New retiree visa rules bewilder Thai immigration: Source

[ttrd]

6 minutes ago, Jlop said:

"They must either show evidence of monthly salaries of at least 65,000 baht transferred to a Thai bank account or balances of at least 800,000 baht in their Thai bank accounts." I'm trapped in a vicious cycle trying to relocate to Krabi as a retiree with a large-enough pension. I've gone to two branches of Bangkok bank, one if the several times, trying to open an account in part so I could meet the immigration financial requirements. At various points they requested a work permit (don't have or want), or an embassy letter (I  assuming they mean the old income affidavit). I showed them their own online rules allowing an account if you have a letter from your pension source, and showed them a signed letter from my former employer (US government) listing my pension  They didn't accept it because it looked like it was not a signed original (sorry that's what they send, machine signed). I'm trying to get an original signature, just as US gov shut down. Then they wanted a letter confirming immigration status from the immigration office. Immigration told me yesterday they won't do that unless I have an address book to show. I assume you have to show a long-term rental contract or some kind of home ownership to get that proof, but how can you get that if you can't get the retirement visa, since you can't show the deposits, since you can't get an account, and you can't get an account, since you don't have the address book, and on and on in nauseating circular repetition....

 

I don't give up easily, but it's hard to figure out how to get off of this un-merry go round.

 

 

 

Try Siam Bank and Krunthai Bank - there I have opened accounts (in the past) with only tourist visa. Despite rules about work permit or retirement visa some banks or even branches differ from the main rules so it is worth to give it a try ...

[cleopatra2]

14 minutes ago, Jlop said:

"They must either show evidence of monthly salaries of at least 65,000 baht transferred to a Thai bank account or balances of at least 800,000 baht in their Thai bank accounts." I'm trapped in a vicious cycle trying to relocate to Krabi as a retiree with a large-enough pension. I've gone to two branches of Bangkok bank, one if the several times, trying to open an account in part so I could meet the immigration financial requirements. At various points they requested a work permit (don't have or want), or an embassy letter (I  assuming they mean the old income affidavit). I showed them their own online rules allowing an account if you have a letter from your pension source, and showed them a signed letter from my former employer (US government) listing my pension  They didn't accept it because it looked like it was not a signed original (sorry that's what they send, machine signed). I'm trying to get an original signature, just as US gov shut down. Then they wanted a letter confirming immigration status from the immigration office. Immigration told me yesterday they won't do that unless I have an address book to show. I assume you have to show a long-term rental contract or some kind of home ownership to get that proof, but how can you get that if you can't get the retirement visa, since you can't show the deposits, since you can't get an account, and you can't get an account, since you don't have the address book, and on and on in nauseating circular repetition....

 

I don't give up easily, but it's hard to figure out how to get off of this un-merry go round.

 

 

 

I suspect the embassy letter being requested is not the income affidavit. More likely a letter stating your residence in Thailand 

[tingtongtourist]

On 2/2/2019 at 6:04 AM, HuskerDo said:

Don't you think the foreigners/farangs are getting worse as well with their disrespect of Thai people, Thai culture, Thai laws, etc?   

 

I don't think they are anti-foreigner but rather anti-trouble maker. Not all that are being affected are trouble-makers but they are paying the price for those who are.

 

I think you may have something. 

The foreigners i notice always seem to fall in 2 sides:

 

1. financially secure. probably have no problem with new rules. quite happy in relationships and always positive about the Thai life.

 

2. all the time struggle about visa, struggle with money, struggle in relation with Thais. complain about everything.

usually found to be abusing Immigration laws, therefor they themself are cause of these crackdown.

 

this 2nd group is like those destitute alco English teacher types and smart-arze young Euro punks that think they are better than all.

 

I guess Thai Imms wont loose any sleep if they keep the 1s and the 2s get moved along.

 

And lets be honest, they dont really offer Thais or the country anything of value,

 

mostly their whole existence is centred around trying to bed as many Thai women as they can without spending any baht

 

[ttrd]

11 minutes ago, tingtongtourist said:

I think you may have something. 

The foreigners i notice always seem to fall in 2 sides:

 

1. financially secure. probably have no problem with new rules. quite happy in relationships and always positive about the Thai life.

 

2. all the time struggle about visa, struggle with money, struggle in relation with Thais. complain about everything.

usually found to be abusing Immigration laws, therefor they themself are cause of these crackdown.

 

this 2nd group is like those destitute alco English teacher types and smart-arze young Euro punks that think they are better than all.

 

I guess Thai Imms wont loose any sleep if they keep the 1s and the 2s get moved along.

 

And lets be honest, they dont really offer Thais or the country anything of value,

 

mostly their whole existence is centred around trying to bed as many Thai women as they can without spending any baht

 

RE - And lets be honest, they dont really offer Thais or the country anything of value,

 

Well, this in not quite correct - in a broader perspective they keep both the immigration, police, court and the jail busy which secures places of work for Thais which again benefit the country as a whole ...

