Big trouble at sadao border

[dnrot]

Hi everybody

I've been visiting thailand for a long time,my first visit dates back from 1973,i'm from a generation who contributed to make this country more and more popular year after year.i'm now 69 and since my retirement my visits more frequent,roughly speaking twice a year,mid february to beginning

april,and summer time from end june to mid september at most.I've used tourist visas ,exemption visas as well due to my visits to neighbouring countries as long as I didn't need visas for staying under the 30 days limit.i've never used extension process but once in 2012,never overstayed  and never questionned neither.

One of my favorite ''escape''is penang,which is a place I envoy particularly,combined with the fact it used to be an easy going place to make visas

and several times I used this facility with no problem,and my return to thailand done through the usual sadao border .

Last year I didn't make visa and the superviser commited just informed on the twice a year limit for overland visa exemptions,and it was just the first one,but nothing more.

Then,I used the same way this year,I stayed 10 days in bkk,had booked plane ticket to penang to cover possible bickering from the Airlines companion with their overzealous check ing we're complying to thailand regulations (by the way i'be grateful to anybody who would produce an official statement refereing to this ticket out of the country within 30days),no visa again for the same reason.

And this time at Sadao the trouble begins. 

It goes without saying my passeport is filled with stamps,visas from thailand and neighbouring countries,and i'm aware of the tightening context

which prevails in thailand with foreigners of all kind (except chinese of course),as the thaivisa forum suggest,and my post here should be another

mark of this turn,and is meant to provide information for people crossing there and not being caught unawares. 

It happened on march 9th, and after looking thoroughly,but no questionning, the officer sent me to supervisors,two women the younger one overly 

disgrâce full, not really talkative,the elder one,probably the superior, asked money ,return ticket,and booking which actually I hadn't,because the place I go regularly doesn't provide this kind of service,but i'd the card..then she said ok,and turned over to the other one who at last said

''What are you doing in thailand ? ''Then,as a retired,I spend some time there,call it holidays,then,what's the real problem?

From there,no answer at all,but the mention,i'll be forbidden using visa exemptions ,inscribed in the passport and of course in the data base of theirc computeurs as well,and finally they let me go with my last 30 days.

At this point it raises several points.

I don't see the point of making visas all the time.If I stay just for a few days,I should waste it once admitted in the country ?And making another one for a new entrance?Bearing in mind visas delivery is also tigntening everywhere as suggested in more and more post here..so it means in practice it should make practically untractable visiting thailand for the future.

Or else,making a non imm O visa in paris ( i'm french)as I did last summer,but not  being able to go out during the 90 days validity because of the neighbouring consulates more and more unfriendly? 

I'm really disgusted with  human sillyness and particularly with the rubbertape one,for the first time i'm wondering if I shouldn't tell them

''Go to hell'' once and for all!

To top it all,at the same time à young german guyin it's 30's was seriously questionned as he ''didn't look german",he was actually slightly tan skinned and then his passport was conclusively forged ! And where did you get this fake..and so on!

Yes,at this juncture,no further comment is need éd, when it comes to this level of filth in the head...go on like this folks and long life to dumbheads

[PoorSucker]

29 minutes ago, dnrot said:

making a non imm O visa in paris ( i'm french)as I did last summer,but not  being able to go out during the 90 days validity because of the neighbouring consulates more and more unfriendly? 

Get a multiple entry non-o, then you can enter unlimited times during a year, each time receiving 90 days. 

Or even better a Non-OA that gives you one year permission to stay every time you enter during a year. 

Only difference when applying is that the Non-OA requires a health declaration and police report. 

The Non-OA can be used for two years if you get a multiple entry re-entry permit the second year. 

[Briggsy]

Going in and out as you please, those days are over.

 

However since you are only in Thailand for less than 16 weeks per year, a little planning of tourist visas and re-entry permits and dates of travel and you can still achieve this.

[dcnx]

58 minutes ago, dnrot said:

,i'm from a generation who contributed to make this country more and more popular year after year.

None of that matters. Unfortunately, too many of you don’t understand that.

 

How much you spend or contribute here means nothing and you’re not looked upon any differently than a dirty backpacker showing up for the first time.

 

You’re (we’re) all grouped together as either farang or farang khee nok. The latter reserved for those who don’t waste their money on obvious inflated prices, scams, and rip-offs.

