BKK Bank passbook NOT showing SWIFT transfer as foreign transaction

[theoldgit]

On 2/27/2019 at 10:14 AM, theoldgit said:

What used to be a simple process for many of us to transfer sufficient funds to live on, whilst meeting the required level of income, has now become a logistical nightmare for many.

 

In my case I transfer whatever I need monthly from my Santander Intenational account online, via TransferWise, it's quick, easy and very cost effective.

 

The fact that as I bank with Kasikorn and the deposit shows up as "Dummy branch" shouldn't be an issue, it's a regular deposit, it comes from overseas and have the additional paperwork to support the fact.......

So what are my options, I could open an account with Bangkok Bank, continue to use TW and hope that they mark the next twelve months transfers as FTT, if they don't mark one as such I'm probably scuppered.......

I could get Santander to transfer the required amount every month and hope thay don't use an intermediary bank as that may not show up as a deposit from overseas. You can't initiate a transfer in Sterling to Thailand online, you have to call Jersey, the bank costs are higher, you don't get the same rate as TW and you have to pay a receiving fee, and of course if there's an intermediary bank they'll take their cut and it may not show up as an International Transfer.

 

As I've said before, why does such a simple task need to be so difficult.

Santander International have just confirmed that in order for me to send Sterling from my account in Jersey I will need to call them in Jersey, they've also confirmed that they use a correspondent bank who will also deduct a fee, and of course I'm already aware that Kasikorn would also charge a fee of 500 Baht to receive it. I calculate that this would cost me in the region of an extra 25,000 Baht a year and still run the risk that the correspondent bank would log the deposit into my Kasikorn account as domestic.

 

Looks like I'm going to try and open an account with Bangkok Bank and hope they continue to record TW deposits as foreign deposits.

 

This whole debacle is totally unnecessary.

[Sheryl]

Santander International have just confirmed that in order for me to send Sterling from my account in Jersey I will need to call them in Jersey, they've also confirmed that they use a correspondent bank who will also deduct a fee, and of course I'm already aware that Kasikorn would also charge a fee of 500 Baht to receive it. I calculate that this would cost me in the region of an extra 25,000 Baht a year and still run the risk that the correspondent bank would log the deposit into my Kasikorn account as domestic.
 
Looks like I'm going to try and open an account with Bangkok Bank and hope they continue to record TW deposits as foreign deposits.
 
This whole debacle is totally unnecessary.

As has been said several times before Bangkok Bank will not always record TW payments as foreign transfers. Only if TW used them for that batch of transfers; they may use any of 3 different partner banks and you cannot choose which nor know in advance. At present they use BB the most, seems like 90-95% of the time (this could change) and this is what has given rise to the mistaken idea that having one's account at BB gurantees TW transfers will always be coded FTT. Not always, as many TV members can attest.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[steve73]

9 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

As has been said several times before Bangkok Bank will not always record TW payments as foreign transfers. Only if TW used them for that batch of transfers; they may use any of 3 different partner banks and you cannot choose which nor know in advance. At present they use BB the most, seems like 90-95% of the time (this could change) and this is what has given rise to the mistaken idea that having one's account at BB gurantees TW transfers will always be coded FTT. Not always, as many TV members can attest.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I've used TW to send to my Kasikornbank 17 times.  6 were via TBM, 5 via BBL, and 6 via KBL (which were the only ones recorded as INTL).

 

It does seem that if you bank with BBL there is a higher probability of them sending via that bank, but as we have seen it is not guaranteed.

 

Better that we put our efforts into getting our recipient banks to correctly code the transfers irrespective of what partner bank TW (& others) uses for each particular transfer.... or if not "correctly" coded, at least coded suitably for Immigration's needs. 

 

I don't recall seeing any posts from people using TW to send to their account in one of the "other" banks in Thailand (i.e. not TMB, BBL or KBL)... I would assume that all of such transfers would be coded as domestic... Has anyone done this?

[Pib]

1 minute ago, steve73 said:

I don't recall seeing any posts from people using TW to send to their account in one of the "other" banks in Thailand (i.e. not TMB, BBL or KBL)... I would assume that all of such transfers would be coded as domestic... Has anyone done this?

