thai id card for foreigners

[phutoie2]

On 15/09/2017 at 11:42 AM, jumbo said:

Just carry my pink ID card and my drivers license. Fly around in thailand, show id for hotel bookings, get stopped by traffic cops, never needed anything else. Never carry my passport with me... absolutely not needed for any purpose when you have the pink ID

Funny thing happened when I wanted to buy a new sim card, prepaid for my son. Could not do at the sales counter at the AIS shop but had to go to their 'regular' shop in the same mall if I wanted to use the pink ID...Only time I was asked to produce my passport and I still think it was the unfamiliarity of the sales lady rather than the ID itself that was confusing....

 

 

Does this ID card have details of your current immigration status?, I ask as when booking in at a Bangkok hotel last week the reception staff commented " you stay Thailand long time", when looking at my entry stamp, TM6 and current permission to stay date in my passport which they asked for.

Edited September 18, 2017 by phutoie2
Poor grammar

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

Contrary to popular myth, a Thai driver's license is not a substitute for your passport. It's a driver's license. It's states your entitlement to drive. It does not represent any evidence of your lawful presence in Thailand. It just says you can drive.

The pink ID card is a different matter. There's a lot of crap on here about it. There is a translation gaffe, where everyone thinks it states it's not an ID card. What they mean is it doesn't mean you're Thai. It IS a form of national identification however. It is a resident alien card. Perversely it actually hindered my Work Permit renewal. The staff at the Ministry of Labour seemed to be using it as some kind of training exercise. I should have left it at home!

 

I'm a hotel manager and I instruct my staff to accept it as identification, which is what I believe we're allowed to do, it has your permanent address. I also stay in a lot of hotels myself and my own pink ID card has ALWAYS been accepted for check in, but then I never stay in no-star $#!t holes where the staff are only trained to smile. If anyone has substantial evidence to the contrary I'm happy to listen, but I'm not interested to argue with some pompous twerp that can't see the value of something you're legally obliged to get anyway if you're on a Tabien Baan.

Edited September 18, 2017 by NilSS

[jumbo]

On 9/15/2017 at 2:11 PM, tutsiwarrior said:

 

the confusion resulted from many posters stating that they had gone to the tessaban/amphur for the kor ror 22 for their marriage extension of stay...if you see my other post I obtained the kor ror 22 from the amphur the next day after obtaining the yellow book and ID card from the tessaban where I had originally gone for the kor ror 22...

 

we live next to the tessaban premises and our neighborhood is referred to as 'tessaban'...the amphur is a couple of miles away and is where the district police headquarters resides...

 

could be that along with immigration offices, banks, etc. there is no consistency to how individual districts in Thailand choose to arrange things...TiT...'LOL'...

 

 

Got a lesson taught by the missus over the weekend. In Ayutthaya, where we live, the Khet/Tambun where you live decides on where you go for these matters. Old city goes to Tessa Baan and newer areas go to Amphur seems to be the rule... So I was incorrect with my assumption and you very correct...

 

[jumbo]

9 hours ago, phutoie2 said:

Does this ID card have details of your current immigration status?, I ask as when booking in at a Bangkok hotel last week the reception staff commented " you stay Thailand long time", when looking at my entry stamp, TM6 and current permission to stay date in my passport which they asked for.

Try and get the yellow tabien baan ( a must for the Pink ID) without a valid VISA

But to reply on your question, no it does not. I booked and stayed at hotels, entered airplanes, registered for easy pass and m-pass and opened a bank account with the Pink ID

On the other hand, for people who don't think they want or need it, don't do it as you can definitely live without it although my ID makes my life a lot easier.

I hardly need my passport.

Another exeption was that for e-bank transferring funds to foreign countries they needed to register my new passport.....

 

 

[Thanyaburi Mac]

Used my pink ID card yesterday, withdrew a batch of baht from SCB, then went to SuperRich to exchange for US $$$.  No  problem, altho both places initially asked for my passport.

 

Mac

[bluesofa]

8 hours ago, NilSS said:

Contrary to popular myth, a Thai driver's license is not a substitute for your passport. It's a driver's license. It's states your entitlement to drive. It does not represent any evidence of your lawful presence in Thailand. It just says you can drive.

