Buriram becomes first Thai province to penalize refusal for COVID-19 vaccine

[fleccer]

3 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

I would ask you to back up that assertion with some links, but I don’t think you care much for actual information.

Because I know doctors in my country who claim that some of their patients having problems due to the vaccine.

 But I need to ask one thing to all the fans of this "vaccine": if this vaccine is so safe it has no harmful effect, why do I have to sign forms to release both the authorities and the big pharma from responsibility? I have had several vaccines in my life but I have never been asked to sign anything. So you wanna vaccinate me? Do you force me to do it? Ok then I'm not gonna sign anything at all, the responsibility is yours not mine. I won't sign a <deleted>

 

[bermondburi]

40 minutes ago, DBath said:

I’d have no problem with a green pass being implemented:

 

• I workout at home
• I have my own pool
• Wife is an exceptional cook, so we never eat out and have our groceries delivered
• While I do occasionally stay at a Marriott in Bangkok when I go there, it’s not a deal breaker for me not to
• I don’t go to stadiums, sporting events, theaters or other venues

While I’ve not made a decision to vaccinate or not, I will definitely not be getting vaccinated with Sinovac or AZ. I’ve said this before, and I have my reasons, which are nobody’s business. So, spare me the long drawn-out, over-analyzed statistics and don’t bother coming back at me with the ‘science’ about how everyone should be willing to take either of those vaccines. 
 

That said, the ‘green pass’ suits me fine, with the added benefit of being able to avoid people like you and others here who want to try and dictate how I should live my life, simply because of those who are too stupid to responsibly do so. I’m healthy, happy, I always wear a mask and diligently wash and use hand gel every time I go out - and when I return. I avoid getting near or touching other people. I have everything I need and I certainly don’t need some stupid, crazy government law or any other person dictating how I should live my life.
 

Anyone here care to provide me statistics on what my risk percentages are for getting or passing covid to others? I’d sure be interested to know, as I haven’t seen anything intelligently written about that.
 

Regardless, it’s probably not going to change my opinion one iota. 

My own green pass. Currently used to enter all of the above, plus malls, many shops, train stations, airports, even some fast food places, workplaces, government buildings, utility companies etc. 

 

It shows my picture, my ID number, my vaccination status(different colours mean different things), had a QR code for scanning, and a check in facility for tracking. 

 

I also think it's a good idea, right now it doesn't matter that people aren't vaccinated, no record of infection is another shade of green, but in the future I can see this changing.

 

You may find yourself extremely limited in where you can go and what services you can access if the future if Thailand implemented a similar system. 

 

On the plus side, I can go about my normal business.

[holy cow cm]

6 minutes ago, todlad said:

You are right that no one will change their minds here but let it be said that the real world efficacy of the sinovac vaccine is significantly better than the results they got in the trials phase. It is your right to shun Chinese products and services but in this case, maybe I helped to set the record straight.

Sure, get enough jabs of anything and it will proliferate in your body. And that is the case with this vaccine as it has been suggested to have multiple jabs to help it get to a higher level of protective state. The only case I can say, is perhaps it is better than nothing, but that is clearly how the powers of the Junta have made it as there are no choices. No thanks for me and my family, but be safe and take care.

[holy cow cm]

54 minutes ago, DBath said:

I’d have no problem with a green pass being implemented:

 

• I workout at home
• I have my own pool
• Wife is an exceptional cook, so we never eat out and have our groceries delivered
• While I do occasionally stay at a Marriott in Bangkok when I go there, it’s not a deal breaker for me not to
• I don’t go to stadiums, sporting events, theaters or other venues

While I’ve not made a decision to vaccinate or not, I will definitely not be getting vaccinated with Sinovac or AZ. I’ve said this before, and I have my reasons, which are nobody’s business. So, spare me the long drawn-out, over-analyzed statistics and don’t bother coming back at me with the ‘science’ about how everyone should be willing to take either of those vaccines. 
 

That said, the ‘green pass’ suits me fine, with the added benefit of being able to avoid people like you and others here who want to try and dictate how I should live my life, simply because of those who are too stupid to responsibly do so. I’m healthy, happy, I always wear a mask and diligently wash and use hand gel every time I go out - and when I return. I avoid getting near or touching other people. I have everything I need and I certainly don’t need some stupid, crazy government law or any other person dictating how I should live my life.
 

