American suspect who allegedly raped a masseuse refuses to reenact the crime scene in Khon Kaen today, claims he felt “unsafe”

[Red Forever]

7 hours ago, Hamus Yaigh said:

'innocent until proven guilty' is also an international human right under the UN's Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 11 so not just an Americanism.

Yes ok but hasn't he admitted to the assault?

Enough of this pearl clutching moral outrage "innocent till found guilty" manure.

[Chongalulu]

1 hour ago, Bogbrush said:

Crime scene indications (what you call ‘re-enactments’) take place when a suspect has admitted his guilt to Police under caution; the purpose is to add substance to his admission so that he cannot, when taken in front of a magistrate to enter a formal plea, claim his confession was coerced. 

If he’s frogmarched to be paraded around the crime scene in intimidating circumstances exactly what ‘substance' is being added to the confession - the farcical pointing? It’s all part of any coercion..and we’ve seen graphic video evidence of exactly how confessions or cooperation with the police are extracted. 

[RobU]

10 hours ago, Benmart said:

The sick mob mentality on this forum has already tried him. That's a sad reality. 

He has confessed to both crimes claiming drugs made him do it. He is guilty by his own admission the forum is supporting him in this and postulating possible/hopeful outcomes for his crimes. How can that be sick? we are just helping him along. 5555

[MrJ2U]

When you sober up a bit its hard to reenact what a horrible thing you did.

 

 

It's hard to come to grips of the coming nightmare of spending the rest of your life in a Thai prison.

 

 

 

 

[rott]

14 hours ago, Thailand said:

He is possibly guilty but shouldn't the guy still still have the benefit of"innocent until proven guilty"?

True but people charged with murder normally would not get bail. Though I believe in Thailand it has been known for westerners charged with serious offences to be granted bail and have their passports returned to them.

[Acharn]

9 hours ago, digger70 said:

Say If,If he's by chance Not guilty.How can he do a Reenactment of the Event.

If he does the Reenactment That sure proves that he's guilty. 

 

Some of the "reenactments" I've seen on TV news, the cops are pretty obviously coaching the defendant through the play. Not always. Anyway, it's one of the reasons for the Fifth Amendment  to the American constitution, and why the judge is supposed to question the defendant pretty closely when he/she enters a guilty plea. Farangs mostly come from legal systems with similar safeguards against self-incrimination and don't understand the background of the Thai legal system.

[chalawaan]

He's an animal, but these re-enactments are pointless nonsense.

 

Wait, they're not pointless at all, what would a crime scene or interrogation room photo op be without some nimmeranjie pointing at someone/something? ????????????????????????????????☝????️????????

[gilo]

12 hours ago, rupert the bear said:

i dont want to get into the court of public opinion but re enactments,the guys right. its a circus a clown show and has no part in any legal system.give him due process.

absolutely...

[natway09]

He admitted he thumped her, just not rape.

Now he does not feel safe,,,,, poor boy, can u buy a single cell , I hope not

[Dogmatix]

13 hours ago, Srikcir said:

More seriously, there is no jury system in Thailand. Judges alone decide cases (allegedly) based on the merits presented by the parties (defense vs prosecution).

See Siam-legal.com

It's not an issue of "public opinion" but of "judicial opinion." These re-enactments are directed towards influencing judges, ineffect making judges part of the prosecution. 

 

In Asia there is now only a jury system in Hong Kong and that only due to the joint agreement with the UK.  China has already dispensed with juries in ' national security' trialsof disidents in Hong Kong. All the other former British colonies abolished jury trials in the late 60s or early 70s,

Edited October 4, 2021 by Dogmatix

[Dogmatix]

The Thai police have many times claimed they would stop insisting on crime re=-enactments which serve no useful investigative purpose but earn money for the police because they charge the media to attend. If the onlookes try to lynch the suspect then it is well worth the media paying for ring side seat for their cameraman.  It is this type of drama that keeps the system profitable for the cops and the media. 

 

'This ((his refusal to participate) angered family members and relatives who had traveled a fair distance to Khon Kaen hoping to encounter the suspect in person and demand answers as to why he conducted the actions he allegedly did.'

