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[orchidfan]

On 10/30/2021 at 6:46 PM, giddyup said:

All I know is St John's wort is readily available without prescription, whereas all of the man made antidepressants are not. What does that tell you?

Where can you buy St John's wort here ?

I used to take it in Hong Kong where it was easily available. 

But just haven't seen it here in pharmacies. 

Worked like a charm btw. Although tended to wear off over time. 

[thecyclist]

There is a good chance that the depression is secondary to the panic attacks. The panic attacks cause you to lose control, you constantly worry about having another one, and that makes you depressed. Once you get the panic attacks under control the depression will subside. The Pattaya Bangkok hospital used to have (and probably still has) a good psychiatrists. The choice of anti-depressants is still hit and miss. About a 50 % chance that the first one will hit the spot. For me Sertraline worked wonders. It takes a couple of weeks to take effect. During that time the anxiety might even get worse. They will prescribe you Alprazolam to tide you over.Minimal side effects. Insomnia for a couple of weeks,treated with Zolpidem. The only side effects that stays is delayed ejaculation, probably not a major concern at your age. If you are lucky you feel like like a new human being,you wake up one morning and Depression has turned into elation 

[orchidfan]

On 10/31/2021 at 1:53 PM, giddyup said:

80 is nothing? Seriously, when most men only live to mid 80's if they're lucky. How old are you, 50? Listen, I know you mean well, but I've really heard enough from you OK?

I'm with you on this. 

I'm early 70s and just detest young(er) men telling me to get out, jog, climb hills.....I did all that for 40yrs,  but at 70÷ the body often just isn't up to it joints, muscles etc) despite all the will and motivation. 

As have mentioned earlier, I used to take St John's Wort before and it was great. Just haven't found it here in Thailand. Maybe only online ?

[giddyup]

5 minutes ago, orchidfan said:

I'm with you on this. 

I'm early 70s and just detest young(er) men telling me to get out, jog, climb hills.....I did all that for 40yrs,  but at 70÷ the body often just isn't up to it joints, muscles etc) despite all the will and motivation. 

As have mentioned earlier, I used to take St John's Wort before and it was great. Just haven't found it here in Thailand. Maybe only online ?

I have a very bad back, plus knees and hips aren't what they used to be, so I'm not going jogging up Pratumnac hill as suggested, but according to the post I'm just being closed minded. You can buy St John's wort from iHerb or Lazada.

[giddyup]

16 minutes ago, thecyclist said:

There is a good chance that the depression is secondary to the panic attacks. The panic attacks cause you to lose control, you constantly worry about having another one, and that makes you depressed. Once you get the panic attacks under control the depression will subside. The Pattaya Bangkok hospital used to have (and probably still has) a good psychiatrists. The choice of anti-depressants is still hit and miss. About a 50 % chance that the first one will hit the spot. For me Sertraline worked wonders. It takes a couple of weeks to take effect. During that time the anxiety might even get worse. They will prescribe you Alprazolam to tide you over.Minimal side effects. Insomnia for a couple of weeks,treated with Zolpidem. The only side effects that stays is delayed ejaculation, probably not a major concern at your age. If you are lucky you feel like like a new human being,you wake up one morning and Depression has turned into elation 

Are you still on antidepressants? Did you try any other alternatives like meditation? I tried a couple of breathing exercises and it did seem to help temporarily, but like a lot of things you have to persevere before any real results.

[orchidfan]

Just now, giddyup said:

I have a very bad back, plus knees and hips aren't what they used to be, so I'm not going jogging up Pratumnac hill as suggested, but according to the post I'm just being closed minded. You can buy St John's wort from iHerb or Lazada.

Ok thanks for that. 

Lower back pain too and a spastic sciatic nerve....so even walking, gardening or bicycle riding are semi painful. 

Probably due to 40+yrs sitting down in the job( aviation ). 

Some of these guys have no idea how this aging can pan out.

Sorry,  we know all about mountain climbing, swimming, surfing, hiking, tennis  etc etc. Just now at 70+, it's getting apt more difficult !

All the best..

 

[thecyclist]

27 minutes ago, giddyup said:

Are you still on antidepressants? Did you try any other alternatives like meditation? I tried a couple of breathing exercises and it did seem to help temporarily, but like a lot of things you have to persevere before any real results.

Exercise and meditation (I do both) are very helpful, but they are unlikely to be enough to get you out of the acute phase. You have had it only for a week, so it might just clear up by itself. But the deeper you sink into that black hole the harder it will be to get out and stay out. There is something to be said for nipping it in the bud. Andrew Solomon makes a case for that in his brilliant book "The noonday demon" 

[giddyup]

15 minutes ago, thecyclist said:

Exercise and meditation (I do both) are very helpful, but they are unlikely to be enough to get you out of the acute phase. You have had it only for a week, so it might just clear up by itself. But the deeper you sink into that black hole the harder it will be to get out and stay out. There is something to be said for nipping it in the bud. Andrew Solomon makes a case for that in his brilliant book "The noonday demon" 

So if you are still taking Sertraline, how long has it been, and do you stay on it for life, and what are the side effects? Or were you taking it just to get you through the rough patch? Pretty sure I won't be reading the book you suggested. Reading about depression while depressed may not be the best therapy.

