Then how much Lump sum is enough to retire and what age?

[georgegeorgia]

I have a work colleague 51yo,so depressed and bored with his life in Australia he wants to sell his house and move to Thailand.

his only money will be around 10 million baht give or take.

no other income

 

Questions are how much is enough to last him until he can eventually get the old age pension,(currently 67) so how long can that last him.

i know,a lot of you will be saying...how long is a piece of string?

 

but lets put it into more complex , at 50yo in Pattaya ?  in Isaan say Khon kaen? Udon? in Chiang mai? Bangkok? , all different lump sum cash to live.

how much a lump sum would say a 50yo need to last him say 20   years?

could perhaps 20 million baht say ?

obviously if someone lives in sakhon nowhere it will be different than say living in Bangkok or phuket/pattaya

 

i guess not only demographics taken into consideration ?

i guess this is where planning needs to happen especially to live for the next say 20 years on a lump sum 

 

the question is..........if your in your 50's or even close to 60's when is the time financially to retire?

how do you know when?

 

im in my early  50's and working out i have roughly with assets selling my house an savings  about 18- 20 million baht with no other income until 60, where i will receive my superanuation but even that wont be that much, ,but would i risk selling my house in Sydney and  retiring yet,no , i would be too scared !!

i dread working the next 10 years , but my feeling is nothing will ever be enough, will myself have to pour money into my retirement funds over the next 10 years just to try to retire at 62 if im lucky.and then feeling guilty saying it might not be enough ...and that is my greatest fear , never enough, and leaving it too late to retire and getting a terminal illness god forbid...maybe i worry too much????

 

Edited May 19, 2020 by georgegeorgia

[worgeordie]

How long is a piece of string,

I depends on his spending habits is he a fool with his money

or canny with it, so many variables to consider.

regards Worgeordie

[CharlieH]

Far too vague on details to even guess.

 

There are too many variables.

Examples:

Lifestyle

Whether or not he gets "involved"

Health/medic accidents

Exchange rate ! (Aussie dollar)

Visa rules shifting. (Unpredictable)

 

In short, DONT make any long term plans.

You are building on shifting sand.

 

[1FinickyOne]

15 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

taken into consideration but lifestyle,drinking in bars , etc ,

Just divide the 10MM by the number of months... but lifestyle is everything... 

 

Though I am going to guess if he can't do the math for himself, he is not likely to be able to keep under the budget either... 

[Bramley]

Retirement visa requires that you have B 800,000 in the bank each year. If he wants to live a simple life, that's plenty enough to live.

[totally thaied up]

Need to remember, he will have to return to Australia for two years before getting the OAP to qualify. 

[OneMoreFarang]

30 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

sell his house and move to Thailand

Was he ever in Thailand?

Does he like pretty girls?

Would he be careful with his money?

 

[simon43]

Has no one ever heard of bank accounts that pay interest?  I currently receive 8% pa on my savings here in Laos with a Franco-Lao bank.  When I retire in 5 years from now, the interest from my modest bank savings, plus my modest UK part-pension will be more than enough to live happily on.

 

Do banks in Thailand not offer similar interest-paying accounts?  (I guess not!).

[DaLa]

Some may debate that the financial part of this is the most important. However to ignore all the other parts of the equation could (will) lead to problems.

 

Mix any two unsatisfactory elements of being here with 10 times the amount of cash he has and that could still leave him 'depressed and bored' in LoS.

 

He won't know whether having to rely on a 'friend' (Thai) to do almost everything other than tie his shoelaces will be something he can live with until he's been here a while.

 

Best to eat the elephant a mouthful at a time.

 

[georgegeorgia]

17 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Has no one ever heard of bank accounts that pay interest?  I currently receive 8% pa on my savings here in Laos with a Franco-Lao bank.  When I retire in 5 years from now, the interest from my modest bank savings, plus my modest UK part-pension will be more than enough to live happily on.

 

Do banks in Thailand not offer similar interest-paying accounts?  (I guess not!).

Australia its around 1.8% , as for the banks in Laos i dont know if i would feel "comfortable' putting say 10 million baht into the Franco Lao bank,i have never heard of it.

maybe something like Bangkok bank would be more comfortable with,but at 8% it sounds great.

Edited May 19, 2020 by georgegeorgia

[stouricks]

26 minutes ago, Bramley said:

Retirement visa requires that you have B 800,000 in the bank each year. If he wants to live a simple life, that's plenty enough to live.