I did one TW transfer to my Krungsri Bank account.   It was coded as a domestic transfer and TW used TMB as the partner bank. 

 

But my half dozen or so TW transfers to my Bangkok Bank account have all been coded as international but Bangkok Bank was used as TW's partner bank in those cases.  

[jacko45k]

1 hour ago, theoldgit said:

Santander International have just confirmed that in order for me to send Sterling from my account in Jersey I will need to call them in Jersey, they've also confirmed that they use a correspondent bank who will also deduct a fee, and of course I'm already aware that Kasikorn would also charge a fee of 500 Baht to receive it. I calculate that this would cost me in the region of an extra 25,000 Baht a year and still run the risk that the correspondent bank would log the deposit into my Kasikorn account as domestic.

Santander appear to be a bad choice here. I have a Jersey based account with a different bank, and any transfers I make to my Bangkok Bank account are free and no intermediate bank is used. Bangkok Bank take the usual, up to 500 baht, when they convert the Sterling to baht.  

[smedly]

On 2/26/2019 at 3:51 PM, moe666 said:

My credit union in the states uses swift transfer for at least 8 years, it is actually transfered thru western union from credit union to BKK FTT

they may tell you that but they actually use an intermediary bank such as HSBC who provide them with the service transparent to you

[sumrit]

6 hours ago, steve73 said:

Better that we put our efforts into getting our recipient banks to correctly code the transfers irrespective of what partner bank TW (& others) uses for each particular transfer.... or if not "correctly" coded, at least coded suitably for Immigration's needs. 

I don't recall seeing any posts from people using TW to send to their account in one of the "other" banks in Thailand (i.e. not TMB, BBL or KBL)... I would assume that all of such transfers would be coded as domestic... Has anyone done this?

 

I've been using TW since 2017 without any problems and, until the end of December, always transferred the money into my Krung Thai bank account.

 

However, with the new monthly income rules, I opened a Bangkok Bank account at the beginning of January and have been using them for the last two months.

 

Because of the way we pay for things I have tended to make two separate transfers each month so have probably in excess of 40 transfers.

 

With the issue over TW using three intermediary Thai banks, I have gone back over every transfer I've made to see which bank they've used for each transfer.

 

From June 2017 until June 2018 about two-thirds were transferred using TMB as the banking partner with the remaining third coming via the Bangkok Bank. none came via Kasikorn. There doesn't appear to be any obvious pattern to suggest which bank they use or why.

 

 Since the beginning of July 2018 all, apart from two transfers, have come via the Bangkok Bank. The two exceptions, one last October and the other was last Friday 22-2-2019, came via the TMB.

 

All transfers to my Krung Thai account are shown as domestic Transfers, regardless of the partner bank. Of the five I've sent to my Bangkok bank' four went direct and are recorded as International Transfers and the one last Friday via TMB shows as a domestic transfer. I went to the Bangkok bank Monday to ask about a Credit Advice receipt for that TMB payment but was told I needed to contact TMB for that. After contacting them TMB have emailed me to confirm it's been applied for but I've not received anything yet.

 

One thing I have noticed though is that, on the PDF of the Transferwise Transfer Confirmation Receipt, with ALL transfers that use the Bangkok bank as the banking partner, there is an eight-digit  'banking partner reference ' number near the bottom of the page, and it's specific to that particular transfer, so that's possibly a 'short cut' for the bank to identify the transaction. 

With all TMB transfers, there is no partner reference at all. When I get time I intend to contact TW to ask for clarification and see whether there's a similar reference number we might use to identify TMB transactions. 

 

 

 

 

6 hours ago, steve73 said:

 

 

 

[Maestro]

8 hours ago, steve73 said:

I've used TW to send to my Kasikornbank 17 times.  6 were via TBM, 5 via BBL, and 6 via KBL (which were the only ones recorded as INTL).

 

It does seem that if you bank with BBL there is a higher probability of them sending via that bank, but as we have seen it is not guaranteed.

 

Better that we put our efforts into getting our recipient banks to correctly code the transfers irrespective of what partner bank TW (& others) uses for each particular transfer.... or if not "correctly" coded, at least coded suitably for Immigration's needs. 

