Medical cover in Thailand - Age 86

[New beginnings]

A friend planning to move permanently to Thailand has asked me to check possible medical cover for his father who may wish to come with him.  The father currently lives in the U.K. and therefore has always been covered by the NHS.  This will obviously cease to be the case if he moves permanently to Thailand.  Does anyone know of any company, possibly a specialist provider, within Thailand that may be able to consider such cover for an 86 year old.

[Sheryl]

No insurer based in Thailand covers at this age. There are some  internationally based expat policies that do, however.

 

 Cigna Global

Gloability Health - Essential plan

 

Cigna will cost less than Globality. No need to get outpatient cover, just inpatient and accepting a deductible (excess) will significantly lower premiums. Even so, at that age it will not come cheap.

 

Can get a quote online but be prepared to be pestered with sales phone calls if you do. If you want to avoid this enter "00000000" or "99999999" for phone number.

 

[Lamkyong]

i hope he has loads of dosh  even at 58  i was getting  quotes upward of 45.000 bht per month without preexisting 

[Sheryl]

Where on earth did you get a quote that high? Must have been a package inclusive of OPD (unnecessary) and with no deductible, and even then that is high.

 

Cigna rate for a 58 year old male = $3,022 a year with a $375 deductible and no copay,  $2,720 with a $750 deductible and no copay. Add various copay options and it comes down further. E.g: $2,176 with a 20% copay up to maximum out of pocket of $5,000. .

 

 

 

 

[New beginnings]

I must admit I wondered that myself.  I'm currently with BUPA Thailand platinum package.  Current premium 6200 bahts per month with annual 10% no claims bonus. Age 60.

[auntyedna]

Age-related inflation makes health insurance a no-brainer once you're over 60.  Best advice is to pay as you go, and use the public hospitals, not the private ones.  I stopped paying BUPA's annual premiums eight years ago and put the equivalent of that last 2009 premium in the bank each year.  Despite a 600k (private hospital) operation in 2012 , I am currently Baht1.1million in the black.  I will be using public hospitals from now on.  Some are better than others - I recommend the teaching hospitals.

[New beginnings]

I know what you mean Auntyedna.  But for me the comfort of having a card in my wallet confirming I am covered gives me peace of mind.  What if you are unconscious and hospital delay treatment whilst they check you are able to pay.  From my point of view I hope I will never have to claim and will still consider it money well spent.

[Kwasaki]

54 minutes ago, New beginnings said:

Does anyone know of any company, possibly a specialist provider, within Thailand that may be able to consider such cover for an 86 year old.

My Thai health cover because l starting paying before l was 70 does cover up to 80 but won't cover a recurring condition.

OP your friends pa at 86,   he could have some money put aside for treatment but if it was to turn out a long term thing best ship him back off to UK.

Personally at 86 l'd stay where l am.

[Sheryl]

39 minutes ago, auntyedna said:

Age-related inflation makes health insurance a no-brainer once you're over 60.  Best advice is to pay as you go, and use the public hospitals, not the private ones.  I stopped paying BUPA's annual premiums eight years ago and put the equivalent of that last 2009 premium in the bank each year.  Despite a 600k (private hospital) operation in 2012 , I am currently Baht1.1million in the black.  I will be using public hospitals from now on.  Some are better than others - I recommend the teaching hospitals.

 

And what will you do if you have a 2 million baht bill? As is entirely possible, even in a government hospital?

 

Or for that matter, a one million baht bill followed by other large bills?

 

And what would you have done if you had had a major hospital bill before your savings reached this level? You happen to have been lucky. There was no guarantee you would not have had a catastrophic accident or illness in 2010, when your savings were quite small.

 

One of the big problems with self-insuring, aside from the fact that people tend to underestimate maximum possible cost, is that once you spend it, it is gone. Hence not recommended unless you have a clear fall back plan e.g. ability to return to your home country once your savings are wiped out. Many people do not.

[banK]

5 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Where on earth did you get a quote that high? Must have been a package inclusive of OPD (unnecessary) and with no deductible, and even then that is high.

 

Cigna rate for a 58 year old male = $3,022 a year with a $375 deductible and no copay,  $2,720 with a $750 deductible and no copay. Add various copay options and it comes down further. E.g: $2,176 with a 20% copay up to maximum out of pocket of $5,000. .

 

 

 

 

 Is there a table of tariffs for Cigna for various ages, or do you need to get a quote online. 

 

Reason I ask is that this year's renewal I thought was quite a hike (28 percent), from age 68 to 69. I did ask them at the time and they said that it was due to "worldwide health cost increases".

 

I was somewhat skeptical to that reason due to my past history.

 

It went from 3139 gbp to 4039 gbp.

