Gun Laws in Thailand

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, grollies said:

They don't and they are. Did you see the photo opportunity with the chief of police with his new sig sauers? pointing it at the lady next to him. 

No l didn't see that, l just think govs have more important things to get done other than this kind of thing, taking guns from foreigner's won't make a great difference on gun incidences or crime. 

[Arkady]

 

Here is an image from the time of that PR release about the Sig 320s, albeit not of the police chief at that time. The gun has a magazine in it and the slide is forward, making it obvious on both counts that it has not been checked as clear. Apart from handling a potentially unsafe weapon, the senior policeman is breaking two of the 5 Cooper rules (often posted in Thai and English at Thai shooting ranges)  here: always assume every gun is loaded, even if you have checked it yourself; and never point a gun at anything you don't plan to destroy.   

[Arkady]

1 hour ago, Kwasaki said:

No l didn't see that, l just think govs have more important things to get done other than this kind of thing, taking guns from foreigner's won't make a great difference on gun incidences or crime. 

 

Taking unregistered guns from foreigners (and Thais) could make a difference but there are no specific plans for that.

[joeyg]

On 10/31/2016 at 10:37 AM, joeyg said:

However FYI Thailand has twice the gun violence deaths of the USA.  Just sayin' 

 

"Thank You!"

[cracker1]

Why are you re-printing this story that is more than a year old ?

[uffe123]

Looks like a toy gun that shoots plastic bullets so soft you couldn't kill a fly, bought one for my grandson. Anyway that is all you can own in Thailand. Maybe chewing some tobacco and spitting will do more damage

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, uffe123 said:

Looks like a toy gun that shoots plastic bullets so soft you couldn't kill a fly, bought one for my grandson. Anyway that is all you can own in Thailand. Maybe chewing some tobacco and spitting will do more damage

You can upgrade BB guns and use a different weight plastic pellet.

[MatteoBassini]

The OP would have either seen a BB gun, or a shotgun.

 

While researching gun laws in Thailand, I was surprised that shotguns are also legal for regular citizens to own. They're even cheaper than pistols.

 

 

If you didn't know what this is, you would think it's a "black rifle" that is now infamous in the US. But it's not an AR-15, it's a Derya Mk12, a Turkish made 12-gauge shotgun. Similar shotguns like this are also popular in Thailand, like the Saiga-12. As far as I've researched, full-auto shotguns are also legal (they are treated no differently from pump-action shotguns or semi-auto shotguns in the law).

 

[Arkady]

2 hours ago, MatteoBassini said:

The OP would have either seen a BB gun, or a shotgun.

 

While researching gun laws in Thailand, I was surprised that shotguns are also legal for regular citizens to own. They're even cheaper than pistols.

 

 

If you didn't know what this is, you would think it's a "black rifle" that is now infamous in the US. But it's not an AR-15, it's a Derya Mk12, a Turkish made 12-gauge shotgun. Similar shotguns like this are also popular in Thailand, like the Saiga-12. As far as I've researched, full-auto shotguns are also legal (they are treated no differently from pump-action shotguns or semi-auto shotguns in the law).

 

 

Yes, you can find Derya Mk12s and I think Saiga 12s too in Wang Burapha but they are not the full-auto versions.  Private citizens may own semi-auto shotguns, pistols, short barrelled sub-machine guns (also semi-auto only) and rim fire rifles in .22lr, .22 magnum or .17HMR. Lever action centre fire rifles are allowed but semi-auto centre rifles like the AR15 are prohibited for civilians and there is a temporary ban on imports of short barrelled semi-auto sub-machine guns, although there has been no recall and stocks already in the country can still be traded and transferred.  You can have a centre fire rifle that looks like an assault rilfe in .223 or .308 but on closer examination you should find that it has a charging handle that needs to be pulled back manually after every shot, unless it has been illegally modified.  Better to buy a more accurate bolt action rifle in that case but the assault rifles look cool to some people.  There are quite a few clever dicks locally who buy CMMG .22lr AR15 look alikes legally and convert them illegally to an AR15 by adding a .223 barrel and upper to use military 5.56mm ammo.  AR15s are fun to shoot but it is not worth the risk of getting caught with an illegal conversion in my opinion.