The pink ID card is a different matter. There's a lot of crap on here about it. There is a translation gaffe, where everyone thinks it states it's not an ID card. What they mean is it doesn't mean you're Thai. It IS a form of national identification however. It is a resident alien card. Perversely it actually hindered my Work Permit renewal. The staff at the Ministry of Labour seemed to be using it as some kind of training exercise. I should have left it at home!

 

I'm a hotel manager and I instruct my staff to accept it as identification, which is what I believe we're allowed to do, it has your permanent address. I also stay in a lot of hotels myself and my own pink ID card has ALWAYS been accepted for check in, but then I never stay in no-star $#!t holes where the staff are only trained to smile. If anyone has substantial evidence to the contrary I'm happy to listen, but I'm not interested to argue with some pompous twerp that can't see the value of something you're legally obliged to get anyway if you're on a Tabien Baan.

 

In the past I managed some houses we rented out to tourists. We, like you, were required to register all aliens staying in our properties within 24 hours.

I don't know the form number needed, because after a lot of hassle we managed get approval to do the registering online, by logging in to the immigration system directly, having been issued with a user ID and password.

 

Now I have no hidden agenda here, but there is a question I would be interested in knowing the answer to: Does possession if the pink ID card cancel requirement by the "housemaster" to register the alien?

If it does fine (I have a pink ID too), but if not, then the passport details will still be required if checking in under your own name.

 

 

 

[Pattaya46]

8 hours ago, NilSS said:

Contrary to popular myth, a Thai driver's license is not a substitute for your passport. It's a driver's license. It's states your entitlement to drive. It does not represent any evidence of your lawful presence in Thailand. It just says you can drive.

The pink ID card is a different matter. //

How is the pink ID different in what you said ? It's not a substitute to your passport either, and it's not an evidence of your lawful presence in Thailand. Both are a proof of identity accepted in Thailand, but the DL is far easier to get 

[jeab1980]

33 minutes ago, bluesofa said:

 

In the past I managed some houses we rented out to tourists. We, like you, were required to register all aliens staying in our properties within 24 hours.

I don't know the form number needed, because after a lot of hassle we managed get approval to do the registering online, by logging in to the immigration system directly, having been issued with a user ID and password.

 

Now I have no hidden agenda here, but there is a question I would be interested in knowing the answer to: Does possession if the pink ID card cancel requirement by the "housemaster" to register the alien?

If it does fine (I have a pink ID too), but if not, then the passport details will still be required if checking in under your own name.

 

 

 

Grey area i expect. I check in with Pinko its never been questioned anywhere in Thailand (even though it clearly states valid in province of issue only). Thats my part done if the hotel or guest house doesnt register me there problem not mine.

As house master i would say thats a diffrent matter if a friend from say Chiang Mai comes to stay with us who has a pinko.

1. Do we bother going to immigration and telling them ? (Letter of law says yes we so no way hosah). If we did surley pinko would be no good as it clearly states valid in province of issue?

So as a housmaster if you registered them you would need there passports.

I understand you managed guest houses

Which you rented the answer to your question is If you accept pinko do you register them is there a way of inputing them on the register on the web site? GREY AREA.

[bluesofa]

31 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

Grey area i expect. I check in with Pinko its never been questioned anywhere in Thailand (even though it clearly states valid in province of issue only). Thats my part done if the hotel or guest house doesnt register me there problem not mine.

As house master i would say thats a diffrent matter if a friend from say Chiang Mai comes to stay with us who has a pinko.

1. Do we bother going to immigration and telling them ? (Letter of law says yes we so no way hosah). If we did surley pinko would be no good as it clearly states valid in province of issue?

So as a housmaster if you registered them you would need there passports.

I understand you managed guest houses

Which you rented the answer to your question is If you accept pinko do you register them is there a way of inputing them on the register on the web site? GREY AREA.

Regarding the grey area of inputting pink ID cards on the immigration system, I wouldn't know if the system has been improved.

A few years back it was only interesting in passport details, TM6, etc, - plus the fact all the passports are written in Latin script (if only secondary). It wasn't an option to enter anything in Thai script (as per the pink ID).

Plus the fact it has your Thai ID number and not passport number, with your name transliterated into Thai. I would guess it would make it an uphill struggle for immigration to cross-reference any of that.

 

Still, it would be interesting if there's someone with direct knowledge of this.

