Is there a big drop in number of foreigners living in Chiang Mai

[mjakob007]

Friends in Chiang Mai seem to think, there is a big drop in foreigners living in Chiang Mai, leading to many good condos now being vacant.

Or is it the sheer number of new condos that has outweighed the demand from tenants?

 

Talking to some friends, their argument was there are many more guest houses and less tourists.

My thought is, neither of above should have an impact on condo occupancy, as tourists are not potential tenants in condos.

 

Have you seen a change in occupancy in the condos you live or know?

 

 

 

 

[Bill97]

No change in the condo I live in.

[thaibeachlovers]

I wouldn't be surprised if some have given up and gone home. Count me in their number. LOS just ain't the place it used to be and immigration are clearly making it more difficult to live in Thailand. Just read a few of the topics on other sub forums about it if in doubt.

[Sparkles]

I doubt many have gone home.Forget about condo occupation.The amount of condos  and moobans has doubled in the last few years

 

Sometimes going to Makro or Tops at KSK I wonder where all the foreigners have come from. 10 years ago you would see a few, now dozens.

 

I dont believe there is any where reliable to get figs but for me the foreigner population has taken a huge lift and still rising.Go to the foreigner related fb pages restaurants etc its teaming with new arrivals.

 

CM is being promoted heavily OS as the "perfect retirement destination" which we all know its not but neither are our home countries a good place to be in the current environment

[pgrahmm]

I think they've spread out....I'm seeing farangs in places where, at one time I was one of the very few, if not the only....

 

The same with businesses aimed at farangs.....They are getting much more plentiful in outlying areas....And farangs walking about - not in tourist areas & not around a shopping destination....

CM city has gotten less & less user friendly over the past few years....

 

Seems anyone serious about staying beyond holidays (living here), has moved away from the city center in droves....

 

I avoid the moat/inner city area now....

 

Everything our family needs is available without venturing into town.....

Edited June 4, 2017 by pgrahmm

[HullyGully]

Probably the only people who know the facts are Immigration

 

They will know province by province

 

My general feel is its down

[Rhys]

...did the massage businesses get raided or closed down by TOT?

[fatdrunkandstupid]

Yes there has been a mass exodus of expats from Chiang Mai.  The bulk of them have relocated to Phuket in anticipation of using the light rail system that will run from top to bottom of the island and will be entirely completed in just 23 months from now.

[sfokevin]

^^^ But the government has already approved funding for the Chiang Mai Monorail!

 

http://www.chiangmaicitylife.com/news/the-chiang-mai-monorail-a-dream-come-true-looks-like-it/

[fatdrunkandstupid]

1 minute ago, sfokevin said:

^^^ But the government has already approved funding for the Chiang Mai Monorail!

 

http://www.chiangmaicitylife.com/news/the-chiang-mai-monorail-a-dream-come-true-looks-like-it/

That project will never move forward because the funds will be stolen.

 

The Phuket light rail, in contrast, is to be funded from donations by local taxi drivers.

[anto]

My experience living here in the Suburbs of Chiang mai for the last 8 years is that yes there has been a mass migration of Farangs out of here .A lot of young English teachers especially .Also retirees if the nearly always empty number one bar in town is anything to go by .It used to be full of Aussie old times daily in the past .

[whimsy]

2 hours ago, Rhys said:

...did the massage businesses get raided or closed down by TOT?

Raided by the phone company? No. 

[worgeordie]

Farangs are been replaced by Chinese,Koreans,and other Asians,not so much

as retirees ,but to operate businesses.

 

Condominiums,are sprouting up like mushrooms,far exceeding demand , I think,

unless they are building them,in the hope that Bangkok will sink faster than anticipated ,

and that the population will have to move to the higher ground of Chiang  Mai.

 

If the number of Farangs posting on ThaiVisa is anything to go by ,then I would say 

there are a lot less Farangs here.

regards worgeordie

[mduras01]

Visa rules tightening, other countries nearby modernizing--vietnam is certainly way better than it was 10 years ago--I think it's more of a spread into SE Asia as options become more readily available? I have seen more Koreans, Chinese and Japanese in my building. A lot less foreigners.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[rogeroc]

I was pretty permanent in CM but will be a rare visitor from now on,  I know others like me. 

