PM promises "Fast - Safe - Transparent - Comprehensive" vaccine program - no mention of foreigners.

[robblok]

11 minutes ago, jayboy said:

You seem a little confused.It is not a question of expecting the Thai government to take care of foreigners, though the Thai government certainly has moral obligations to foreigners legally resident in the Kingdom.The Thai government has every reason to ensure that foreigners are vaccinated, particularly workers from Myanmar.More generally it makes no sense in the current situation to have significant numbers of Thai residents (including Westerners) who are not receiving the vaccine.

 

I hope and expect though I don't know for sure that elderly foreigners and those with co-morbidities etc will be given priority along with their Thai equivalents.I agree that for the rest of us the likelihood is that we will have to procure from private hospitals in the second half of this year.

 

Your GF is mistaken to think her company can procure vaccines directly, and the fact it is a "medical company" is neither here nor there.Government policy is certainly that the private sector can be involved but not an ad hoc basis.However the way it will work is that the Government will license established Thai agency companies to negotiate with the  individual vaccine manufacturers and then on sell to private hospitals and the like.

 

If I was a cynical person I might even hazard a guess that the agencies licensed would be under the ownership of influential people.Look at the virtually unknown Siam Bioscience designated as a manufacturer of vaccine in JV with foreign producers.

I think my GF is not mistaken, they are Roche and will try to get the vaccine. It might not work because as you say so far the government wants to keep private companies out. But the GM for Thailand is looking into it. I did not say that it was a sure thing. They wanted to just inoculate all of their employees and their partners / kids maybe.

 

I don't believe in moral obligations. I believe that people who work in Thailand and pay taxes have a right to it. Others not so much and should pay for it themselves. To expect a poor country like Thailand to pay for it is IMHO crazy. 

 

As for the Myamar workers, they are workers and should get it if legal (a point should be made for also doing illegaal workers). I just don't think Thailand should pay for people who are not liable / paying income tax. So not for elite visa holders or retirees. These people can afford it themselves neither are they Thai or paying in the system. So they should pay for it (includes me). 

 

Should not be sponging of the Thai government.

[Guderian]

They still have only a limited idea of whether there are any long-term side-effects to taking these vaccines, especially the new mRNA ones. Maybe it's not such a bad idea to wait until later in the year when hundreds of millions will have been vaccinated around the world, and decide then which is the best for you.

[jonclark]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

So what.. why do you expect the Thai government to take care of you. You are not Thai. I don't mind paying a private hospital. Also GF her company is looking into getting the vaccine themselves they are a medical company. I don't see the problem of governments not taking care of non Thais. 

We made choices when we came here.. why expect a government to take care of us. If you want that then go back to your home country. There you are being taken care of have more rights.

 

Well apart from the ethical issue, by not including everyone in Thai society you are prolonging the outbreak as some individuals could remain potential carriers and infected for longer. Nationality is irrelevant. Vaccinating foreigners who live in Thailand  benefits Thailand. 

 

Common sense dictates that all people are vaccinated as quickly as possible. And that requires a vaccine to be rolled out systematically and equally.

[ThomasThBKK]

32 minutes ago, dcnx said:

Considering private hospitals just got the green light to buy their own vaccines, you don’t need a crystal ball. Just common sense.

 

They can't.

 

Not a single vaccine is approved yet. 

 

It's obviously stupid not to offer vaccines to everyone living here, paid of course. Doesn't even make sense to discuss this. 

Thailand however is far far far back in the vaccine pipeline now as they didn't do <deleted>. 

 

With only a few hundred million USD they could have vaccinated the majority of the population (astra zenecca prices), that is far less than economic damages caused by a week of lockdown imho.

 

 

[DaLa]

Why is there only a distinction being made between income tax and VAT in this post. I don't pay income tax but I have paid stamp duty on land 0.5%, transfer duty 2%, average 160,000 baht 4 times a year on import duty,  6.5 baht per litre on my fuel, god knows how much I paid on my E class Merc that cost me twice as much here as it would in the UK.

 

Back to the argument, I will pay for the vaccine myself rather than wait as it will most likely be a condition of travel in the future.

[robblok]

5 minutes ago, jonclark said:

 

Well apart from the ethical issue, by not including everyone in Thai society you are prolonging the outbreak as some individuals could remain potential carriers and infected for longer. Nationality is irrelevant. Vaccinating foreigners who live in Thailand  benefits Thailand. 

 

Common sense dictates that all people are vaccinated as quickly as possible. And that requires a vaccine to be rolled out systematically and equally.

That is true, but it never said anything about cost. Why not make it mandatory and let the foreigners who don't work and pay thai wages tax pay for their own vaccination.

 

Your right that from an outbreak point of view its better, but paying for it is a different story.

