My foreign fiancé keeps saying that he is buying me from my parents

[bbi1]

2 minutes ago, simon43 said:

You studied in Europe, yet you write using USA spelling ==> 'apologize', 'organize' etc.  

 

Hmm.....

Europeans don't speak English in their countries too and I'd imagine that classes in their universities also wouldn't be in English. Only people in the UK do that.

[JimmyJ]

I'd like to suggest that the next ghost make an entrance as the other half of one of these recent posters.

 

Give us the other side of the story.

[NCC1701A]

so why is TV feeding us these fairy tales? Is it a exercise to prevent dementia?

Edited January 16, 2019 by NCC1701A

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, hhdoob said:

I don't need to prove anything to anyone here. But I will just take this as compliment. 

ohoohhh Thais don't speak or write like that..... always 2 versions to a story, what is it exactly???

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, Nyezhov said:

Please read my post, Id say very probable. So maybe folks should cut the girl a break. If "she" is a troll, she is a good enough imitation to deserve it ????

maybe it's a HE ????

[Mavideol]

1 hour ago, hhdoob said:

Thanks for all the comments. I guess I'd better just seriously talk to him again that I am truly offended by what he said and hope for the best. I just want to work this out with him and focus on this pregnancy and the baby coming. I have no plan to terminate it, as I believe I do have a decent job, a condo, a car and a safe environment for raising a child. 

 

It is very true what someone has said before that the concept of sin sod does not translate well into western cultures. And just because we both speak English (English are not native language for both of us), it does not mean that we always understand each other. Sometimes, he does not want to bring this up, as he doesnt want to upset me and stress me out at this moment. While I have trouble letting go and ending the fight too, but ll try better anyway. 

 

No need for endless off topic debate. Topic is closed. Thanks. 

that's my girl.....55555

[from the home of CC]

32 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

so why is TV feeding us these fairy tales? Is it a exercise to prevent dementia?

look at the response #'s, it's all about the benjamins

[Nyezhov]

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

 

So sorry to have offended your highly PC sensibilities. As a man with full possession of my masculine nature, I have zero regard for the extraordinary weakness of society, in it's ever incessant demand for correct terminology, and it's constant attempt to not have it's paper thin skin ruffled. Just not who I am, thank you very much. The term high functioning woman is a compliment. The term high functioning man would be too. His woman? Yes, his woman. Is he her man? Of course he is. We are not talking about possession in the form of slavery. We are talking about a term of affection. Grow some thicker skin, please. 

 

Did you see the Gillette ad? I'll bet you liked what they had to say about toxic masculinity. 

Oh dude trust me it doesnt offend me in the slightest. Only snowflakes and TDSers get offended. But hey, Im so sorry to have offended your manly manliness with your prehistoric comments that you seek to backtrack. Term of affection indeed LOL.

 

 

[Nyezhov]

1 hour ago, poohy said:

Never mind this girl and her problems what concerns me more, is you stated you are educated but according to your icon you are a Millwall supporter ????

(before panties get twisted its called humour) 

I like Millwall because of their Motto. Im a Yank, therefore I am Man U!

[totally thaied up]

Too many posts like this recently. For a girl that was this educated, a 500,000 baht Sin Sod and house would have been asked for. If It was true what was written, the problem was her getting pregnant to some guy that has no real understanding about Thai culture. By the sounds of it, he is just too young for her. 

 

The family would lose too much Face and that what all this Sin Sod BS is about. 100,000 baht Sin Sod for a girl of such education? Bar Girls can get more than that off some silly old guy!

 

If this was all true, she needs to have a serious talk about the future and he better get a better realization with Thai culture or this will end in tears in the future.

 

 

Edited January 16, 2019 by totally thaied up

[Odin Norway]

2 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

 

A couple of points here:

 

1. it sounds like your fiance is clearly not financially capable of supporting a family right now, much less funding a wedding  / sin sod, etc....  But then, based on what you wrote, that should be no surprise to you, as you seem to have been pretty clear on his personal situation.

