Suspect of working in Thailand ... Really? Doing what?

[Grusa]

6 hours ago, NanLaew said:

Yes, I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you.

You stole my line!

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, ThomasThBKK said:

 

Once they <deleted> me off and complained when i greated them in english.

 

Whatever you do with these guys is wrong ???? i refuse to learn this language, the same time invested in another language like spanish/chinese or a random programming language etc would gain me more opportunities.

"I refuse to learn this language"....   it's not the most endearing of attitudes to draw a favorable encounter. 

 

The point you make regarding the futility of learning a single country language [Thai] vs learning alternate languages is somewhat flawed, how much time have you spend in Spanish or Chinese speaking countries lately vs time in Thailand.

 

 

 

 

[tandor]

18 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

The truth is if you are denied to entry in Thailand

it's can not be because you are working in Thailand, because at the moment

you are not inside, so it's difficult to prove.

Then it's just free accusation or suspection from the immigration

then they can use another excuse (Not enough money, too entries in thailand in one year

or whatever reason, bad or good, real or not) and denied you.

The good question could be if you are denied for a dumb reason

(For example not enough funds even if you have your atm card and a well stocked bank account)

what are your legal recourse (I mean with a correct chance of success) before to be pulled in a plane back to your country?

..Well Immigration have the right to ask whatever question(s) they wish..after all they are the first line of authority..the same as it is in any country, yes?

[hugocnx]

16 hours ago, Maestro said:

Depending on the reason for the rejection, the foreigner can file an appeal with the Minister of the Interior according to section 22 of the Immigration Act.

After you've been send back to the country you came from or your home country. Wish you a lot of success, lol.

[DJ54]

There are some that for whatever reason continually try to buck the system. A guy (legally married to Thai) here did the border runs and when the rules changed he was told 7 days to get out and to get the correct visa. 

 

He came back and was here for awhile and didn’t get it sorted out.

Did a border run or flight not sure but was told patty is over and banned for 1 year. 

 

Immigration although sometimes get it wrong see patterns that are

suspect...

[kingofthemountain]

4 hours ago, tandor said:

..Well Immigration have the right to ask whatever question(s) they wish..after all they are the first line of authority..the same as it is in any country, yes?

You are totaly right

and i agree with that

i was just trying to give an answer to the OPwith my post

[kingofthemountain]

3 hours ago, hugocnx said:

After you've been send back to the country you came from or your home country. Wish you a lot of success, lol.

indeed that's the problem 

[gk10002000]

20 hours ago, MiNombreEsFicticious said:

"What kind of work do you suppose immigration suspects these people are doing?" asks the OP.

 

I am pretty sure that no Immigration Officer has pushed their thought process that far forward. They just operate with a list of 4 or 5 memorized questions (you have 20,000? why you here? why so many entries?, etc.), little to no thinking required or being done. Thinking is frowned upon here. 

Probably true.  I just went to the LOS in July for 3 weeks.  USA citizen, visa exempt.  62 year old clean cut shaven hansum man.  I have visited thailand about a dozen times going back to 2004.  My latest passport dates from 2011.    I had not been to Thailand since 2015. I have 6 Visa Exempt one month stays in that passport. I think in 2010 and 2012 I did a 30 day visa extension and stayed just under two months total.  All straight up, no issues ever.  Two of those years I visited the country twice, each time on a Visa Exempt from the USA.  Never arrived in Thailand from a border crossing or some country other than my home country USA.   The IO at BKK did not ask me any questions but sure took a long time looking at something.  I had plenty of travel money on me in case I was asked.  It just seemed odd. Maybe she was just doing due diligence, seeing if my name was associated with my previous old passport, etc.  Averaging less than one visit per year.

[Tayaout]

3 hours ago, hugocnx said:

After you've been send back to the country you came from or your home country. Wish you a lot of success, lol.

No it can be done when under detention. They can then keep you for a maximum of 7 days and have to let you in if no verdict is reached under that timeline. The form can be printed in advance and there is a fee. Probably the details are pinned in the form thread. 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Tayaout

[ukrules]

14 hours ago, Old Croc said:

you either have great independent wealth or a means of income inside the country.

...or a means of income outside the country.

[gk10002000]

16 hours ago, Old Croc said:

It's very simple.

If you are of working age and have spent many years inside the country on visas or exempt entries, with only occasional short trips over the border to renew a visa, you either have great independent wealth or a means of income inside the country.

The onus is not on the IO to prove where your local income comes from, but on you to properly explain how you can afford to live here while pretending to be a tourist. You should prove funds in the same way that the over 50 retirees or married people have to show income or large savings. It may be difficult for those who have used Thailand's former laxness to set up a life here, but if there isn't a visa category that fits your situation, bad luck, move on.

The fact that past practices allowed people unlimited entry and stays in this way doesn't mean the country is in the wrong when they decide to tighten up on this unfettered access.  It really just means the party is over for many of those who have lived on Thailand's largess for years.

