Lao expat being warned by Thai immigration need visa for cross border shopping

[papapayayae]

We are expats living in Vientiane. We have been in Vientiane for 5 years, and we cross the border to Udon Thani or Nong Khai virtually every weekend with our own car and buy basically everything we need from Central shopping or Big C or Lotus. We also enjoy spend a night in Udon Thani and taking kids to water park, to bowling, and eat all kinds of restaurants in the Central shopping and enjoy the international variety in Top's market.

 

But today when we drove across the border to Udon Thani for our one night shopping trip with our 2 kids and our elderly mother who is staying with us in Laos, were told by the immigration personnel that we can only come over without visa one more time this year. I reasoned with him that we live in Laos and come over for shopping, food and entertainment just for 1 night. But he just said it's new rule, after 2nd no visa entry, we all need to apply visa every time we come over to shopping even just 1 day. But I think if 1 night leisurely holiday across the border turn into stress by paying for expensive visa for five of us and go through the stress applying all these visas, even my 2 young kids need visas and that's what Nong Khai immigration personnel said. We absolutely won't go though the hassle and come over anymore.

 

I remember I read this forum before years ago, and I remember there are always Thai experts in this forum, so I like to ask the experts. There are virtually hundreds of expats if not thousands including all their families members living in Vientiane and it's surrounding and most of us cross the border very often to Udon Thani or Nong Khai for serious shopping and foods. I just cannot believe this new rule do not differentiate Thai visa runners from expats living on other side of river and spend a fortune in Udon Thani and Nong Khai on shopping and food and entertainment. I hope today I just ran into an immigration personnel that does not understand the new rule and how it applies. Hope someone with Thai visa knowledge knows how this new rule applies or does not affect us thousands of expats that cross the border and splurge on shopping in Udon and Nong Khai on regular basis.

 

 

 

[Maestro]

The published new rule was announced in this topic:
http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?/topic/959042-Only-2-Visa-Exempt-Entries-At-Border-Crossings-Per-Calendar-Year-Effective-Dec-31st

Later, it was amended to give all nationalities entitled to the visa-exempt programme 30 days per entry, but still only twice per calendar year.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

[mstevens]

As you across the border so frequently, it would probably be worth your while to apply for a multiple-entry tourist visa at the Thai embassy in Vientiane which will allow you unlimited entries across the border to Thailand for 6 months.  The cost of this visa is 5,000 baht.

 

If you visit Thailand most weekends, that would work out at a defrayed cost of around 200 baht per visit.  Yes, it is a hassle and an expense but given that you visit Thailand so regularly it would appear that it is worth your while.  Ditto for all the other expats who make the same trip.  I can understand if you were an occasional visitor how it would be a hassle but for those who visit so regularly the multiple-entry visa will allow you to continue what you were doing.

[SoFarAndNear]

I don't think that there is much what you can do. There are reports of a new rule that only 2 visa on arrivals are allowed per year. You could apply for a multiple entry 6 months tourist visa.

Edited January 4, 2017 by SoFarAndNear

[Maestro]

Single-entry tourist visas are free at the moment until the end of February.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?/topic/956458-Tourist-Visa,-Single-Entry,-at-Thai-Embassies-worldwide-free-of-charge-from-1.12.2016-to-28.2.2017

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[ukrules]

It looks like your shopping days in Thailand are over for now.

 

I would think you already have enough visa hassles in Laos to be bothering to get special additional visas merely to go shopping in Thailand.

 

I wonder what the boards of directors of the large mall groups think about this new situation.

[bendejo]

I used to live in Vientiane 3-6 months per year.  Rather then go through all the visa bs it was much easier (and cheaper) to do a monthly run to Nong Khai.  But the trip to Tesco made it something to look forward to, and the groceries and other stuff I would buy were real sanity savers given Lao's meager choice of consumer goods.

Perhaps a visit to the Thai embassy could help: with a display of deference explain your situation to someone with a desk (as opposed to a window or counter position).  Maybe something can be worked out, as they say in Brazil "there is always a way."  There was one fellow at the embassy who would come out to the area where we wait to be called to the windows and take people's questions.  He was knowledgeable, approachable and easy to talk to.  I have no idea of his official duties or title, or if he's still there.

Best of luck with this.

 

 

[Maestro]

If you have permanent residence status in Laos you could present your case in writing to the Thai consul and suggest that you should qualify for the multiple-entry tourist visa.

