reality blend it with passion fruit wine.

Indicating that by hiding the real contents of the product, wine importers bypass the law and get a blue tax label issued.

Now start reading, something you claim to be superior at, on the picture I posted and tell me if they are trying to hide in any way that this is a blended product.

To help you a little more, it says clearly in French and German language, Alcoholic beverage with a BASE of wine.

I appreciate you're trying to help me out, however by the looks of it, it might be you that would require some help.

The article states that previously you could distinguish between wine and blended fruit wines by the blue and orange tax labels. Well that isn't the case anymore, you will now have to read the back label to figure out if the wine has been diluted with fruit wine. And additionally being able to read Thai if you want to know what fruit it has been blended with. I'm not a big wine drinker here in Thailand due to a few reasons, but I thought this was interesting, especially since I wasn't aware of this, hence I read the whole article.

I have to admit I'm a bit confused to as where I would have stated that I'm superior at reading. I just stated that the article isn't very well written and that you'd need some reading capabilities. However maybe I should have said that some level of comprehension would be needed, and that's if you'd even bothered to read the whole article before posting your proof that it was wrong, with the following comment from you: By the way I looked through their stock of blended and "real" wine, and couldn't find a single bottle or box that didn't have a blue label, and they had many fruit wines." That I unfortunately had to remove due to nesting of quotes being at a maximum.

So since you claim to understand it all so perfectly, I'm sure you can tell us all which is the basis now on which a blue or orange tax label is issued to a certain beverage.

Since before blended wines were issued an orange label and real wines a blue label, but this has changed according to the article and you, which beverages get now the orange label and under which consideration.

Sorry to disappoint, but no, I don’t “understand it all so perfectly”, I just read the article…

I now know, that if I want to make sure I don’t get wine mixed with some sort of fruit wine, I can no longer rely on the blue or orange tax labels.

I have to read the label on the back of the bottle. Interesting to me, maybe not to you.

Either way, if you’re curious as to what basis are used to issue blue or orange tax labels, I can’t help you there, but I suggest you do a Google search.

[TheCruncher]

Sorry to break it for you but I learned reading at a very young age, something that may not apply to yourself.

Let me help you a litlle.

This is what the site says

It is so disappointing to learn that, instead of discouraging the other company not to confuse consumers with misleading labels showing famous wine countries such as Australia on the front, this company chose to follow suit by selling affordable wine using Australian name but in reality blend it with passion fruit wine.

Indicating that by hiding the real contents of the product, wine importers bypass the law and get a blue tax label issued.

Now start reading, something you claim to be superior at, on the picture I posted and tell me if they are trying to hide in any way that this is a blended product.

To help you a little more, it says clearly in French and German language, Alcoholic beverage with a BASE of wine.

I appreciate you're trying to help me out, however by the looks of it, it might be you that would require some help.

The article states that previously you could distinguish between wine and blended fruit wines by the blue and orange tax labels. Well that isn't the case anymore, you will now have to read the back label to figure out if the wine has been diluted with fruit wine. And additionally being able to read Thai if you want to know what fruit it has been blended with. I'm not a big wine drinker here in Thailand due to a few reasons, but I thought this was interesting, especially since I wasn't aware of this, hence I read the whole article.

I have to admit I'm a bit confused to as where I would have stated that I'm superior at reading. I just stated that the article isn't very well written and that you'd need some reading capabilities. However maybe I should have said that some level of comprehension would be needed, and that's if you'd even bothered to read the whole article before posting your proof that it was wrong, with the following comment from you: By the way I looked through their stock of blended and "real" wine, and couldn't find a single bottle or box that didn't have a blue label, and they had many fruit wines." That I unfortunately had to remove due to nesting of quotes being at a maximum.

So since you claim to understand it all so perfectly, I'm sure you can tell us all which is the basis now on which a blue or orange tax label is issued to a certain beverage.

Since before blended wines were issued an orange label and real wines a blue label, but this has changed according to the article and you, which beverages get now the orange label and under which consideration.

Sorry to disappoint, but no, I don’t “understand it all so perfectly”, I just read the article…

I now know, that if I want to make sure I don’t get wine mixed with some sort of fruit wine, I can no longer rely on the blue or orange tax labels.

I have to read the label on the back of the bottle. Interesting to me, maybe not to you.

Either way, if you’re curious as to what basis are used to issue blue or orange tax labels, I can’t help you there, but I suggest you do a Google search.

