Gasoline or gasahol? So confused

[findlay13]

On 8/3/2021 at 2:45 PM, DavisH said:

My wife always sticks in gasohol 95 in her swift. She compains about it not running as well on e20. Fuel consumption on e20 is worse as well. 

I use 95 Benzine in my Kawasaki Vulcan MC. 95 Gasaholin the Honda city car.In Australia I have a Kia "designed" to use E10 .I used it once .Down in Power down in mileage.It now gets 91 straight petrol.My 2 Triumph MCs get 95 straight petrol.No gasahol for me if I can avoid it.If you run your vehicle every couple of days it's ok apparently, but not if they're going to sit for awhile.It's hydroscopic and can attract water which you don't want in your fuel system.BUT UP2U. My friend runs 95 gasahol in his Kawasaki Vulca and has no problems,but he runs it daily.

 

 

Edited August 27, 2021 by findlay13

[DavisH]

5 hours ago, findlay13 said:

I use 95 Benzine in my Kawasaki Vulcan MC. 95 Gasaholin the Honda city car.In Australia I have a Kia "designed" to use E10 .I used it once .Down in Power down in mileage.It now gets 91 straight petrol.My 2 Triumph MCs get 95 straight petrol.No gasahol for me if I can avoid it.If you run your vehicle every couple of days it's ok apparently, but not if they're going to sit for awhile.It's hydroscopic and can attract water which you don't want in your fuel system.BUT UP2U. My friend runs 95 gasahol in his Kawasaki Vulca and has no problems,but he runs it daily.

 

 

The vast majority of cars are designed and run on gasohol fuels in Thailand. Very few pumps have pure benzene (95). Our PTT has it but never use it as its much more expensive. I used gasohol for many years in a honda civic (250K kms) and never had a problem. 

[canthai55]

9 minutes ago, DavisH said:

 I used gasohol for many years in a honda civic (250K kms) and never had a problem. 

Agreed. In any car made since before the turn of the century ethanol blended fuel will work fine.

Many people telling old wives tales from the days of carbs and leaded fuel.

My bike sat almost 7 years full of gasahol. No issue.

[problemfarang]

On 8/27/2021 at 11:16 AM, ftpjtm said:

Another consideration for those who mainly use 95 or fuel without ethanol, 

 

I grew up in New England in the US where we have variable weather, hot as Thailand in summer and well below freezing in winter. 

 

When I was younger, ethanol fuel additives were very popular and a must in freezing weather. This is because as temperatures change, condensation can form inside near empty fuel tanks, and when the tank is filled this contaminates the fuel with a small amount of water. In the winter the water can freeze, stopping fuel flow and leaving vehicles stranded. So it was a early winter ritual to add some "gas line anti freeze", which was a bottle of ethanol, to your fuel. The ethanol absorbs the water in the fuel and it is burned off with the ethanol in the combustion chamber. 

 

A decade or two ago the US government mandated that all gasoline sold in the US must contain 10% ethanol (or methanol). This mandate ended the need for gasoline anti freeze, as ethanol is present in all fuel. 

 

While freezing gas lines are not a worry in Thailand, there are evenings when it's cool enough to cause substantial condensation. This could lead to water in fuel tanks, and 100% petroleum fuels like 95 won't absorb it. If enough water accumulates in your tank it can cause engine misfiring or stalling. 

 

So I would recommend that persons who predominantly use 95, use an occasional tank of one of the grades containing ethanol to flush water out of the fuel tank. Either that or add an occasional bottle of overpriced "fuel conditioner", which is mainly ethanol, to your tank to achieve the same result at a higher price.

good advice, thanks

im planning use 95 and sometimes E20. I want to try E85 just to see if it really power up the engine that much as ppl say. 

[DavisH]

21 hours ago, problemfarang said:

good advice, thanks

im planning use 95 and sometimes E20. I want to try E85 just to see if it really power up the engine that much as ppl say. 

You will lose power with E85 and get lower fuel economy. You would need to remap your engine to get the most out of E85.

 

[problemfarang]

19 hours ago, DavisH said:

You will lose power with E85 and get lower fuel economy. You would need to remap your engine to get the most out of E85.

 

Thnx for the heads up, but i though these modern cars are coming with remaped engines, dont they?

[jackdd]

25 minutes ago, problemfarang said:

Thnx for the heads up, but i though these modern cars are coming with remaped engines, dont they?

Even if the engine could produce slightly more power due to the higher octane rating, E85 has less energy content than 91/95/E20 (even if taking the price into consideration), so the fuel efficiency is worse and you need to refill more often

Like most people you probably hardly ever use the full power of your engine anway, so there is no point in getting E85, even if your engine would be tuned for it.