 

Nothing is so wrong that it is not good for anything ...

[lamyai3]

12 hours ago, Jlop said:

I've gone to two branches of Bangkok bank, one if the several times, trying to open an account in part so I could meet the immigration financial requirements. At various points they requested a work permit (don't have or want), or an embassy letter (I  assuming they mean the old income affidavit).

All BB is talking about here is an embassy letter confirming residence. It's provided by the embassy yes, but a completely different thing to an income letter or affidavit. 

[tingtongtourist]

14 hours ago, ttrd said:

RE - And lets be honest, they dont really offer Thais or the country anything of value,

 

Well, this in not quite correct - in a broader perspective they keep both the immigration, police, court and the jail busy which secures places of work for Thais which again benefit the country as a whole ...

 

Nothing is so wrong that it is not good for anything ...

 

ok, going by this theory, then why go blacklisting farangs for years and years?

 

surely better to let them straight back in?

 

for collecting more fines, backanders and fixing unemployment, maybe even some extra cusomer for the prison system.

5555 

[Jlop]

On 2/15/2019 at 5:23 PM, BertM said:

Let's start from beginning. You probably need to sign a 6 to 12 mtg lease first, then, go apply for 90 day O visa. Then you can open a Thai bank account after showing your visa & lease agmt. Then you will need to transfer 800k into new account or start your monthly transfers. Then, before your 90 day O visa expires, you need to apply for your 12 mth extension.

You can ask Ubonjoe on this forum. He can probably give you the correct steps if mine are not quite correct. That is basically what I did and it worked.

Thanks for that explanation, glad that worked for you. Sounds a bit risky though that you need to sign a long-term lease when you don't know yet if they will let you stay that long. Also, immigration did not ask for any Thai bank statements when you went for the 90-day O visa?

 

[ttrd]

23 hours ago, Jlop said:

Thanks for that explanation, glad that worked for you. Sounds a bit risky though that you need to sign a long-term lease when you don't know yet if they will let you stay that long. Also, immigration did not ask for any Thai bank statements when you went for the 90-day O visa?

 

RE - Sounds a bit risky though that you need to sign a long-term lease when you don't know yet if they will let you stay that long. Also,

 

You can enter into a long lease with a short termination notice ...

[onera1961]

On 2/15/2019 at 4:14 AM, Jlop said:

I've gone to two branches of Bangkok bank, one if the several times, trying to open an account in part so I could meet the immigration financial requirements. At various points they requested a work permit (don't have or want), or an embassy letter (I  assuming they mean the old income affidavit). I showed them their own online rules allowing an account if you have a letter from your pension source, and showed them a signed letter from my former employer (US government) listing my pension 

Not sure if you're discussing about opening a bank account or changing your visa to Non-O. You should have gotten an O-A visa from the US before coming here. With an O-A visa, it is comparatively easy to open an account but still not a piece of cake in today's environment. To open a Bangkok bank account, you need a lease and an embassy letter (not income letter) or a Thai who could vouch for you. Talk to the manager directly not the staff. There are agents who can also help you open a bank account. 

Edited February 17, 2019 by onera1961

[rosst]

On 2/1/2019 at 6:25 PM, Banana7 said:

If you don't like the new rules, consider the Philippines Special Resident Retiree’s Visa (SRRV).  Search here on Thaivisa for "SRRV" to learn more.

 

Yes, I am living most of the time in the Philippines, I am still just using the tourist visa which is easy to use and you can stay up to three years just renewing the visa and can get a six month extension.

If you have a pension, you can get a retirement visa for $10,000 USD and no pension $20,000 USD lodged in a specified bank account, which can be drawn and used under certain circumstances or withdrawn when leaving.

Upsides and downsides of the Philippines, depending on where you are, the main cities of Manila and Cebu are bloody awful in my opinion, I live in the provinces and find it very enjoyable.

Worth a look, food not as good as Thailand, it takes time to find the dishes to your taste but the widespread English language skills makes it a good destination to look at.

Travel is not expensive but tourist accommodation is much dearer than Thailand but long term accommodation is not bad.

I love Thailand but only go there for holidays now, I feel very sad for long term expats being priced out by this visa bullsh#t.

Just my two bobs worth.

[gmac]

On 2/1/2019 at 6:08 PM, moonseeker said:

Still very reasonable requirements for retirement. Much more important would be a mandatory health insurance for anybody on long-term visa or retirement-extensions.