Well let me tell you, to finish with this, that nothing has changed in the way how orange or blue tax labels are issued. They are issued in the exact same way as they were before the article was written.

The orange label NEVER indicated that it was a blended wine, it means that it is processed in Thailand. so even genuine Thai wines will have an orange tax label.

Blue label means it is an imported product, and that was so also before the article was written, so yes the writer wrote a whole lot of crap when he said that blended wines were orange labelled previously.

The odd wine product is a “winner all around,” Campbell said. It bears the country's orange customs seal, which means the wine underwent final processing in Thailand.

Wines with a blue customs seal, Campbell said, are “vinified elsewhere and imported into the Kingdom.”

Read more: http://www.snooth.com/articles/thai-wine-industry-trying-to-find-its-feet-amid-high-taxes/?viewall=1#ixzz3mwvrXth9

Edited September 27, 2015 by TheCruncher

[MTH]

Well let me tell you, to finish with this, that nothing has changed in the way how orange or blue tax labels are issued. They are issued in the exact same way as they were before the article was written.

The orange label NEVER indicated that it was a blended wine, it means that it is processed in Thailand. so even genuine Thai wines will have an orange tax label.

Blue label means it is an imported product, and that was so also before the article was written, so yes the writer wrote a whole lot of crap when he said that blended wines were orange labelled previously.

The odd wine product is a “winner all around,” Campbell said. It bears the country's orange customs seal, which means the wine underwent final processing in Thailand.

Wines with a blue customs seal, Campbell said, are “vinified elsewhere and imported into the Kingdom.”

Read more: http://www.snooth.com/articles/thai-wine-industry-trying-to-find-its-feet-amid-high-taxes/?viewall=1#ixzz3mwvrXth9

There we go, since you now seem to know the difference between the tax labels, maybe now would be a good time to finally get an answer as to why you’d think your box of fruit wine with a blue tax stamp would be “proof” that the article is wrong. That’s exactly what the article is stating, you cannot rely on the color of the tax stamp, you will have to read the label on the bottle, to figure out if it’s a blended wine or not.

[TheCruncher]

Well let me tell you, to finish with this, that nothing has changed in the way how orange or blue tax labels are issued. They are issued in the exact same way as they were before the article was written.

The orange label NEVER indicated that it was a blended wine, it means that it is processed in Thailand. so even genuine Thai wines will have an orange tax label.

Blue label means it is an imported product, and that was so also before the article was written, so yes the writer wrote a whole lot of crap when he said that blended wines were orange labelled previously.

The odd wine product is a “winner all around,” Campbell said. It bears the country's orange customs seal, which means the wine underwent final processing in Thailand.

Wines with a blue customs seal, Campbell said, are “vinified elsewhere and imported into the Kingdom.”

Read more: http://www.snooth.com/articles/thai-wine-industry-trying-to-find-its-feet-amid-high-taxes/?viewall=1#ixzz3mwvrXth9

There we go, since you now seem to know the difference between the tax labels, maybe now would be a good time to finally get an answer as to why you’d think your box of fruit wine with a blue tax stamp would be “proof” that the article is wrong. That’s exactly what the article is stating, you cannot rely on the color of the tax stamp, you will have to read the label on the bottle, to figure out if it’s a blended wine or not.

The article says

So, after you learn about this you will look carefully for the blue or orange stamp on the cap. If you want 100 % imported grape wine you will choose those with blue stamps. If you want to restrict your budget and it is acceptable to you that you will drink half grape wine then you will pay less than 300 Baht for orange stamp.

and continues

But from now on, orange or blue stamps cannot help us anymore.

Orange labels have NEVER been an indication that it is blended wine nor have blue labels EVER been a guarantee that you had 100% imported grape wine.

The way it is today is as it has been ever since tax labels have been introduced.

Orange has ALWAYS been local wine, either 100% grape wine or blended product, or spirits and blue label has ALWAYS been for imported product either 100% grape or blended product.

So the ridiculous claim from the writer, and you, that previously you could distinguish between blended or 100% grape wine by looking at the label is a HOAX.

And blended wine wasn't introduced in Thailand by Siam Winery, it has been available from international wineries ever since, and always with a blue label.

Edited September 27, 2015 by TheCruncher

[norrider]

Strange story. Police and customs make razzia,because of loud music? Wouldnt they need a court order for that?

