New retiree visa rules bewilder Thai immigration: Source

[Pib]

3 hours ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

A couple of posters have stated that a FD account is accepted.

Seems like my next move, 800,000 in an FD account and live off a savings account.

Keep in mind a Foreign Currency account is "not" insured under the Thailand Deposit Protection program; only Thai baht accounts are covered.

[rexall]

5 hours ago, Benroon said:

Thousands ? Dream on

Thousands? Who knows? It is simple mathematics. Those who cannot meet the income requirements will have to (1) Find a new workaround if one makes itself available, (2) Overstay and take their chances (not likely) or (3) Leave Thailand.  

Have I left anything out?

[NanLaew]

8 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

You are non stop in your defense of everything these silly folks do.

 

There are a metric TONNE of investments that yield better than 2% -- all over the world. There are better places to park money -- especially now that they don't even intend for you to use half of it in the case of the new rules requiring you to keep 400K tied up. Show me another country that has such silly rules.

Yes. But it's only US$25.5 k after all and I'm pretty sure the paltry 2% yield on that can be more than compensated for by the loadsa cash you have stuck in the 'metric TONNE' of other, better investments '-- all over the world'.

[tropo]

19 hours ago, HuskerDo said:

You can also keep most of your money in your homeland and deposit/transfer funds 65,000 baht into a Thai account each month. What's the issue? Of course if you don't qualify for a retirement visa that's another story.

Your confidence may be a little premature. Every immigration office makes their own rules and according to a report about 1 week ago (long thread - look it up), the chiefs upstairs at Jomtien Immigration are not willing to accept the monthly bank deposit method. Perhaps they'll change their mind - time will tell.

[William Phelps]

It would be very good to have an Official  letter that can be  printed and taken to show the Immigration officer

They all seem to have their own interpretation. When I was there I heard an officer say to a man income of 65,000 per month no longer allowed he told the person to just go away so I assume he will not get a retirement visa ( even though he may have had one for years on that basis.  Is this really what The Thai Chief of Immigration wants ?? 

I have the money in the bank so no problem for me.  Although not happy when I went to get Visa a few days early they

( The officer who dealt with me ) would not let me have it "come back when the 3 months are up "

I wonder if they have a complaints email of their wonderful Web Site which unless you read Thai its impossible to use !   Not sure it couldbe used if one could read Thai !!

[rexall]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

America, Simon and him with the long name.

Bullwinkle!  

[tropo]

8 hours ago, Just1Voice said:

Did you not understand - I can show a monthly income into a Thai bank ????

I think you misunderstood. It's not what you can do but what a particular  Immigration office will accept. 

[rexall]

1 hour ago, skatewash said:

 Yes, you can certainly print this out and if someone reads it they can quite clearly see what it proves, but what's the old saying:  "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink."  If the IO isn't interested in looking at anything outside of documentation from Thai banks (letter, statement, and passbook) it may do you no good.

It is my understanding (I have yet to verify it personally), TransferWise deposits will show as foreign transactions into a Bangkok Bank account.  If deposited into any other bank, will show as domestic transactions.

[Enki]

23 hours ago, moonseeker said:

Still very reasonable requirements for retirement. Much more important would be a mandatory health insurance for anybody on long-term visa or retirement-extensions.

The misery I have witnessed with many foreigners  in my 24 years in TH, due to not having health coverage at all is unreal and not needed. Fully acceptable, that a government does not want low-end and irresponsible foreigners burdening their system. Or it would end up a welfare state like so many European places. There will still be plenty of retirees left, after sorting it all out.  MS>

Thailand is a welfare state, just like Europe. Just not on the same level. Why the hate? If you come from a backyard country, what are you doing in Thailand?

[maddox41]

Well I bring over lump sums thru a forex company to my Thai bank as I need it., you save thousands of $$, Sometimes it's 20 K usd or 10 K usd I have docs to prove it plus I go home 1 time a year and bring back 20 K in cash  which I can show on my bank statement  I wounder if thats  good enough for the peanuts at immigration and of course alittle extra for their goodwill. But I'm sure it's going to change in the next month  as it allways does  555

[pontious]

43 minutes ago, rexall said:

It is my understanding (I have yet to verify it personally), TransferWise deposits will show as foreign transactions into a Bangkok Bank account.  If deposited into any other bank, will show as domestic transactions. 