 

2. Sin sod, despite perhaps being common here, is a totally foreign thing to westerners. We simply don't do that in the west, no tradition of that at all. So that's what leads, probably insensitively on his part, to the poor jokes re buying you off your family. Really, the issue of sin sod is something you and he should have discussed and come to some agreement on BEFORE deciding to pursue marriage.

 

3. I can't help but feel here like really the ONLY reason the two of you are actually considering marriage right now is because of the coming baby... And that's unfortunate. Do you want to have a baby now? Are you capable of being a mother now? And how's being a new mother likely to affect your career future plans and abilities?  Depending on the answers to those questions, perhaps you might consider terminating the pregnancy either inside Thailand if allowed or outside Thailand if necessary. And put off marriage until both you and any future husband are in a better place for making a marriage and family. (That doesn't mean, necessarily though, that you'd have to break up with this guy...)

 

But overall, it really doesn't sound like this is the right time and circumstance for the two of you to get married, and I didn't really read much in your comments explaining why the two of you ought to be married at all!!!

 

And if both you and your family and he are so tight on money, then why planning the very large guest list wedding and making an already strained situation even more difficult? For face and for your parents to show their friends and relations that you grabbed a wealthy farang husband (even though it sounds like he's piss poor...)

 

It seems there's a lot of common sense and good judgment lacking here.

 

 

Sorry mate. You are adding sense to the situation are you not. Big mistake ????

[spidermike007]

38 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Oh dude trust me it doesnt offend me in the slightest. Only snowflakes and TDSers get offended. But hey, Im so sorry to have offended your manly manliness with your prehistoric comments that you seek to backtrack. Term of affection indeed LOL.

 

 

 

That is cute. No point in beating this fairly dead horse too much. I appreciate your lack of sensitivity. Says you are a man! And I consider my comments to be very contemporary. Actually, rather a badge of honor, in this day and age of weakness, spurned by extreme emasculation, required by most Western woman, combined with the battle against masculinity (and some abuse, I do believe that) being waged by the Me Too movement, and Gillette. Not backtracking in the slightest. I own my statements. Stand by them 110%! And I love having the ability to embrace my masculinity, and having made the choice to remain a man, in this world of toning down manhood, at all costs. Just brothers fighting the righteous fight. 

[Sheryl]

3 hours ago, hhdoob said:

Thanks for all the comments. I guess I'd better just seriously talk to him again that I am truly offended by what he said and hope for the best. ....

You need to discuss a whole lot more than just the sin sod.

 

There is the matter of the entire wedding and why it is being done the way it is, costing what it will. I know this is all normal for Thailand but it is completely not normal for a Westerner. In the West, a couple has pretty much a wide open set of options for what sort of wedding to have, and are expected to jointly decide on it and keep it within their budget. It is not at all unusual to be as small as just say 10 people or even less. It is certainly never the case that every single distant relative, coworker, friend, and coworker/friend of every relative will be invited. One of the nicest werddings I ever went to consisted of onl ythe briede and groom plus the 2 witnesses required by law followed by a dinner with about 6 friends. Not a single relative present.

 

Obviously nothing like that is possible in Thailand, it would be considered scandalous, but your finance may not really understand this and even if he has sort of realized it, you need to understand that what is taking shape is probably a very long way from anything he had in mind and that it doesn't make sense to him. He may also feel marginalized or excluded from the decision making, as if his preferences and his culture did nto matter to anyone.

 

It might help for him to hear something from you to the effect of "I know all of this seems unnecessarily expensive  and strange to you and that it is not the sort of wedding you would have wanted. But in Thai culture, weddings have to follow a very set formula and the  bride and groom don't really have mush say in it. This is my culture, I need to be able to live in it and I don't want to humiliate my family in any way so I really need you to understand and go along with it"  or something to that effect.