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[BritTim]

I agree that single entry tourist visas for every visit are quite impractical for your situation. Quite apart from the time every week to arrange them, your passport would be full in no time.

 

As suggested, multiple entry tourist visas would be a solution if the Vientiane consulate will issue them to you. To be honest, this is the logical use case for them.

 

Do you have any relatives (however remote) who are Thai citizens? Remember that many Lao have Thai relatives. If so, and the consulate want to help, it could give them an excuse to issue a multiple entry Non Imm O visa to visit family in Thailand.

 

Good luck!

[dbrenn]

A much more sensible way to screen out visa runners would be to go back to limiting visa exempt stays to 180 days in total per calendar year. This two trips visa exempt limit will deter bona fide tourists like the OP, who visit Thailand for its superior shopping options. 

 

[BritTim]

52 minutes ago, dbrenn said:

A much more sensible way to screen out visa runners would be to go back to limiting visa exempt stays to 180 days in total per calendar year. This two trips visa exempt limit will deter bona fide tourists like the OP, who visit Thailand for its superior shopping options. 

 

 

I agree with this, provided the immigration computer can do all the necessary calculations. When such restrictions were applied in the past, it was a nightmare. Any time a traveler had several visa exempt entries, the immigration official had to start manually calculating the number of days.

[dbrenn]

15 minutes ago, BritTim said:

 

I agree with this, provided the immigration computer can do all the necessary calculations. When such restrictions were applied in the past, it was a nightmare. Any time a traveler had several visa exempt entries, the immigration official had to start manually calculating the number of days.

Agreed, and I'm assuming that the immigration computer could be set up to show total days per year.

 

It's not only people who come to Thailand for shopping who will be affected either. A friend of mine who lives in Laos has heart problems and has to visit Thailand regularly because of its better health care - simple now via a drive to Udon. Retirees who do likewise may find that they have to resort to Lao (or Cambodian) health care, which is a rather scary proposition. 

[ubonjoe]

Get a single entry tourist visa, enter Thailand and get a 60 day entry then before returning to Laos get a multiple re-entry permit for a fee of 3800 baht would be an option. Or try to get a multiple entry tourist visa that would allow unlimited entries for 6 months from the date of issue for a fee of 5000 baht.

[BritTim]

50 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Get a single entry tourist visa, enter Thailand and get a 60 day entry then before returning to Laos get a multiple re-entry permit for a fee of 3800 baht would be an option. Or try to get a multiple entry tourist visa that would allow unlimited entries for 6 months from the date of issue for a fee of 5000 baht.

 

The re-entry permit route could be a decent option if it is convenient to visit during the week. His original post implied he comes over at weekends.

 

EDIT: Actually, now I come to think of it, I believe Nong Khai Friendship Bridge is one of the few border crossings where a re-entry permit can be applied for on exit. Is this a 7-day operation?

Edited January 5, 2017 by BritTim

[ubonjoe]

4 minutes ago, BritTim said:

EDIT: Actually, now I come to think of it, I believe Nong Khai Friendship Bridge is one of the few border crossings where a re-entry permit can be applied for on exit. Is this a 7-day operation?

Yes 7 days a week.

[ubonjoe]

Off topic posts meant to derail the topic and the expected replies to them have been removed.

[JLCrab]

So maybe now some enterprising Lao or Cambodian citizen will set up a shopping service where they cross over to Thailand and execute your buying list and then meet you at the border with your payment upon delivery.

[laochef]

I used to live in TH for 28 years. Now I have lived in  Laos for 7. I just came back from 2 months in TH. When I applied for the SETV at the Thai Consulate, I had to copy my Lao Visa, Lao ID Card (for foreigners) and my Lao Workpermit. Nobody told me why...

When I picked up the visa, I saw a poster, stating that Expats, with Lao Visa & Workpermit etc., could get a special border-pass Visa. Next time I go (for more than a month) I will go there and enquire what documents are needed, cost and validity, and if still available etc., etc.

 

If someone else has seen this poster, or gotten the special border=pass visa, please  post here on TV.

[papapayayae]

Thank you for all the answers. Many members suggest the multiple 6 month entry tourist visa. But I did some research and it has many criterias as well besides the high cost. A family of 5 like us will cost 25,000 bahts and one year cost 50,000 for our family just to go shopping in Udon Thani, assuming they issue to all of us. We are not permanent residents there nor having these diplomatic or courtesy visa, we are on business multiple visa. So besides the whopping visa cost for 5 which is 50000 bahts a year, we probably have to really sweat to get these Thai multiple entry tourist visas just for some shopping fun.