Not always - they use 3 Thai banks if they use Bangkok bank it will show FTT - If they use the other 2 banks it will show as SMT - domestic transfer.

[Sumarianson]

On 2/1/2019 at 5:11 PM, NCC1701A said:

Reactions on Thaivisa, a webforum frequented by expats in Thailand, was overwhelmingly negative, with many commentators saying the regulations undercut claims from Thai officials that the deposit is to ensure they have sufficient resources to get by.

 

“Then why keep up the charade that this money is to cover living expenses if it can only be used six months out of the year,” user Connda wrote. “So…what’s next? What’s the next hammer to drop?”

“And I thought the 800,000 baht was for living expenses, not as an interest earner for the Thai banks!” user Madmitch vented.

 

there is room in my attic if anyone wants to hide.

The banks have the politicians /leaders in their pocket, always have. The rules are designed to make money for the banks and immigration.

[jesimps]

22 minutes ago, pontious said:

Not always - they use 3 Thai banks if they use Bangkok bank it will show FTT - If they use the other 2 banks it will show as SMT - domestic transfer.

I think you are correct. My Oct/Nov/Dec sent from my UK bank to SCB show two transfers going via Bangkok Bank BUT one going via TMB according to my TransferWise PDF notifications. I assume if I banked with Bangkok Bank that my account would show two international and one domestic transfer. Sounds too hit and miss to me.

Edited February 2, 2019 by jesimps

[jesimps]

1 hour ago, Enki said:

Thailand is a welfare state, just like Europe. Just not on the same level. Why the hate? If you come from a backyard country, what are you doing in Thailand?

The hate is because the poster is from a group of four or five people who seem to despise their fellow expats and who seem to delight in making smug, hateful, superior etc replies to anyone who questions the Thai Immigration authorities.

[Brickbat]

Thai economy booming, budget surplus exceeded forecasts, baht strong, so now , I assume they figure they don’t need “ poor farangs”. Hence the stab. 

800,000 , I was told , 2 months prior, 3 months after. No idea 400K was locked and for how long. I hope this is someone’s misinformed blunder. And not true. 

[smedly]

These new rules have been dreamed up (by the stupid dept) in order to wipe out the agents (they claim), I will predict now - unless (the stupid dept has a rethink) it will solve nothing, agents will still be doing what they are doing now only twice now instead of once a year, the IO will still be taking bribes from agents to ignore seasoning. Either it is a direct attempt to increase the agent fees and bribes or really is just poorly thought out

 

Is anyone clear about the seasoning for people renewing their extension - is it 3 months prior and 3 months after or 2 months prior and 3 months after - currently it is 2 months prior for new extensions and 3 months prior for renewal - so which is it because it matters - only answer if you are 100% sure

[skatewash]

2 hours ago, pontious said:

Ask the bank to print out your international transfers. 

I like the idea, but are TW always coded as international transfers in your bank?

Situation:

TW'd 11 x 65,000 baht to Bangkok Bank and each has a FTT code

The final TW transfer of 65,000 baht to Bangkok Bank gets coded as some sort of domestic transfer (maybe BNT)  [Reason:  TW didn't have 65,000 in it's Bangkok Bank account, but it did have 65,000 in its other partner bank TMB, so it domestically transferred that money to my Bangkok Bank account and Bangkok Bank coded it has a domestic transfer - which it was from Bangkok Bank's perspective.  Remember under TW's business model they only do the international transfer if they have to, if they have money in Thailand they can just transfer it domestically and avoid the international SWIFT fees.  That's why they can offer good average rates they aren't always doing SWIFT transfers sometimes they are just shifting money from one of their partner banks in Thailand to another.]

 

I ask Bangkok Bank to print me my international transfers.

I get back a list of 11 transfers all coded FTT.