 

And then there is the really big issue - the unplanned pregnancy. He must have all sorts of feelings about that as well, and together with the traditional Thai wedding that is shaping up,  he may feel powerless and like he is being steam-rollered, and that may explain why some hurtful comments at time.

 

There is probably a lot more under the surface here and it is not a good idea to avoid it. You need to hash it all out with him, now, frankly and try to understand things from his point of view while also explaining your own point of view to him.

 

Compromise is essential in all marriages but most especially in cross-cultural ones and it is also essential that each party be prepared to accept the other's culture non-judgmentally without considering it "wrong" just because it is very different.

 

While I do think from what you say that he ought to have more understanding of Thai culture  than he seems to, I also get the sense of an attitude on your part that "the Thai way is the right way and he should accept it" and that attitude is not very respectful of him or his culture.

 

Frankly if it were not for the baby I too would advice putting the wedding off for now, but I do understand it is not possible for a respectable Thai woman to have a baby out of wedlock so you really need to work on this.

 

There are some counselling services in Bangkok that have both Thai and Western counselors and experience working with the issues that arise in cross-cultural marriages. I realize money is tight but this might be an investment very well worth making.

www.psiadmin.com/

https://www.bangkokcounsellingservice.com/

 

Believe me, if you don't start working on the cross-cultural and communication issues (they are intertwined) now it will only get worse. Just as you had a lot of assumptions about what would naturally be part of a wedding and he had entirely different ones, there are innumerable assumptions you each have about being parents and raising a child, as well as about married life in general, that will often  be worlds apart.

 

 

 

 

 

[bbi1]

3 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Frankly if it were not for the baby I too would advice putting the wedding off for now, but I do understand it is not possible for a respectable Thai woman to have a baby out of wedlock so you really need to work on this.

So does that mean if a Thai woman has a baby out of wedlock then they are not respectable? Does that mean no sin sod would be paid then?

[observer90210]

OP should apply for a post as english teacher as "her"  ???? lexical and syntax are perfect for the job and the 100K would soon be earned !!

[totally thaied up]

19 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

But in Thai culture, weddings have to follow a very set formula and the  bride and groom don't really have mush say in it. This is my culture, I need to be able to live in it and I don't want to humiliate my family in any way so I really need you to understand and go along with it"  or something to that effect.

I have seen several Ampur Weddings now between foreigners (myself included), that did not have Sin Sod or a need for a crazy expensive wedding party. Just a meal with the family and a baht of gold given to the mother. If you have a half decent family and can sit down with the Family and explain why this is not going to happen and all are willing to understand you have better things to put your money down on, Thai families will listen.

 

In the last 10 years, I have been to 4 weddings at the Amphur for foreign friends. No Sin Sods were paid but most gave the parents a baht of gold as a gift. Like I said, if you have a halfway decent Thai family, sitting down and talking about all of this is pretty easy to do. If they want to project Face 'just for Face value', you need to talk about that as compromises on both sides need to be in order - just not for the Thais. My Mother-in-Law wanted a big party as she is Chinese and wanted to show big Face. In the end, I showed her renovated building plans for her daughter's house with the proceeds of what money I would have spent on a Wedding and she saw this as a much better way of showing face longterm. As I said, compromises on both sides must be made and by the sounds of it, her boyfriend does not have a clue about Thai ways or values yet. A quick search online would have yielded him all the knowledge he needed on Weddings and Sin Sod, not just talk on 'buying his wife'.  

 

19 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Frankly if it were not for the baby I too would advice putting the wedding off for now, but I do understand it is not possible for a respectable Thai woman to have a baby out of wedlock so you really need to work on this.

I have seen my share of Thai girls get pregnant to Thai guys and for the guy to walk off into the sunset, leaving the girls to bring up the child themselves. I would say half my wives friends are village married (ban nok) and the guys do not stick around. Those that are married to farangs/foreign men have a pretty hard life as well with husbands like myself, that are 20 years older and are set in our ways. It certainly is not easy for a Thai woman but in this case, getting married just for the child is something I would really need to think about as it certainly did not seem planned. A lot of talking needs to be done now regarding the future. 