Edited August 31, 2021 by jackdd

[canthai55]

1 hour ago, problemfarang said:

Thnx for the heads up, but i though these modern cars are coming with remaped engines, dont they?

If your owners manual says it is E85 compliant. Most new models are multi fuel.

As all cars are different, there are no hard and fast rules.

You will have to try the different fuels out, and determine a cost per Km or cost per 100 Km with each of them, doing the type or driving you do, where you live.

Then you can decide which fuel suits your needs the best.

[DavisH]

2 hours ago, problemfarang said:

Thnx for the heads up, but i though these modern cars are coming with remaped engines, dont they?

Mapped but not remapped. Remapping is generally used to tune a car for more perfomance - especially cars that are already turbo charged. But they can also optimise the tune for different fuel grades. Many drag cars run on e85. 

As others mentioned, you would need to try different grades of fuel and calculate the overall cost. They also observe any changes in performace. In some cars, some say the car runs the same on each, but other cars the performance is noticeably less. 

[ftpjtm]

10 hours ago, canthai55 said:

You will have to try the different fuels out, and determine a cost per Km or cost per 100 Km with each of them, doing the type or driving you do, where you live.

I did exactly that when my neighbor insisted she saves money by using 91 in her Honda City.

 

In my MG3 I get 10.53 Km/L with 91 vs 10.25 Km/L on E85. It has a 45 L fuel tank, so range is 474 Km on 91 vs 461 on E85.

 

Assuming pricing @ 29.68 for 91, and 22.94 for E85 (per Kuhnbenq's post earlier on this thread) it costs 282 baht to drive 100 Kms on 91 vs 224 on E85.

 

So I save 60 baht per 100 Km running E85, or about 200 baht per fill/300-350Kms. Yes, the range is a bit less but it's barely noticeable and the power feels the same with either fuel. 

 

Maybe the performance difference is greater with a Honda City, but E85 is definitely the way to go in my MG.

Edited August 31, 2021 by ftpjtm

[spidermike007]

Gasahol 95 seems to be the best compromise. The other pure 95 is alot more expensive. I doubt the gained mileage would offset that. 

 

I am avoiding the use of E20 or B85. Seems alot riskier. Been warned away from that by engineer friends. 

Edited February 1, 2022 by spidermike007

[Yellowtail]

If you have an old bike the runs bad with gasohol, it's pretty easy to remove the the alcohol from gasohol. I do this for my old pressure-washer. 

 

[JAS21]

25 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

If you have an old bike the runs bad with gasohol, it's pretty easy to remove the the alcohol from gasohol. I do this for my old pressure-washer. 

 

Are you referring to something from the website below where they talk about various methods including their additive OR?? https://www.bellperformance.com/blog/ethanol-removal-additive

[Yellowtail]

25 minutes ago, JAS21 said:

Are you referring to something from the website below where they talk about various methods including their additive OR?? https://www.bellperformance.com/blog/ethanol-removal-additive

No, I'm talking about just mixing gasohol with water and letting the water settle out. The alcohol bonds more strongly with water than with petrol, so you end up with petrol on top and "vodka" on the bottom. 

[JAS21]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

No, I'm talking about just mixing gasohol with water and letting the water settle out. The alcohol bonds more strongly with water than with petrol, so you end up with petrol on top and "vodka" on the bottom. 

Yes, if I remember correctly that is talked about in the video and elsewhere BUT I understand you loose some octane. Have you actually used the water method and were you happy with the result. Isn’t it a lot of pissing about though.

[Longwood50]

They use to use lead to boost the octane in gasoline.  After that was banned they juiced the gas with alcohol to push the octane up plus give a boost to the farmers to grow the crops that ethanol is made from.  

Ethanol is less fuel efficient than gasoline so you burn more litters to go the same distance.  Ethanol is also harder on engines.  They have made the newer engines more tolerant of ethanol but if I had my choice I would pick gasoline and if I was forced to use one with ethanol I would use the least possible usually a 90%/10% blend. 

[Yellowtail]

22 hours ago, JAS21 said:

Yes, if I remember correctly that is talked about in the video and elsewhere BUT I understand you loose some octane. Have you actually used the water method and were you happy with the result. Isn’t it a lot of pissing about though.

It works great in the pressure washer, and not much of a hassle when your only using a few liters now an then.

 

It would certainly be doable on a larger scale, but one would need to be better equipped. 

 

I don't know about what additives would also be separated out.