 

 

 

[Happystance]

Proof of onward travel within 30 days, for those seeking 30 day visa exemption, is posted on each Thai embassy and consulate pages.

Those with a visa are not required, in theory. 

This is my experience anyways.

 

I was just stopped with a one-way ticket to BKK and asked for proof of onward by an airline agent who clearly wasn't going to let me board, until his supervisor noticed my visa and apologized.

 

These days, with the immigration climate being so tenuous, I always buy a cancellable ticket out of the country.

Costs me nothing but time and covers that base regardless.

[dnrot]

I'm perfectly aware of the situation getting worse and worse up to pushing people out of the country long time residents included,let alone people like me they don't give a damn I spend money in thailand or not,But it won't prevent me from thinking they're nothing but brainless..

I'm not sure I can get multiple non immigrant O in paris,and report ing to police Thanks but french police is already enough for me

As to the reference to embassy to suggest the required return ticket within 30days it's improper as embases have no say in fixing regulations allowing entrance in the country,they just take care of visa delivery,and  i've never been asked at immigration to show this ticket,the only proper ground for rejection being,as far as I know,the money concernant ten ortwenty thousand bahts,that's why I was ask ing a statement from the immigration  making this requirements clearly set

[Kenchamp]

4 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

Get a multiple entry non-o, then you can enter unlimited times during a year, each time receiving 90 days. 

 

I have a feeling that before long they will be scrutinizing people with non o's. 

[JackThompson]

4 hours ago, dcnx said:

How much you spend or contribute here means nothing and you’re not looked upon any differently than a dirty backpacker showing up for the first time.

On the contrary, a dirty backpacker on their first visit gets better treatment.  So does the once-per-year go-go bar tourist, in "furlough from jail" mode, who is three sheets to the wind his entire stay. 

 

It's the more "settled" farangs, who have some knowledge of the language and customs, and who spend money here over a longer period, that they consider "problem" visitors who Must Be Stopped.

[Thailand Outcast]

17 minutes ago, Kenchamp said:

I have a feeling that before long they will be scrutinizing people with non o's. 

This is also my thinking.  For sure they don't worry if a few people change to O-A but there could be thousands of people change to this visa. 

[JackThompson]

5 hours ago, dnrot said:

And this time at Sadao the trouble begins. 

It goes without saying my passeport is filled with stamps,visas from thailand and neighbouring countries,and i'm aware of the tightening context which prevails in thailand with foreigners of all kind (except chinese of course),as the thaivisa forum suggest,and my post here should be another mark of this turn,and is meant to provide information for people crossing there and not being caught unawares. 

 

It happened on march 9th, and after looking thoroughly,but no questionning, the officer sent me to supervisors,two women the younger one overly disgrâce full, not really talkative,the elder one,probably the superior, asked money ,return ticket,and booking

The "Money" is 10K Baht (for visa-exempt - 20K Baht with a Visa), the "Ticket" needs to be out within 30-days, the "Booking" can be a simple as a refundable/free hotel booking made online.

 

Those are standard, published rules for visa-exempt entry (land or air), though not enforced all the time.  Those with more history get more scrutiny (per my post, above). 

 

Also note that Sadao is not a particularly friendly place, since their "put money in your passport to enter" scam was shut down.  That system avoided providing those requirements.  Still, it is much better than the truly bad entry points, where one can be denied even if having everything required, and even a valid Visa for entry.

Edited March 10, 2019 by JackThompson

[PoorSucker]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

 

Also note that Sadao is not a particularly friendly place. 

From sadao 20 years ago. 

[Baerboxer]

12 hours ago, dnrot said:

I'm perfectly aware of the situation getting worse and worse up to pushing people out of the country long time residents included,let alone people like me they don't give a damn I spend money in thailand or not,But it won't prevent me from thinking they're nothing but brainless..

I'm not sure I can get multiple non immigrant O in paris,and report ing to police Thanks but french police is already enough for me

As to the reference to embassy to suggest the required return ticket within 30days it's improper as embases have no say in fixing regulations allowing entrance in the country,they just take care of visa delivery,and  i've never been asked at immigration to show this ticket,the only proper ground for rejection being,as far as I know,the money concernant ten ortwenty thousand bahts,that's why I was ask ing a statement from the immigration  making this requirements clearly set

 

Reverse the situation. Ask yourself if a Thai national could visit France, whenever they liked, on a Visa waiver, and doing this regularly without raising interest from French immigration?