[DrTuner]

4 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

2. Sin sod, despite perhaps being common here, is a totally foreign thing to westerners. We simply don't do that in the west, no tradition of that at all.

Some countries have it, f.ex. Finland the bride used to be given a chest full of stuff when they pushed her out the door. Sometime in the 50's I think. What's notable is that most I know of had to pay to get rid of the daughter. Makes you think why the market prices are set that way, eh?

 

Oh and do remember to check the teeth when deciding on sin sod. 

 

EDIT: Quite a few actually https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowry

Edited January 16, 2019 by DrTuner

[Spidey]

2 hours ago, Nyezhov said:

Im a Yank, therefore I am Man U!

Good man!

[Nyezhov]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

 

That is cute. No point in beating this fairly dead horse too much. I appreciate your lack of sensitivity. Says you are a man! And I consider my comments to be very contemporary. Actually, rather a badge of honor, in this day and age of weakness, spurned by extreme emasculation, required by most Western woman, combined with the battle against masculinity (and some abuse, I do believe that) being waged by the Me Too movement, and Gillette. Not backtracking in the slightest. I own my statements. Stand by them 110%! And I love having the ability to embrace my masculinity, and having made the choice to remain a man, in this world of toning down manhood, at all costs. Just brothers fighting the righteous fight. 

Real men shoot .45s and love Muddy Waters

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

In this case, it's pretty apparent that the OP's BF made a deposit.... it just wasn't the kind of deposit she was looking for....

 

Or... maybe it was!

 

 

Edited January 16, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Sheryl]

44 minutes ago, totally thaied up said:

I have seen several Ampur Weddings now between foreigners (myself included), that did not have Sin Sod or a need for a crazy expensive wedding party. Just a meal with the family and a baht of gold given to the mother. If you have a half decent family and can sit down with the Family and explain why this is not going to happen and all are willing to understand you have better things to put your money down on, Thai families will listen.

 

In the last 10 years, I have been to 4 weddings at the Amphur for foreign friends. No Sin Sods were paid but most gave the parents a baht of gold as a gift. Like I said, if you have a halfway decent Thai family, sitting down and talking about all of this is pretty easy to do. If they want to project Face 'just for Face value', you need to talk about that as compromises on both sides need to be in order - just not for the Thais. My Mother-in-Law wanted a big party as she is Chinese and wanted to show big Face. In the end, I showed her renovated building plans for her daughter's house with the proceeds of what money I would have spent on a Wedding and she saw this as a much better way of showing face longterm. As I said, compromises on both sides must be made and by the sounds of it, her boyfriend does not have a clue about Thai ways or values yet. A quick search online would have yielded him all the knowledge he needed on Weddings and Sin Sod, not just talk on 'buying his wife'.  

 

I have seen my share of Thai girls get pregnant to Thai guys and for the guy to walk off into the sunset, leaving the girls to bring up the child themselves. I would say half my wives friends are village married (ban nok) and the guys do not stick around. Those that are married to farangs/foreign men have a pretty hard life as well with husbands like myself, that are 20 years older and are set in our ways. It certainly is not easy for a Thai woman but in this case, getting married just for the child is something I would really need to think about as it certainly did not seem planned. A lot of talking needs to be done now regarding the future. 

I think you need to understand the differences in various socvial classes within Thailand.

 

I very much doubt any of the girls you know who had babies out of wedlock had Masters degrees from a Western University.  Likewise what can be done wedding wise, relates to the class of the family.

[totally thaied up]

42 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

I very much doubt any of the girls you know who had babies out of wedlock had Masters degrees from a Western University.  Likewise what can be done wedding wise, relates to the class of the family.

I know the various classes. I have been to very big Weddings before and my wife said to me after she read this post, this girls family could make everything 'right' (as in the Thai proper way of doing things to cultural needs) - he (the boyfriend) only has to show up to the Wedding in the suit they pick for him. If I was him, I would just relax and go with the flow.

