Ownership and removal of house contents

[Jen65]

If one splits up with ones Thai Partner  ( mutually agreed) when the property is in the name of the Thai Partner , can one retrieve all the items/furniture etc that one has paid for and has receipts for same ?

[Peterw42]

11 minutes ago, Jen65 said:

If one splits up with ones Thai Partner  ( mutually agreed) when the property is in the name of the Thai Partner , can one retrieve all the items/furniture etc that one has paid for and has receipts for same ?

Theoretically yes but whether circumstances would allow. You wont get far if the door is locked and she wont open it.

Your best approach would be a donation to the local police in exchange for helping you to retrieve your goods.

[NanLaew]

Unless there's a genuine Louis XIV bureau and commode in there, I wouldn't bother. Index flat-pack stuff doesn't qualify.

[soi3eddie]

The partner might not be happy or obliging if it means they would be living in an empty shell of a house. You don't say whether this is pre-emptive of a split or after the fact. If in advance do as I did, make a list of all your posessions of value (sentimental or financial) and get ready for an opportunity to leave the scene unhindered and without drama (maybe when "ex" partner goes to the market, visit family or shopping mall etc.). Anything left behind is likely to be lost for good. Move on and put it behind you. Renting a furnished apartment is cheap in Thailand. Buy new things as needed.

[lopburi3]

There is no marriage or joint property so it belongs to the owner (which you say is not you).  I am no lawyer (thank goodness) but suspect you have no rights outside of marriage.

[blackcab]

The problem you have is that you might be able to prove that you paid for the items, but you can't prove the items were not a gift.

 

Looking at the situation, in that the furniture was used in a daily basis in someone else's house, I'm sure you can understand the situation is not clear cut.

 

In these type of situations my advice would be to take any personal effects and leave the rest if you can comfortably afford to do so.

 

It is not going to be worth the stress of fighting over second hand furniture, unless of course the sums involved are considerable.

[worgeordie]

The easiest remedy might be.. give it one more try .

regards Worgeordie

[Jen65]

5 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

Theoretically yes but whether circumstances would allow. You wont get far if the door is locked and she wont open it.

Your best approach would be a donation to the local police in exchange for helping you to retrieve your goods.

although we split amicably , I have "right of access "  until I die or until I rescind it ie the property is sold by agreement with both of us. It can not be sold without my agreement whilst I am alive .   There is a simple document one signs at the Land Office to give you ( the farang ) right of access and costs about 100bht -  not many know about that !!!  It is agreed and signed when the property is purchased and filed with the house docs .

[ThailandRyan]

Many years ago a GF I was living with decided to take a vacation without telling me where she was going.  She just drove away one afternoon and did not return or answer calls.  I knew the relationship was on shaky ground, and the house I had built, bungalow style, had cost me just a little over time.  The next morning when the neighbors started asking me where she went, I did not say a word, just backed my truck up to the front door, and had the neighbor help me load my refrigerator, TV, washing machine, and all my personal belongings including my cookware.  Left her the minifridge, the cooking station and cabinet, the bed and the couch, and I bounced after locking the house, locking the screened and gated porch area, and throwing my keys through the small dog door in the slider.  Walked or drove basically with what I wanted and restarted anew in a new rental far far away from the home in Wang Samo, actually moving to Phuket.....lol.  Never once did I obtain a call from the now ex.  I had a usufruct that I walked away from as there was no way I would live in the village anymore, gossip is awful and rife.  I had all of the purchase receipts showing I had bought the items as I had the receipts written in my name from the small store in Wang Sam Mo I had bought it from. Different story with my now Thai ex-wife, gave the house to our daughter, the Truck to the ex father in-law and put the property in the daughters name as well.  Still walked away with my personal items, and started anew.  I learned a long time ago to never invest more than you can walk away from.

[jackdd]

1 hour ago, Jen65 said:

although we split amicably , I have "right of access "  until I die or until I rescind it ie the property is sold by agreement with both of us. It can not be sold without my agreement whilst I am alive .   There is a simple document one signs at the Land Office to give you ( the farang ) right of access and costs about 100bht -  not many know about that !!!  It is agreed and signed when the property is purchased and filed with the house docs .