 

The reason that handguns tend to be marked up a lot more than shotguns and rifles is that gun shops get a much smaller annual quota of handguns to sell from the government than they do for long guns.  For some reason shotguns are regarded as less dangerous than handguns in .357 magnum and higher calibre which can only be licensed for sport, not self defence, and require a certificate of training from a certified range, which, of course, is available from many ranges for a small fee without having to do the training.  The cheapest legal firearms you can buy in Thailand are Turkish pump action shotguns and Czech bolt action .22lr rifles.

 

[Arkady]

On 2/10/2018 at 6:34 PM, Kwasaki said:

You can upgrade BB guns and use a different weight plastic pellet.

 

You can also shoot steel ball bearings out of them but that would make them illegal firearms in Thailand.  Since the steel ball bearings are harder than the soft metal of the barrels the BB guns would degrade quite fast on a diet of ball bearings but they could be deadly. 

[Arkady]

Bickering posts were deleted.

[joeyg]

On 10/13/2017 at 10:10 PM, Arkady said:

 

Taking unregistered guns from foreigners (and Thais) could make a difference but there are no specific plans for that.

You think these would be Included? 

Thailand's army distributed 2,700 assault rifles to volunteers over the past two months to fight insurgents in the south, officials say.

The policy comes amid a spike in violence in the conflict which afflicts the Muslim-majority provinces.

However, human rights groups say that arming civilians will only aggravate the situation.

The government, which took power in a coup this year, has pledged peace in the region.

On Monday two people were killed and three others injured in a drive-by attack when a gunman in a pick-up truck opened fire at five people in another vehicle in Pattani province.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-29892629

[Arkady]

32 minutes ago, joeyg said:

You think these would be Included? 

Thailand's army distributed 2,700 assault rifles to volunteers over the past two months to fight insurgents in the south, officials say.

The policy comes amid a spike in violence in the conflict which afflicts the Muslim-majority provinces.

However, human rights groups say that arming civilians will only aggravate the situation.

The government, which took power in a coup this year, has pledged peace in the region.

On Monday two people were killed and three others injured in a drive-by attack when a gunman in a pick-up truck opened fire at five people in another vehicle in Pattani province.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-29892629

In the past reports suggested that they distributed shotguns to volunteers in the South.  Distributing assault rifles seems to be upping the ante.  Shotguns are only effective up 50 metres or so loaded with the 00 buckshot they issue and these were pumps with a tube capacity of 5-7 rounds.  5.56mm assault rifles are effective up to about 450 metres and are particularly effective at longer ranges, if fitted with a combat scope which the US military now issues to every GI. They are also very effective close combat weapons and can be used on full auto with a 30 round magazine but it doesn't say how many rounds were issued to each volunteer.  They is no shortage of 5.56 ammo knocking about in Thailand, either sold illegally by military armourers or even reloaded. Some registered .22lr assault rifles are illegally converted to 5.56mm with a new barrel and upper receiver which is five minute job with the right .22 and the right conversion parts.   Have fired an army M4 5,56mm carbine at an army range.  It is a blast because you have this short 16" barrel firing a powerful round with almost no recoil due to the gas system reloading the next round and counteracting the recoil.  But I am not saying this is appropriate for civilian volunteers.

[Kimber]

On 10/31/2016 at 7:01 AM, Don Mega said:

 

A vest is classified as a weapon in many countries.

 

No sense to it IMO.   a ballistic vest can't be used as a weapon other than being swung like a club.

 

I was presented with my old name tagged Ballistic vest on retirement, then had to destroy it when the laws changed.   Can't have people protected from some cop or thug trying to blow them away. 

 

BTW any reasonably trained Cop will have no trouble bringing someone down with leg shots.

[Kimber]

On 2/10/2018 at 6:48 PM, uffe123 said:

Looks like a toy gun that shoots plastic bullets so soft you couldn't kill a fly, bought one for my grandson. Anyway that is all you can own in Thailand. Maybe chewing some tobacco and spitting will do more damage

Here in Australia it's illegal to own even a toy that resembles a semi-automatic weapon.

 

A kid can own such a toy but it has to be colored as a toy,  eg if it's black or dark blue, or painted so by the owner then they've committed a firearms offense.

That's how ridiculous our laws have become.

[Kimber]

On 2/12/2018 at 5:23 PM, MatteoBassini said:

The OP would have either seen a BB gun, or a shotgun.

 

While researching gun laws in Thailand, I was surprised that shotguns are also legal for regular citizens to own. They're even cheaper than pistols.