 

I just feel that only people who pay into a system are entitled to benefits from it. People like me who chose to live somewhere else can be expected to pay for it if they are not paying into the system (vat does not count).

 

 

[Lacessit]

11 minutes ago, robblok said:

I think my GF is not mistaken, they are Roche and will try to get the vaccine. It might not work because as you say so far the government wants to keep private companies out. But the GM for Thailand is looking into it. I did not say that it was a sure thing. They wanted to just inoculate all of their employees and their partners / kids maybe.

 

I don't believe in moral obligations. I believe that people who work in Thailand and pay taxes have a right to it. Others not so much and should pay for it themselves. To expect a poor country like Thailand to pay for it is IMHO crazy. 

 

As for the Myamar workers, they are workers and should get it if legal (a point should be made for also doing illegaal workers). I just don't think Thailand should pay for people who are not liable / paying income tax. So not for elite visa holders or retirees. These people can afford it themselves neither are they Thai or paying in the system. So they should pay for it (includes me). 

 

Should not be sponging of the Thai government.

You don't believe in moral obligations. So if you were to get a Thai girl pregnant, you would walk away from the responsibility of fatherhood?

Thailand is not a poor country. It's the food bowl of Asia, and a significant manufacturing hub besides. The populace here is only poor because of the wealth concentrated in the hands of a very small elite.

I agree, I don't want to be sponging off the Thai government. Having said that, I don't want to be stung by them either.

[bikerbri]

I like the idea of herd immunity for Thais. I won’t need the vaccine. More vaccine to go round for the Thai citizens..

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You don't believe in moral obligations. So if you were to get a Thai girl pregnant, you would walk away from the responsibility of fatherhood?

Thailand is not a poor country. It's the food bowl of Asia, and a significant manufacturing hub besides. The populace here is only poor because of the wealth concentrated in the hands of a very small elite.

I agree, I don't want to be sponging off the Thai government. Having said that, I don't want to be stung by them either.

I don't believe Thailand has a moral obligation towards retirees and people on study or tourist visas' or elite visa's to pay for their vaccination as these people did not pay into the healthcare system.

 

Different story for people who work here and pay into the system (foreigners too). I don't mind to pay for my vaccination and i do think that everyone should be vaccinated but the people i mentioned should pay for it themselves. 

 

No I would not like it if the government made a profit on me but it would not deter me either. It will probably be a private hospital that makes the profit. 

[metisdead]

Some posts using trolling images or trolling videos have been removed. 

[John Drake]

46 minutes ago, rupert the bear said:

only greed and self interest.embassies need to speak up but dont hold your breath[im sure the staff will get theirs though]

 

Got an email from the US Embassy yesterday or the day before. It said Americans getting vaccinated is not their problem. Contact Thai authorities. Will not provide vaccination services for American citizens. Your tax dollars at work. 

[farang63]

Vaccine Questions: - Will we be able to stop wearing the mask? NO - Will bars, restaurants, gyms, discos etc. work normally? NO - Will we be immune to Covid? We still don't know exactly - Will we no longer be contagious? We still don't know exactly - Would the schools restart normally? NO - Will we be able to stop social distancing? NO - Will we be able to stop sanitizing our hands every 5 minutes? NO - Will we be able to hug and kiss our grandparents again? NO - Will cinemas, theaters and stadiums reopen? NO - Will we be able to assemble? NO - Will there be no more lockdowns? They might serve the same - What real benefit is there then in getting vaccinated? MAYBE the virus will not kill you. Works 90-95% - But why is it not even certain that the virus will not kill me? NO but the possibility of this happening is statistically very low - But if statistically I still have a very low chance of the virus killing me ... then why should I get vaccinated? To protect others - So if I get vaccinated, can others be safe? NO - Will vaccinating me return to normal life as before? NO-- At this point I understand that the vaccine will not change things much ... One last doubt ... - If many times the vaccine causes me an adverse reaction in a few months or years due to the vaccine, does anyone take responsibility? NO

[jayboy]

15 minutes ago, robblok said:

I think my GF is not mistaken, they are Roche and will try to get the vaccine. It might not work because as you say so far the government wants to keep private companies out. But the GM for Thailand is looking into it. I did not say that it was a sure thing. They wanted to just inoculate all of their employees and their partners / kids maybe.

 

I don't believe in moral obligations. I believe that people who work in Thailand and pay taxes have a right to it. Others not so much and should pay for it themselves. To expect a poor country like Thailand to pay for it is IMHO crazy. 

 

As for the Myamar workers, they are workers and should get it if legal (a point should be made for also doing illegaal workers). I just don't think Thailand should pay for people who are not liable / paying income tax. So not for elite visa holders or retirees. These people can afford it themselves neither are they Thai or paying in the system. So they should pay for it (includes me). 