 

I really wish them well anyway. Anyone having a child at any stage of life is doing hard. Honestly, I could not do it, the children part. Just too old now but they both have a responsibility now and that is a pretty big thing. 

 

 

Edited January 16, 2019 by totally thaied up
Edit - add content

[Skallywag]

8 hours ago, hhdoob said:

He always doesn't like that I am Thai and that I am with him and people would look at us differently. He hates paying for me even for a meal, because it makes him feel like one of those type of men. We share everything equal. But in practice, I just end up having to pay more always. I have a full-time job and work extra jobs also.

Boy this is somerhing - How can the guy still be studying for a PhD in his mid-30's? He's cheap and unemployed but has the money to fly back to Europe several times a year?   For the short time you have lived together here in Thailand sounds like nothing is going right, so why get married?  You dont need to be married for the childs sake.  Also as I see in so many of these desperate postings - Love is never mentioned, if he doesnt tell you he loves you many times a week - forget the marriage -  sure sign in my book. 

[HighPriority]

3 hours ago, bbi1 said:

So does that mean if a Thai woman has a baby out of wedlock then they are not respectable? Does that mean no sin sod would be paid then?

Greatly reduced is my understanding.

Im a newbie @ this racket, I married my wife 1 year ago in a small 25-40 people ceremony @ mums house in the village in Phon Phisai.

My wife is divorced with 2 daughters and is of low formal education, she explained Sin Sod to me, she spoke to her parents and told me that 10,000 Baht was the amount.

I didn’t understand or expect that money would come back to us, she told me that the Sin Sod was to be used to buy food for the guests, it was a surprise when people started shoving Baht in my hands, it was really emotional when her best friend gave me 300-400 Baht, I knew how much (Little) she earned...

We ended up getting 4000-5000 back.

My wife is an absolute bargain ????????????

[totally thaied up]

33 minutes ago, HighPriority said:

Greatly reduced is my understanding

A few years ago I went to a Wedding of a young University girl that got pregnant to a far-a-way family member. She was about 5 months showing and the gossip was terrible. The guy she was marrying was a real player and it was well noted. Everyone was generally saying how many months would this last. It was just a small Wedding but by the end of the night, we would have had 80 people drinking, so it just proves even on a small scale, how many people can show up to a family event and how costly they can be.

 

My wife mentioned to me tonight in a serious way that Sin Sod is still very important in almost all aspects of social life. She told me foreigners do not understand how important it is to many families. We, from not being Thai and not having stress placed from family upon us, do not understand how it can affect you socially. If you do have above social standing/visibility, I could imagine not getting Sin Sod, to be something totally unimaginable. 

 

[Enki]

3 hours ago, DrTuner said:

Some countries have it, f.ex. Finland the bride used to be given a chest full of stuff when they pushed her out the door. Sometime in the 50's I think. What's notable is that most I know of had to pay to get rid of the daughter. Makes you think why the market prices are set that way, eh?

 

Oh and do remember to check the teeth when deciding on sin sod. 

 

EDIT: Quite a few actually https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowry

So, you fail to grasp that a Sin Sod and a Dowry are the exact opposite?

[Enki]

1 hour ago, Skallywag said:

How can the guy still be studying for a PhD in his mid-30's?

That is pretty normal for a European PhD. However I don't think he us studying for it, he already made it or did I misunderstand the OP?

[Rc2702]

I don't believe for a second this is class related. Surely it's more to do with the families need to boast. I'm certain many wealthy Thai families performed marriage rituals differently. It's not a one size fits all world.

[darksidedog]

An inappropriate post and a reply have been removed.

This is a public forum, not the local pub, so please reserve base comments for there, not here.

 

[swampdonkey]

Not written by Thai as English is just too good. Sorry, but troll

Totally agree, That title was definitely not written by a Thai


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