 

I don't recall seeing any posts from people using TW to send to their account in one of the "other" banks in Thailand (i.e. not TMB, BBL or KBL)... I would assume that all of such transfers would be coded as domestic... Has anyone done this?

To which bank are you referring with the code KBL and where does this code come from?

[steve73]

1 hour ago, sumrit said:

 

One thing I have noticed though is that, on the PDF of the Transferwise Transfer Confirmation Receipt, with ALL transfers that use the Bangkok bank as the banking partner, there is an eight-digit  'banking partner reference ' number near the bottom of the page, and it's specific to that particular transfer, so that's possibly a 'short cut' for the bank to identify the transaction. 

With all TMB transfers, there is no partner reference at all. When I get time I intend to contact TW to ask for clarification and see whether there's a similar reference number we might use to identify TMB transactions. 

Thanks, I'd not noticed the banking partner reference before... but even this is inconsistent.

Coming via TMB it has never been shown.

Via BBL it was shown once (from 5)... but still coded as dummy. 

When via Kasikornbank (KBL) it was shown 3 times from 6 (and one of those had 2 numbers (but all payments were shown up as international).  

 

(Apologies for using KBL rather than KBANK for the pedantic amongst you.)

[OJAS]

11 hours ago, Sheryl said:

As has been said several times before Bangkok Bank will not always record TW payments as foreign transfers. Only if TW used them for that batch of transfers; they may use any of 3 different partner banks and you cannot choose which nor know in advance. At present they use BB the most, seems like 90-95% of the time (this could change) and this is what has given rise to the mistaken idea that having one's account at BB gurantees TW transfers will always be coded FTT. Not always, as many TV members can attest.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Agreed - I am 1 said TV member who can so attest on the basis of personal experience!

 

@theoldgit- if you do manage to open an account with Bangkok Bank, you might like to consider registering for the service which they provide for making transfers via their London branch, as set out in the folliowing link:-

 

https://www.bangkokbank.com/en/Personal/Other-Services/Transfers/Transferring-Into-Thailand/Transfer-money-from-UK-to-Thailand-via-London-Branch

 

Since these are de facto inter-UK bank BACS or Faster Payments Service transfers (to UK sort code and account numbers), Santander may allow you to initiate them online without the need to call them each month.

 

I myself have reverted to using this method for my 65k+ monthly transfers from my UK account after 18 months of using TransferWise. You can choose to have the GBP-to-THB conversion performed either pre-transfer in London at a flat rate of £15, or post-transfer in Bangkok at a flat rate of £20 plus 0.25% of the THB conversion between a minimum of 200 THB and maximum of 500 THB. Despite the apparent higher charges, the perceived wisdom on here has always been that it is better to have the conversion performed in Bangkok, because the rate used by the London branch is way inferior to the corresponding TT rate used at the Bangkok end. This is the option which I use, and I gather from a recent comment by @Kalasin Jo on here that it is now the way to go in any event in order to guarantee the coveted FTT coding for each transfer in your passbook (apparently conversions performed in London are coded as internal Thai transfers).

 

Finally, I have not heard any rumours to the effect that Bangkok Bank's London branch is planning to discontinue offering this service in the way that its New York counterpart will shortly be doing, as has been reported extensively on here.

 

[JTXR]

An update to the original post....

I just made another SWIFT transfer to Bangkok Bank from the same credit union in the U.S., doing everything exactly the same, EXCEPT I asked that the transfer be in $ instead of in baht.  This time the transfer showed in Bangkok Bank as an international transfer.  Since I want to do this every month and be at least 65K baht on the receiving end, I'll need to build in a bit of a cushion to take into account possible exchange rate differences, still, it's good to know.

 

So, even if doing SWIFT transfers from bank or credit union, be sure to make the transaction in foreign currency, not in baht.

[xylophone]

6 minutes ago, JTXR said:

An update to the original post....