 

Should not be sponging of the Thai government.

 

Government policy is not to keep the private sector out (far from it) but to ensure that the import of each vaccine is handled by one handling source in Thailand.I doubt whether Roche would qualify for a variety of very obvious reasons, not least conflict of interest. In any case they don't need to import vaccines to ensure their employees are looked after.If they want to jump the queue that's a different matter.

 

Whether you believe in moral obligations is a matter of no consequence to anyone but yourself.The Thai government certainly does and this was made clear at the recent FCCT briefing on the subject.You have some odd ideas about who is paying and not paying tax but this is beside the point.I don't think regarding Western foreigners that the Thai government should be expected to pay for their vaccinations - and I don't think anyone has seriously argued this anyway.The important thing is that the vaccine is rolled out in line with Thai government policy with the more vulnerable - regardless of nationality or tax status - given priority.Oh and by the way Thailand is not a poor country.

 

You get yourself in a complete muddle in your comments on Myanmar workers, arguing one way and then the other.The point you need to grasp  is that it's useless and frankly rather silly to agonise about the status of Thai residents (ooh look, he's an Elite member - don't give him the vaccine) in the current pandemic crisis.The overwhelming urgency is to get protection for everybody.

[Lacessit]

5 minutes ago, robblok said:

I don't believe Thailand has a moral obligation towards retirees and people on study or tourist visas' or elite visa's to pay for their vaccination as these people did not pay into the healthcare system.

 

Different story for people who work here and pay into the system (foreigners too). I don't mind to pay for my vaccination and i do think that everyone should be vaccinated but the people i mentioned should pay for it themselves. 

 

No I would not like it if the government made a profit on me but it would not deter me either. It will probably be a private hospital that makes the profit. 

You have your opinion, I have mine.

Just how well do you think the owners of private hospitals here are connected to those in government?

[jayboy]

57 minutes ago, chuang said:

.just wonder which country give free vaccine to foreigners....

 

Every European country for sure.

[bristolgeoff]

The farang will be last or made to pay alot.the rich thais will do this to jump the line for sure but quietly doing that.Not right but this time it is better to be in a western country to get the jab fairly

[MuayThaiGuy]

He doesn't know that it's "safe". That's a lie.

It's not like any vaccine you've ever taken.

It's the first ever mRNA vaccine ever to be used on humans.

The long term effects are completely unknown.

The people rolling up their sleeve for it are essentially volunteering to be guinea pigs for Pfizer (which is a company with a long history of criminal/deceptive practices).

Also, if you have adverse health effects (as many people do), you're not allowed to sue Pfizer or Moderna.

They're completely exempt from liability.

Insanity.

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, jayboy said:

 

Government policy is not to keep the private sector out (far from it) but to ensure that the import of each vaccine is handled by one handling source in Thailand.I doubt whether Roche would qualify for a variety of very obvious reasons, not least conflict of interest. In any case they don't need to import vaccines to ensure their employees are looked after.If they want to jump the queue that's a different matter.

 

Whether you believe in moral obligations is a matter of no consequence to anyone but yourself.The Thai government certainly does and this was made clear at the recent FCCT briefing on the subject.You have some odd ideas about who is paying and not paying tax but this is beside the point.I don't think regarding Western foreigners that the Thai government should be expected to pay for their vaccinations - and I don't think anyone has seriously argued this anyway.The important thing is that the vaccine is rolled out in line with Thai government policy with the more vulnerable - regardless of nationality or tax status - given priority.Oh and by the way Thailand is not a poor country.

 

You get yourself in a complete muddle in your comments on Myanmar workers, arguing one way and then the other.The point you need to grasp  is that it's useless and frankly rather silly to agonise about the status of Thai residents (ooh look, he's an Elite member - don't give him the vaccine) in the current pandemic crisis.The overwhelming urgency is to get protection for everybody.

Of course it was about jumping the cue (plus not getting an Chinese vaccine that was what the that GM was concerned about)

 

Seems people are arguing that they want it for free. My point was if you pay into the system have a right to Thai healthcare it should be free. Otherwise you should pay. (seems we are agreeing about expats that they have to pay themselves)

 

The reason why i got muddled with Myanmar workers is clear they are a large group and if the Thai government does not pay it wont happen. For Westerners have funds for themselves. Its not so much about status again I just don't believe the Thai government should pay for them period. (me included).

 

I can agree with access that it should be based on how vulnerable they are but access is not the same as free.

[robblok]

8 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You have your opinion, I have mine.

Just how well do you think the owners of private hospitals here are connected to those in government?

No idea, there could be those that own them or own shares in them.

[Pedrogaz]

2 hours ago, djayz said:

We are only "dirty farang" if we take such comments to heart. See it for what it really is: an ignorant comment made by an ignorant human (this guy, not the general population) who only has his position thanks to family connections. If he didn't have those, he'd be driving a tuktuk.