 

 

If you didn't know what this is, you would think it's a "black rifle" that is now infamous in the US. But it's not an AR-15, it's a Derya Mk12, a Turkish made 12-gauge shotgun. Similar shotguns like this are also popular in Thailand, like the Saiga-12. As far as I've researched, full-auto shotguns are also legal (they are treated no differently from pump-action shotguns or semi-auto shotguns in the law).

 

 

If I was living in Thailand or Phils  (which I've decided not to do) I would be less than confident as a farang not being able to possess a licensed firearm.   

Yet Thais and the Phils folk seem to have little to no problem owning such weapons and being entitled to use them at will.

 

 

 

 

[Arkady]

6 minutes ago, Kimber said:

 

No sense to it IMO.   a ballistic vest can't be used as a weapon other than being swung like a club.

 

I was presented with my old name tagged Ballistic vest on retirement, then had to destroy it when the laws changed.   Can't have people protected from some cop or thug trying to blow them away. 

 

BTW any reasonably trained Cop will have no trouble bringing someone down with leg shots.

 

A vest is also a restricted item in Thailand that civilians are not allowed to have, at least in public.  I am not sure that it falls under the Firearms Act but foreign reporters have been arrested trying to take them out of the country.  I am also not sure if you are allowed to have them in your home or not. Some guy was selling them made with steel plates at my shooting club out of his car boot here last year and said you could keep them at home for home defense, if you can put one on quick enough.  He had shot one with different calibres to show different sized dents made by each.

[Kimber]

On 2/12/2018 at 8:05 PM, Arkady said:

 

Yes, you can find Derya Mk12s and I think Saiga 12s too in Wang Burapha but they are not the full-auto versions.  Private citizens may own semi-auto shotguns, pistols, short barrelled sub-machine guns (also semi-auto only) and rim fire rifles in .22lr, .22 magnum or .17HMR. Lever action centre fire rifles are allowed but semi-auto centre rifles like the AR15 are prohibited for civilians and there is a temporary ban on imports of short barrelled semi-auto sub-machine guns, although there has been no recall and stocks already in the country can still be traded and transferred.  You can have a centre fire rifle that looks like an assault rilfe in .223 or .308 but on closer examination you should find that it has a charging handle that needs to be pulled back manually after every shot, unless it has been illegally modified.  Better to buy a more accurate bolt action rifle in that case but the assault rifles look cool to some people.  There are quite a few clever dicks locally who buy CMMG .22lr AR15 look alikes legally and convert them illegally to an AR15 by adding a .223 barrel and upper to use military 5.56mm ammo.  AR15s are fun to shoot but it is not worth the risk of getting caught with an illegal conversion in my opinion.

 

The reason that handguns tend to be marked up a lot more than shotguns and rifles is that gun shops get a much smaller annual quota of handguns to sell from the government than they do for long guns.  For some reason shotguns are regarded as less dangerous than handguns in .357 magnum and higher calibre which can only be licensed for sport, not self defence, and require a certificate of training from a certified range, which, of course, is available from many ranges for a small fee without having to do the training.  The cheapest legal firearms you can buy in Thailand are Turkish pump action shotguns and Czech bolt action .22lr rifles.

 

 

"You can have a....."       But not if you're a farang. 

[Arkady]

3 hours ago, Kimber said:

 

"You can have a....."       But not if you're a farang. 

 

The new amendments to the Firearms Act will unfortunately and unnecessarily in my opinion prohibit registration of guns to foreigners for the first time but there is nothing about prohibition by race.  Farangs with Thai citizenship will still be eligible.  I registered five guns as a foreigner with PR without any questions asked at all or any need to go for interview in those days, before obtaining Thai citizenship.  Only since I became Thai was my right to register firearms questioned, due to having a  farang face and name, which was bizarre, but all was resolved by appearing at the licensing centre in person and reassuring them I was really Thai and could speak and understand the language to their satisfaction.  They seem to be more nervous under the military government than in the past.  I understand from a gun shop that at least one farang with Thai citizenship has been turned down in Bangkok but I don't know the reason given.  They also reject some applicants who are Thai from birth for various reasons.    

[Puchaiyank]

Being an avid sportsman and collector...accumulated scores of shotguns, rifles, handguns and priceless beautiful historic arms over a 20 year period...since I travel a good bit my only son asked if he could keep them safe in his home since I'm not around much to secure the arms...He then sold them all to a single collector for about 50 cents on the dollar. 

Why am I telling you this?   ????