 

Edited September 19, 2017 by bluesofa

[MrPatrickThai]

My alien card is a waste of time. I was forced to get it though in order to get a Thai citizen ID card.

[pearciderman]

12 hours ago, NilSS said:

but I'm not interested to argue with some pompous twerp that can't see the value of something you're legally obliged to get anyway if you're on a Tabien Baan.

 

Please can you show the relevant section of the relevant act that says you are "legally obliged" to get an ID card if you are on a blue book. (Guessing you mean the blue and not yellow book?).

 

Most, people get the ID card after getting a yellow book.

Edited September 19, 2017 by pearciderman

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

All Thais are required to carry Thai ID card from age 15, I thought this was common knowledge, and you want to debate this with me? Yes, you get the pink ID with a Yellow Tabien Baan, blue ID card if your Thai and on a Blue Tabien Baan, this should be intuitively obvious. I can't remember the time limit for getting it but it is stipulated you are supposed to apply for it within a certain number of days in either case.

 

Regarding driver's license as ID, the problem with DL is you can literally make up an address to get one. There are minimal checks, you can even be living in a hotel. Even with a letter from immigration, you are a visitor. A driver's license is practically worthless as ID in the case of foreigners. A resident Alien card however is beyond the reach of anyone without a Tabien Baan, and with this (your permanent address in Thailand) comes much more gravity. It is on this basis I accept an Alien Card, but reject Driver's License.

Edited September 19, 2017 by NilSS

[thedemon]

56 minutes ago, pearciderman said:

 

Please can you show the relevant section of the relevant act that says you are "legally obliged" to get an ID card if you are on a blue book. (Guessing you mean the blue and not yellow book?).

 

Most, people get the ID card after getting a yellow book.

 

Section 4 and section 38 of the Civil Registration Act B.E. 2551 (2008).

 

 

[blackcab]

@NilSS

 

The only problem with accepting a pink ID card for guests checking into a hotel is that the pink ID card doesn't contain all of the mandatory information required by the online TM30 system.

 

How do you report guests without a TM6 number or without knowing the day until the guest is permitted to stay in Thailand?

 

As the hotel manager the responsibility to record foreign guests in the online TM30 system is ultimately yours, even if you delegate the task to other people.

Edited September 19, 2017 by blackcab

[jeab1980]

8 minutes ago, blackcab said:

@NilSS

 

The only problem with accepting a pink ID card for guests checking into a hotel is that the pink ID card doesn't contain all of the mandatory information required by the online TM30 system.

 

How do you report guests without a TM6 number or without knowing the day until the guest is permitted to stay in Thailand?

 

As the hotel manager the responsibility to record foreign guests in the online TM30 system is ultimately yours, even if you delegate the task to other people.

When i didnt have a pinko and i used passport they only ever copied face page never looked at or asked for (as i dont keep it in passport Tm6). Niether did they flick through passport to find the valid at the time visa.

[jeab1980]

1 hour ago, NilSS said:

All Thais are required to carry Thai ID card from age 15, I thought this was common knowledge, and you want to debate this with me? Yes, you get the pink ID with a Yellow Tabien Baan, blue ID card if your Thai and on a Blue Tabien Baan, this should be intuitively obvious. I can't remember the time limit for getting it but it is stipulated you are supposed to apply for it within a certain number of days in either case.

 

Regarding driver's license as ID, the problem with DL is you can literally make up an address to get one. There are minimal checks, you can even be living in a hotel. Even with a letter from immigration, you are a visitor. A driver's license is practically worthless as ID in the case of foreigners. A resident Alien card however is beyond the reach of anyone without a Tabien Baan, and with this (your permanent address in Thailand) comes much more gravity. It is on this basis I accept an Alien Card, but reject Driver's License.

Age of 7 now drug testers were in local school on Thursday sent probably 75% of kids scurrying home to get there ID cards. Letter from school on friday all children over 7 as you can now get ID cards at 7 must carry them at all times.

[thedemon]

7 minutes ago, blackcab said:

@NilSS

 

The only problem with accepting a pink ID card for guests checking into a hotel is that the pink ID card doesn't contain all of the mandatory information required by the online TM30 system.

 

How do you report guests without a TM6 number or without knowing the day until the guest is permitted to stay in Thailand?

 

As the hotel manager the responsibility to record foreign guests in the online TM30 system is ultimately yours, even if you delegate the task to other people.

