UK voters should make final Brexit decision if talks with EU collapse: poll

[adammike]

4 hours ago, bomber said:

add BMW,nissan,toyota,JL and the best part of 14000 Airbus jobs to the list and theres another 80k,never mind there will be plenty of work tattie picking in Lincolnshire

Spud bashing is what it was known as in Kent when I was a boy,horrible when it was wet and muddy.

[BwindiBoy]

42 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Brexiteers are notoriously bad at history... even recent..... or just good at ignoring it??

Also some still seem to think they all voted for the same Brexit or the one in the referendum s

Anyway, here's a list of remarks that Brexit leaders have come up with over the last couple of years........ how things have changed!!!!

https://www.indy100.com/article/brexit-deal-lates-quotes-liam-fox-theresa-may-nigel-farage-eu-michael-gove-8636801?fbclid=IwAR1zY5htFtWjxF-30Q0mX0HW6bcAOibqavqnDhQz_5otkEUh3nPbyOi5V10

And Remainers all voted for the same version of "Remain"?  They ALL want a federal Europe, with diminishing individual state powers, and a European army?  Why do you hate it so much that the UK people are confident enough to choose independence?

[bristolboy]

Just now, BwindiBoy said:

And Remainers all voted for the same version of "Remain"?  They ALL want a federal Europe, with diminishing individual state powers, and a European army?  Why do you hate it so much that the UK people are confident enough to choose independence?

What are you on about? How does it make sense to talk about different versions of remain? Remain was the status quo.

[bomber]

48 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

There would be many problems for Italy. Debt in Euro and having to pay back with a deeply discounted Lira. It would be a disaster for them on a scale far worse than the UK. 

good point,it would be even worse than i imagined,so it wont be happening anytime soon,bookies only give 2-1 on it happening,should be more like 102-1

[Jack100]

Would it be naïve of me to think that after Brexit , if the  jolly French customs  man at the port or aiport has a bad day ( wine hangover )  - the Italian , German and Dutch papers will go to the top of his pile and the UK papers well ....will not . ?

[bristolboy]

4 minutes ago, Jack100 said:

Would it be naïve of me to think that after Brexit , if the  jolly French customs  man at the port or aiport has a bad day ( wine hangover )  - the Italian , German and Dutch papers will go to the top of his pile and the UK papers well ....will not . ?

It would have to be a really bad hangover for that jolly Frenchman not to recall that Italy, Germany, and the Netherlands are in a free trade zone with France thanks to the EU.

[bomber]

14 minutes ago, BwindiBoy said:

And Remainers all voted for the same version of "Remain"?  They ALL want a federal Europe, with diminishing individual state powers, and a European army?  Why do you hate it so much that the UK people are confident enough to choose independence?

european army has to be better than following the US into illegal,expensive wars

[My Thai Life]

6 minutes ago, Jack100 said:

Would it be naïve of me to think that after Brexit , if the  jolly French customs  man at the port or aiport has a bad day ( wine hangover )  - the Italian , German and Dutch papers will go to the top of his pile and the UK papers well ....will not . ?

Yes it would be extremely naive. The Germans, Dutch and Italians tend not to export to France via Calais.

[Grouse]

4 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

yes, she does

 

How come TM has changed from Brexit means Brexit to you can choose: my deal/no deal/no Brexit?

 

By being shrewd

[BwindiBoy]

19 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

What are you on about? How does it make sense to talk about different versions of remain? Remain was the status quo.

Wow, I never had you down as being so naïve.

 

That "status quo" is not certain - what the E.U. looks like today is not what it will look like in the future, and each of us (including you Remainers) will have a different idea and expectation of what that future would look like.

 

So "what I'm on about" is that the post I was responding to shouldn't cherry pick and focus on Leave, because the same argument applies to Remain.

[Grouse]

4 hours ago, My Thai Life said:

There is no "no brexit" option

Tusk said so a couple of days ago. I'll get a reference 

[mommysboy]

What a week! It's difficult to take it all in.

 

I think the 'Gove gang' are deluded to think that we can go back and negotiate a better deal.  There's no point wasting precious time.  Let's get the deal before Parliament asap.