[simon43]

Before I moved to Thailand in 2002, I had a class IV firearms licence in the UK to legally buy (but not use) disguised weapons.  I had a collection of over 20 such weapons, some disguised as walking sticks, umbrellas, shooting sticks and pens.

 

When I moved to Thailand, I wasn't allowed to import my collection.  Some were donated to the Tower of London armoury museum - the rest were 'destroyed' ????

[Kwasaki]

5 hours ago, simon43 said:

Before I moved to Thailand in 2002, I had a class IV firearms licence in the UK to legally buy (but not use) disguised weapons.  I had a collection of over 20 such weapons, some disguised as walking sticks, umbrellas, shooting sticks and pens.

 

When I moved to Thailand, I wasn't allowed to import my collection.  Some were donated to the Tower of London armoury museum - the rest were 'destroyed' ????

I liked rough shooting and clay shooting, I luved my Beretta shotgun but no way could I bring it to Thailand so sold it along with my other shotguns.

I like shooting the Glock 21 here but expensive and some minder instructors won't put the target further out but still good fun.

Never bothered to try clay shooting here too far away and too expensive I would guess. 

One of my best hobbies is Archery now but also do some shooting with a families airgun at targets.

[JimmyJ]

I believe the answer to my questions is "No", but would like to make sure:

 

I am moving to Thailand from the US.

 

Can I arrange to bring or import a pistol?

 

Once in Thailand, is it possible to get a (concealed) carry permit?

[grollies]

3 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

I believe the answer to my questions is "No", but would like to make sure:

 

I am moving to Thailand from the US.

 

Can I arrange to bring or import a pistol?

 

Once in Thailand, is it possible to get a (concealed) carry permit?

No and no.

[Arkady]

7 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

I believe the answer to my questions is "No", but would like to make sure:

 

I am moving to Thailand from the US.

 

Can I arrange to bring or import a pistol?

 

Once in Thailand, is it possible to get a (concealed) carry permit?

An individual's right to import firearms was cancelled by legislation about 20 years ago.  I know people who have had special guns, e.g. a custom made Holland and Holland shotgun from London, imported by getting a Thai gun shop to place an order through a registered importer using the gun shop's quota. For a common or garden handgun, this process would obviously cost a lot more than buying one in Thailand.

 

It is possible to have a Por 12 concealed carry permit in Thailand and foreigners have had them in the past.  Today the only foreigners likely to get yearly Por 12s are American DEA agents working on secondment, as it is the DEA's condition for sending agents to Thailand. I talked to a Thai official who was involved in getting these for them. The security guards that travel with foreign VIPs can also get these issued on a temporary basis but the VIPs need to be at the level of POTUS or important royalty.  Otherwise you need to have a good reason to be considered for one, e.g. you are a Thai lawyer, MP, senator, owner of a jewellery shop that needs to transport valuables, senior executive of a large company. They are issued by the police only on a one year renewable basis.  Provincial police can issue a Por 12 that is valid for their province only. National police can issue for the whole country. The Por 12 is valid for one specified firearm only.

 

If that is not difficult enough there is a bill pending to amend the 1947 Firearms Act that will make it impossible to issue any type of firearms license to foreigners. However, it has been said that this bill may have been quashed and may not be approved during the life of the current appointed legislature. One obvious problem with the bill that had clearly not been thought through was that it would prevent secondment of DEA agents and visits by POTUS and other foreign dgnatories who decline to travel unarmed. Under the current unamended law a Por 4 license to own a firearm but not carry it concealed may be issued to foreigners who have a house registration certificate (tabien baan) that is over 6 months old. Currently a work permit is required too.  Bangkok is still issuing these to foreigners who speak reasonable Thai and pass a general sniff test.  Most other provinces, where things are harder for Thai applicants too, probably will not issue to foreigners.

 

Many foreigners with Thai wives get the missus to register a gun in her name. A lot of them carry the guns to the range without the missus present too but this is not worth the risk of getting caught at a  random police road block in my opinion because it is a criminal offense for both the foreigner and the missus.

[Jdiddy]

On 2/26/2018 at 6:21 PM, Kimber said:

Here in Australia it's illegal to own even a toy that resembles a semi-automatic weapon.

 

A kid can own such a toy but it has to be colored as a toy,  eg if it's black or dark blue, or painted so by the owner then they've committed a firearms offense.

That's how ridiculous our laws have become.

 

NZ strikes a better balance, they focus on vetting the person, not the gun

[Jun2x]

On 2/1/2017 at 11:03 AM, Arkady said:

If you want any more detailed info, you can PM me.