I wouldn't use the words "While pretending to be a Tourist".   Being independently wealthy and having plenty of passive income, I would like to tourist in Thailand for say 1/2 of each year or make visits from the USA when I feel like it.  Sure I can get a retirement visa and its extensions if desired, but I really would not be necessarily retiring in Thailand.  A few 60 day SETVs with 30 day extension each time should be able to be obtained with no issues.  Now if they want to ask how I can afford it, I would be happy to show them my investment portfolio of stock and funds and bonds that pay me almost 70K a year in USD now.  And Social Security elibigle when I choose for another 30K a year ( I am 62 +).  As far as being a Tourist or a Retiree, well there is no way I am giving up my USA residence and contacts as I have rentals and family ties in the USA as well as financial and banking interests.  So to say I was going to be a retiree in Thailand would not be accurate.

[dcnx]

This is how peasants think. To them, it’s impossible to travel extensively without work or have investments that allow you to do so. They live day to day and are incapable of understanding those who are not peasants. 
 

When you live on your knees in servitude, you’re unable to see beyond your own miserable circumstances. 

[Oww]

3 hours ago, dcnx said:

This is how peasants think. To them, it’s impossible to travel extensively without work or have investments that allow you to do so. They live day to day and are incapable of understanding those who are not peasants. 
 

When you live on your knees in servitude, you’re unable to see beyond your own miserable circumstances. 

Can your grandparents or even parents fathom the idea of 'traveling extensively without work'?

You are the one who obviously so desperately desires to live in Thailand, a developing country. Since you obviously consider yourself a higher life form than those 'miserable peasants', why don't you go live in Switzerland or Monaco instead of spending so much time on TV bitching and insulting Thais? It seems more like you have been personally affronted or humiliated by the tougher immigration requirements, (which really are not that tough) which apparently is spoiling your obviously burning hot desire to live there.

[ubonjoe]

16 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Problem being they don't tell you why you are being refused, and you don't see your passport until you're getting off the plane home.

They give the person being denied entry a completed form stating the reason for the denial to sign before sending them to the detention room. Their have been many posts showing a copy of that form.

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

They give the person being denied entry a completed form stating the reason for the denial to sign before sending them to the detention room. Their have been many posts showing a copy of that form.

It's in Thai though.

[BritManToo]

37 minutes ago, Oww said:

Can your grandparents or even parents fathom the idea of 'traveling extensively without work'?

My dad was a self employed builder, he used to spend every summer camping in Spain (camper van).

That was for the entire 1960s and 1970s.

So yes.

[jacko45k]

16 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

Still most handle English better than the majority of farang can demonstrate using the Thai language despite years living here.

What on Earth that has to do with it heaven knows. 

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

It's in Thai though.

It is in English and Thai.

Edit: It is a TM35 form here is the top of one posted yesterday.

[BritManToo]

5 minutes ago, FredGallaher said:

You need to learn to chill out. All your posts say the same things. Why do you stay here, if you dislike everything? Is it impossible for you to not criticise and never find something good to say? When you look in the mirror do you see someone happy to live here or a grumpy old man? 

I'm really happy if I don't have to interact with the locals.

(excluding simple commerce)

[Momofarang]

22 hours ago, wasabi said:

I wish when accused of working they would dig deeper because in our case they'll find no proof of what isn't there.

But we all know that this doesn't work anymore. Look at what Bush Jr. did to Irak.

[Tayaout]

49 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

It is in English and Thai.

Edit: It is a TM35 form here is the top of one posted yesterday.

For some reasons mine was Thai only except for the title at DMK. I remember because I relulanctly signed it without understanding it thinking that was a bad idea. I saw a picture of one from CM or Phuket that was also both language. Maybe they updated their form since they started tightening the borders. 

Edited October 1, 2019 by Tayaout

[tingtongtourist]

18 hours ago, 4675636b596f75 said:

3 pages and not one answered my question.  Do I have to ask it again?  When they claim they suspect you of working, what type of work would that be?

 

Taxi Driver?

Whore?

Professional Agitator?

Goldsmith?

 

 

they dont have to accuse you of any occupation.

If well under 40y.o, and live Thailand many years of course they think:

 

"how is this guy support himself that long time, with no work?" 

 

so they check visa history, look you up and down if they think you are the rich guy who can afford this life

otherwise right or wrong they assume you working illegal or have dodgy ways to make money.

 

You cant really blame them.

If guys dressed in rags, smell of beer and cigs, heap of tattoos..and lugging a dirty 10 years old backpack..

 

Thats hardly a profile of guy on a monthly allowance from rich family, or Wall st genius, or international playboy.

 

Maybe borrow a friends Rolex and they let you in without question?

 

I always did hand the passport in with left hand and wearing my nice Submariner

and over 10 years of no worry visa

so there might be something to it!

 

[problemfarang]

Im little bit angry about this. To be honest im not against immigration stopping people entry to the country. Especially for the ppl working here without the proper visa nor paper work. Because i have to do lot of paper work, waste of my time, spend my energy, etc. What work they do? i know at least 5 ppl teaching without a work permit, i know another 2 selling things, i know 1 doing some online thing. 1 doing bit coin thing. some more i cannot remember now.