 

For me, inevitably, this comes down to WTO deal or no Brexit.  I'd be happy with either but I doubt we have a good enough government to steer us through the former.

 

[Grouse]

4 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

I find this a VERY  baba bobo comment.'

 

For clarity, referendums in the UK are advisory only and that is why a super majority was not specified 

 

IF some kind of special referendum was called for, say abolition of the monarchy, then a super majority would be required; probably 67% of the electorate.

 

In future elections, I want some simple tests of sanity and cognition before being declared fit to vote. This has been a real eye opener to me. UK education must be abysmal.

[bomber]

5 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

What a week! It's difficult to take it all in.

 

I think the 'Gove gang' are deluded to think that we can go back and negotiate a better deal.  There's no point wasting precious time.  Let's get the deal before Parliament asap.

 

For me, inevitably, this comes down to WTO deal or no Brexit.  I'd be happy with either but I doubt we have a good enough government to steer us through the former.

 

a better deal is not possible,how can the gove gang do better? total waste of time to even sit at the same table.it was always going to be damage limitation and that is how its turned out,thanks brexit boys and girls and how many of you wanted JC and his Labour morons,cos that is what you have delivered to the british people.

[Grouse]

4 hours ago, vogie said:

Just out of interest was that more than the electorate that voted to remain?

 

Shudda, wudda, cudda.

It was advisory only FACT. Regardless of what anyone said. That is WHY a supermajority was not specified. It was not a mistake (unlike the whole idea which was undeniably a mistake to put it politely)

[Johnyo]

a better deal is not possible,how can the gove gang do better? total waste of time to even sit at the same table.it was always going to be damage limitation and that is how its turned out,thanks brexit boys and girls and how many of you wanted JC and his Labour morons,cos that is what you have delivered to the british people.

Brexit deal: take it or leave it, EU tells Britain
EU member states collectively rule out any redrafting of withdrawal agreement. There were also moves to toughen demands on the UK in the political declaration in terms of the trade-off between access to British waters for EU fishing fleets and UK firms’ ability to sell fish into the European market.

A section on the “level playing field” requirements of the UK is also likely to be strengthened, with calls for “dynamic alignment” with a host of Brussels regulations, to reassure EU member states that Britain will not enjoy a competitive advantage from a future deal,

So it's official the UK will not enjoy a better deal than they currently have, so it's "mays way" or no brexit unless you want to crash the economy completely. Even the most idiotic brexiters can see that fact, so I suspect Mays deal will get the support, and the brexiters will get BINO.

A crap deal for remainers, and an even crappier deal for brexiters.

Lucky they needed us more than we needed them, Prosecco, Mercedes and Brexit unicorns.


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[bomber]

4 minutes ago, Grouse said:

For clarity, referendums in the UK are advisory only and that is why a super majority was not specified 

 

IF some kind of special referendum was called for, say abolition of the monarchy, then a super majority would be required; probably 67% of the electorate.

 

In future elections, I want some simple tests of sanity and cognition before being declared fit to vote. This has been a real eye opener to me. UK education must be abysmal.

a poll did state something like 67% of leave voters were lets say not very bright,what did it for them was OAPs,benefit scroungers and the wetherspoons british is best brigade.folks like this 

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 hours ago, vinny41 said:

NO it doesn't provide a link where the EU allows each country to have a remain or leave vote every 5 years

What the heck is “it” and what is “a link where the EU allows each country to have a remain or leave vote every 5 years”? 

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 hours ago, vinny41 said:

NO it doesn't provide a link where the EU allows each country to have a remain or leave vote every 5 years

What the heck is “it” and what is “a link where the EU allows each country to have a remain or leave vote every 5 years”? 

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 hours ago, vinny41 said:

NO it doesn't provide a link where the EU allows each country to have a remain or leave vote every 5 years

What the heck is “it” and what is “a link where the EU allows each country to have a remain or leave vote every 5 years”? 

[My Thai Life]

4 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

How come TM has changed from Brexit means Brexit to you can choose: my deal/no deal/no Brexit?

Personally, I don't read too much into it because official policy of both parties is to respect the result of the referendum, not to hold a 2nd referendum, and not to revoke A50.

