Do you believe in God and why

[ThaiBunny]

15 hours ago, Centra said:

the Great B was a prince who deserted his young wife and child on the night of his birth

He's certainly my role model - can't stand babies

[VincentRJ]

On 6/18/2019 at 9:04 PM, Centra said:

The fact that the Great B was a prince who deserted his young wife and child on the night of his birth, is such a great role model to many Asian countries defies my logical thinking.

Perhaps I can help you understand the situation. As a prince, or at least the son of a major warrior chieftain, Gautama was in a very privileged environment, living in a guarded palace with lots of servants and workers taking care of all chores.

 

Leaving his wife and child would presumably have had an emotional effect on his wife, but not directly on the child who was too young to have any conception of a father. Both of them would have been fully taken care of, despite the temporary absence of the husband for a period of 6 years.

 

My own father was also absent for the first 3 to 4 years of my life, because he was a soldier in WWII. I was born in 1942. I have no memory of his absence. My first memories begin from the age of around 4, or maybe 3 & 1/2.

 

If you've ever traveled abroad to significantly undeveloped countries, you should have been emotionally affected by the suffering of homeless, sick and deformed people, often sitting, lying down, and sleeping by the road-side in the most awful conditions.

 

During the times of the Buddha, about 2,500 years ago in India, one can only imagine how awful conditions must have been for so many poor and underprivileged people, without the benefit of modern medication, painkillers, anesthetics, and surgery.

 

That someone from a protected and privileged environment would voluntarily leave that environment (palace) in order to find a solution to the awful suffering he had witnessed outside of the palace, is very commendable and very unselfish.

 

Unfortunately, there are no written scripts from those times. Everything was transmitted through memory. The following story of events, from the book "Old Path White Clouds" by Thich Nhat Hanh, reads like a reasonable re-creation of what could have happened.
https://www.quora.com/Why-did-Gautam-Buddha-leave-his-wife-only-after-one-night

 

"In short - Siddhartha was disgusted by the corruption, thirst of power, selfish ambitions and jealousy among people in politics. He was aware that true liberation from suffering won't come from mere social works and changing social rules, but from inner transformation of individuals. And he wanted to find a way which can give true liberation to people."

 

Read the 'long story' for more details. 

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 3:49 AM, Elad said:

Empty space is something, it contains the geodesics of spacetime.

This spacetime can be curved or distorted which gives the effects of 'gravity' and 'time dilation' which was briefly mentioned earlier.  

Sooooo, explain in understandable terms HOW empty space contains the geodesics of spacetime, or are you claiming that it just randomly "happened", all by itself. Nothing happens by itself.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 6:38 PM, ThaiBunny said:

And why when something truly horrible has happened do people "pray" for the survivors and their families. God didn't prevent the event but She's going to provide balm, solace and succour for the survivors?

Why oh why do the non believers keep confusing "god" with religion?

People can pray all they like, but it's not going to make any difference except maybe make them feel better.

What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?

People are so insignificant on a cosmic scale, that I can't imagine a supreme being that gives a rat's bottom about us as individuals. In a cosmic blink we'll all be extinct anyway, so what does it matter, except to us?

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 4:11 PM, skippybangkok said:

 

Here is another interesting one - Ramadan - fasting from sun up to sun down ( so one knows what it like to be poor - good concept actually )

 

But - obviously god was unaware that the sun does not set in the Summer in the arctic - I guess he is forgetful ? Antartica in winter - no need to fast !

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

You are obviously unaware that Islam has a convenient exeptions clause that covers almost every situation.

Unfortunately, many Muslims are also unaware of it.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 1:43 AM, notmyself said:

 

Given the number of times this has been explained it could well be fair to say you are being disingenuous but it is possible you have missed the numerous posts so I shall go with that.

 

Atheism is, by definition, a response to a claim rather than a claim itself so saying atheists (apparently) believe the one universe we can be sure of was both created and created from nothing, is imagined.. pulled out of thin air.. made up. Rather than dig up an example from the thread where I try to simplify using real world situations, I'll keep it simple or short.