 

I remember once standing behind several Indians entering Malaysia at KLIA. They had to show out bound tickets, hotel reservations, money etc. When I walked up it was just a smile and a stamp in the passport.

 

But those days are over. Europeans and other "Westerners" are no longer automatically treated as some elite upper class. Sorry but that's how it is.

 

There have been some good suggestions on what visas and re-entry permits might be useful to you. 

[JackThompson]

10 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

From sadao 20 years ago.

Yes, but during the period where you could put 100/200 Baht in your passport, it was a breeze.  The system is similar to entering many Latin American countries by land-border - they just ask for $1 or something, and no problems.

 

Contrast to Aranya/Poipet now, where their "fixers" ask 20K Baht for hassle-free entry.

[JackThompson]

40 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

Reverse the situation. Ask yourself if a Thai national could visit France, whenever they liked, on a Visa waiver, and doing this regularly without raising interest from French immigration?

Ask yourself whether a French national could come to Thailand, and take an illegal-job paying many times what a job they could get in France would pay. 

 

40 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

I remember once standing behind several Indians entering Malaysia at KLIA. They had to show out bound tickets, hotel reservations, money etc. When I walked up it was just a smile and a stamp in the passport.

Yes, because you would have no reason to take a job illegally, there.  The folks from India are much more likely to have that motivation, and are likely labeled as a "class or group" who have a history of breaking the law - working while on tourist-entries and overstaying to continue that illegal work.  And, in the process of doing this, driving down wages for the citizens who are not directly replaced, by flooding the labor-market with "will work cheap" offers.

 

40 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

But those days are over. Europeans and other "Westerners" are no longer automatically treated as some elite upper class. Sorry but that's how it is.

In other words, immigration is - in a few nations only - ignoring economic-reality, and screwing their own citizens out of making money from self-funded foreigners who have no reason to compete with them for jobs in their own country. 

[BritManToo]

12 hours ago, Kenchamp said:

I have a feeling that before long they will be scrutinizing people with non o's. 

They already are, at the Poipet/Aranyaprathet border when I left and entered in January.

[mokwit]

I have a feeling that before long they will be scrutinizing people with Elite visas

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

They already are, at the Poipet/Aranyaprathet border when I left and entered in January.

Beginning to wonder why on Earth anyone uses that border. I used it once when Thaksin was here and the place disgusted me!

[egypte]

Entered Thailand 4 days ago at Sadao Border without any issue and only smiles from the officer.

On a French passport with Extension based on retirement and Muli Re-Entry.

No questions asked, except where do you come from and where are you going to.

[BritManToo]

32 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Beginning to wonder why on Earth anyone uses that border. I used it once when Thaksin was here and the place disgusted me!

It's the main bus route from Vietnam/Cambodia to Thailand.

I was going on holiday, fly to Saigon for a week, bus to Phnom Penh for a week, then bus to Siam Reap for a week. Changed my mind, will now miss Siam Reap and go to Koh Kong and use the border there to return to Chiang Mai.

 

Trat to Bangkok and Aranyaprathet to Bangkok are about the same bus travel time.

Edited March 11, 2019 by BritManToo

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

It's the main bus route from Vietnam/Cambodia to Thailand.

Could you not change bus in PP and come in further south, seems an idea if your target was Pattaya area,

[JackThompson]

1 minute ago, jacko45k said:

Could you not change bus in PP and come in further south, seems an idea if your target was Pattaya area,

In my experience, it is less of a PITA to change in Battambang to a shared-taxi going to Ban Laem, if coming from PP.  The route to KK was slow, when I last did it (though worth doing once for the scenery).  Maybe there are faster hops (VIP vans?) PP to KK now. 

 

That said, and though I would not recommend it, I can understand why folks prefer the Aranya entry-point, as you can get a big-bus direct to Bangkok or Pattaya (yellow-bus) from there, and avoid vans and such.

[dnrot]

I'm perfectly aware of the situation getting worse and worse up to pushing people out of the country long time residents included,let alone people like me they don't give a damn I spend money in thailand or not,But it won't prevent me from thinking they're nothing but brainless..

