Vietnam Visa update - big changes

[La Quenta]

Well.....it's all happening in Vietnam. 

 

For those not informed, since approx 1st April, Vietnam started rejecting the vast majority of rolling business visas and a very large number of tourist visas. People who are trying to do new work permits to change jobs or get new jobs are ALSO being rejected.

 

The vast majority of those whose visa has been 'flagged' are being asked to leave the country within 15 days on an exit visa (which costs additional fees). Its basically a mass deportation. The deportees largely consist of retirees, digital nomads, workers whose workplace 1. improperly processed work permits or 2. didnt do it at all, or 3. used a dodgy agent to process (all unbelieveably common).

 

It is quite possible that once all is said and done, Vietnam will lose 75% of foreigners living in situ by around August/September this year. Hundreds have already left (no choice really) just in the past few weeks alone. 

 

There remains no official Government announcement aside from "Those who entered Vietnam - specifically those after March 2020 - on a tourist visa have been granted an extra month stay"  Aside from that, no official notice at all.  Certainly no clarification for those who were in country before March 2020. It was just a decision made and executed, except no one is entirely clear what is going on...even the agents. 

 

What does this mean? The takeaway is, for the next couple years (or more), it is quite likely that Vietnam will be totally out of the question for anyone who doesn't fit the following 2 criteria.

 

1. A tourist staying 30 days or less

2.An expert worker, with a minimum of a Bachelor Degree, 3 years+ verified experience in the field for the job in question outside of Vietnam (that can be formally verified).

 

In short, it has become very very very expat unfriendly in a very short space of time. 

[Jingthing]

Yes I've been following that.

I guess I'll pull a I told you so here.

I have posted many times to people promoting "retirement" in Vietnam that based on the visa offers there the government just isn't into that and thinking you're going to permanently settle in a country based on endless tourist visa runs or business visas based on fake businesses is basically quicksand city.

[bojo]

I'd be interested to know why Vietnam has changed tack or is this no surprise. I get JT says 'the government just isn't into this', but why not?? Anyway, it's news to me, but I'm not up to speed Vietnam-wise.................

[connda]

Pity guys married to Vietnamese women.  No "spouse visa" that I'm aware of.  Worse than Thailand.  I wonder how many guys with Vietnamese wives are having their families broken up.  ????  Sad.

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, bojo said:

I'd be interested to know why Vietnam has changed tack or is this no surprise. I get JT says 'the government just isn't into this', but why not?? Anyway, it's news to me, but I'm not up to speed Vietnam-wise.................

Vietnam is a serious country. It was obvious before that culturally they're very much into clearly productive foreigners but very indifferent to long term tourists, people claiming B.S. businesses for visa purposes, and retirees. Most countries in the world don't have a retirement visa! I don't know exactly what triggered this total disaster for so many expats there, but I think it's probably related to ... guess it ... Covid-19. 

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, connda said:

Pity guys married to Vietnamese women.  No "spouse visa" that I'm aware of.  Worse than Thailand.  I wonder how many guys with Vietnamese wives are having their families broken up.  ????  Sad.

Hmm. That I don't know about but I assumed that they did have allowances based on family. 

[bojo]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Vietnam is a serious country. It was obvious before that culturally they're very much into clearly productive foreigners but very indifferent to long term tourists, people claiming B.S. businesses for visa purposes, and retirees. Most countries in the world don't have a retirement visa! I don't know exactly what triggered this total disaster for so many expats there, but I think it's probably related to ... guess it ... Covid-19. 

Cheers for the insight..................

[thaitero]

So one can be tourist for 30 days,,

What sort of rule there is to be 30 day tourist again after first 30 touristdays ?

[WineOh]

I worked in VN on a few different projects a while back.

The visa situation is a complete nightmare.

Business visa and work permit are nigh on impossible to get.

Hanoi, although I do like it, is full of young gap year teachers from the states who survive on 15 day border runs to remain in lawful status.

 

VN's visa system makes Thailand's look like Disneyland in comparison. 

 

Vietnam is a beautiful country to visit.

Living there permanently would be a totally different story.

[madmen]

Stay away from communism and Islam and no problems. 

 

It was always sloppy seconds to Thailand. Feel sorry for the expats 

[Poet]

The so-called mass deportations are simply an ending of the pandemic concession that allowed many foreigners to stay far longer than usual.