 

My view is that she is trying to "bounce" Tory MPs to support her deal, and it reflects her increasing desperation. Chequers was constructed without discussion with her cabinet and this statement was too. Actually, this statement is so bizarre and disconnected from policy that I have to wonder if she meant to say it at all, or just got her words mixed up in the parley.

 

However, what this bizarre statement does seem to have done is to increase the likelihood of a change of Tory leadership, which would bring a Leaver into power. Next week in Westminster will be interesting.

[rixalex]

Yah, because under a different leadership Ireland wouldn’t have been an EU member, and Northern Ireland wouldn’t have been part of the UK. 
 
Truth is: The Ireland issue exists much longer than the word Brexit. So everyone who voted for Brexit knew exactly that he was voting for what is on the table now: a hard border in Ireland or a soft Brexit to prevent such. There’s nothing in between. So, yes, the people got you into this mess. 

Nonsense. If the EU insists there has to be a hard border, let THEM organise it. Like that's going to happen. It's brinksmanship, like everything the EU has been doing throughout the negotiations. The we-are-not-worthy Europhile remainers lap it up though, every time.

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[Grouse]

4 hours ago, vogie said:

The people have had their vote, I think you are referring to the Losers Vote, hope this help you on this post and future posts.

Even the "government" refers to The People's Vote.

 

Personally, I am against any referendums. I wouldn't ask the population anything except what they are for breakfast.

 

Referendums are for the population to ratify (rubber stamp) decisions already taken by grown ups. [ it gives them a nice warm feeling like wetting their trousers]

[vogie]

6 minutes ago, Grouse said:

It was advisory only FACT. Regardless of what anyone said. That is WHY a supermajority was not specified. It was not a mistake (unlike the whole idea which was undeniably a mistake to put it politely)

It was only advisory in your world and others in denial, but in reality we all know it was voted for by Parliament and on the leaflet it stated that the Government "will implement whatever you decide" 

I know in grouse world that nothing appears as other people see things, and I know you'll never face reality.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, rixalex said:

Nonsense. If the EU insists there has to be a hard border, let THEM organise it. Like that's going to happen. It's brinksmanship, like everything the EU has been doing throughout the negotiations. The we-are-not-worthy Europhile remainers lap it up though, every time.

EU controlling it's borders and UK not controlling it's borders. Is this what the famous 'Taking back control?' slogan was all about? 

[welovesundaysatspace]

4 minutes ago, rixalex said:

 

Nonsense. If the EU insists there has to be a hard border, let THEM organise it. Like that's going to happen. It's brinksmanship, like everything the EU has been doing throughout the negotiations. The we-are-not-worthy Europhile remainers lap it up though, every time.

Sent from my SM-G610F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

It’s not nonsense. Ireland is not an EU issue. It’s an Irish issue that started well before Brexit. But the creation of the EU was a crucial pillar for reaching peace there, because it enabled free movement of goods and people. So, again, of course everyone voting for Brexit knew that he was voting for what you have now. 

Edited November 18, 2018 by welovesundaysatspace

[Grouse]

4 hours ago, vinny41 said:

It will be interesting try to sell Remain on a No rebate, No opt outs, Adopt the Euro, EU Army,  Accept anything that the EU says

The remain camp have shown their cards to the EU  

I suspect we can indeed have the status quo ante 

[vogie]

9 minutes ago, bomber said:

a poll did state something like 67% of leave voters were lets say not very bright,what did it for them was OAPs,benefit scroungers and the wetherspoons british is best brigade.folks like this 

What a stupid ignorant arrogant comment, but it does say a lot about you.

[kwilco]

1 hour ago, BwindiBoy said:

And Remainers all voted for the same version of "Remain"?  They ALL want a federal Europe, with diminishing individual state powers, and a European army?  Why do you hate it so much that the UK people are confident enough to choose indepece?

You may not have noticed but we were already in the EU........  we ALl voted to stay. We knew exactly where we were.

[BwindiBoy]

Just now, kwilco said:

You may not have noticed but we were already in the EU........  we ALl voted to stay. We knew exactly where we were.

But not where you WOULD be heading!