What about this BNT coded transfer, it's also an international transfer, can you include that too, please?

Can't do, it's listed as a domestic transfer in our computer.
Yeah, but it's not, see I have this TW receipt and if you look at this carefully you will plainly see that it originated overseas.

Sorry, can't change our code.  It's done automatically.  It was a domestic transfer for us so that's how it's coded.

Maybe so, but it really came from overseas, see.... look at this receipt...

 

So are you going to be able to convince Bangkok Bank to include the domestic transfer as an international transfer?  There're going to stamp it with their stamp as authentic and true?

 

If not, is the IO going to want to look at the TW receipt?  Might he only be interested in the stamped statement from Bangkok Bank.

It appears you're one transfer short...

But see, I actually did 12 and 1 got coded this way (domestic) but it really should be international because look at my TW receipt, see....

 

The devil is in the details.

[skatewash]

1 hour ago, rexall said:

It is my understanding (I have yet to verify it personally), TransferWise deposits will show as foreign transactions into a Bangkok Bank account.  If deposited into any other bank, will show as domestic transactions.

Usually yes, sometimes no.  The TW business model doesn't guarantee the coding that your bank will apply to their transaction.  If it's actually SWIFT'ed from overseas and arrives at Bangkok Bank that way then probably 100% of the time it's coded FTT - international.  But what if it comes from TW's account in Bangkok Bank and wasn't SWIFT'ed from overseas.  Then maybe it's still coded as FTT, but maybe not.  But what if it comes from TMB (another TW partner bank in Thailand), then maybe it gets coded as a domestic transfer, which from the perspective of Bangkok Bank it was.  From the perspective of you and TW it was an international transfer but from the perspective of your bank in Thailand it sure looks like it came from TMB which would be a domestic transfer.  TW doesn't care about any of this.  As long as they get your money into your account they don't care how it's coded by Bangkok Bank.  Bangkok Bank doesn't care about this either.  However their computer systems codes the transfer is fine with them.

 

But you may care about this.  You may want it to have an international transfer code (FTT or some other non-domestic code) but it may actually have a domestic code reflecting the truth of the matter that it actually came from TMB (at least on its last leg).

And the IO may care about this.  He may not consider that to be an international transfer because that's not the way it's coded.  You may want to show him the TW receipt which might show that it originated as an international transfer.  He may not want to look at the TW receipt.  That could be a real problem.

[marcusarelus]

25 minutes ago, smedly said:

These new rules have been dreamed up (by the stupid dept) in order to wipe out the agents (they claim), I will predict now - unless (the stupid dept has a rethink) it will solve nothing, agents will still be doing what they are doing now only twice now instead of once a year, the IO will still be taking bribes from agents to ignore seasoning. Either it is a direct attempt to increase the agent fees and bribes or really is just poorly thought out

 

Is anyone clear about the seasoning for people renewing their extension - is it 3 months prior and 3 months after or 2 months prior and 3 months after - currently it is 2 months prior for new extensions and 3 months prior for renewal - so which is it because it matters - only answer if you are 100% sure

2 months prior and 3 months after unless it's a typo and then it is 3 before and 3 after and if checked at the next extension it eliminates the agents and every crooked expat is expected to conduct his own negotiations with Imm.  Since few at Imm speak English and by next year micro cameras will be all the rage it should make for interesting times for the Imm officers not on the straight and narrow. 

Edited February 2, 2019 by marcusarelus

[leiftheswede]

So actually meaning that u have to keep 800.000 Thb in the bank for 5 month (to before and 3 after application) then u can only use 400.000 during the rest of the year - 7 month.  What's the point of these 400.000 in the bank that u can't use ??  Someone must have banged their head to come up with a regulation like that. With a proved income of 65.000 Thb a year - do u have to show the same kind of savings in the bank ??

 

[smedly]

17 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

2 months prior and 3 months after unless it's a typo and then it is 3 before and 3 after and if checked at the next extension it eliminates the agents and every crooked expat is expected to conduct his own negotiations with Imm.  Since few at Imm speak English and by next year micro cameras will be all the rage it should make for interesting times for the Imm officers not on the straight and narrow. 

what part of "only answer if you are 100% sure" didn't you get ?