 

Person #1 - x is true - claim

Person #2 - I don't believe you - response to said claim

 

Knowingly adding any inference to this basic logic is dishonest.

 

 

 

except that when someone claims that someone's belief is wrong or mistaken, it behooves that someone to provide more proof than just saying that "they" don't believe it.

 

so saying atheists (apparently) believe the one universe we can be sure of was both created and created from nothing, is imagined.. pulled out of thin air.. made up.

I have no idea of the point you are trying to make with that.

 

If "god" didn't make life, the universe and everything, from whence did it come? Science can not prove how it was created. Best they can do is say it started at the big bang. Soooo, what made the big bang happen, and from where did all the material to make the galaxies come?

No one has yet answered that question in a realistic manner.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎6‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 3:06 AM, notmyself said:

Related to this.... By shifting the burden of proof (it's not been proven false) it necessitates believing in 2 (or more) things that directly contradict each other

and those 2 ( or more ) things are?

[thaibeachlovers]

 

On ‎6‎/‎17‎/‎2019 at 6:44 PM, transam said:

We must turn the other cheek, must forgive.....Something like that....Well "god" should practice what he preaches...????

Why do you think "god" has any of the thought processes of humans?

 

[luckyluke]

29 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Nothing happens by itself.

Not even the god you consider as the only real/unique one? 

[transam]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

 

Why do you think "god" has any of the thought processes of humans?

 

Well he did send his "son" down to sort us lot out, the "book" says he was a nice bloke, and it seems all the writers of that "book" do not write anything other than that...

[thaibeachlovers]

15 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

Not even the god you consider as the only real/unique one? 

55555555555555555555555555

I already asked that question, "where did "god" come from".  

[thaibeachlovers]

13 minutes ago, transam said:

Well he did send his "son" down to sort us lot out, the "book" says he was a nice bloke, and it seems all the writers of that "book" do not write anything other than that...

That was an explanation simple minded people could understand. If "god" sent an emissary to earth, it would have to be in a form that the people could understand. However, he once appeared as a burning bush.

[transam]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That was an explanation simple minded people could understand. If "god" sent an emissary to earth, it would have to be in a form that the people could understand. However, he once appeared as a burning bush.

And a.......

 

[skippybangkok]

Why oh why do the non believers keep confusing "god" with religion?
People can pray all they like, but it's not going to make any difference except maybe make them feel better.
What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?
People are so insignificant on a cosmic scale, that I can't imagine a supreme being that gives a rat's bottom about us as individuals. In a cosmic blink we'll all be extinct anyway, so what does it matter, except to us?

So who created Gala ?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[thaibeachlovers]

30 minutes ago, skippybangkok said:

 

So who created Gala ?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

I asked that 4 posts ago.

[ThaiBunny]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?

What an utterly pointless belief

[ThaiBunny]

49 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That was an explanation simple minded people could understand. If "god" sent an emissary to earth, it would have to be in a form that the people could understand. However, he once appeared as a burning bush.

I once had a girlfriend with a burning bush. Turned out to be crabs

[thaibeachlovers]

6 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

What an utterly pointless belief

Do you realise that you just wrote a pointless post to complain that mine was pointless:-)

[ThaiBunny]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Do you realise that you just wrote a pointless post to complain that mine was pointless:-)

Therefore in keeping with the the entire thread

[StreetCowboy]

9 hours ago, skippybangkok said:

 

So who created Gala ?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

Picts

[StreetCowboy]

10 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

except that when someone claims that someone's belief is wrong or mistaken, it behooves that someone to provide more proof than just saying that "they" don't believe it.

 

so saying atheists (apparently) believe the one universe we can be sure of was both created and created from nothing, is imagined.. pulled out of thin air.. made up.

I have no idea of the point you are trying to make with that.

 

If "god" didn't make life, the universe and everything, from whence did it come? Science can not prove how it was created. Best they can do is say it started at the big bang. Soooo, what made the big bang happen, and from where did all the material to make the galaxies come?