The misery I have witnessed with many foreigners  in my 24 years in TH, due to not having health coverage at all is unreal and not needed. Fully acceptable, that a government does not want low-end and irresponsible foreigners burdening their system. Or it would end up a welfare state like so many European places. There will still be plenty of retirees left, after sorting it all out.  MS>

All this banging the drum for health insurance is all very well but many can't get it due to pre-existing conditions and some companies refuse renewals after a certain age.  How are those people supposed to comply or should they just leave?

[Sheryl]

For the age issue, simply take your budiness elsewhere to a company that does insure at that age.

It's the pre-existing conditions that can be a deal breaker. There are differences in how companies handle them and if it is something in the past and now resolved, or something that is completely controlled and stable it would be worth shopping around. Work with a broker and consider insuring on a moratorium basis.

But if not then you either need to be able to afford to set aside at least 1 million baht for health care (with ability to replenish it as used) -- 4 mill if you want to use orivate hospitals - or indeed you can't afford to live here.

Not a visa requirement. But a fact of life.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Jlop]

On 2/17/2019 at 10:00 PM, onera1961 said:

Not sure if you're discussing about opening a bank account or changing your visa to Non-O. You should have gotten an O-A visa from the US before coming here. With an O-A visa, it is comparatively easy to open an account but still not a piece of cake in today's environment. To open a Bangkok bank account, you need a lease and an embassy letter (not income letter) or a Thai who could vouch for you. Talk to the manager directly not the staff. There are agents who can also help you open a bank account. 

On this trip I am just trying to open a bank account.

[FPizzle]

The following meeting at BNH Hospital on 14 March in the 3rd floor conference room may be of interest to many of us.  It is open to all.

OVERCOMING THAILAND’S IMMIGRATION CHALLENGES

Date: March 14, Thursday

Time:  9:00 gather, 9:30 - 11:30 am

Venue:  BNH Hospital, Convent Road, 3rd Floor Conference Room 

Recently the Thai Immigration Bureau has changed regulations concerning retirement visas and other types of visas. Aim-on Larpisal, Department Head of Immigration & Employment and Jane Puranananda, General Manager, of Dej-Udom & Associates law firm will discuss these changes and provide practical suggestions to deal with problems or issues. They will also cover other related topics, such as notarial services and legalization of documents.  

[Almer]

Leaving 400k in the bank for ever will do wonders for the balance sheet of banks but do little to help the local economy, who need it more.

[JSixpack]

9 minutes ago, Almer said:

Leaving 400k in the bank for ever will do wonders for the balance sheet of banks but do little to help the local economy, who need it more.

Can the bank not use it for lending in the local economy just like other deposits? Any special restriction? It may be that the bank, assessing creditworthiness, can ensure that the deposit is used more productively than for just paying bar fines and buying bottles of Chang at the 7/11.

[Odisan]

20 hours ago, JSixpack said:

Can the bank not use it for lending in the local economy just like other deposits? Any special restriction? It may be that the bank, assessing creditworthiness, can ensure that the deposit is used more productively than for just paying bar fines and buying bottles of Chang at the 7/11.

Err, yeah... just because it's 'in' your account doesn't mean it's 'in' your account. It's in there so you can take it out, but you won't want to take it out because it needs to be in. However, the bank don't play by the same in/out rules, so they can take it out (and shake it all about) and it'll still look in to you and immigration, but it's not really in because they will have taken it out; however, to all intents and purposes it's in. Unless you take it out, of course; then the bank can't take it out because it's no longer in and immigration may determine that it's not in for the required in period, and will likely out you because your in wasn't in long enough to meet the in requirements for staying in Thailand.

Innit.

 

[Odisan]

On 2/1/2019 at 4:44 PM, Just1Voice said:

I'm just glad I can show a monthly income into a Thai bank for well above the required 65K a month.  With recently printed out deposits from my bank for the past year.  

You're my hero. Please send hero photo.

[GeorgeCross]

20 hours ago, JSixpack said:

Can the bank not use it for lending in the local economy just like other deposits? Any special restriction? It may be that the bank, assessing creditworthiness, can ensure that the deposit is used more productively than for just paying bar fines and buying bottles of Chang at the 7/11.

 

if thai banks are anything like western banks, through the process of fractional reserve banking, they will be able to lend that money out at a rate of 9:1

 

so that 400K becomes a lendable amount of 3.6M baht - lendable as loans, mortgages etc

 

remember that when somchai buys the house next door! (though i wouldn't mention it to him hahaha)

 

 

Edited June 19, 2019 by GeorgeCross

[Andrew Dwyer]

Err, yeah... just because it's 'in' your account doesn't mean it's 'in' your account. It's in there so you can take it out, but you won't want to take it out because it needs to be in. However, the bank don't play by the same in/out rules, so they can take it out (and shake it all about) and it'll still look in to you and immigration, but it's not really in because they will have taken it out; however, to all intents and purposes it's in. Unless you take it out, of course; then the bank can't take it out because it's no longer in and immigration may determine that it's not in for the required in period, and will likely out you because your in wasn't in long enough to meet the in requirements for staying in Thailand.