 

I agree with you but the same situation applies for a foreigner with PR. No TM6 and no Permitted Until stamp - in fact maybe no stamps at all.

 

PR's may be an isolated case but it goes to show that it isn't always even possible for the hotel to comply so the whole system is demeaned.

 

I know this from experience and now only use the pink ID card for checking in because handing over a passport with no TM6 and no entry stamps is more trouble that it's worth.

[blackcab]

3 minutes ago, thedemon said:

 

I agree with you but the same situation applies for a foreigner with PR. No TM6 and no Permitted Until stamp - in fact maybe no stamps at all.

 

PR's may be an isolated case but it goes to show that it isn't always even possible for the hotel to comply so the whole system is demeaned.

 

I know this from experience and now only use the pink ID card for checking in because handing over a passport with no TM6 and no entry stamps is more trouble that it's worth.

 

Are Permanent Residents required to be reported to immigration for the purpose of a TM30?

 

It would seem a strange thing to have to do really and a bit at odds with the concept of Permanent Residence.

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, blackcab said:

Are Permanent Residents required to be reported to immigration for the purpose of a TM30?

No

They don't have to any of the reporting that is required for those on temporary permits to stay.

[thedemon]

15 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

No

They don't have to any of the reporting that is required for those on temporary permits to stay.

 

Yes but we are talking about the reporting obligations of a hotel, not the individual.

 

If Immigration have made an exception for PR's then they have forgotten to tell anyone. At least I have never seen any mention of it.

[pearciderman]

1 hour ago, thedemon said:

Section 4 and section 38 of the Civil Registration Act B.E. 2551 (2008).

 

 

That would appear to be just amendments to this legislation - Civil Registration Act B.E. 2534

 

"

“Section 38. The district or local registrar shall issue a household registration for persons without Thai nationality having been permitted to stay temporarily and those having been giving leniency for temporary residence in the Thai Kingdom as a special case in accordance with law on immigration and the declaration of the Cabinet and their children born within the Thai Kingdom. In a case of permission of temporary residence overdue, the registrar shall immediately dispose of such persons.
The Director of Central Registration shall make profile registration for persons without Thai nationality besides those under paragraph one in accordance with the declaration of the Cabinet.
Registrations under paragraph one and two shall lie in the manner prescribed in the regulations under the discretion of the Director of Central Registration.”

 

No mention there of ID cards being legally required for those aliens who are on a yellow book.

 

As for Section 4...........I can't find a copy in English of the full 2534 act, (could you maybe post the link that you used to read it?).

 

:-)

 

[ubonjoe]

49 minutes ago, thedemon said:

Yes but we are talking about the reporting obligations of a hotel, not the individual.

If Immigration have made an exception for PR's then they have forgotten to tell anyone. At least I have never seen any mention of it.

Immigration did not make the exemption. All the reporting is under chapter 4 of the immigration act that is titled "Temporary Stay in the Kingdom".

It is also mentioned here on the immigration website. https://www.immigration.go.th/content/การแจ้งที่พักคนต่างด้าว

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

Regarding TM30 provision, we have to provide that via immigration's online portal for all foreigners. In high season it represents a major administrative overhead. HOWEVER, you do not need a TM30 for your home address if you are on the house book for that address (the house book, blue or yellow, is issued to the house, not you, it's not 'your' book), so as far as immigration are concerned it's not required if you stay at a hotel either, just like Thai people on a Tabien Baan are not required to submit a TM30 when they stay at a hotel. The system is ridiculous, but not that ridiculous, hence the acceptance of an Alien Card (unavailable without a Tabien Baan). Of course, no two immigration offices are the same, YMMV. Call.

 

There are a lot of douches out there, Thai and farang, that think this pink ID puts you on the same level as stateless persons from Burma etc etc and you're not allowed to travel. It's a complete nonsense. It's a different category of card, valid for ten years, and certainly there is no requirement to stay in the same province. Nonsense written everywhere.

Edited September 19, 2017 by NilSS

[jeab1980]

1 hour ago, NilSS said:

Regarding TM30 provision, we have to provide that via immigration's online portal for all foreigners. In high season it represents a major administrative overhead. HOWEVER, you do not need a TM30 for your home address if you are on the house book for that address (the house book, blue or yellow, is issued to the house, not you, it's not 'your' book), so as far as immigration are concerned it's not required if you stay at a hotel either, just like Thai people on a Tabien Baan are not required to submit a TM30 when they stay at a hotel. The system is ridiculous, but not that ridiculous, hence the acceptance of an Alien Card (unavailable without a Tabien Baan). Of course, no two immigration offices are the same, YMMV. Call.