 

banK

[joebrown]

16 hours ago, Sheryl said:

No insurer based in Thailand covers at this age. There are some  internationally based expat policies that do, however.

 

 Cigna Global

Gloability Health - Essential plan

 

Cigna will cost less than Globality. No need to get outpatient cover, just inpatient and accepting a deductible (excess) will significantly lower premiums. Even so, at that age it will not come cheap.

 

Can get a quote online but be prepared to be pestered with sales phone calls if you do. If you want to avoid this enter "00000000" or "99999999" for phone number.

 

I'm not 100% sure, but I understood Pacific Cross insure people aged over 70 yrs. I believe their cover runs until age 90yrs. Might be worth giving them a try.

[maoro2013]

I'm 64. Just been knocked back for cover by Allianz.  I have had two recent medicals, everything perfect, blood pressure, heart, lungs, liver and kidney function, except for a slightly high cholesterol. Really don't know why, I know people with high blood pressure on all sorts of medication who are insured.

 

A previous poser mentioned a couple of options, I might try one of those.

[Farang99]

15 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

My Thai health cover because l starting paying before l was 70 does cover up to 80 but won't cover a recurring condition.

OP your friends pa at 86,   he could have some money put aside for treatment but if it was to turn out a long term thing best ship him back off to UK.

Personally at 86 l'd stay where l am.

If his father is out of the UK for more than one of the last 3 years he will not be eligible for treatment on the NHS.

[maoro2013]

1 minute ago, joebrown said:

I'm not 100% sure, but I understood Pacific Cross insure people aged over 70 yrs. I believe their cover runs until age 90yrs. Might be worth giving them a try.

Yes Pacific Prime do, I guess if successful medical and awareof pre existing conditions.

 

I got a quote from them, but happened to run into someone I know who is a rep for Allianz. Pacific Prime quoted for a package which looks exactly like the Allianz, in fact underwritten by Allianze at nearly double Allianz's price.

 

Have a carefull look around.

[Kwasaki]

59 minutes ago, Farang99 said:

If his father is out of the UK for more than one of the last 3 years he will not be eligible for treatment on the NHS.

That subject has been done to death, excuse the pun.

Scenario 86 year old man arrives unwell at UK hospital,  Nurse says sorry you will have to just go away and die.  Right. 

[shaurene]

Do your friend a favor, tell him toleave his father at home at 86 the heat, humidity and viruses will make him very unwell, 

he will not last long here. He has a chance if he is a super fit 86 yr old. His first encounter with a bar girl will finnish him off.

[MyFriend You]

17 hours ago, auntyedna said:

Age-related inflation makes health insurance a no-brainer once you're over 60.  Best advice is to pay as you go, and use the public hospitals, not the private ones.  I stopped paying BUPA's annual premiums eight years ago and put the equivalent of that last 2009 premium in the bank each year.  Despite a 600k (private hospital) operation in 2012 , I am currently Baht1.1million in the black.  I will be using public hospitals from now on.  Some are better than others - I recommend the teaching hospitals.

Great suggestion, I have private health due to the nature of my job, I need it, when I finally,  absolutely retire, I will make due with the teaching hospitals, I had my teeth cleaned for 300 baht in a dental school once, the Thai Smile places in Bangkok wanted between 1100-2400 baht.

[homisch]

Hi, I'm new here.

Maybe possible a Foreign travel health insurance. That may run for max one year.
He may have to return UK once the year and renew this insurance for one more year - or similar

homisch

[ujayujay]

34 minutes ago, shaurene said:

Do your friend a favor, tell him toleave his father at home at 86 the heat, humidity and viruses will make him very unwell, 

he will not last long here. He has a chance if he is a super fit 86 yr old. His first encounter with a bar girl will finnish him off.

Nonsense

[robertson468]

With, or without Medical Insurance, I would recommend the Public Hospitals and ask for a Private Ward.  It is far, far less expensive than the Private ones who principally are profit making organisations.  I don't blame them because that is the nature of business.  Likewise if you have to take medication, and you are attending a Private Hospital, ask for the prescription and take it to a pharmacy.........much less expensive

[RBOP]

I was able to get personal travel insurance for my 80 year old Mom who came for a 3 month visit. Company is International SOS . Very professional and fast assistance. made a claim when Mom fell out of bed and needed stiches. ISOS reimbursed the expenses no problem.

[wpcoe]

19 hours ago, Lamkyong said:

i hope he has loads of dosh  even at 58  i was getting  quotes upward of 45.000 bht per month without preexisting 

 

19 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Where on earth did you get a quote that high? Must have been a package inclusive of OPD (unnecessary) and with no deductible, and even then that is high.