 

and the rest of your post is speculative nonsense 

[bizboi]

On 2/1/2019 at 5:25 PM, Banana7 said:

If you don't like the new rules, consider the Philippines Special Resident Retiree’s Visa (SRRV).  Search here on Thaivisa for "SRRV" to learn more.

 

did you ever stop to think people are here because they have thai wives and families - how does that fit in the philipines?

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, bizboi said:

did you ever stop to think people are here because they have thai wives and families - how does that fit in the philipines?

Plenty of available women for wives in PI, or anywhere else in SEA for that matter.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, skatewash said:

If not, is the IO going to want to look at the TW receipt?  Might he only be interested in the stamped statement from Bangkok Bank.

I'm sure the agent could fix it.

[bizboi]

22 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

Credit rating Vietnam BB  Thailand BBB+

 

I got to Thailand 20 years ago and put $25K in the bank and nothing has changed for me in those 20 years. 

yes it has - you now have to leave it in!!

[finnishmen]

have thai immigration ask foreign thai wife and family,childrens too what like immigration idiot make stupid new rules alltime lot. familys have many and no like visa have alltime harden and harden make. lot money go to out thailand if expats go out country and wife and family stay thailand and need poor life,no money good and no busines and thailand no come money lot. immigration have idiot no think good anythink how lot he waste money and familys at stupid new rules. i think immigration think no need foreign money we have rich and no need foreign in country, newermind million thai no have work if all foreigns go out stupid visa system then have.

[chama]

On 2/1/2019 at 4:49 AM, Fex Bluse said:

Is that accurate? That the money needs to stay 3 months after the extension is granted? Because it used to be that the money needed to be in the account for 3 months before the extension is granted. This is going to catch many people off guard! 

This time it has been "after" in all of the news releases. What they really mean is your funds need to be in their accounts for three months after the approval. This will give them time to move it into another account all together.

[pontious]

2 hours ago, skatewash said:

Usually yes, sometimes no.  The TW business model doesn't guarantee the coding that your bank will apply to their transaction.  If it's actually SWIFT'ed from overseas and arrives at Bangkok Bank that way then probably 100% of the time it's coded FTT - international.  But what if it comes from TW's account in Bangkok Bank and wasn't SWIFT'ed from overseas.  Then maybe it's still coded as FTT, but maybe not.  But what if it comes from TMB (another TW partner bank in Thailand), then maybe it gets coded as a domestic transfer, which from the perspective of Bangkok Bank it was.  From the perspective of you and TW it was an international transfer but from the perspective of your bank in Thailand it sure looks like it came from TMB which would be a domestic transfer.  TW doesn't care about any of this.  As long as they get your money into your account they don't care how it's coded by Bangkok Bank.  Bangkok Bank doesn't care about this either.  However their computer systems codes the transfer is fine with them.

 

But you may care about this.  You may want it to have an international transfer code (FTT or some other non-domestic code) but it may actually have a domestic code reflecting the truth of the matter that it actually came from TMB (at least on its last leg).

And the IO may care about this.  He may not consider that to be an international transfer because that's not the way it's coded.  You may want to show him the TW receipt which might show that it originated as an international transfer.  He may not want to look at the TW receipt.  That could be a real problem.

I doubt IO will know any bank codes -FTT - SMT - I think IO will want to see 65000 minimum per month - that's it . Do I know that - NO -But

I think people are getting paranoid over this. The world is not about to end. As far as I know.????

Edited February 2, 2019 by pontious

[Xango111]

Has anybody of this immigration officers thought about that spending a monthly budget of 100'000 Baht I actually have to put 1'300'000 Baht on the bank account, to stay covered for 5 months. This goes against their own regulations of a 800'000 Baht deposit.

[uffe123]

On 2/1/2019 at 5:17 AM, evadgib said:

It isn't worth getting excited until after a new govt gets sworn in.

Are you Joking? the new government will be the same as the old. Only military appointees can run for office,