Once you understand that, you can take everything he says with a pinch of salt. A little like not taking the likes of Trump seriously. 

A good philosophy.

[herfiehandbag]

3 hours ago, keith101 said:

We will be the last to be vaccinated unless we get it through private hospitals paying through the nose for it and that way the Government doesn't have to consider buying vaccines for us dirty farang as Anutin called us .

Well, to be fair, no - one has said that. They have said that it is to be a comprehensive programme.

I have diabetes. I am registered with and my condition is managed by the clinic at my local government hospital, attending every three months. I pay, but it is not exorbitant, less than half what the private hospital charges. B2500 for my three monthly check and medications and insulin, B3500 for my annual full check up including a chest X ray and again medications. I was told at my last visit that when the vaccine becomes available I will receive it along with my fellow patients. I fully expect that I will have to pay - I doubt it will be that expensive.

[tonysilly]

Yes no mention if Farang pay double or triple price!!! 555

[Tanoshi]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

If you pay income tax i agree. Otherwise I dont. Nobody ever got rights from paying VAT in any country.

If you have a Thai bank account income tax is automatically deducted from the interest @15%.

Most expats will therefore be paying VAT and income tax.

[dave moir]

3 hours ago, keith101 said:

We will be the last to be vaccinated unless we get it through private hospitals paying through the nose for it and that way the Government doesn't have to consider buying vaccines for us dirty farang as Anutin called us .

The vaccine is produced and sold at cost! Anyone trying to sell at a profit can be reported to the manufacturer and they will stop supplying the sellers!

[Tanoshi]

5 minutes ago, dave moir said:

The vaccine is produced and sold at cost! Anyone trying to sell at a profit can be reported to the manufacturer and they will stop supplying the sellers!

The AstraZeneca vaccine is under $4 per dose. (120 baht)

Edited January 16, 2021 by Tanoshi

[sanchmo]

3 hours ago, robblok said:

So what.. why do you expect the Thai government to take care of you. You are not Thai. I don't mind paying a private hospital. Also GF her company is looking into getting the vaccine themselves they are a medical company. I don't see the problem of governments not taking care of non Thais. 

We made choices when we came here.. why expect a government to take care of us. If you want that then go back to your home country. There you are being taken care of have more rights.

I agree. I don't anticipate having to wait. Where we live, I have to pay a little more than Thais for medical care, but it pales in comparison to what I would pay in the U.S. I have no complaints.

[Elreeco]

54 minutes ago, farang63 said:

Vaccine Questions: - Will we be able to stop wearing the mask? NO - Will bars, restaurants, gyms, discos etc. work normally? NO - Will we be immune to Covid? We still don't know exactly - Will we no longer be contagious? We still don't know exactly - Would the schools restart normally? NO - Will we be able to stop social distancing? NO - Will we be able to stop sanitizing our hands every 5 minutes? NO - Will we be able to hug and kiss our grandparents again? NO - Will cinemas, theaters and stadiums reopen? NO - Will we be able to assemble? NO - Will there be no more lockdowns? They might serve the same - What real benefit is there then in getting vaccinated? MAYBE the virus will not kill you. Works 90-95% - But why is it not even certain that the virus will not kill me? NO but the possibility of this happening is statistically very low - But if statistically I still have a very low chance of the virus killing me ... then why should I get vaccinated? To protect others - So if I get vaccinated, can others be safe? NO - Will vaccinating me return to normal life as before? NO-- At this point I understand that the vaccine will not change things much ... One last doubt ... - If many times the vaccine causes me an adverse reaction in a few months or years due to the vaccine, does anyone take responsibility? NO

Correct.....

[Dialemco]

Until large numbers of the world's population are vaccinated there will be Covid and no normal life for anyone. The immediate problem is shortage of vaccines which will have to be procured by Governments of countries that can afford to pay first for their Citizens and yes for all those that cannot pay the quicker vaccines are rolled out in every country the better for everyone.

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, rooster59 said:

Thai prime minister Prayuth Chan-ocha has urged the health authorities to conduct a fast Covid-19 vaccine rollout. 

 

Yet health minister Anutin Charnvirakul admitted one of the vaccines won't arrive in Thailand until JUNE. 

Fell at the first hurdle then..... he promised to stamp out corruption, that was a non-starter too !

[Srikcir]

4 hours ago, robblok said:

So what.. why do you expect the Thai government to take care of you. You are not Thai. 

When some embassies say Covid-19 vaccination is the responsibility of the "host" country for expats (and not the foreigners home country), isn't it reasonable that an expectation that the host (ie., Thailand) will include foreigners in their vaccines rollout plans?

And I don't mean a 'where ever' you can get it as a plan.