Only HALF of that 800k can be used for only 7 months, then it has to go back into the bank, so forget that. Bht 65,000 per month should be sufficient to live on, if not then change your lifestyle.

[CharlieH]

6 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

Australia its around 1.8% , as for the banks in Laos i dont know if i would feel "comfortable' putting say 10 million baht into the Franco Lao bank,i have never heard of it.

maybe something like Bangkok bank would be more comfortable with,but at 8% it sounds great.

Assuming NO capital expenditure, assuming NO changes in visa rules, NO medical issues or emergencies, NO change in exchange rate, @ 65k per month he can last 12 yrs at best.

 

Lets face it, he hasnt enough to stop and retire, and by the sound of it his head is in no place to even be making such decisions. The latter being the priority right now.

He shouldnt be making any life changing decisions from what you describe.He should be concentrating on getting himself sorted first. (IMHO)

[HashBrownHarry]

32 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Has no one ever heard of bank accounts that pay interest?  I currently receive 8% pa on my savings here in Laos with a Franco-Lao bank.  When I retire in 5 years from now, the interest from my modest bank savings, plus my modest UK part-pension will be more than enough to live happily on.

 

Do banks in Thailand not offer similar interest-paying accounts?  (I guess not!).

8% on what currency?

[NCC1701A]

tell your friend to get a spread sheet and run the calculation clear out to his pension. 

he has to have at least 45,000 baht a month every month. 51 to 67 is 16 years. 

 

 45,000 baht X 12 = 540,000 X 16 = 8,640,000 baht to make it to his pension. 

 

 45,000 baht a month includes 10,000 for health insurance and 10,000 baht for rent.

 

No alcohol included in that 45,000 baht. there is however about 8000 baht in there for entertainment.  

 

don't forget about inflation. and the impossible to forecast exchange rate. 

 

and 800,000 in cash in a Thai bank for immigration. I would say if he can't come up with this small amount of money at 51 years of age then he is no where near ready for retirement. 

 

I have a ton of cash in the bank and I still get nervous sometimes just because no one knows the future. 

 

but i can live quite well on my $1,995 US social security. I add about $1000 a month to this and it is physically impossible to have that much fun. 

 

and tell your friend, no matter where he goes, there he is.  

 

good luck. 

 

[ThailandRyan]

2 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

tell your friend to get a spread sheet and run the calculation clear out to his pension. 

he has to have at least 45,000 baht a month every month. 51 to 67 is 16 years. 

 

 45,000 baht X 12 = 540,000 X 16 = 8,640,000 baht to make it to his pension. 

 

 45,000 baht a month includes 10,000 for health insurance and 10,000 baht for rent.

 

No alcohol included in that 45,000 baht. there is however about 8000 baht in there for entertainment.  

 

don't forget about inflation. and the impossible to forecast exchange rate. 

 

and 800,000 in cash in a Thai bank for immigration. I would say if he can't come up with this small amount of money at 51 years of age then he is no where near ready for retirement. 

 

I have a ton of cash in the bank and I still get nervous sometimes just because no one knows the future. 

 

but i can live quite well on my $1,995 US social security. I add about $1000 a month to this and it is physically impossible to have that much fun. 

 

and tell your friend, no matter where he goes, there he is.  

 

good luck. 

 

I have to agree with you NCC, you have put down a reasonable sum and broken it down.  I was just starting to do the same thing but you beat me to it.  I however was using the 65,000 Baht per month income method, and his needing to leave the majority of the money in Australia instead of cashing out completely.  Never take more than you can afford to loose and walk away from and still be able to restart yourself again instead of ending up like another thread running where the Farang was in the hand-out line after loosing it all after having cashed out and moving here.  

[ThailandRyan]

44 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Was he ever in Thailand?

Does he like pretty girls?

Would he be careful with his money?

 

One of your house parties OneMore?

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, georgegeorgia said:

but lets put it into more complex , at 50yo in Pattaya ?  in Isaan say Khon kaen? Udon? in Chiang mai? Bangkok? , all different lump sum cash to live.

how much a lump sum would say a 50yo need to last him say 20   years?

could perhaps 20 million baht say ?

obviously if someone lives in sakhon nowhere it will be different than say living in Bangkok or phuket/pattaya

 

Chiang Mai, I live on 600kbht/year (40k/month plus holiday fund).

That gets me a woman, a house and enough to provide for 2 children at the same level of living I had in the UK when earning a top wage. (The woman is considerable younger, prettier and more compliant than my 'top wage' managed to attract in the UK).