I'm not sure I can get multiple non immigrant O in paris,and report ing to police Thanks but french police is already enough for me

As to the reference to embassy to suggest the required return ticket within 30days it's improper as embases have no say in fixing regulations allowing entrance in the country,they just take care of visa delivery,and  i've never been asked at immigration to show this ticket,the only proper ground for rejection being,as far as I know,the money concernant ten ortwenty thousand bahts,that's why I was ask ing a statement from the immigration  making this requirements clearly set

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Could you not change bus in PP and come in further south, seems an idea if your target was Pattaya area,

I've taken your advice, ditched the trip to Siam Reap.

 

Instead getting the bus from Phnom Penh to Koh Kong ($12) and staying there a week.

Then over the border, bus/van to Trat, then Trat to Bangkok 310bht, then Bangkok to Chiang Mai 500bht

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Instead getting the bus from Phnom Penh to Koh Kong ($12) and staying there a week.

What on earth will you do there for so long?

[dnrot]

To baerboxer 

I don't demand any kind of ''elite treatment''but just a fair treat ment  along with the official regulations,and not being exposed to arbitrary..any country lay down it's own rules and has sovereignty to let in or not,But here there is no serious ground to give  me the hard time of it and so far i'd never had any problem..I asked the police what 's the problem,and I couldn't elicit any answer

The reference to france as the way they treat thai people is off Subject, thailand could impose the same and then I wouldn't go once and for all,I just claim respect of their own law

[mrmicbkktxl]

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Reverse the situation. Ask yourself if a Thai national could visit France, whenever they liked, on a Visa waiver, and doing this regularly without raising interest from French immigration?

 

I remember once standing behind several Indians entering Malaysia at KLIA. They had to show out bound tickets, hotel reservations, money etc. When I walked up it was just a smile and a stamp in the passport.

 

But those days are over. Europeans and other "Westerners" are no longer automatically treated as some elite upper class. Sorry but that's how it is.

 

There have been some good suggestions on what visas and re-entry permits might be useful to you. 

You are comparing apples with pears.France is a 1st world country,Thailand is 3rd world country.I don't think french come to Thai because they want to work here,Thais would love to go to any western country if they could, and work there.Also Thais 90% love to overstay their visa or misuse their visa[ask the Japanese and Koreans.If the immigration wouldn't be so lazy or stupid,they would separate between 1st world countries,2nd... 3rd.... and...............,actually they doing that already,most westerners get a 30 VOA,some 15days and some need a visa from their embassy,but when it comes to multiple entries they put all non Thais in one bucket.They can not or don't want to understand some westerners have money and time to travel around,so they asking stupid questions like'are you working here?'I think 99% of westerners what come here on a VOA are genuine tourists,and like the OP  said'why I should get a visa if I stay only a few days"Why Thai immigration must treat airport arrivals different from land border arrivals?Why Thai immigration treats a westerner the same way as a guy from Cambodia or Myanmar?It is obviously that  Cambodians not travel to Thailand for a beach vacation.

If they don't want non Thais travel around including neighboring countries,then they should say so clearly on their immigration or embassy website.,but that will never ever happen Thais are happy with their shi. mentality[nothing is sure] and if westerners don't like it they should stay home,since the Chinese and Indians are coming they no need westerners anymore

[JustAnotherHun]

2 minutes ago, mrmicbkktxl said:

You are comparing apples with pears.France is a 1st world country,Thailand is 3rd world country.I don't think french come to Thai because they want to work here,

Even a well-off Thai could not live over years on back to back TVs in any EU country. That's fact.

[BritManToo]

15 minutes ago, mrmicbkktxl said:

Thai immigration treats a westerner the same way as a guy from Cambodia or Myanmar?

Cambodians get much easier treatment than white guys, takes them 10 minutes to cross, we queue for an hour.

[Youlike]

12 minutes ago, JustAnotherHun said:

Even a well-off Thai could not live over years on back to back TVs in any EU country. That's fact.

Thaksin bought himself a EU passport....plus a whole island.

[mrmicbkktxl]

Just now, BritManToo said:

Cambodians get much easier treatment than white guys, takes them 10 minutes to cross, we queue for an hour.

Yes on land borders,I think they no need to show a passport,they get a day pass and can not leave the province they came in