Everyone will be exposed vs. everyone will be infected?

[Jingthing]

OK,

 

...

 

as a non medical person I am very confused about the meaning of more recent messages from scientists that seem to indicate that EVERYONE will sooner or later be infected with the Covid 19 virus.

 

What does that mean exactly?

 

That everyone will come into contact with the virus. Well, yes obviously but being exposed to it is not the same as being infected. 

 

Or do they REALLY mean that everyone will literally be infected, at least at a no symptom level, and including vaccinated people?

 

If its the latter shouldn't there be a sea change in any alarm people feel about infection statistics which are almost by design gross undercounts anyway?

 

To add my message here is in no way a suggestion that the pandemic isn't serious. Everyone should get vaccinated and when exposed and or infected that greatly reduces the chances of hospitalization and death.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Jingthing

[ezzra]

If we listen and believe every so called specialist and scientist will all go bonkers in no time vaxed or no vaxed, there's a lot of information coming from all quarters and all are verified or correct, so as long as you fully vaxed and you the right things to protect yourself and loved one you'll be good...

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, ezzra said:

If we listen and believe every so called specialist and scientist will all go bonkers in no time vaxed or no vaxed, there's a lot of information coming from all quarters and all are verified or correct, so as long as you fully vaxed and you the right things to protect yourself and loved one you'll be good...

So you have no response to the question then.

[Jingthing]

This link gets into this issue but provides less clarity than I would like.

 

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2021/08/will-everyone-get-covid-at-some-point.html

 

 

[DavisH]

I would think everyone will be exposed to the virus at some point - how your body reacts to it is another matter - some may be asymptomatic with no symptoms, then "recover", or get anything from a mild to serious illness (or death). So I guess if the virus is present, one is 'infected', but could have no symptoms or have symptoms. Perhaps the point of the article is that the virus will become endemic and not go away. It will probably mutate and future vaccines may be required. 

[VocalNeal]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

What does that mean exactly?

I think it means that like flu we will all get Covid or may have had it already. 

[Jingthing]

9 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

I think it means that like flu we will all get Covid or may have had it already. 

Right but suppose it enters your body and your immune system vaccinated or not quickly fights it off without ever making you at all sick. Does that count as an infection?

[VocalNeal]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Right but suppose it enters your body and your immune system vaccinated or not quickly fights it off without ever making you at all sick. Does that count as an infection?

Some of us may have had it without knowing what it was? Infection is infection whether it makes one sick or not.

[Puccini]

https://health-desk.org/articles/what-is-the-difference-between-exposure-and-infection-to-a-virus#:~:text=our experts say-,When it comes to infectious diseases%2C "exposure" means coming,always lead to an infection.

 

[placeholder]

5 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Right but suppose it enters your body and your immune system vaccinated or not quickly fights it off without ever making you at all sick. Does that count as an infection?

It isn't a question of the virus entering one's body. It's whether or not it can commandeer cells to start reproducing copies of itself. Antibodies can stop that from happening.

[Jingthing]

14 minutes ago, placeholder said:

It isn't a question of the virus entering one's body. It's whether or not it can commandeer cells to start reproducing copies of itself. Antibodies can stop that from happening.

Not exactly. If it gets to that point virus has entered. 

Personally I still think the public announcements about everyone eventually getting infected are very unclear. 

[placeholder]

Just now, Jingthing said:

Not exactly. If it gets to that point virus has entered. 

Personally I still think the public announcements about everyone eventually getting infected are very unclear. 

Yes exactly. Here is the medical definition of infection

 "The invasion and multiplication of microorganisms such as bacteria, viruses, and parasites that are not normally present within the body."

https://www.medicinenet.com/infection/definition.htm

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, placeholder said:

Yes exactly. Here is the medical definition of infection

 "The invasion and multiplication of microorganisms such as bacteria, viruses, and parasites that are not normally present within the body."

https://www.medicinenet.com/infection/definition.htm

You're  missing my point.

The question was why are we getting announcements that everyone will be infected when many of the exposures don't lead to infection.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Jingthing

[sirineou]

I would think that to be infected you need to have a positive test. . 

[placeholder]

Just now, Jingthing said:

You're  missing my point.

I don't think so. Being exposed to a virus does not mean being infected. Everyone is constantly inhaling all sorts of viruses and bacteria. Are we being infected by them? If the aren't commandeering bodily resources to reproduce themselves, then they have not succeeded in infecting us.

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, placeholder said:

I don't think so. Being exposed to a virus does not mean being infected. Everyone is constantly inhaling all sorts of viruses and bacteria. Are we being infected by them? If the aren't commandeering bodily resources to reproduce themselves, then they have not succeeded in infecting us.

Yes you are. I didn't say they are the same thing. I'm trying to understand what the scientists really mean when they say everyone will eventually be infected. 

Do they really mean that or do they actually mean everyone will just be exposed to it.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Jingthing

[placeholder]

Just now, Jingthing said:

Yes you are. I didn't say they are the same thing. I'm trying to understand what the scientists really mean when they see everyone will eventually be infected. 