Edited November 1, 2021 by giddyup

[thecyclist]

2 hours ago, giddyup said:

So if you are still taking Sertraline, how long has it been, and do you stay on it for life, and what are the side effects? Or were you taking it just to get you through the rough patch? Pretty sure I won't be reading the book you suggested. Reading about depression while depressed may not be the best therapy.

Off and on it for ages. Was off it before the lockdown. I am in Vietnam right now and the hard lockdown with not even outdoor exercise allowed - I need my daily jog or bike ride - Was driving me nuts. So back on it. You don't take antidepressants just to get you through a rough patch, sedatives (finely calibrated and slowly tapered off are for that).Minimum is 6 to 12 month. All side effects (mainly insomnia and for a week or two increased anxiety) are temporary. The only exception is a marked delay of orgasm/ejaculation. Not libido or erectile function (which in my case improved), but it just often takes you forever to come. 

By the way reading up on the subjects was sort of therapeutic in itself for me. It puts you in charge of your own treatment, and learning about all the different treatments available instills optimism and improved mood. 

[Longwood50]

Most of the anti depressant drugs are to boost serotonin levels

How SSRIs work. SSRIs treat depression by increasing levels of serotonin in the brain. Serotonin is one of the chemical messengers (neurotransmitters) that carry signals between brain nerve cells (neurons). SSRIs block the reabsorption (reuptake) of serotonin into neurons.

Some seem to work better for some than others.  A trial and error approach. 

Sunshine, fresh air and exercise have been shown to be very useful.  

[YaiJung]

Pills are not the answer.  The purpose of these drugs is to mask symptoms and get the patient through another day.  The side-effects are horrendous and in many cases lead to a downward spiral which ends in the inevitable mental breakdown/hospitalization.  These drugs have been around for a very short time in the grand scheme of things.  For most of them the long-term effects are not even known.  It is pure laziness and greed on the part of the doctors who prescribe them. 

 

I agree with another poster who said the anxiety is likely the cause of the depression.  There are a gazallion reasons to be anxious or depressed in life...especially our modern life and the pursuit of happiness through pleasure(taken to the extreme by many thailand expats)...or even the idea that we can somehow be permanently happy/joyful.  It is normal for most people at one time or another to suffer anxiety.  The problem is when you latch onto the thoughts and try to control them.  This can lead to the panic attacks.  You have to learn to take them like waves in the ocean when you are swimming at the beach.  Let them come and go, without attaching to them, trying to fight them or control the thoughts.  Mindfulness meditation is probably the best thing you can do for anxiety/panic attacks.  The Buddhists figured this out 2500 yrs ago.  Luckily you are living in one of the best places on the planet to learn meditation. 

 

To get results from meditation you have to practice it for a while.  Likely you will see some small results almost right away, but if you keep at it, it can be absolutely life-changing.  You can start with 5-10 min 2x per day. 

 

Trouble is, many people absolutely refuse to sit still and practice breathing for even those few min per day.  They would rather take some pills and continue the living they way they always have, which got them where they are in the first place.  

 

Anyway, best of luck and hope you feel better. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lemsta69]

19 minutes ago, YaiJung said:

Pills are not the answer.  The purpose of these drugs is to mask symptoms and get the patient through another day.  The side-effects are horrendous and in many cases lead to a downward spiral which ends in the inevitable mental breakdown/hospitalization.  These drugs have been around for a very short time in the grand scheme of things.  For most of them the long-term effects are not even known.  It is pure laziness and greed on the part of the doctors who prescribe them. 

 

I agree with another poster who said the anxiety is likely the cause of the depression.  There are a gazallion reasons to be anxious or depressed in life...especially our modern life and the pursuit of happiness through pleasure(taken to the extreme by many thailand expats)...or even the idea that we can somehow be permanently happy/joyful.  It is normal for most people at one time or another to suffer anxiety.  The problem is when you latch onto the thoughts and try to control them.  This can lead to the panic attacks.  You have to learn to take them like waves in the ocean when you are swimming at the beach.  Let them come and go, without attaching to them, trying to fight them or control the thoughts.  Mindfulness meditation is probably the best thing you can do for anxiety/panic attacks.  The Buddhists figured this out 2500 yrs ago.  Luckily you are living in one of the best places on the planet to learn meditation. 