 

Last night I chatted with another expat in Lao. He is retired in Lao near Vientiane, using the tourist visa and 90 day extension in Lao, so he is sure he is not qualify to get Thai multiple tourist visa. He needs to visit Udon Bangkok hospital for his treatment a few times a year. Now he is worried he may not be able to cross the border for treatment anymore. And there are lots of retirees and long stay people using the tourist visa plus extension routes, and surely they are not qualify for Thai multiple visa. There is now lots of talk of uncertainty about this rule among expats in Laos.

It does affect thousands of people, and most of expats there will not qualify the criteria for multiple Thai tourist visa nor will pay 10000 bahts visa fee a year to go shopping in Udon.

 

I think time will tell what happen in the long run. An Lao expat wrote on other website he drove to Nong Khai on Jan 1 for 3 hours shopping went back Laos same day, drove across again Jan 3 for a few hours, he has not been told anything yet by Thai immigration, he will drive across again in a few days and see what happen in his 3rd no visa entry. But as for me, I think our leisurely drive to Udon Thani and enjoy the shopping and foods is probably coming to an end. We drive back to Laos later today, I will try ask the Thai immigration again how they apply this rule for people like us.

 

 

[ubonjoe]

I think legal residents can get a border pass like Lao citizens can get. Same for the Thai side for those holding permanent residency.

[4evermaat]

But are Lao citizens allowed to cross over without restriction, similar to Malaysian?

[ubonjoe]

Just now, 4evermaat said:

But are Lao citizens allowed to cross over without restriction, similar to Malayian?

Yes they can since they get there entries from a bilateral agreement.

Malaysians are mentioned because they get their entries under the visa exempt scheme.

[brewsterbudgen]

I used to live in TH for 28 years. Now I have lived in  Laos for 7. I just came back from 2 months in TH. When I applied for the SETV at the Thai Consulate, I had to copy my Lao Visa, Lao ID Card (for foreigners) and my Lao Workpermit. Nobody told me why...
When I picked up the visa, I saw a poster, stating that Expats, with Lao Visa & Workpermit etc., could get a special border-pass Visa. Next time I go (for more than a month) I will go there and enquire what documents are needed, cost and validity, and if still available etc., etc.
 
If someone else has seen this poster, or gotten the special border=pass visa, please  post here on TV.

This would be excellent and a very 'common sense' solution.

[papapayayae]

6 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I think legal residents can get a border pass like Lao citizens can get. Same for the Thai side for those holding permanent residency.

Does legal residents include people without Lao residency? and people who are not on long term courtesy or diplomatic visa status and with no work permit but having long term business visa?

[ubonjoe]

16 minutes ago, papapayayae said:

Does legal residents include people without Lao residency? and people who are not on long term courtesy or diplomatic visa status and with no work permit but having long term business visa?

I don't think so.

[chrissables]

Things seem to be getting more and more crazy regarding visa's. What possible benefit is there to Thailand to stop expats in Laos come on shopping trips here? Or just frequent holidays?

[Gweiloman]

14 minutes ago, chrissables said:

Things seem to be getting more and more crazy regarding visa's. What possible benefit is there to Thailand to stop expats in Laos come on shopping trips here? Or just frequent holidays?

 

Unfortunately, brought about by those who try to play the system instead of doing things the proper way.

[chrissables]

I agree, b

11 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

 

Unfortunately, brought about by those who try to play the system instead of doing things the proper way.

I agree, but if they do their job and look at dates of entry to each country it would show they live in Laos and visit here, or otherwise.

 

And playing the system is not wrong, the system is for allowing it to happen. Unfortunately the Thai's seem to ignore these things, then over react later.

[NoshowJones]

8 hours ago, ukrules said:

It looks like your shopping days in Thailand are over for now.

 

I would think you already have enough visa hassles in Laos to be bothering to get special additional visas merely to go shopping in Thailand.

 

I wonder what the boards of directors of the large mall groups think about this new situation.

Another case perhaps for the brown envelopes to change hands when these boards of directors find their malls getting emptier at the weekends.

[NoshowJones]

5 hours ago, dbrenn said:

A much more sensible way to screen out visa runners would be to go back to limiting visa exempt stays to 180 days in total per calendar year. This two trips visa exempt limit will deter bona fide tourists like the OP, who visit Thailand for its superior shopping options. 

 

Sensible ways and Thailand are just not compatable.