If you have this right, then you just go into the house and take your stuff, what's the problem?

[Peterw42]

1 hour ago, Jen65 said:

although we split amicably , I have "right of access "  until I die or until I rescind it ie the property is sold by agreement with both of us. It can not be sold without my agreement whilst I am alive .   There is a simple document one signs at the Land Office to give you ( the farang ) right of access and costs about 100bht -  not many know about that !!!  It is agreed and signed when the property is purchased and filed with the house docs .

I think you will find most are aware of a usufruct, its mentioned often on the forum.

Not sure why you are asking, if you have access and the split is amicable, just go and get your property.

[Delight]

 There is no such thing as 'Title' when it comes to house furniture.

I think that the law will conclude that it belongs to the owner of the house.

If you were to take items without permission -then your Thai partner will probably get the police onto you.

If they catch you -all will be lost.

Your only answer to to agree 'who gets what'

Probably this should have been agreed as part of the 'Mutually Agreed 'stage.

[bwpage3]

It is amicable, yet instead of talking to your partner and getting the things you want, you come on TV asking strangers for advice.

 

This makes no sense at all.

[bwpage3]

2 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Many years ago a GF I was living with decided to take a vacation without telling me where she was going.  She just drove away one afternoon and did not return or answer calls.  I knew the relationship was on shaky ground, and the house I had built, bungalow style, had cost me just a little over time.  The next morning when the neighbors started asking me where she went, I did not say a word, just backed my truck up to the front door, and had the neighbor help me load my refrigerator, TV, washing machine, and all my personal belongings including my cookware.  Left her the minifridge, the cooking station and cabinet, the bed and the couch, and I bounced after locking the house, locking the screened and gated porch area, and throwing my keys through the small dog door in the slider.  Walked or drove basically with what I wanted and restarted anew in a new rental far far away from the home in Wang Samo, actually moving to Phuket.....lol.  Never once did I obtain a call from the now ex.  I had a usufruct that I walked away from as there was no way I would live in the village anymore, gossip is awful and rife.  I had all of the purchase receipts showing I had bought the items as I had the receipts written in my name from the small store in Wang Sam Mo I had bought it from. Different story with my now Thai ex-wife, gave the house to our daughter, the Truck to the ex father in-law and put the property in the daughters name as well.  Still walked away with my personal items, and started anew.  I learned a long time ago to never invest more than you can walk away from.

I learned a long time ago to never invest more than you can walk away from.

 

Maybe you should learn about relationships and how to get into a long lasting relationship and how to maintain it over the years, so you don't have to walk away from all your stuff?

 

Surely you did not move all the way to Thailand to keep giving away all your stuff?

[blackcab]

As it appears you have a Usufruct, I will now change my previous advice. There should be no problem removing furniture from a property you have a Usufruct for.

[blackcab]

2 hours ago, Jen65 said:

...ie the property is sold by agreement with both of us. It can not be sold without my agreement whilst I am alive.

 

This is not correct. The owner of the property can sell it while you are alive, and they do not need your permission to do so.

 

However, as a Usufruct is a real property right, any purchaser is required to honour the Usufruct agreement that you have until you die or the Usufruct expires.

 

In practice, this means that while the land can be sold, nobody would pay to purchase it.

[Yellowtail]

8 hours ago, blackcab said:

 

This is not correct. The owner of the property can sell it while you are alive, and they do not need your permission to do so.

 

However, as a Usufruct is a real property right, any purchaser is required to honour the Usufruct agreement that you have until you die or the Usufruct expires.

 

In practice, this means that while the land can be sold, nobody would pay to purchase it.

 

Why would someone in their thirties not buy a bargain property that had a Usufruct held by an eighty year old?

[blackcab]

4 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

 

Why would someone in their thirties not buy a bargain property that had a Usufruct held by an eighty year old?

 

If you can find such a property please let me know and I will pay you a commission.