They are also clearing up the mess of special visas sold by agents, including dodgy business and work permits via companies set up only for that purpose.

Stressful for the folks caught up in it but what did they expect?

The pandemic put everything on pause for a year or so, but this process was clearly underway long before the pandemic.

Don't get me wrong, I think Vietnam is terrific, better than Thailand, but sadly they are not interested in longterm guests.

 

[GrahamJ]

32 minutes ago, connda said:

Pity guys married to Vietnamese women.  No "spouse visa" that I'm aware of.  Worse than Thailand.  I wonder how many guys with Vietnamese wives are having their families broken up.  ????  Sad.

Hi, a couple of friends of mine who have Vietnamese wife's get a 5 year visa based on marriage. I'm not sure whether this entitles them to stay for 5 years without exiting and then re-entering I need to ask them. 

 

[madmen]

4 minutes ago, Poet said:

The so-called mass deportations are simply an ending of the pandemic concession that allowed many foreigners to stay far longer than usual.

They are also clearing up the mess of special visas sold by agents, including dodgy business and work permits via companies set up only for that purpose.

Stressful for the folks caught up in it but what did they expect?

The pandemic put everything on pause for a year or so, but this process was clearly underway long before the pandemic.

Don't get me wrong, I think Vietnam is terrific, better than Thailand, but sadly they are not interested in longterm guests.

 

Better than Thailand in what way? They despise westerners at a whole new level. It's just a 3rd world dump on par with Cambodia 

[Johnny Mac]

It's communist, so therefore don't be shocked by anything.

[La Quenta]

17 minutes ago, madmen said:

It was always sloppy seconds to Thailand. Feel sorry for the expats 

 

On the contrary, day to day life is superior to Thailand imo. It's far more eastern, much more of an adventure than Thailand. It's got that French feel in the food, coffee and architecture than Thailand doesnt have. The street life is far more interesting and engrossing. The mountains and beaches are much better than Thailand, especially in Central and North. 

 

Up until this year, the Government has very much been 'live and let live' when it comes to foreigners. You never see the overt Racism as you do on occasion in Thailand. 

 

I love Thailand by the way and have lived there too. It's just a personal opinion that Vietnam is much more interesting and beautiful. 

 

Quote

Stay away from communism and Islam and no problems. 

 

Thats not a very intellectual argument. 

[La Quenta]

31 minutes ago, thaitero said:

So one can be tourist for 30 days,,

What sort of rule there is to be 30 day tourist again after first 30 touristdays ?

 Up until this April, there were options to get a permit (with just a Degree, no other caveats) with 2-3 year resident card. Also 3 month business and 3 month tourist visas.

 

The difference now - work permits are much trickier to get all of a sudden, and only 1 month tourist visas and almost all the business visas are being eradicated. 

[Maha Sarakham]

22 minutes ago, madmen said:

Better than Thailand in what way?

 

Food.

Customer Service.

Hospitality.

Variety of natural landscapes (and taken care of far better).

Honesty & no dual pricing.

I'd even go as far to say they may even be nicer/friendlier than most of the Thais these days.

 

My wife is Thai but neither she nor I are blind to the benefits of Vietnam.  We both would like to go back after covid is 'over', we both immensely enjoyed it.

[gearbox]

28 minutes ago, madmen said:

Better than Thailand in what way? They despise westerners at a whole new level. It's just a 3rd world dump on par with Cambodia 

Vietnam? Have you met any Aussies from Vietnamese descent? They have East Asian mentality, very little in common with Thailand or Cambodia. They value education and hard work, apparently they think allowing low class westerners to live there is not going to contribute much for their development. As they get richer those were going to drop out anyway, why the westerners don't retire in Singapore or South Korea? Because they can't afford it.

[Poet]

25 minutes ago, madmen said:

Better than Thailand in what way? They despise westerners at a whole new level. It's just a 3rd world dump on par with Cambodia 

Your experience in the 70's may have been different but, over the past five years or so, all my visits there have been terrific.

I like Thailand too, but Vietnam definitely has an edge in terms of service, price, unspoiled beaches, general friendliness, and the quality of the women who are interested in foreigners.

The good news is that we get to enjoy all these countries.