 

There are a lot of douches out there, Thai and farang, that think this pink ID puts you on the same level as stateless persons from Burma etc etc and you're not allowed to travel. It's a complete nonsense. It's a different category of card, valid for ten years, and certainly there is no requirement to stay in the same province. Nonsense written everywhere.

Interesting what source  did you get this from? With regards to province ect we can only go on what it actually says on the card and therefore in reality so can Thais. It does state only of use in province issued. Yes we all know thats for migrant countryless people however its there. In plack and white.

[Tanoshi]

8 hours ago, pearciderman said:

 

That would appear to be just amendments to this legislation - Civil Registration Act B.E. 2534

 

"

“Section 38. The district or local registrar shall issue a household registration for persons without Thai nationality having been permitted to stay temporarily and those having been giving leniency for temporary residence in the Thai Kingdom as a special case in accordance with law on immigration and the declaration of the Cabinet and their children born within the Thai Kingdom. In a case of permission of temporary residence overdue, the registrar shall immediately dispose of such persons.
The Director of Central Registration shall make profile registration for persons without Thai nationality besides those under paragraph one in accordance with the declaration of the Cabinet.
Registrations under paragraph one and two shall lie in the manner prescribed in the regulations under the discretion of the Director of Central Registration.”

 

No mention there of ID cards being legally required for those aliens who are on a yellow book.

 

As for Section 4...........I can't find a copy in English of the full 2534 act, (could you maybe post the link that you used to read it?).

 

:-)

 

It is not a legal requirement, just a provision to issue ID cards for persons without Thai nationality.

 

Section 4. Paragraph two of Section 6 of the Civil Registration Act B.E. 2534
shall be repealed and replaced be the following:
“The provision in paragraph one is allowed to use for making a copy or
making a copy and being certified true copy of identification card and other civil
registration document in accordance with this Act for persons without Thai
nationality.”

[blackcab]

16 hours ago, NilSS said:

...so as far as immigration are concerned it's not required if you stay at a hotel either...

 

Just to clarify your post:

 

Are you saying that anyone entered on a yellow Tabien Baan (who can prove it) does not need to be registered for a TM30 by a hotel when they stay as a guest?

[pearciderman]

20 hours ago, jeab1980 said:

Age of 7 now

 

Now? Notice the date on the below article?

 

"

ID cards for children issued from July 10

By The Nation

Authorities are preparing to visit schools from next week to issue national identification cards for children aged between seven and 14 years old there.

"Such preparations are included in our implementation plans," Department of Provincial Administration (DPA) deputy director-general Niran Kanlayanamit said yesterday.

Starting from July 10, district offices will also issue national identification cards for children. The move is in response to the 2011 National Identification Card Act, which requires that Thais aged between seven and 70 years carry the cards.

Of the Thai population, about 8 million are between seven and 14 years old. Before this act takes effect, only Thais above 15 years old age were required to carry national ID cards.

"It will be easier for children to access government services. They can just produce their national identification cards alone. No need to carry birth certificates and household registrations," Niran said, "It will also lower the risk of Thai children's identity being stolen by alien children".

-- The Nation 2011-07-07"

[inThailand]

April fools day?

 

Making seven year old kids carry their Id card?

At least the police may not need 10 officers to arrest one of these serious criminals.   

[Tanoshi]

21 hours ago, jeab1980 said:

Age of 7 now drug testers were in local school on Thursday sent probably 75% of kids scurrying home to get there ID cards. Letter from school on friday all children over 7 as you can now get ID cards at 7 must carry them at all times.

 

Some schools believe they are a law unto themselves.

Responsible parents keep their kids ID cards safe at home. They produce them only on request.

[pearciderman]

17 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

 

Some schools believe they are a law unto themselves.

Responsible parents keep their kids ID cards safe at home. They produce them only on request.

"Starting from July 10, district offices will also issue national identification cards for children. The move is in response to the 2011 National Identification Card Act, which requires that Thais aged between seven and 70 years carry the cards."