No one has yet answered that question in a realistic manner.

 

The universe is merely temporal, a fluctuation in the fabric of space and time.  Both matter and anti-matter exist in equal and balanced abundance, and occur as the ebb and flow of fluctuations in the nothingness of space.

 

I think that's a bit simpler and easier to comprehend, and makes more sense than the Book of gGenesis, and does not rely on any third party for its justification.  I'm not sure how you are going to come up with any evidence to disprove it, and I rely on Occam's Razor to carry the house.

 

[Skallywag]

On 4/27/2019 at 3:43 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

I prefer to use "Spirit", because it's non-personal. 

Hormones produce the feeling of love, or is it the other way around... the release of hormones are a consequence of the feeling?

Enjoy people whose "spirits" put forth benevolence and love and positiveness .

 

Spirit comes from within - no need to search out how or why,  just live in that positive way

 

 

[Elad]

13 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Sooooo, explain in understandable terms HOW empty space contains the geodesics of spacetime, or are you claiming that it just randomly "happened", all by itself. Nothing happens by itself.

Geodesics are the notion of a straight line, for example, when flying to Thailand from the UK or USA at 30,000 ft you appear to be travelling in a straight line, however, the flight path is in fact a large circular arc, because the plane follows the geodesics around the surface of the Earth.

 

It's the same in space, particles and photons of light follow geodesics along 4D spacetime, and in the presence of large bodies of mass the 4D spacetime is curved or warped and thus the particles or photons just follow the geodesics of the curved spacetime. Earth follows a geodesic path around the sun and so does the moon around the Earth.

 

Gravity is not a force, it's a consequence of curved 4D spacetime.

 

If you accelerate in a car at 9.81 m s^-2 then you will feel the force of the seat pushing into your back and shoulders, whereas, If you jump off a high rise building, you will also accelerate at 9.81 m s^-2 but you wouldn't feel any force on your shoulders, if there wasn't any air resistance and you had your eyes closed then you would just feel like you're floating. This is because you are just following the geodesics of 4D spacetime which point directly towards the centre of the Earth.

 

Scientists don't know how the universe started. The big bang theory is their best current model and there's plenty of evidence to support it such as the 'Cosmic Microwave Background Radiation' (CMBR), evidence of when the first atoms formed around 300,000 years after the big bang.       

[dick dasterdly]

23 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Why oh why do the non believers keep confusing "god" with religion?

People can pray all they like, but it's not going to make any difference except maybe make them feel better.

What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?

People are so insignificant on a cosmic scale, that I can't imagine a supreme being that gives a rat's bottom about us as individuals. In a cosmic blink we'll all be extinct anyway, so what does it matter, except to us?

Good points, well made.

 

"What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?"

 

Certainly somewhat more believable than the standard 'god' line promoted by various religions, but why would any 'god' bother, bearing in mind they had no interest in the result?

[ThaiBunny]

15 hours ago, StreetCowboy said:

I rely on Occam's Razor to carry the house

You're going for the "close shave" result?

[ThaiBunny]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

but why would any 'god' bother, bearing in mind they had no interest in the result?

Everyone needs a hobby. She went on to try to create a better one, having comprehensively screwed up on this one

[UASCB500BIKER]

NO NO  NO.....Aliens  ALiens  Aliens  in space SHIPS,,  UUU Saw fake ggggooooddd....Da Da ....Book of Fairty Tails !!!!  UUU Seeing visons called Lack of Oxgyen to your Simple Brain....Quit being a Child !!!!  Close This 100 Pages......Are uuuu a Jesus FREAKE Too....

[Skeptic7]

On 6/20/2019 at 11:52 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

Why oh why do the non believers keep confusing "god" with religion?

People can pray all they like, but it's not going to make any difference except maybe make them feel better.

What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?

People are so insignificant on a cosmic scale, that I can't imagine a supreme being that gives a rat's bottom about us as individuals. In a cosmic blink we'll all be extinct anyway, so what does it matter, except to us?