Anyone here care to provide me statistics on what my risk percentages are for getting or passing covid to others? I’d sure be interested to know, as I haven’t seen anything intelligently written about that.
 

Regardless, it’s probably not going to change my opinion one iota. 

I totally 100% agree with you on all levels. My stand is me and my family will choose when and what to jab with. As for normal life, well this is not going to happen in a long long time as long as mutations become prevalent.

[Sheryl]

4 hours ago, todlad said:

 

From the few examples I remember in Bangkok, the blood clot rate for the Sinovac vaccine is/was around 0.002%. Given the population of Serrana and multiplying the population by the vaccination rate of 98%, then we might expect less than one blood clot case.

As for the other problems and "permanent damage" (whatever you mean by that), I have nothing to add at this stage.

Sinovac has nto been linked to any increase in blood clots. You may be thinking of AZ and J&J vaccines.  For those yes the percentage is around 0.001 - .002%

 

No cases of "permanent" damage have been identified  to date due to Sinovac in either the clinical trials (4 different countries, about 40,000 people) or post-authorization administration ( dozens of countries, over 100 million people vaccinated).  The only severe adverse reaction reported to date are very rare allergic reactions, which can be effectively treated.

[placeholder]

8 minutes ago, holy cow cm said:

Sure, get enough jabs of anything and it will proliferate in your body. And that is the case with this vaccine as it has been suggested to have multiple jabs to help it get to a higher level of protective state. The only case I can say, is perhaps it is better than nothing, but that is clearly how the powers of the Junta have made it as there are no choices. No thanks for me and my family, but be safe and take care.

So many falsehoods here

First off, 2 injections are the standard with Coronavac. Just like Pfizer and Moderna. 

And no "get enough jabs of anything and it will proliferate in your body." is false, The immune system sees to it that these dead virus particles are eliminated from one body in short order.

And no, there's no question that it's a lot better than nothing. Repeated studies have show this to be the case.

Why are you so committed to creating or relaying falsehoods?

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, DBath said:

While I’ve not made a decision to vaccinate or not, I will definitely not be getting vaccinated with Sinovac or AZ. I’ve said this before, and I have my reasons, which are nobody’s business. So, spare me the long drawn-out, over-analyzed statistics and don’t bother coming back at me with the ‘science’ about how everyone should be willing to take either of those vaccines. 

If you don't want your reasons to be others' business, just leave the subject alone. Same goes for science and statistics. But "long drawn-out over analyzed statistics." Given how few sentences are devoted to them, it's clear that any mention of science and statistics qualifies as long and drawn-out to you.

[todlad]

39 minutes ago, holy cow cm said:

Choice is the key issue here, freedom of choice. As far as I remember we live in a supposed Democratic country, even if you here it said it is a bit laughable using the term.. A mask does not enter your body and alter it. I understand a mask protects you and others out in public, I am ok with it if it is a must. I am not opposed to vaccine taking, but I am opposed to being led to the guillotine and told to put my head into it so they can pull the handle at their egotistical will. My choice of vaccine is not in Thailand and there are ulterior motives for this reason. When the time comes on my and my families time, we will choose what we choose and not some person or government on a tyrannical escapade because of their own ego or using oppressive behavior in order to make others rich. This Buriram control freak needs to go away.

 

 

I don't argue with much of that. A mask plus distancing plus frequent hand washing is quite effective. You are wisely pro vaccine and you are, as you say, free to make your own choice.  In the end, I don't know the legality of the Buriram suggestion but I doubt he will be able to take it too far. However, if it pushes more people down your chosen route, so much the better.

[holy cow cm]

7 minutes ago, placeholder said:

So many falsehoods here

First off, 2 injections are the standard with Coronavac. Just like Pfizer and Moderna. 

And no "get enough jabs of anything and it will proliferate in your body." is false, The immune system sees to it that these dead virus particles are eliminated from one body in short order.

And no, there's no question that it's a lot better than nothing. Repeated studies have show this to be the case.

Why are you so committed to creating or relaying falsehoods?