 

nonthaburi immigration office was like 3km from my home. the main street around here has many pubs or bars or restaurant/bars, you name it. All the stuff working there are from Vietnam, Laos or Cambodia. Seriously there are 1 or 2 thai from 12 ppl. What really annoys me is, after 'hard' work at the nonthaburi immigration, some officers go to drink beer at these places often. I see them and know them.

 

my question is why they dont do anything about these illegal stuff in these places? 

 

One day i asked one of the immigration officer drinking beer and sitting with one of these laotion girl, you know she works here illegal and you dont do anything. But i have to do lot of things to get my work permit or able to stay in thailand. his answer was, ohh they are poor ppl, trying to help their families back at home. But you guys have money and comfortable life. 

 

Well no need more comments to his words i believe. Again i felt so happy that i have non-o and never go to immigration office for years now. 90 days go and come back

[problemfarang]

1 minute ago, FredGallaher said:

So you feel that you should be treated special.

 

what do you mean? i just cant understand how your question is related to my post to be honest. 

 

 

[Nowisee]

On 9/30/2019 at 4:34 AM, MiNombreEsFicticious said:

"What kind of work do you suppose immigration suspects these people are doing?" asks the OP.

 

I am pretty sure that no Immigration Officer has pushed their thought process that far forward. They just operate with a list of 4 or 5 memorized questions (you have 20,000? why you here? why so many entries?, etc.), little to no thinking required or being done. Thinking is frowned upon here. 

Often times they only know how to ask the question.  The answer is often misunderstood.

 

12 hours ago, tandor said:

..Well Immigration have the right to ask whatever question(s) they wish..after all they are the first line of authority..the same as it is in any country, yes?

Yes in deed.  Entering the US, they can sniff out suspicious acting people, they don't always get it right.  The results is 666,582 overstay events in 2018.  

China students-12,924, Thailand students -1,045, Thailand other -376.  Thailand numbers seem relatively low.  Compared to Philippines other -5,407.  No wonder it's difficult for Filipinos to get a visa.  The surprising numbers were from Canada -92,542.  

 

 

[Peter Denis]

8 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

I wouldn't use the words "While pretending to be a Tourist".   Being independently wealthy and having plenty of passive income, I would like to tourist in Thailand for say 1/2 of each year or make visits from the USA when I feel like it.  Sure I can get a retirement visa and its extensions if desired, but I really would not be necessarily retiring in Thailand.  A few 60 day SETVs with 30 day extension each time should be able to be obtained with no issues.  Now if they want to ask how I can afford it, I would be happy to show them my investment portfolio of stock and funds and bonds that pay me almost 70K a year in USD now.  And Social Security elibigle when I choose for another 30K a year ( I am 62 +).  As far as being a Tourist or a Retiree, well there is no way I am giving up my USA residence and contacts as I have rentals and family ties in the USA as well as financial and banking interests.  So to say I was going to be a retiree in Thailand would not be accurate.

If you like to visit Thailand for half of the year or more, you need not come on Tourist Visa, because that could get you eventually in trouble as a 'serial tourist'.

And the solution is very simple > You obviously qualify for a Non Imm OA Visa - retirement, as you are 62+ with  sufficient income.  Such a Visa  would allow you to stay up to 2 years in Thailand with a minimum of admin IO hassle.  And since you would be going often back to your USA residence, at the end of the 2nd year you can simply apply for a new Non Imm OA Visa.

The Non Imm OA Visa is often refered to as 'retirement Visa', but that does not mean that you actually have to retire (it does of course prohibit you from doing work while in Thailand).  And neither does it require that you should become a resident in Thailand.  You can simply keep your official residence in USA and use the Non Imm OA Visa as an 'easy entry-ticket' to visit Thailand as often and as long as you like.

Edited October 1, 2019 by Peter Denis

[Suradit69]

4 hours ago, jacko45k said:

What on Earth that has to do with it heaven knows. 

What "it" is heaven knows. 

 

It's a comment on the assumption that individual Thais must achieve a certain proficiency in English while farang who chose to stay here long term can't be bothered learning any Thai.

 

In a 7 page thread conversations usually develop various subtopics. Sorry if that overwhelmed your ability to keep up.

[hugocnx]

12 hours ago, Tayaout said:

No it can be done when under detention. They can then keep you for a maximum of 7 days and have to let you in if no verdict is reached under that timeline. The form can be printed in advance and there is a fee. Probably the details are pinned in the form thread. 

But you are not always put under detention.

[tgeezer]

Peter Denis’ suggestion is a good one. What prevents people from working in Thailand in the terms of this topic, is the absence of a Work Permit. IOs at the border need not suspect that you are working they only need to decide that your visa is not being used for the purpose that it was issued. Frequent visits arouse suspicion that one is making Thailand one’s home. IO’s should accept visas which allow for a stay of over 90 days if a person appears to be living in Thailand. 

[metempsychotic]

On 9/30/2019 at 8:09 AM, Puchaiyank said:

This question about "working" in Thailand exposes the greater issue: "Shouldn't immigration be burden with evidence of proof... to support their loose allegations of wrong doing?"

 

Entirely too much bias and power in the hands of unethical people...

name one country where immigration needs to show burden of proof to deny entry.