 

To get results from meditation you have to practice it for a while.  Likely you will see some small results almost right away, but if you keep at it, it can be absolutely life-changing.  You can start with 5-10 min 2x per day. 

 

Trouble is, many people absolutely refuse to sit still and practice breathing for even those few min per day.  They would rather take some pills and continue the living they way they always have, which got them where they are in the first place.  

 

Anyway, best of luck and hope you feel better. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

pills ARE the answer for me. I take 20mg Citalopram daily and it keeps me sane. meditation? yeah nah not my cup of tea, I love my little white pills ????

[Lemsta69]

11 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

All of those things definitely help.  Only reason I mentioned meds awas that you asked.  

 

Do not however expect immediate results as you probably knw from your past nothing happens overnight.  

 

One of the things I found helped was quietly brushing and petting cat.  Not sure of the size of your god but the same might apply.

 

 

well I got overnight results when I first started taking Citalopram about 18 years ago. I'm forever grateful to the doc who prescribed them, he got it right the first time. winner winner chicken dinner! ????

[unblocktheplanet]

I'm earlier in your decade but I'm still fighting the battle. Prescribed mirtazapine for sleep in 2003, never deprescribed & stopped working in 2018.

 

After more than a year, I resorted to alprazolam for sleep in August 2019. Still on it but not effective anymore. Have been weaning mirtazapine 10% per month for five months, four to go. Getting tough now. Benzos cause cognitive decline--something we really don't need.

 

My major periods of depression, anxiety & sleeplessness were thyroid, first hyper-, then hypo-. Yoga used to centre my calm but often falls short now. Meditation is really difficult for me, for some reason.

 

I believe mine to be cortisol-related but docs-in-a-box everywhere are hard to convince. And I'm not sure there's treatment. I sure don't want to test-drive a new AD but I'm getting awful weary of feeling all end-of-the-world.

 

Covid & climate disasters have not helped. Certainly can't afford private hospitals but am unaware of any psychotherapy options.

 

Just my story. Hope you find your trail of breadcrumbs out of yours. Back to giddy! Best of luck... 

 

 

[unblocktheplanet]

13 minutes ago, Lemsta69 said:

well I got overnight results when I first started taking Citalopram about 18 years ago. I'm forever grateful to the doc who prescribed them, he got it right the first time. winner winner chicken dinner! ????

Tell us more, please. Either my endocrine system failed or mirtazapine burned-out. How is citalopram for sleep? I get very, very little. Even when I do get a rare night's rest, still feel exhausted & unrefreshed. Thx.

[atpeace]

What do you do everyday?  A routine day entails... Maybe knowing this will help others understand your situation.

[Lemsta69]

2 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Tell us more, please. Either my endocrine system failed or mirtazapine burned-out. How is citalopram for sleep? I get very, very little. Even when I do get a rare night's rest, still feel exhausted & unrefreshed. Thx.

that's a tough question to answer mate. I'm not as fit as I should be and I drink too much so it's very easy for me to fall asleep. I have way too many naps. yerr I know, go for a walk ????

 

the feeling I get when i don't take the pills is like a fog pushing down on my brain. or maybe like a fishing net that's dragging me under. when I take the Citalopram it feels like there's an opposing force pushing the fog back up or lifting the net off my head.

 

but as I've found out, everybody is different. my little sister tried it and said it made her feel woozy and other side effects. all I got when I first started taking it was a nice rush, similar to a speed hit. so of course I fell in love with it! ????

 

 

[Neeranam]

7 hours ago, orchidfan said:

Where can you buy St John's wort here ?

I used to take it in Hong Kong where it was easily available. 

But just haven't seen it here in pharmacies. 

Worked like a charm btw. Although tended to wear off over time. 

I saw it years ago in a shop in Siam Discovery. Easier online these days. 

 

https://shopee.co.th/ลดซึมเศร้า-St.-John's-Wort-Extract-EuroHerbs-European-Quality-300-mg-60-Caps-i.22484395.1901086751

[thecyclist]

6 hours ago, YaiJung said:

Pills are not the answer.  The purpose of these drugs is to mask symptoms and get the patient through another day.  The side-effects are horrendous and in many cases lead to a downward spiral which ends in the inevitable mental breakdown/hospitalization.  These drugs have been around for a very short time in the grand scheme of things.  For most of them the long-term effects are not even known.  It is pure laziness and greed on the part of the doctors who prescribe them. 

 

I agree with another poster who said the anxiety is likely the cause of the depression.  There are a gazallion reasons to be anxious or depressed in life...especially our modern life and the pursuit of happiness through pleasure(taken to the extreme by many thailand expats)...or even the idea that we can somehow be permanently happy/joyful.  It is normal for most people at one time or another to suffer anxiety.  The problem is when you latch onto the thoughts and try to control them.  This can lead to the panic attacks.  You have to learn to take them like waves in the ocean when you are swimming at the beach.  Let them come and go, without attaching to them, trying to fight them or control the thoughts.  Mindfulness meditation is probably the best thing you can do for anxiety/panic attacks.  The Buddhists figured this out 2500 yrs ago.  Luckily you are living in one of the best places on the planet to learn meditation. 