Too much wrong information out there and too much information that doesn't line up.. Why are you so committed to push your agenda? Just because you say it's true doesn't mean I or anyone else have to believe you. I am educated and I read tons and follow as much as possible. People can go ahead and jab away, up to you and them. I would also say please don't put out what you believe is true because in actuality nothing is supported to be 100% factual as everything is still inconclusive. I always try to look at both sides of the road. Repeated studies from who? WHO? WHO only says they can reach over the threshold of 50% efficacy? China vaccines are plainly to say, inferior. But please be my guest as is your choice. I say that to everyone, it is your choice and I wish no ill on anyone. I am not trying to tell people not to jab with the China ones. Entirely up to you!

[4MyEgo]

On 5/14/2021 at 11:10 PM, ThailandRyan said:

Insanity and utterly ridiculous when vaccines are not available for all people who may need them.  Sorry sir you get to go to jail because you did not sign up to be vaccinated and you broke the law 

But your honor I tried and no one would help me Said the 70 year old blind man.  To bad said the judge, its off to Klong Prem prison you go......

 

I would assume that this IDIOT bought his way into his position and knows nothing about the Nuremberg Code and Human Rights 

[holy cow cm]

14 minutes ago, todlad said:

I don't argue with much of that. A mask plus distancing plus frequent hand washing is quite effective. You are wisely pro vaccine and you are, as you say, free to make your own choice.  In the end, I don't know the legality of the Buriram suggestion but I doubt he will be able to take it too far. However, if it pushes more people down your chosen route, so much the better.

Thank you! Wait and see what happens to Buriram and this guy, but word said yesterday that he (PM) is neutral as each Governor makes their own decisions. who knows why, perhaps only a political stance to keep Bhumjathai on his Junta side. Have a great safe day. 

[placeholder]

Just now, holy cow cm said:

Too much wrong information out there and too much information that doesn't line up.. Why are you so committed to push your agenda? Just because you say it's true doesn't mean I or anyone else have to believe you. I am educated and I read tons and follow as much as possible. People can go ahead and jab away, up to you and them. I would also say please don't put out what you believe is true because in actuality nothing is supported to be 100% factual as everything is still inconclusive. I always try to look at both sides of the road. Repeated studies from who? WHO? WHO only says they can reach over the threshold of 50% efficacy? China vaccines are plainly to say, inferior. But please be my guest as is your choice. I say that to everyone, it is your choice and I wish no ill on anyone. I am not trying to tell people not to jab with the China ones. Entirely up to you!

You're right. There is way too much wrong information out there. But unless you believe that there's some sort of conspiracy among the world's epidemiologists, it's not coming from me but you. And no, everything isn't still inconclusive. Unless you believe that the odds of all these studies being wrong make that likely. What is it that you don't understand about effectiveness being a technical term when it's used by epidemiologists? That has only to do with the infection rate and not how well a vaccine does in suppressing symptoms. There's a live study going on right now in Brazil in which a town located in Sao Paolo is effectively back to normal thanks to a vaccination rate of adults of 98%, This is inconclusive why? And why are all the other studies inconclusinve. You think it's an amazing coincidence that all these studies agree on how potent Coronavac is.

As for you reading "tons", I believe you. There are tons of nonsense out there about Covid. But none of it comes from epidemiological studies.

[todlad]

33 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Sinovac has nto been linked to any increase in blood clots. You may be thinking of AZ and J&J vaccines.  For those yes the percentage is around 0.001 - .002%

 

No cases of "permanent" damage have been identified  to date due to Sinovac in either the clinical trials (4 different countries, about 40,000 people) or post-authorization administration ( dozens of countries, over 100 million people vaccinated).  The only severe adverse reaction reported to date are very rare allergic reactions, which can be effectively treated.

Apologies ... i don't want to be seen to be adding to fake news so i welcome your correction.

I agree with your comment regarding the permanent damage assertion.

[Danderman123]

1 hour ago, fleccer said:

Because I know doctors in my country who claim that some of their patients having problems due to the vaccine.