[dabhand]

Strange story. Police and customs make razzia,because of loud music? Wouldnt they need a court order for that?

The fact that both police and customs turned up, in numbers, for a supposed noise issue seems to suggest all is not as has been reported.

More likely that the rozzers and the customs guys had pre-planned the raid in the expectation (hope?) of generating some dosh for the next policeman's ball.

Did they succeed? Reports on another forum indicate that they came up empty handed but I suppose the truth will be as elusive as ever.

[DD13]

Well let me tell you, to finish with this, that nothing has changed in the way how orange or blue tax labels are issued. They are issued in the exact same way as they were before the article was written.

The orange label NEVER indicated that it was a blended wine, it means that it is processed in Thailand. so even genuine Thai wines will have an orange tax label.

Blue label means it is an imported product, and that was so also before the article was written, so yhes the writer wrote a whole lot of crap when he said that blended wines were orange labelled previously.

The odd wine product is a winner all around, Campbell said. It bears the country's orange customs seal, which means the wine underwent final processing in Thailand.

Wines with a blue customs seal, Campbell said, are vinified elsewhere and imported into the Kingdom.

Read more: http://www.snooth.com/articles/thai-wine-industry-trying-to-find-its-feet-amid-high-taxes/?viewall=1#ixzz3mwvrXth9

There we go, since you now seem to know the difference between the tax labels, maybe now would be a good time to finally get an answer as to why youd think your box of fruit wine with

P a blue tax stamp would be proof that the article is wrong. Thats exactly what the article is stating, you cannot rely on the color of the tax stamp, you will have to read the label on the bottle, to figure out if its a blended wine or not.

The article says

So, after you learn about this you will look carefully for the blue or orange stamp on the cap. If you want 100 % imported grape wine you will choose those with blue stamps. If you want to restrict your budget and it is acceptable to you that you will drink half grape wine then you will pay less than 300 Baht for orange stamp.

and continues

But from now on, orange or blue stamps cannot help us anymore.

Orange labels have NEVER been an indication that it is blended wine nor have blue labels EVER been a guarantee that you had 100% imported grape wine.

The way it is today is as it has been ever since tax labels have been introduced.

Orange has ALWAYS been local wine, either 100% grape wine or blended product, or spirits and blue label has ALWAYS been for imported product either 100% grape or blended product.

So the ridiculous claim from the writer, and you, that previously you could distinguish between blended or 100% grape wine by looking at the label is a HOAX.

And blended wine wasn't introduced in Thailand by Siam Winery, it has been available from international wineries ever since, and always with a blue label.

Perhaps you two guys should "meet up" go to the Customs & Excise, get the true SP on the tax situation, and report back to TV

Then we would all know what's what

Edited September 29, 2015 by DD13

[Rimmer]

Off topic post removed

[Bernard Flint]

I got invited to and attended a party at the minister of interior's pad in BKK once.

I utterly forget the guy's name, and it was about 4 years ago. It was apparently a foul name, as my red-shirt wife was disgusted at the name & wouldn't go with me.

It was quite an opulent affair. He had a cherry 1967 Chevy stepside pickup painted purple that I was drooling over.

Did we chat?????

[jmccarty]

I'm just curious. I know it's possible to track that import duties weren't paid on a car, such as a VIN but how could they tell that they weren't paid on the alcohol? Who knows where he bought the bottles? Isn't the burden of proof on the police, if they asked him to prove where he bought them from wouldn't that illegally put the burden of proof on the suspect?

Something sounds not quite right. Or maybe I'm just being pessimistic.

Imported booze has a black customs sticker over the cap. Why would anyone remove that? No label, illegal! Looks black to me anyway!

Edited September 30, 2015 by jmccarty

[ratcatcher]

What kind of muppet keeps his wine collection standing up on glass display shelves and not in a reasonably cool, dark area.

More dollars than sense.

[balo]

My understanding of this case is that it was the Norwegian owner of New Nordic who rented out to his Norwegian hi-so friend to have a party....

Edited September 30, 2015 by balo

[dabhand]

My understanding of this case is that it was the Norwegian owner of New Nordic who rented out to his Norwegian hi-so friend to have a party....

Interesting info on the owner on AD's website.

Seems that you can virtually guarantee that any foreigner involved with the property business in Thailand has a murky past. The nature of the business, I suppose