 

Cigna rate for a 58 year old male = $3,022 a year with a $375 deductible and no copay,  $2,720 with a $750 deductible and no copay. Add various copay options and it comes down further. E.g: $2,176 with a 20% copay up to maximum out of pocket of $5,000. .

 

Even my BUPA B2-million policy with no OPD, no deductible, no copay last year at age 61 was billed as US$2400, or about B7,000/month.

[Suradit69]

19 hours ago, New beginnings said:

I must admit I wondered that myself.  I'm currently with BUPA Thailand platinum package.  Current premium 6200 bahts per month with annual 10% no claims bonus. Age 60.

And, I believe, with BUPA, you have to start coverage before 55 (??) and then not let coverage lapse in order to be able to renew annually as you get older. When I had BUPA before my pension-related medical coverage began, I noticed that their annual premiums listed in their brochure didn't even appear above age 65 or so. You would be at their mercy depending on your individual claims record.

 

As mentioned in an earlier post, coverage for outpatient care is uneconomic since the added premium was usually nearly equivalent to the maximum amount you'd be allowed to claim.  And of course the cost of continued prescription medicine purchases would not be covered.

 

 

 

[Sheryl]

14 hours ago, banK said:

 Is there a table of tariffs for Cigna for various ages, or do you need to get a quote online. 

 

Reason I ask is that this year's renewal I thought was quite a hike (28 percent), from age 68 to 69. I did ask them at the time and they said that it was due to "worldwide health cost increases".

 

I was somewhat skeptical to that reason due to my past history.

 

It went from 3139 gbp to 4039 gbp.

 

banK

 

You have to do it online. Not hard to do, though.

[Ashto]

1 hour ago, robertson468 said:

With, or without Medical Insurance, I would recommend the Public Hospitals and ask for a Private Ward.  It is far, far less expensive than the Private ones who principally are profit making organisations.  I don't blame them because that is the nature of business.  Likewise if you have to take medication, and you are attending a Private Hospital, ask for the prescription and take it to a pharmacy.........much less expensive

I've found the discussion very helpful, thanks to all. On the question of using public rather than private hospitals, can anyone suggest good public hospitals in central Bangkok, ie within a few kilometres of Sathorn?

[Sheryl]

Chulalongkhorn, hands down. Rama IV road near Rajadamri.

 

There is an after hours clinic on the 13th floor of the OPD building where you can see specialists by appointment, only a couple hundred baht more than the very crowded public channel and well worth it. It runs from about 4 PM onward and also Saturday mornings.

 

You cannot, however, make appointments other than in person.  And even the after hours clinic, is  crowded. But nowhere near as bad as the public channel plus you can directly access a senior doctor rather than having to run a gauntlet of medical students and interns first.

[RBOP]

4 minutes ago, Ashto said:

I've found the discussion very helpful, thanks to all. On the question of using public rather than private hospitals, can anyone suggest good public hospitals in central Bangkok, ie within a few kilometres of Sathorn?

Chulalongkorn,  its at the corner of Sathorn and Rama IV. 

[Ashto]

28 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Chulalongkhorn, hands down. Rama IV road near Rajadamri.

 

There is an after hours clinic on the 13th floor of the OPD building where you can see specialists by appointment, only a couple hundred baht more than the very crowded public channel and well worth it. It runs from about 4 PM onward and also Saturday mornings.

 

You cannot, however, make appointments other than in person.  And even the after hours clinic, is  crowded. But nowhere near as bad as the public channel plus you can directly access a senior doctor rather than having to run a gauntlet of medical students and interns first.

Thanks, much appreciated. 

[Lamkyong]

sorry mis info got it all wrong

[bazza73]

19 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

One of the big problems with self-insuring, aside from the fact that people tend to underestimate maximum possible cost, is that once you spend it, it is gone. Hence not recommended unless you have a clear fall back plan e.g. ability to return to your home country once your savings are wiped out. Many people do not.

It's a gamble, as many things in life are.

Rajavej charges 4000 baht a day for a private room. I have 500,000 baht put aside for medical emergencies, which means I'm covered for 4 months. I doubt anyone could stay in a hospital for four months without either dying there, or getting the hell out.

My fallback is to get on a flight to Australia, assuming I can. I've kept on paying for private health cover there, so as soon as I get off the plane in Australia my hospital costs are zero.

IMHO the cost of cover for the over-seventies here is unrealistic. I'm willing to bet the actuaries and bean counters of the health funds offering cover have banded together to set premiums at the highest  level in order to maximize profit on the demographic. Greedy bastards.

Paying premiums of 250,000 baht a year is dead money. Once you spend it, it is gone. At least with self-insurance, you lose nothing until the medical event arrives. Which may be never.