[orang37]

The Monorail will be completed on schedule, but will run only one-way; this was stipulated in the agreement with the songthaew and tuk-tuk tongs and the Rattabaan that finally got the project moving. There will only be one stop: the end of the line.

 

TOT is busy fining, and even closing, massage parlours that have not signed-up for hi-speed internet.

 

Lots of farang leaving our lovely home ?  I am not sure about this, but, I believe the relative percentage of expat zombies in the cohort is rising.

 

"And, I think to myself: what a wonderful world."  (song by Thiele and Weiss, artist Louis Armstrong)

 

Wonderful World

[balo]

Several digital nomads that used to have CM as a base have left , they have relocated south or to another country with less strict visa rules like Cambodia. 

On one of the big Facebook groups for  CM there's a moving sale almost daily, 

 So I think it's safe to say that the numbers has gone down , especially among the younger people. 

[humqdpf]

9 hours ago, anto said:

My experience living here in the Suburbs of Chiang mai for the last 8 years is that yes there has been a mass migration of Farangs out of here .A lot of young English teachers especially .Also retirees if the nearly always empty number one bar in town is anything to go by .It used to be full of Aussie old times daily in the past .

I don't think that it is just Chiang Mai - anyone who was doing a bit of English teaching on the side to make end meet has given up. Many of those too young for a retirement visa have moved on, some to Cambodia. When you go to a Thai consulate in a neighbouring country, the vast majority queueing up are either tourists on a package tour or Asean or Asian tourists. As the songs says, times they are a-changing.

[dotpoom]

15 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I wouldn't be surprised if some have given up and gone home. Count me in their number. LOS just ain't the place it used to be and immigration are clearly making it more difficult to live in Thailand. Just read a few of the topics on other sub forums about it if in doubt.

I agree LOS doesn't seem like the place it used to be.

When I first came here it was a time before the "mobile phone" and I firmly believe thst is the root of the problem.

   I used to walk along a Soi and all these ladied would try to make conversation with you and then go into a titter together with the hand jumping up to cover their mouth ( the hand thing which I never understood the reason for has stopped now and only the celibrities on Television all over the world seem to have taken it up).

  You would see the ladies sitting at their work or in the Soi fanning themselves with their fans and chatting away to each other......all gone now.

  Now all you see are people imeressed in their own world whether they are out with family or friends.

     The fun and joy of Thailand no longer exists......Mobile Phone addiction has taken over.

PS. When the first mobiles ( cell) phones first started to appear on the scene a scam started up for the ladies. Very few had a phone so when they would meet a "punter" they would tell him they really like him and would love to see and hear from him again. " Sure thing" baby he would say......I ' ll give you a call......"Sorry teerak" she would say, I no have phone". So of course some guys would buy her a phone to contact her.

  I had a G/F who's daughter had about 12 phones. She used to sell them on.

 

Edited June 5, 2017 by dotpoom

[DGS1244]

This is the quite season when many ex-pats relocate during the rainy times, they will be back later in the year.

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

Down from what ? It is not down from 10 years ago but it maybe down from recent highs.

 

For those who blame the country I think it is better to look at other reasons as well. Many Brits and Russians is struggling with weak currencies. For the old style visa runners the stricter implementation of old existing visa regulations came as a blow. An important reason is also that people have many choices and like to stay in different places to get the T shirt.

[AlfonsV]

I agree it depends on the expat's age and the purpose to stay here. However, I never would move to Phuket.

[ujayujay]

All around Thailand the property business is eroding.  Westerners go, sell her Condos/ Houses. Same time even more villages will be built. Think, is a Moneyloundring thing, so this propertys not have to be rent out. 

Wondering about the price stability, think, is a bubble, that bursts soon.

