It's Getting Worse...More Shops Closing Down

[ChipButty]

I am an Alien 

[Leaver]

On 9/3/2020 at 3:16 PM, Eindhoven said:

 

No need for ways around it. Your two tourist visa story is just a story.

 

Apart from that, it's not about how long I have been staying now. I'm only staying because I won't be able to get back in for the winter, which is when I would normally be here.

So they should make it easier for the people who are already here and would normally stay for the winter.

I'm fully insured, have ample funds and don't want to go down dodgy routes to get a visa.

Will they allow back to back tourist visas once you have left Thailand?  Where will you go to get the next tourist visa?  Will you be allowed back in?  Are you prepared for hotel quarantine?  

[Leaver]

16 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Having an age of 50 is daft like all the other daft things, should be based on money in bank or monthly income, age is irrelevant really. Just common sense which is not common here

If they had any sense, when Covid has passed, they should let everyone who wishes to do so stay here on rolling 30 day exemption stamps, maybe for a token 300 baht fee.  This could be for a 12 or 18 month period, or until their tourism industry rebounds.   

[Wongkitlo]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

You don't say..... and to people who have some funds, there are options to remain.

Yes but as the OP said what is the economic sense of getting rid of tourists who have the funds to stay here? Why force them to get illegal visas(there have been several fake stamps found recently), scam marriages or senseless courses when they are here already and spending. I know you and a few others have decided it is more important to discuss the merits of the present system but in reality at the moment Thailand is behind everyone else in their response to the situation as far as visas is concerned.  They are still pushing people towards questionable visa agents and corrupt immigration officers.

[Wongkitlo]

3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Doubt you will find the word 'certain' in that post......whichever you mean. Quote it please...

Thailand makes up its own rules, if it was all based on reciprocity, they would not allow many nationals in without a visa.

 

If I had claimed you wrote "certain" I would have used quotation marks.

Edited September 4, 2020 by Wongkitlo
Edit

[Leaver]

3 hours ago, ChipButty said:

I am an Alien 

We are all Aliens here. 

 

You could live here 30 years, and break no laws, and not work.  Only put into the Thai economy, not take anything out.  However, you will still only have the same rights as a tourist entering Thailand for their first time on a visa exempt stamp, except for getting a Thai driving / riding licence, which a tourists wouldn't need because they can get an International Driving Permit.  

[jacko45k]

11 hours ago, Wongkitlo said:

They are still pushing people towards questionable visa agents and corrupt immigration officers.

Yes, a win win situation maybe.......

[jacko45k]

11 hours ago, Wongkitlo said:

If I had claimed you wrote "certain" I would have used quotation marks.

Then you misrepresented my post.

[Wongkitlo]

4 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Then you misrepresented my post.

In your first post you advised to get an extension as if it was a simple option. In your next post  you mentioned embassy letters which aren't a solution for everyone and then started writing "perhaps " and suggesting one visa or another. I described  your posts as changing from "certain" to more indefinite. I was trying to politely accuse  you of commenting without fully thinking about your post initially then revising your position. You can not say I misrepresented your post. Maybe you could accuse me of misinterpreting it but that is subjective really.

[jacko45k]

28 minutes ago, Wongkitlo said:

In your first post you advised to get an extension as if it was a simple option. In your next post  you mentioned embassy letters which aren't a solution for everyone and then started writing "perhaps " and suggesting one visa or another. I described  your posts as changing from "certain" to more indefinite. I was trying to politely accuse  you of commenting without fully thinking about your post initially then revising your position. You can not say I misrepresented your post. Maybe you could accuse me of misinterpreting it but that is subjective really.

Are you certain....?

 

 

[Oldie]

17 hours ago, Wongkitlo said:

Yes but as the OP said what is the economic sense of getting rid of tourists who have the funds to stay here? Why force them to get illegal visas(there have been several fake stamps found recently), scam marriages or senseless courses when they are here already and spending.

Nobody forces anyone to get illegal visas. People going this route are criminals and should end in jail. 

[jacko45k]

7 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Nobody forces anyone to get illegal visas. People going this route are criminals and should end in jail. 

People claiming to be tourists when they are actually not is very common. Which Embassy or consulate is issuing illegal visas?

[Wongkitlo]

42 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Are you certain....?

 

 

I am certain I did not "misrepresent" your post. The visa one is a rather boring discussion. I think the original post was more interesting. I find the local Thai population have little understanding of visas. For Scuba's bar owner to comment that the bar may need to close because the amnesty ends shows there must be a lot of people in uncertain visa situations. Stupid economic decisions always annoy me.

[Oldie]

4 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

People claiming to be tourists when they are actually not is very common. Which Embassy or consulate is issuing illegal visas?

The story was not about getting visas from embassies. They are legal. And if you come here on a tourist visa and work for instance then not the visa is illegal but your behavior. This has nothing to do with illegal visas some people try to obtain here. 

[Wongkitlo]

19 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Nobody forces anyone to get illegal visas. People going this route are criminals and should end in jail. 

Have you read the whole post. Some people seem to be pushed into having a choice of illegal visas(and being what you describe as a criminal) and the Immigration Detention Centre.  Which would you choose?

[Wongkitlo]

14 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

People claiming to be tourists when they are actually not is very common. Which Embassy or consulate is issuing illegal visas?