Innit.

 

Outstanding [emoji1319]

[rainwater]

Can anyone explain why I can transfer funds Online to my bank in Thailand, but I Can Not transfer baht back Online to my home country bank and have to go in person to my Thai bank with my passport and fill out paperwork then pay a big wire transfer fee to send money back to my home country bank? WHY?

 

I have a friend with over 800K in his Thai bank, recently returned to his home country in the UK, now he's very sick and may not be able to return to Thailand, how is he suppose to get HIS Money back?

 

I've lived over 12 years full time in Thailand and getting really sick of this nonsense, for me, the bottom line is they don't want long stay expats to retire here anymore, but will be happy to sell 'holiday' condos to anyone who wants to spend 2-3 months at a time here.

 

And next they will be forcing us to buy medical insurance that won't cover anything they consider related to a pre existing condition (even taking preventative cholesterol meds is considered a pre existing condition and won't cover heart attack or stroke as it's considered a blood vessel condition) as you are flushing 1000's of worthless baht/insurance down the toilet just for the "privilege" to stay in the 'Land of Noise Pollution'

 

FED UP! 

[Sharp]

I concur... Absolutely outstanding [emoji106]

Outstanding [emoji1319]

Sent from my SM-P555 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[marcusarelus]

30 minutes ago, rainwater said:

Can anyone explain why I can transfer funds Online to my bank in Thailand, but I Can Not transfer baht back Online to my home country bank and have to go in person to my Thai bank with my passport and fill out paperwork then pay a big wire transfer fee to send money back to my home country bank? WHY?

I use Dee money and transfer it with my phone from Thailand to America.  

[rainwater]

1 minute ago, marcusarelus said:

I use Dee money and transfer it with my phone from Thailand to America.  

you missed my point, there are plenty of ways to transfer funds into Thailand online, getting it sent back online is impossible, try reading my original statement

[marcusarelus]

31 minutes ago, rainwater said:

I have a friend with over 800K in his Thai bank, recently returned to his home country in the UK, now he's very sick and may not be able to return to Thailand, how is he suppose to get HIS Money back?

I'd write the embassy and ask them.  I know they help Americans get money out of the bank to pay for medical bills.  I don't do it but I believe some banks will do international transfers on line.  I believe my SCB account will do it.   

[marcusarelus]

Just now, rainwater said:

you missed my point, there are plenty of ways to transfer funds into Thailand online, getting it sent back online is impossible, try reading my original statement

I use Dee money to transfer money from Thailand to America online.  It's not impossible at all.

[marcusarelus]

35 minutes ago, rainwater said:

And next they will be forcing us to buy medical insurance that won't cover anything they consider related to a pre existing condition (even taking preventative cholesterol meds is considered a pre existing condition and won't cover heart attack or stroke as it's considered a blood vessel condition) as you are flushing 1000's of worthless baht/insurance down the toilet just for the "privilege" to stay in the 'Land of Noise Pollution'

I have medical insurance from AIA and don't have the problems you mentioned.  There is an insurance forum here you might want to check or talk to an agent and ask.  There are worthless policies and policies that are not worthless.  Up to the buyer.  

[rainwater]

2 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

I'd write the embassy and ask them.  I know they help Americans get money out of the bank to pay for medical bills.  I don't do it but I believe some banks will do international transfers on line.  I believe my SCB account will do it.   

He is with Bangkok Bank (so am I), they don't offer international online transfers back to your original bank and I don't think any Thai banks do because of Thai banking law.

[rumak]

On 2/1/2019 at 4:54 PM, youreavinalaff said:

The money must now be in the bank 2 months before AND 3 months after.

that fact alone seems to bewilder many of the retirees trying to do extensions.  along with the tm30 which has now filled up hundreds of pages on thaivisa.    enough bewilderment to go around .  i myself am bewildered by all the bewilderment

[rainwater]

15 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

I have medical insurance from AIA and don't have the problems you mentioned.  There is an insurance forum here you might want to check or talk to an agent and ask.  There are worthless policies and policies that are not worthless.  Up to the buyer.  

No! You're Wrong: Thai medical insurance companies DO NOT offer cover for pre existing conditions, they will lie to you and say what they need to get you to sign up with them but then they will refuse your claim. Their handbooks on rules and regulations are 2 inches thick and you need a lawyer to help translate and read the regulations, in the end you will be stuck paying the claim if they say it's related to a pre existing condition and they will research and get your records from every hospital in the area and where ever you have lived in Thailand to avoid payment. Don't be fooled by these criminals posing as legit insurance companies.  

Edited June 20, 2019 by rainwater