[Winkburn]

Wow less expats is surely a good thing. I think demand for good quality established condo's near River are still very sought after. The new dog boxes without any view will always be difficult to sell. Great potential with the future rail and cooler climate will always attract. I think the level of expats has increased maybe tourist numbers are down. 12  month Visa for retirement or marriage easy to obtain.

Iv'e lived between here and Australia for the last 8 fabulous years and don't tell too many people how good it is here as we have enough Farangs

[connda]

Here's a reality check: Go to Chiang Mai immigration at the Promenade.  Can you get in line a 7am in order to process your visa?  Or do you have to get there at 3am?  2am? 1am?
There's your answer.

 

[steven100]

20 hours ago, mjakob007 said:

Friends in Chiang Mai seem to think, there is a big drop in foreigners living in Chiang Mai,

I think your friends need to try to go out more than just Sunday ....

[NancyL]

According to the officer who processes retirement extensions at CM Immigration, the number of retirement extensions for CM province has been down for the past two years.  I haven't seen exact numbers, but this is something he has told several people.  And yes, it explains why it's very common now to be able to show up at Promenada at 7 am and not be turned away in getting a queue ticket for a retirement (or marriage) extension that day.

 

However, the number of new members joining CM Expats Club, basically an English-speaking retirees group, continues to be high.  The demographics of the new members is very different than the new members of 5 - 6 years ago.  Many more expat-expat couples and w-a-y more Aussies, with very few Brits coming in as new retirees.  Americans continue at about the same percentage -- a little under half of the new members.  

 

The Aussies are much more likely to split their time between Oz and Thailand throughout the year than the U.K. and North American retirees.  Many Aussies come here using tourist visas, esp. the new multi-entry tourist visas.  Also, the newly arrived of all nationalties are much more likely to purchase a car and rent a house outside the city center than the newly arrived of a few years ago.  So, that may explain why the Old City and the Nimman/Huey Kaew area has been given over to Chinese tourists and not so many elderly expat retirees as in the past.

[AlfonsV]

4 minutes ago, NancyL said:

According to the officer who processes retirement extensions at CM Immigration, the number of retirement extensions for CM province has been down for the past two years.

Also a result of new opened immigration offices in neighbor provinces?? Or because people are more bored or aware about the air pollution??

[NancyL]

8 minutes ago, AlfonsV said:

Also a result of new opened immigration offices in neighbor provinces?? Or because people are more bored or aware about the air pollution??

They were starting to see a drop even before the immigration offices opened in the neighboring provinces, but these new offices have definitely accelerated the trend.

 

Other factors could be that newly arrived "retirees", esp. Australians are actually here seasonally using multi-entry tourist visas and other new arrivals are doing their research and obtaining O-A visas in their home countries before coming here.  I know that during the years I was president of CEC (2014 thru Jan 2017), I fielded several emails weekly from people considering retirement and I strongly encouraged the retiree wannabes to obtain the appropriate visa BEFORE coming to CM.

 

For a time, in late 2014 - mid 2015 it wasn't possible to do a "visa conversation" in CM province and after the practice was re-instated, CM Immigration has made the process so opaque and difficult that most new arrivals who turn up with just a 30 day stamp or a single-entry tourist visa end up hiring a visa agent to "convert" to retirement visa extension and find that their fee is higher than if they'd applied for the O-A visa in their home country.  Properly used, an O-A visa has two years of life -- two years where someone's only contact with CM Immigration is for 90 day reports and to obtain re-entry permits during the second year.  So far, both those processes are a doodle.

 

 

[fatdrunkandstupid]

17 hours ago, pgrahmm said:

I think they've spread out....I'm seeing farangs in places where, at one time I was one of the very few, if not the only....

 

The same with businesses aimed at farangs.....They are getting much more plentiful in outlying areas....And farangs walking about - not in tourist areas & not around a shopping destination....

CM city has gotten less & less user friendly over the past few years....

 

Seems anyone serious about staying beyond holidays (living here), has moved away from the city center in droves....

 

I avoid the moat/inner city area now....

 

Everything our family needs is available without venturing into town.....

Interesting strategy.  Living in a city that you take pride in avoiding.