I just made another SWIFT transfer to Bangkok Bank from the same credit union in the U.S., doing everything exactly the same, EXCEPT I asked that the transfer be in $ instead of in baht.  This time the transfer showed in Bangkok Bank as an international transfer.  Since I want to do this every month and be at least 65K baht on the receiving end, I'll need to build in a bit of a cushion to take into account possible exchange rate differences, still, it's good to know.

 

So, even if doing SWIFT transfers from bank or credit union, be sure to make the transaction in foreign currency, not in baht.

Yes I found out the same when I contacted my Bangkok Bank branch in London. If they send it in pounds all seems well apart from the exorbitant fees!

[JTXR]

3 minutes ago, xylophone said:

Yes I found out the same when I contacted my Bangkok Bank branch in London. If they send it in pounds all seems well apart from the exorbitant fees!

Actually, the fees charged by my credit union were the same, and the exchange rate turned out to be better.  Go figure.

[xylophone]

6 minutes ago, JTXR said:

Actually, the fees charged by my credit union were the same, and the exchange rate turned out to be better.  Go figure.

Lucky man JTXR.........my total fees turned out to be about 5.5% of my transferred amount!!

[steve73]

3 hours ago, JTXR said:

Actually, the fees charged by my credit union were the same, and the exchange rate turned out to be better.  Go figure.

If you send your payment in THB, then it should be converted immediately (and you will usually be advised what Fx rate it will be), but if you send foreign currency, then it only gets converted on arrival, and the rate may have changed - up or down... this could be why it sometimes seems better.

 

In the past when I used to send GBP to Kasikorn, it would often be credited to my account after 5 days.. and I would get the banks lowest rate in that period, and with GBP it could be +/- 2% (or more recently) during the course of a week.  My sending banks THB rate was even worse, so that was not an option.  But then I discovered Xendpay (and later Transferwise) that allowed me to fix my rate, and reduce fees... but it's just a pity that these systems to do always get coded as international, depending on which partner bank they use in Thailand.

[Kadilo]

9 hours ago, steve73 said:

If you send your payment in THB, then it should be converted immediately (and you will usually be advised what Fx rate it will be), but if you send foreign currency, then it only gets converted on arrival, and the rate may have changed - up or down... this could be why it sometimes seems better.

 

In the past when I used to send GBP to Kasikorn, it would often be credited to my account after 5 days.. and I would get the banks lowest rate in that period, and with GBP it could be +/- 2% (or more recently) during the course of a week.  My sending banks THB rate was even worse, so that was not an option.  But then I discovered Xendpay (and later Transferwise) that allowed me to fix my rate, and reduce fees... but it's just a pity that these systems to do always get coded as international, depending on which partner bank they use in Thailand.

I sent Swift to Kasikorn last week in GBP, arrived the same day and got the same rate as Transferwise. Granted you lose out in the fee. 

[WeekendRaider]

going back at least 5 years, Charles Schwab to my local Bangkok Bank branch always shown as FTT.  SWIFT via request by airmail.  used to request transfers by fax but the USA switched to a "digital fax" which is difficult to find here.  in fact, never found such a fax in Chiangmai yet.  but didn't look too hard either.  anyone know?

so it used to be the income affadavit was simple and sure.   I'm done for one year now and will see how this works later, I am trying to delay US Soc Sec until 67 and that's 4 years out still for me.  but if that becomes better than 800K in a bank... maybe it changes my mind about waiting for Soc Sec because direct deposit to BBL would seem to be a cinch for TI to verify.  

[Henryford]

On 2/28/2019 at 11:14 AM, theoldgit said:

Santander International have just confirmed that in order for me to send Sterling from my account in Jersey I will need to call them in Jersey, they've also confirmed that they use a correspondent bank who will also deduct a fee, and of course I'm already aware that Kasikorn would also charge a fee of 500 Baht to receive it. I calculate that this would cost me in the region of an extra 25,000 Baht a year and still run the risk that the correspondent bank would log the deposit into my Kasikorn account as domestic.

 

Looks like I'm going to try and open an account with Bangkok Bank and hope they continue to record TW deposits as foreign deposits.

 

This whole debacle is totally unnecessary.

Look at my recent post and failure to get a BB account. This whole thing is crazy. I have the monthly income but can't prove it.