 But I need to ask one thing to all the fans of this "vaccine": if this vaccine is so safe it has no harmful effect, why do I have to sign forms to release both the authorities and the big pharma from responsibility? I have had several vaccines in my life but I have never been asked to sign anything. So you wanna vaccinate me? Do you force me to do it? Ok then I'm not gonna sign anything at all, the responsibility is yours not mine. I won't sign a <deleted>

 

I asked you for data to back up your anti-vaccine garbage, and all you have are stories. 

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, fleccer said:

Because I know doctors in my country who claim that some of their patients having problems due to the vaccine.

 But I need to ask one thing to all the fans of this "vaccine": if this vaccine is so safe it has no harmful effect, why do I have to sign forms to release both the authorities and the big pharma from responsibility? I have had several vaccines in my life but I have never been asked to sign anything. So you wanna vaccinate me? Do you force me to do it? Ok then I'm not gonna sign anything at all, the responsibility is yours not mine. I won't sign a <deleted>

 

Well, for one thing, they had governments over a barrel. Without a release, they wouldn't offer the vaccinies. And yes it was new. But by now we have hundreds of millions of vaccinations and a huge amount of data.

[DBath]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

Filed this post under:

> Life of the Party requests statistics to ignore...

Thanks for your consideration, it’s heartfelt, I can tell. 

[fleccer]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

 a huge amount of data.

Yeah, but this large amount of data concerns the immediate, but we know nothing of medium and long-term effects, no one knows. It takes years or even decades to make a vaccine, but they released this one in only 6 months, come on

[holy cow cm]

38 minutes ago, placeholder said:

You're right. There is way too much wrong information out there. But unless you believe that there's some sort of conspiracy among the world's epidemiologists, it's not coming from me but you. And no, everything isn't still inconclusive. Unless you believe that the odds of all these studies being wrong make that likely. What is it that you don't understand about effectiveness being a technical term when it's used by epidemiologists? That has only to do with the infection rate and not how well a vaccine does in suppressing symptoms. There's a live study going on right now in Brazil in which a town located in Sao Paolo is effectively back to normal thanks to a vaccination rate of adults of 98%, This is inconclusive why? And why are all the other studies inconclusinve. You think it's an amazing coincidence that all these studies agree on how potent Coronavac is.

As for you reading "tons", I believe you. There are tons of nonsense out there about Covid. But none of it comes from epidemiological studies.

Keep on tooting your horn about all studies lining up with your biased rhetoric. You can copy and paste this link below to your browser and read from an online news publisher called Nature. Now do I believe the material, yes and no, but it is yet another information post showing inconsistencies, so even these numbers there are stated imperfect and tend to lean to inconclusive. The numbers are all over the place, and yes it has been suggested by many groups to do more than 2 jabs to reach a higher efficacy with the Chinese vaccines as they are plainly inferior to most all others. Only thing you have going on your rant is it is better than nothing and for the poorer nations something is better than nothing. I suggest we stop talking now because it is simply getting boring and not going anywhere. Again, be my guest and go get any of the Chinese vaccines you seem to think are above standard, and for that matter of fact I suggest everyone do the same. In the long run jabbing is probably better than not getting a jab if we don't want to be hermits and have some sort of normality in our lives again..

 

China’s COVID vaccines are going global — but questions remain (nature.com) 

 

This is just one of so so many oodles of articles written on this subject. It has even came out ihn otehr articles that vaccines at  times have been botched and less than inferior. No telling why, but I do not trust anything coming from that country. End of Story and go preach to someone else.

[DBath]

2 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Yet you are an anomaly like most of us who live the same way.  However, the "stupid, crazy government law or any other person dictating how I should live my life." is not entirely for just people like us, but for those who don't care to follow rules and is done to unfortunately protect them from themselves.  

I’m pretty sure I implied this in my post and I agree (I think). There are many who defy or are too ignorant to follow the procedures, I just don’t believe I should be lumped in with those people and forced to do something I shouldn’t have to IMO. Especially when I happen to be religiously and diligently following all of the procedures. Some people here want to make forcing others to get a vaccine ‘a procedure’ and that’s what I have a serious problem with, because it’s my choice, for now at least. 

[Sir Dude]

Buri Ram province adminstration and mayor is pretty fascist on a whole bunch of stuff in general, so no surprise here.