 

 

 

Hi bro, my boss is a Thai guy and is looking for a long range stock for his Remington 700 from overseas vendor. Is stock a regulated item in Thailand? Can he order it overseas without hassle? Lastly, can you recommend a good vendor? Thanks.

[Arkady]

2 hours ago, Jun2x said:

Hi bro, my boss is a Thai guy and is looking for a long range stock for his Remington 700 from overseas vendor. Is stock a regulated item in Thailand? Can he order it overseas without hassle? Lastly, can you recommend a good vendor? Thanks.

I don't own a Remington rifle myself but here are some recommendations  https://www.pewpewtactical.com/best-remington-700-stocks/

https://www.rem870.com/2016/08/01/best-remington-700-stocks/

https://www.rem870.com/2013/10/25/5-best-remington-700-chassis-modular-driven-technologies-jp-accuracy-international-masterpiece-arms-kinetic-research-group/

 

The difference between a stock and a chassis is that a chassis is a more military style thing with a pistol grip and handguard, whereas a stock is a more conventional stock. The chassis style is more popular these days and is good for tactical rifle matches but I personally think a conventional stock is better for benchrest as a pistol grip is not needed for that but can still be used OK, if you can avoid exerting any pressure with your thumb on the pistol grip while pulling the trigger which could push the bullet slightly off course. Macmillan is normally regarded as the best for conventional stocks and Accuracy International from England for chassis. Both are quite expensive.  Unless you have the ability to also upgrade the barrel to a match barrel, I would hesitate to spend top dollar on the best stock.  The factory Remington barrels can be OK but it depends on your luck whether you get a good one or a lemon. Theoretically you can import stocks to Thailand, as they are regarded as accessories that do not need an import permit but the US sellers may need an export license for anything classified as ITAR or may just decide it is too complicated to deal with foreign customers.  I think the UK has some similar regulations too.  The catch 22 is that you would need a  Thai import license to get the US export license which is impossible because a Thai import license is not needed. On the other hand the Thai customs have been known to decide that a stock is part of a war weapon and required the recipient to get a letter from an army officer saying it is for him. 

 

Given the above it may be easiest to just buy what is available locally, if you can't find an overseas vendor willing to ship the stock you want. Since Remington 700 is the most popular center fire rifle in Thailand, you can find a lot of options such as stocks and chassis available for them in the Wang Burapa Gunshops and other specialist shops that sell only accessories not guns.  Without a match barrel I think the easiest option would be to buy one of those and let the shop install it, if he doesn't have gunsmithing skills.  The ATI and Magpul brands are popular in Thailand and there are others.  Most of these may not improve long range accuracy hugely, unlike Macmillan or AI, but at least they will allow you use a magazine, since the standard Remingtons don't come with a magazine well. They may also improve stability on the bench, compared to the standard Remington stocks that are designed for hunters to shoot from a standing position.  Getting a fancy benchrest rest or bipod will improve stability too.

 

Since Remingtons come with a rather heavy trigger for liability reasons and because it is better for hunting, a simple upgrade that can improve accuracy from the bench is a drop in after market trigger.  These need a US export permit and a Thai import license.  So it is probably best to pay through the nose to buy whatever is available here. You want to get the trigger pull down to at least 2lbs, whereas the factor trigger pull is going to be around 4-5lbs which makes long range accuracy difficult.  Upgrading the trigger is actually the first thing I would do to a new Remington 700. I have a Sako 85 in .308 that has an adjustable trigger that can be set to about 4lbs for hunting or 13oz for benchrest. I find I am a lot more accurate with the 13oz, which is basically a hair trigger, from the bench but the 4lb trigger is more useful for tactical rifle matches where a very light trigger would result in discharges before the shooter was ready, which is of course dangerous.  That is why military rifles usually have a 7-8lb trigger pull.

 

Another issue that mitigates against paying absolute top dollar for upgrades in Thailand is the lack of ammunition choice. Top class long range shooters around the world load their own ammo and experiment with different components to get the perfect round for their rifle. Unfortunately this is illegal in Thailand where you have to shoot whatever ammunition you can find. 

 

[TheX]

Is this thread still active or dormant? I'm pretty sure most of you by now know the rules for having a gun in thailand is pretty much close to impossible. however if anyone has questions I would like this thread to remain open and we can still keep it active. even for the sake of pellet guns or the likes.