[madmen]

11 minutes ago, La Quenta said:

 

On the contrary, day to day life is superior to Thailand imo. It's far more eastern, much more of an adventure than Thailand. It's got that French feel in the food, coffee and architecture than Thailand doesnt have. The street life is far more interesting and engrossing. The mountains and beaches are much better than Thailand, especially in Central and North. 

 

Up until this year, the Government has very much been 'live and let live' when it comes to foreigners. You never see the overt Racism as you do on occasion in Thailand. 

 

I love Thailand by the way and have lived there too. It's just a personal opinion that Vietnam is much more interesting and beautiful. 

 

 

Thats not a very intellectual argument. 

My biggest takeaway was 50 million motorbikes beeping the horn all at the same time without even a break 

Good for you if you live on a mountain top but how long before the authorities find you? 

[Poet]

38 minutes ago, madmen said:

Stay away from communism and Islam and no problems.

Vietnam = 0.07% Islamic

Thailand = 4.29% Islamic

[Maha Sarakham]

3 minutes ago, madmen said:

My biggest takeaway was 50 million motorbikes beeping the horn all at the same time without even a break.

 

True in the cities, absolutely obnoxious.  Outside of the cities, not too bad.

[madmen]

4 minutes ago, gearbox said:

Vietnam? Have you met any Aussies from Vietnamese descent? They have East Asian mentality, very little in common with Thailand or Cambodia. They value education and hard work, apparently they think allowing low class westerners to live there is not going to contribute much for their development. As they get richer those were going to drop out anyway, why the westerners don't retire in Singapore or South Korea? Because they can't afford it.

Just wow. The Vietnamese in Australia are huge mafia and drug gangs that were brutal in the extreme. Just Google it 

[madmen]

3 minutes ago, Poet said:

Vietnam = 0.07% Islamic

Thailand = 4.29% Islamic

Communists Thailand 0% Vietnam 100%

????

[BenDeCosta]

If I were struggling in Vietnam, I'd just go to Cambodia.

 

Cambodia still has relatively "friendly" visa requirements, it's pretty easy to stay there long-term.

 

I'd love to know why Vietnam is trying to make things so hard for foreigners, especially given the current situation. If anything it is making me want to look at backup options in case Thailand starts doing the same thing.

[shdmn]

1 hour ago, connda said:

Pity guys married to Vietnamese women.  No "spouse visa" that I'm aware of.  Worse than Thailand.  I wonder how many guys with Vietnamese wives are having their families broken up.  ????  Sad.

Married guys can get a 5 year visa exemption and a permanent residence card.  So most are probably not affected.

[Poet]

4 minutes ago, madmen said:

Communists Thailand 0% Vietnam 100%

Honestly, these days, the US seems to be far more in the grip of Communism than Vietnam.

Those "50 million motorbikes beeping the horn all at the same time without even a break" were not on their way to a "White Guilt" re-education session, they were out there hustling and 100% focused on making dough.

They certainly work a lot harder, and are far more ambitious, than the Thais.

 

[gearbox]

2 minutes ago, Zikomat said:

So they kick out thousands on a short notice. Typical behavior of the communist cannibals.

The options for the western low class in SE Asia are slowly shrinking. Where to now? Vietnam kicking them out, Thailand according to TVF is getting worse and worse, Myanmar under coup, Cambodia taken over by the Chinese, Malaysia expensive, Indonesia muslim, India they are drinking one beer with 4 straws, Philippines crime and bad food..looks like only PNG left!

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, BenDeCosta said:

If I were struggling in Vietnam, I'd just go to Cambodia.

 

Cambodia still has relatively "friendly" visa requirements, it's pretty easy to stay there long-term.

 

I'd love to know why Vietnam is trying to make things so hard for foreigners, especially given the current situation. If anything it is making me want to look at backup options in case Thailand starts doing the same thing.

Definitely look up back up options but I don't see Thailand doing what Vietnam did. The trend I see in Thailand is trying to attract richer and richer expats though. Whether that adds up to an over zealous "filtering" of less rich expats remains to be seen. 

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, gearbox said:

The options for the western low class in SE Asia are slowly shrinking. Where to now? Vietnam kicking them out, Thailand according to TVF is getting worse and worse, Myanmar under coup, Cambodia taken over by the Chinese, Malaysia expensive, Indonesia muslim, India they are drinking one beer with 4 straws, Philippines crime and bad food..looks like only PNG left!

Cambodia and Philippines (when they open again). I suppose Laos for more pioneer types.