[todlad]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

Sinovac has nto been linked to any increase in blood clots. You may be thinking of AZ and J&J vaccines.  For those yes the percentage is around 0.001 - .002%

 

No cases of "permanent" damage have been identified  to date due to Sinovac in either the clinical trials (4 different countries, about 40,000 people) or post-authorization administration ( dozens of countries, over 100 million people vaccinated).  The only severe adverse reaction reported to date are very rare allergic reactions, which can be effectively treated.

I just needed to say, I remembered the small number of cases in Thailand from a while ago following vaccination with sinovac. They reported stroke like symptoms. Take a look as that is what I was thinking about ... https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/thailand-to-continue-with-chinese-vaccine-after-side-effects-in-small-number-of-cases

[DBath]

2 hours ago, bermondburi said:

My own green pass. Currently used to enter all of the above, plus malls, many shops, train stations, airports, even some fast food places, workplaces, government buildings, utility companies etc. 

 

It shows my picture, my ID number, my vaccination status(different colours mean different things), had a QR code for scanning, and a check in facility for tracking. 

 

I also think it's a good idea, right now it doesn't matter that people aren't vaccinated, no record of infection is another shade of green, but in the future I can see this changing.

 

You may find yourself extremely limited in where you can go and what services you can access if the future if Thailand implemented a similar system. 

 

On the plus side, I can go about my normal business.

I don’t disagree that this may be where things are headed. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with it - ever. I also can see why some would prefer to avoid the hassle of not having a green pass, if that’s what it comes down to. I just get frosted with some on here, many have good research and statistics, but feel the need to add their arrogant, snarky comments on top of it and imply your ignorant for not being willing to take just any vaccine and that is a big turn off for me. I already blocked one such person here who fits that profile.  Ultimately, it’s my choice, until a higher authority tells me otherwise and for now that’s fortunate. 

Edited May 16, 2021 by DBath

[Tanoshi]

On 5/14/2021 at 8:02 PM, snoop1130 said:

Buriram Governor Thatchakorn Hatthathayakul urged every individual, aged 18 or more, living or working in Buriram, to submit their COVID-19 risk assessment form and apply for vaccination through the publicly available channels by May 31st.

 

The channels include door-to-door approach by public health volunteers, online registration or personal visits to hospitals or health offices in the province. Failure to apply by May 31st is liable to one month in prison and/or a fine of 10,000 Baht.

The very last thing the Government hospitals want already dealing with Covid patients is thousands of Thais queuing to register for the vaccination.

 

It's been said before, some of these Governors don't have the brain of a wooden rocking horse.

I strongly disagree - I think they have.

[Thomas J]

I don't know what it is about Covid versus other transmittal diseases that has caused this paranoia.  People have TB but no testing required no mandate to get vaccinated.  People enter the country with HIV an incurable disease, but no mandate to be tested, no restrictions on their sexual activities to prevent the spread.  There are measles, rubella, shingles, roseola, and small pox.  Again, all viruses no testing, no requirement to be vaccinated. 

Now while some of those like measles are not life threatening, others like TB are.  TB is the tenth leading cause of death in the world.  

95% of those contracting Covid will not even require hospitalization, and 99.5% recover.  I am not trying to say the public should not be concerned over Covid but the hysteria over it is ludicrous when there is no similar hysteria over those other diseases.  If you are over 60, have pre-existing health problems, overweight, etc you should be concerned and take precautions.  If you are healthy young or middle age adults the fear of contracting Covid is out of proportion to its risk. 

Each day I see Thai's on motorcycles weaving in and out of traffic not afraid of the likelihood of killing themselves in a traffic accident.  Many of them do this without wearing a helmet, and they lower their mask to smoke a cigarette, but they do have the mask on so they don't get Covid.   

[redwood1]

3 minutes ago, Thomas J said:

I don't know what it is about Covid versus other transmittal diseases that has caused this paranoia.  People have TB but no testing required no mandate to get vaccinated.  People enter the country with HIV an incurable disease, but no mandate to be tested, no restrictions on their sexual activities to prevent the spread.  There are measles, rubella, shingles, roseola, and small pox.  Again, all viruses no testing, no requirement to be vaccinated. 