There have been 2 cases of agencies with fake stamps recently

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, Wongkitlo said:

There have been 2 cases of agencies with fake stamps recently

I ask because in reality, Visas can only be obtained from an Embassy or Consulate outside Thailand ... with the exception of a converted TV or Exempt Entry into a Non-Imm-O Entry stamped as 'USED' which domestic immigration can do.

With the help of agents people get Extensions that seem to bypass requirements, but some claim perfectly legal as immigration does have the authority to sign off on requirements.

[spidermike007]

This is not just about the money generated from tourism. It is also about the Thai economy slowing down. And the massive and long term effects of the insane economic lockdown, without an administration that was truly and sincerely prepared to step up, for the common man. It is a disaster. Millions are out of work. Places like Samui, Phuket and Pattaya are really feeling it. Even Bangkok is feeling it. Other parts of the nation too. It will take a while and businesses will continue to suffer and fail. 

[jacko45k]

10 minutes ago, Wongkitlo said:

Have you read the whole post. Some people seem to be pushed into having a choice of illegal visas(and being what you describe as a criminal) and the Immigration Detention Centre.  Which would you choose?

Or maybe a seat on a Thai Airways flight.

Edited September 5, 2020 by jacko45k

[Oldie]

5 minutes ago, Wongkitlo said:

Have you read the whole post. Some people seem to be pushed into having a choice of illegal visas(and being what you describe as a criminal) and the Immigration Detention Centre.  Which would you choose?

The choice should be the Immigration Detention Centre when on overstay or the real jail when using fake visas. The immigration is simply too friendly... And again - nobody is pushed to have an illegal visa. Please help me and tell me an example. From my understanding everybody can leave the country and has to leave if he doesn't qualify anymore to be allowed to stay here longer. It is in many countries like this. And compared to other countries the Thai immigration is very friendly...

[Rimmer]

Please stay on topic:

 

It's Getting Worse...More Shops Closing Down

 

 

[AlfHuy]

58 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

This is not just about the money generated from tourism. It is also about the Thai economy slowing down. And the massive and long term effects of the insane economic lockdown, without an administration that was truly and sincerely prepared to step up, for the common man. It is a disaster. Millions are out of work. Places like Samui, Phuket and Pattaya are really feeling it. Even Bangkok is feeling it. Other parts of the nation too. It will take a while and businesses will continue to suffer and fail. 

I went our with a friend last night.

Had walk through sir cowboy. Empty. A few foreigners walking around, that's all.

Spoke to a girl. She said that she doesn't get any salary anymore and the only thing she gets is 50baht for each drink a customer buys for her.

Hard times.

[polpott]

1 minute ago, Wongkitlo said:

The thread is meant to be about the logic of Thailand not making it easy to get visas when at the same time trying to open up tourism and the logic of such. There are plenty of other threads about tourists etc stuck in Thailand.

And there was me thinking it was about more shops closing down. My bad.

[Wongkitlo]

Just now, polpott said:

And there was me thinking it was about more shops closing down. My bad.

No the OP said the bar owner thought they had to close because she will lose a lot of customers when the amnesty ends

[jacko45k]

14 minutes ago, Wongkitlo said:

No the OP said the bar owner thought they had to close because she will lose a lot of customers when the amnesty ends

Talking to a barfly friend he thinks departing amnesty people will cause some further bar closures, I have no real idea how many are still in Pattaya.... but thought it minimal.

[Nout]

On 9/2/2020 at 12:56 AM, BigStar said:

Yup. That's the reason that Thais can't be tourists: we don't allow that any Thais have money.

 

Yup. Businesses that have evolved over many years, or fewer, to appeal to Thai tastes, or to foreign as well as Thai, do well with Thai tourists and some foreigners still here for whatever reason.

 

Walking street was very busy last night and open till 4am.

[Oldie]

2 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Talking to a barfly friend he thinks departing amnesty people will cause some further bar closures, I have no real idea how many are still in Pattaya.... but thought it minimal.

But I still see very many bars open here in Pattaya and they are completely empty. Obviously they don't need customers. But what hurts me more are the shops that disappear. Let's take the D. I. Y stores where you get many things for little money. I don't need them often but I would miss them a lot. And so many other shopping locations like the Made in Thailand market where many shops disappeared are important to me. Bars - there are far too many anyway. And this business model didn't have a bright future anyway. They simply disappear earlier now - not all but perhaps many. 

[Leaver]

14 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Talking to a barfly friend he thinks departing amnesty people will cause some further bar closures, I have no real idea how many are still in Pattaya.... but thought it minimal.

Judging by the photos of the queues at the immigration office that were in the media, there could be hundreds still here, possibly thousands.

 

Edited September 5, 2020 by Leaver

[Oldie]

12 minutes ago, Nout said:

Walking street was very busy last night and open till 4am.

This is interesting because according to the emergency decree everything should be closed at midnight. 

 

 

Edited September 5, 2020 by Oldie

[Leaver]

34 minutes ago, Wongkitlo said:

No the OP said the bar owner thought they had to close because she will lose a lot of customers when the amnesty ends

Only Thai logic would see long term tourists, buy choice or otherwise, kicked out of the country when their tourism industry has been decimated here.  

 

They are not begging, they are not working, they are not stealing, and not scamming.  They are paying rent, buying food and other groceries, and attending bars etc. 

 

Yet, the Thai government wants them out.  How ridiculous?