So let's see if I've got this straight...

 

You're proposing some thing...which is somewhere...about which you have no clue...no evidence...no name...no idea...no proof...no explanation...and it is incomprehensible to humans...doesn't give a shit about humans...does not now, nor has it ever, interacted with humans...yet (un)said thing created the Universe...EVERYTHING...and has gone off 'to do something else'. 

 

Why should anyone care? Why do you? What's the difference between a pulled-out-of-ass-proposal like yours and something that doesn't exist? Even if it did exist...you'd never know! By your own admission...humans can never even remotely understand it, nor interact with it and humans are insignificant to it and it has gone away. YOU'D NEVER KNOW. 

 

So again I ask...as I have for 117 pages now...WHY SHOULD WE CARE? Why do you? What the difference between this idea which can never be understood, never be interacted with and NEVER be realized...

 

...and something which doesn't exist?

 

5 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

Good points, well made.

 

"What's so hard about believing that "god' or "Gaia" or whatever created the heavens and the earth, life itself, and then went off to do something else, leaving planet earth to get on with it without intervening?"

 

Certainly somewhat more believable than the standard 'god' line promoted by various religions, but why would any 'god' bother, bearing in mind they had no interest in the result?

Good points? Well made? Really??? I disagree. He's been spouting off about this woo-THING about which there is no evidence, no interaction, cannot be understood...BLAH BLAH YADDA YADDA...for 2 months running. 

 

It's nonsense. Offers up nothing. As previously stated...NO difference between this and something that doesn't exist BECAUSE HE...YOU...ME...ALL OF US...WOULD NEVER KNOW AND IT DOESN'T CARE AND DOESN'T WANT YOU TO KNOW. 

 

And even if, for the sake of argument, it does exist...we'd NEVER know. So why is it a good, well made point?  

[StreetCowboy]

2 hours ago, Skeptic7 said:

So let's see if I've got this straight...

 

You're proposing some thing...which is somewhere...about which you have no clue...no evidence...no name...no idea...no proof...no explanation...and it is incomprehensible to humans...doesn't give a shit about humans...does not now, nor has it ever, interacted with humans...yet (un)said thing created the Universe...EVERYTHING...and has gone off 'to do something else'. 

 

Why should anyone care? Why do you? What's the difference between a pulled-out-of-ass-proposal like yours and something that doesn't exist? Even if it did exist...you'd never know! By your own admission...humans can never even remotely understand it, nor interact with it and humans are insignificant to it and it has gone away. YOU'D NEVER KNOW. 

 

So again I ask...as I have for 117 pages now...WHY SHOULD WE CARE? Why do you? What the difference between this idea which can never be understood, never be interacted with and NEVER be realized...

 

...and something which doesn't exist?

 

Good points? Well made? Really??? I disagree. He's been spouting off about this woo-THING about which there is no evidence, no interaction, cannot be understood...BLAH BLAH YADDA YADDA...for 2 months running. 

 

It's nonsense. Offers up nothing. As previously stated...NO difference between this and something that doesn't exist BECAUSE HE...YOU...ME...ALL OF US...WOULD NEVER KNOW AND IT DOESN'T CARE AND DOESN'T WANT YOU TO KNOW. 

 

And even if, for the sake of argument, it does exist...we'd NEVER know. So why is it a good, well made point?  

There are many things that exist only in our imagination, but quite clearly we all admit that they exist in our imagination, or perhaps in your imagination, not mine, or perhaps only in someone else’s Imagination.  But nevertheless, we cannot deny that they exist there.

[Skallywag]

5 minutes ago, StreetCowboy said:

There are many things that exist only in our imagination, but quite clearly we all admit that they exist in our imagination, or perhaps in your imagination, not mine, or perhaps only in someone else’s Imagination.  But nevertheless, we cannot deny that they exist there.

Wow - I did a lot of hallucinogenic mind altering drugs in my life but cannot wrap my mind around your "imagination" theory

Its all good man.  Saul Goodman 55