 

 

[wombat]

Save yourself stress...
got your passport,
bankbook and plastics?
Walk away and don't look back.
 This is LOS!

[natway09]

The law is an ass.

The law here is no different to most  countries,

"getting judgement is one thing, actually getting what the judgement says is another"

[Yellowtail]

55 minutes ago, natway09 said:

The law is an ass.

The law here is no different to most  countries,

"getting judgement is one thing, actually getting what the judgement says is another"

 

SO you would support the return of "debtor's jail"?

  

[Nanaplaza666]

You think you are smarter then most people on here saying the simple 100baht document will give you some rights most people here don't know about but you mutually seperated and you want to know from other people on here how you can get your ???? out of the house ????? Please when you have something real to share come back , otherwise please stay in that house wich to your own words you have the right to untill you die . 

[ThailandRyan]

LOS, The Land Of Starting over..........

[khunPer]

On 12/6/2020 at 11:34 AM, Jen65 said:

although we split amicably , I have "right of access "  until I die or until I rescind it ie the property is sold by agreement with both of us. It can not be sold without my agreement whilst I am alive .   There is a simple document one signs at the Land Office to give you ( the farang ) right of access and costs about 100bht -  not many know about that !!!  It is agreed and signed when the property is purchased and filed with the house docs .

Right of habitation?

 

Quote

The grantee of the right of habitation does not pay rent to the grantor. If there is rental payment made, the matter becomes a tenancy. A right of habitation may be created for either a specific period of time or for the lifetime of the grantee. In case the rights are granted for a specific time period, the law states that such a period may not exceed 30 years; if a longer period is fixed, it shall be enforceable for only 30 years. The grant may be renewed for a period not exceeding 30 years from the time of renewal. Lastly, the right of habitation is not transferable by way of inheritance.

Source: Samui for Sale "Habitation Property Rights".

[Golden Triangle]

On 12/6/2020 at 8:25 PM, bwpage3 said:

I learned a long time ago to never invest more than you can walk away from.

 

Maybe you should learn about relationships and how to get into a long lasting relationship and how to maintain it over the years, so you don't have to walk away from all your stuff?

 

Surely you did not move all the way to Thailand to keep giving away all your stuff?

 

You spout b******s, I was married for a long long time, one day she up & left me, claimed my shift pattern had ruined our marriage. Not a lot I could do about that buster.

[Jen65]

On 12/6/2020 at 8:21 PM, bwpage3 said:

It is amicable, yet instead of talking to your partner and getting the things you want, you come on TV asking strangers for advice.

 

This makes no sense at all.

what I am asking is really "what is the Legal aspect "  rather than just "hearsay " !!!

[Jen65]

15 hours ago, Nanaplaza666 said:

You think you are smarter then most people on here saying the simple 100baht document will give you some rights most people here don't know about but you mutually seperated and you want to know from other people on here how you can get your ???? out of the house ????? Please when you have something real to share come back , otherwise please stay in that house wich to your own words you have the right to untill you die . 

we are not talking about mutual separation, Usufruct or the actual removal of personal effects - I am asking who legally owns the contents if one has paid for same and has receipts .  What I have is not a Usufruct !!

[ChipButty]

Why get stressed out over a load of second hand furniture? that nobody will buy or want it for nothing, move on and buy yourself all new and live alone, New broom sweeps clean

[jomtienisgood]

On 12/6/2020 at 5:34 PM, Jen65 said:

although we split amicably , I have "right of access "  until I die or until I rescind it ie the property is sold by agreement with both of us. It can not be sold without my agreement whilst I am alive .   There is a simple document one signs at the Land Office to give you ( the farang ) right of access and costs about 100bht -  not many know about that !!!  It is agreed and signed when the property is purchased and filed with the house docs .

Is this similar to usufruct?? Obviously seems much cheaper as one wouldn't need a lawyer.. Is this correct??

[jomtienisgood]

1 hour ago, ChipButty said:

Why get stressed out over a load of second hand furniture? that nobody will buy or want it for nothing, move on and buy yourself all new and live alone, New broom sweeps clean

Maybe the broom is part of the items....