Now while some of those like measles are not life threatening, others like TB are.  TB is the tenth leading cause of death in the world.  

95% of those contracting Covid will not even require hospitalization, and 99.5% recover.  I am not trying to say the public should not be concerned over Covid but the hysteria over it is ludicrous when there is no similar hysteria over those other diseases.  If you are over 60, have pre-existing health problems, overweight, etc you should be concerned and take precautions.  If you are healthy young or middle age adults the fear of contracting Covid is out of proportion to its risk. 

Each day I see Thai's on motorcycles weaving in and out of traffic not afraid of the likelihood of killing themselves in a traffic accident.  Many of them do this without wearing a helmet, and they lower their mask to smoke a cigarette, but they do have the mask on so they don't get Covid.   

 

Your logic is sound...But people look into the WHY are labeled conspiracy theorist....There are always reasons for things...

[placnx]

21 hours ago, Spock said:

I believe that a large percentage of Thais not wanting to be vaccinated is not so much a sign of worldliness but ignorance. A vaccination for all is precisely what Thailand requires and the last thing it needs is large slabs of people reluctant to be immunised. Much more worldly populations than Thailand's are happily accepting the very minor risks and being injected, knowing that mass immunisation is the only way out of this mess.

Data on the infectiousness of the Indian variant is being gathered in Bolton, UK. Hopefully there will be clear evidence whether the Pfizer and/or AZ vaccines prevent asymptomatic infection. The 7-day rate per 100K is 255, compared to the next highest, Manchester, which is 46. The weekly change is +155%.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/latest-greater-manchester-infection-rates-20606807 Perhaps considerations such as this may/should influence decision making by individuals and governments.

[placnx]

12 hours ago, sithai64 said:

Its against your human rights to force you to have it .. its not 100% proven OK to start with and even then its your rights

Image: 12160.info

The Nuremberg code, which stated explicit voluntary consent from patients are required for human experimentation was drafted on August 9, 1947. On August 20, 1947, the judges delivered their verdict against Karl Brandt and 22 others.

It's quite usual to have to sign a consent form. Maybe some people could be intimidated to sign for their vaccination.

[todlad]

35 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Can you provide a link to that report?

I linked to a report on that a short while ago and here it is again ... https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/thailand-to-continue-with-chinese-vaccine-after-side-effects-in-small-number-of-cases

[Thomas J]

11 minutes ago, redwood1 said:

Your logic is sound...But people look into the WHY are labeled conspiracy theorist....There are always reasons for things...

No I don't think there is any conspiracy.  I think that just like a horrific plane crash the coverage of it has bred a hysteria that is unwarranted.  If you have 500 people die on Thailand's roads each day, "that is acceptable" however you have 10 people die from Covid and the country needs to be put on lockdown.  The disparity of response is just mind boggling. 

People say it is because I don't have a choice to catch Covid.  Yes you do.  You can avoid as much as you wish social contact with others.  I don't have a choice if a driver hits and kills me either.  I don't have a choice if someone next to me has TB and I contract it. 

However the reality still is that the overwhelming majority of people will be fine even if they contract Covid.  The overwhelming majority of people will not be good if policies are so severe that they stop the economy, bankrupt businesses, crater the banks with bad loans from those who can not repay their loans, permanently kill the tourist industry by shuttering hotels leaving tourists who may eventually want to return with no place to stay. 

I see that there is still a requirement that if I am fully vaccinated against Covid and leave the country I have to still have specific Covid insurance to re-enter.  And at lest as of today's date, I need to be quarantined. Now tell me that makes any sense and is not just a hysterical over reaction. 

[Peter Denis]

36 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Can you provide a link to that report?

 

45 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

There have been a lot of 'severe' reactions reported in Thai news outlets.

The 7 nurses at the training University who experienced 'stroke' like symptoms and were immediately transferred to a hospital, one of whom died days later.

...

 

Link to the article re the 9 student-nurses that experienced severe side-effects after receiving the vaccine.  

https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/9-student-nurses-experience-side-effects-from-sinovac-vaccine

The article is from 7 days ago and I did not yet come across an update.
If one of them died that would surely be reported on Thai media...