 

He deserves his punishment but I don't really blame him for refusing to play the cops' game and help them make money from corruption. I don't blame anyone, including those who are falsely accused for refusing.  He has confessed anyway, so how will it help the police in their investigation.  If their vital details they needed him to help clarify, they could just arrange a private session without onlookers and media.  

 

I still remember the re-enactment of the murders in Koh Tao by the 2B who had confessed after a plastic bag job and they obviously had no clue what they they were supposed to have done and had to be coached through it all by corrupt cops.   

Edited October 4, 2021 by Dogmatix

[Dogmatix]

2 hours ago, Acharn said:

Some of the "reenactments" I've seen on TV news, the cops are pretty obviously coaching the defendant through the play. Not always. Anyway, it's one of the reasons for the Fifth Amendment  to the American constitution, and why the judge is supposed to question the defendant pretty closely when he/she enters a guilty plea. Farangs mostly come from legal systems with similar safeguards against self-incrimination and don't understand the background of the Thai legal system.

Right. The Thai justice system is all about extracting confessions and guilty pleas from suspects who can't afford proper legal representation, which is most of them. Before entering a plea in the English common law system, the suspect is entitled to see the evidence the prosecution has assembled against them.  But this is not the case in Thailand and the suspect will be placed under great pressure to receive a lighter sentence by pleading guilty. When you look at the prevailing level of incompetence in the Thai police and prosecution service, it is obvious that they could hardly function at all without the system of torture and forced confessions and a court system that stacks the odds against poor defendants. If they had to abide by Western principles, how many convictions would they get?

Edited October 4, 2021 by Dogmatix

[Ebumbu]

7 hours ago, billsmart said:

I'm from the US, and the "perp walk" is just the police walking the accused away ,usually in handcuffs. I've always thought it was supposed to be a public display showing the police arrested someone.

For the Son of Sam case, in the 70s, they had Berkowitz walk around the entire block three times so he could be extensively photographed by the press, and harassed by a mob who screamed at him. It was an intentional shaming process -- not just an arrest and detainment. That's how it was then. Not sure how it is now. Back then, they did a walk of shame even before any trial had started.  Reminds me of LOS. 

[joecoolfrog]

18 hours ago, EricTh said:

 

Two unrelated victims accusing the same person of sex crime on the same day and you still think he is 'innocent'?

 

Would a 12 year-old child who didn't know him before that day lie? 

 

There is also a truck driver witness on that day who saw the incident.

 

Strong evidence it appears , so why the need for a ridiculous re-enactment ?

[Sig]

23 hours ago, zzaa09 said:

The saddest aspect of cases of this nature is that the offer of bail is available. 

I'm still astounding as to how such a sicko like this could be eligible for bail. 

"It is unknown at this point if he will be eligible for bail."  It didn't say that he could be eligible for bail. It is unknown.

[Sig]

21 hours ago, EricTh said:

 

Two unrelated victims accusing the same person of sex crime on the same day and you still think he is 'innocent'?

 

Would a 12 year-old child who didn't know him before that day lie? 

 

There is also a truck driver witness on that day who saw the incident.

 

On top of that, according to the article - "The suspect has reportedly admitted to the crimes..."

[Ebumbu]

2 hours ago, Sig said:

On top of that, according to the article - "The suspect has reportedly admitted to the crimes..."

Before or after CCTV cameras were turned off and "enhanced interrogation" methods were employed? You trust the BIB to follow international human-rights standards? 

[steven100]

i'd be inclined to let joe ferrari handle this

[LikeItHot]

Reenacting a rape alone on camera? I would pass too. It's not gonna help his case. Good news is weight loss won't be an issue where he's going.

[elgenon]

What is the penalty for refusing?

 

 

[yogi yogi]

On 10/4/2021 at 4:45 AM, brianthainess said:

You can't be serious ! BAIL ! ??  but if he has connections then i would not be surprised at all in Thailand. 

high bail amount.  do the cops find out what he has in assets when arrested. is that common practice