Well, those scientists who claim that mean that the virus will successfully commander cells and reproduce itself. That's all they mean.  They don't mean that everyone will develop symptoms of covid. 

[zzaa09]

14 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I would think that to be infected you need to have a positive test. . 

Testing has nothing to do with being infected. 

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Well, those scientists who claim that mean that the virus will successfully commander cells and reproduce itself. That's all they mean.  They don't mean that everyone will develop symptoms of covid. 

Yes I already know that many cases are asymptomatic. I still think you're not grasping the question here.

[sirineou]

1 minute ago, zzaa09 said:

Testing has nothing to do with being infected. 

I would think it has something to do with determining if you are infected.

[vinci]

Quote

scientists that seem to indicate that EVERYONE will sooner or later be infected with the Covid 19 virus.

well i guess vax or die and luck in between, good luck all

[Bkk Brian]

3 hours ago, Puccini said:

https://health-desk.org/articles/what-is-the-difference-between-exposure-and-infection-to-a-virus#:~:text=our experts say-,When it comes to infectious diseases%2C "exposure" means coming,always lead to an infection.

 

This link answers the question very well in my opinion

 

"When it comes to infectious diseases, "exposure" means coming into contact with a virus or bacteria. Infection happens when someone is exposed and actually becomes sick from the exposure. Exposure does not always lead to an infection. If the time a person is exposed to the virus is very short, if the amount of virus that enters the body is not in a large enough quantity, or if the body's immune system is able to quickly fight it off, then exposure will be less likely to lead to infection."

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

This link answers the question very well in my opinion

 

"When it comes to infectious diseases, "exposure" means coming into contact with a virus or bacteria. Infection happens when someone is exposed and actually becomes sick from the exposure. Exposure does not always lead to an infection. If the time a person is exposed to the virus is very short, if the amount of virus that enters the body is not in a large enough quantity, or if the body's immune system is able to quickly fight it off, then exposure will be less likely to lead to infection."

It answers A question. 

It doesn’t answer MY question.

[Chomper Higgot]

6 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

This link answers the question very well in my opinion

 

"When it comes to infectious diseases, "exposure" means coming into contact with a virus or bacteria. Infection happens when someone is exposed and actually becomes sick from the exposure. Exposure does not always lead to an infection. If the time a person is exposed to the virus is very short, if the amount of virus that enters the body is not in a large enough quantity, or if the body's immune system is able to quickly fight it off, then exposure will be less likely to lead to infection."

I think that’s a good explanation.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

I think you are worrying about the wrong thing.

 

The underlying message is COVID is likely to become endemic and at sometime in our lives we are all likely to be infected.

 

This informs the choice to meet the virus with or without the help of vaccination.

 

[gk10012001]

Of course the number of cases has been grossly under counted.  Entire populations have not been tested so any statistic about number of COVID cases is to be taken with bags of salt. Yet the officials seem to love to only count "confirmed" cases without even suggesting or mentioning that there may be so many more cases out there present or in the past.  Flu experts estimate that up to 20% of a population actually get the flu in some seasons.  I have no doubt that the alleged mortality rates are so much lower due to under counting of total cases

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, gk10012001 said:

Of course the number of cases has been grossly under counted.  Entire populations have not been tested so any statistic about number of COVID cases is to be taken with bags of salt. Yet the officials seem to love to only count "confirmed" cases without even suggesting or mentioning that there may be so many more cases out there present or in the past.  Flu experts estimate that up to 20% of a population actually get the flu in some seasons.  I have no doubt that the alleged mortality rates are so much lower due to under counting of total cases

Are you suggesting nobody working in the various national public health programs has considered statistical sampling theory in their assessment of infection rates?

[gk10012001]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

Are you suggesting nobody working in the various national public health programs has considered statistical sampling theory in their assessment of infection rates?

I did not say that at all.  I said that when they announce the statistics they clearly state "confirmed" cases.  I have not once seen anybody saying how many more were out there or could be out there.  They unfortunately have a vested interest to make things seem worse, certainly the pharmacy companies could as it invoked panic and a "need" to use more of their products

[3NUMBAS]

with what variant ???

[cdemundo]

From the OP's reference:

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2021/08/will-everyone-get-covid-at-some-point.html

 

Dr. Sandra Adams, a professor of biology and virologist at Montclair State University, had a more nuanced take on the subject.

“There is a distinction between infection and COVID disease. It is possible that all of the unvaccinated will eventually get COVID disease because of the increased infectious rate of the Delta variant,” Adams said.

“Vaccinated individuals may become infected with one of the variants. This scenario (unvaccinated getting COVID and vaccinated becoming infected) is the more dangerous route to the majority of the population obtaining antibodies to SARS-CoV-2 and its variants,” Adams added.

 

Sorry jingthing can't answer your question either but...

This doctor makes the distinction between "becoming infected" and "getting COVID disease".

Her main point (as I see it) is letting the unvaccinated get COVID disease "is the more dangerous route to the majority of the population obtaining antibodies to SARS-CoV-2 and its variants,” when compared with widespread vaccination.