I lasted out on a 'lump sum' from age 52 to 64, then took my pension that nets me the same amount (maybe a bit more).

I had a few pals that were happy enough to live on 250kbht/year when VISA conditions were easier.

 

20Mbht would last me 34 years assuming no interest or wild spending binges.

Edited May 19, 2020 by BritManToo

[OneMoreFarang]

6 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

One of your house parties OneMore?

No. This is more my kind of taste:

 

[NCC1701A]

you ever notice these "how much money is enough" topics always boil down to one thing? 

[BritManToo]

Just now, NCC1701A said:

you ever notice these "how much money is enough" topics always boil down to one thing? 

It's the one thing we all came to Thailand to enjoy.

[spiekerjozef]

400 mln baht at the age of 75 should be enough. Then your thai wife (or any wife...) would be very happy.

[nausea]

Work out what you think you'll need, then double it. 

[FritsSikkink]

1 hour ago, simon43 said:

Has no one ever heard of bank accounts that pay interest?  I currently receive 8% pa on my savings here in Laos with a Franco-Lao bank.  When I retire in 5 years from now, the interest from my modest bank savings, plus my modest UK part-pension will be more than enough to live happily on.

 

Do banks in Thailand not offer similar interest-paying accounts?  (I guess not!).

The interest isn't that much if you deduct the inflation:

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/laos/inflation-cpi

 

[ThailandRyan]

30 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

you ever notice these "how much money is enough" topics always boil down to one thing? 

Always...man can not live on bread alone....T&A makes the world a better place...

[Antonymous]

1 hour ago, georgegeorgia said:

Australia its around 1.8% , as for the banks in Laos i dont know if i would feel "comfortable' putting say 10 million baht into the Franco Lao bank,i have never heard of it.

maybe something like Bangkok bank would be more comfortable with,but at 8% it sounds great.

 

You can read the Franco Lao bank's audit report at 31 Dec 2017 by KPMG:

 

https://www.bfl-bred.com/images/NewWebSite/Financial_reports/2017/Audited_Report_2017_IFRS_Eng.pdf

 

 

[bkk6060]

2 hours ago, georgegeorgia said:

the question is..........if your in your 50's or even close to 60's when is the time financially to retire?

how do you know when?

Sorry, too broad of a question I think.

What is the preferred lifestyle?

Golf, girls, travel, good food and higher end condo rent.  80 to 100,000 b a month.

But, I hear people on here who say they are ok with 20,000.

So, what a person wants to do and their lifestyle/quality of life preference is the answer they need to ask themselves.  Just "retiring" to a low quality purgatory could be a worse experience then continuing to work.

 

[pineapple01]

I waste more on Cars than anything else.

[Antonymous]

17 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

The interest isn't that much if you deduct the inflation:

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/laos/inflation-cpi

 

Yep. Overall inflation rate between 6-7%. That includes food inflation at over 11%.

 

Out of interest just looked up currency exchange rates Thai baht to Laos Kip:

 

1 Jan 2017 1 baht=232

1 Jan 2020 1 baht=296

 

Anyone thinking about retiring in Laos and investing their money in kip should think very carefully ...

 

[JackThompson]

The unknown-unknowns exist - but wasting one's life away, and possibly dying before ever enjoying life (due to "never enough"), is a real consideration.  Balancing those is not an easy question.

 

First, subtract 1M Baht to stick in the bank just to qualify for the retirement-extension.  It is 800K now, but they might raise it.  Even then, there is no guarantee of what the upper limit might be, 5 years + from now.

 

Next, he could figure interest/returns, but no guarantee on those being consistent.  Better to just divide the lump-sum by months, to arrive at the mo-spending amount, then re-invest any interest.

 

He's looking at ~192 months / 9M Baht = ~47K Baht/mo spending money (not counting interest).  Life in Bangkok on that won't be a lot of fun.  If renting a condo in jomtien (~10K/mo decent size studio incl water/elec w/ seaview), would do much better.  Up-country is even less, due to about 4K less on rent, and a couple K/mo less on food (produce, especially), if he eats healthy at home - which maximizes money to spend on other things.  

Re health-insurance - not to be forgotten:  If he were to come to Thailand, and work just One Year in any job (legal w/ work-permit), he could qualify to self-pay into the Thai health system for life, thereafter at 750 Baht/mo.  Combined with a "gap" policy to cover that not covered by the Thai health system, this could significantly reduce the ever-increasing health-care premiums, as one gets older.

[Lacessit]

56 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

No. This is more my kind of taste:

 

Ladyboys, or S&M?