 

To get results from meditation you have to practice it for a while.  Likely you will see some small results almost right away, but if you keep at it, it can be absolutely life-changing.  You can start with 5-10 min 2x per day. 

 

Trouble is, many people absolutely refuse to sit still and practice breathing for even those few min per day.  They would rather take some pills and continue the living they way they always have, which got them where they are in the first place.  

 

Anyway, best of luck and hope you feel better. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That is just so totally wrong and uninformed and overgeneralizes. While sedatives just mask symptoms, SSRIs do not. They have lifted millions of people, some longterm or even permanently, out of a deep black hole.Minimal side effects for most, been around for decades, so pretty much as tried and tested as any medication. And they do not lead to a downward spiral. It's either an upward spiral or they often are just ineffective. They can change your brain chemistry and neuronal networks in a way similar to meditation. Obviously mindfulness meditation is way better than pills, but it takes a lot of time and effort to make that work. Vipassana,yoga or breathing exercises are something that you start when you feel normal and they might help you to never suffer from depression in the first place, but to start meditating when you are right in the middle of a severe bout of depression is either impossible or ineffective. It's like starting to exercise when you are in the middle of a heart attack. You exercise and eat healthy foods to prevent a heart attack, not to short-circuit one that is in progress. 

[RJRS1301]

9 hours ago, YaiJung said:

Pills are not the answer.  The purpose of these drugs is to mask symptoms and get the patient through another day.  The side-effects are horrendous and in many cases lead to a downward spiral which ends in the inevitable mental breakdown/hospitalization.  These drugs have been around for a very short time in the grand scheme of things.  For most of them the long-term effects are not even known.  It is pure laziness and greed on the part of the doctors who prescribe them. 

 

I agree with another poster who said the anxiety is likely the cause of the depression.  There are a gazallion reasons to be anxious or depressed in life...especially our modern life and the pursuit of happiness through pleasure(taken to the extreme by many thailand expats)...or even the idea that we can somehow be permanently happy/joyful.  It is normal for most people at one time or another to suffer anxiety.  The problem is when you latch onto the thoughts and try to control them.  This can lead to the panic attacks.  You have to learn to take them like waves in the ocean when you are swimming at the beach.  Let them come and go, without attaching to them, trying to fight them or control the thoughts.  Mindfulness meditation is probably the best thing you can do for anxiety/panic attacks.  The Buddhists figured this out 2500 yrs ago.  Luckily you are living in one of the best places on the planet to learn meditation. 

 

To get results from meditation you have to practice it for a while.  Likely you will see some small results almost right away, but if you keep at it, it can be absolutely life-changing.  You can start with 5-10 min 2x per day. 

 

Trouble is, many people absolutely refuse to sit still and practice breathing for even those few min per day.  They would rather take some pills and continue the living they way they always have, which got them where they are in the first place.  

 

Anyway, best of luck and hope you feel better. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anti depressant meds first became available in the 1950s and SSRI meds since 1988, Much research has been done on them and their effects, both negative and positive.

For many the medications are an adjunct to and part of a multi pronged approach (psychotherapy, meditation, exercise) to treatment and resolution for depression. 

To categorically state "Pills are not the answer" , is irresponsible. IMHO

 

Edited November 1, 2021 by RJRS1301

[giddyup]

10 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

pills ARE the answer for me. I take 20mg Citalopram daily and it keeps me sane. meditation? yeah nah not my cup of tea, I love my little white pills ????

I've always been like you, my first thought when hit with the panic attack was to run out and buy a packet of smokes, even though I've quit for more than 8 years, but I was looking for that quick fix, a big lungful of nicotine. Second thought was to rush to the doctor and get prescribed some medication.

I've never meditated in my life, but I found a YouTube channel, Meditation For Beginners, and been giving that a try, it's basically just breathing and relaxing. It's early days but I'll try and persevere. I'd rather not put more chemicals into my body unless totally necessary. I already take medication for high BP and gout, rather not add any more to the mix.

Edited November 2, 2021 by giddyup

[Lemsta69]

14 minutes ago, giddyup said:

I've always been like you, my first thought when hit with the panic attack was to run out and buy a packet of smokes, even though I've quit for more than 8 years, but I was looking for that quick fix, a big lungful of nicotine. Second thought was to rush to the doctor and get prescribed some medication.

I've never meditated in my life, but I found a YouTube channel, Meditation For Beginners, and been giving that a try, it's basically just breathing and relaxing. It's early days but I'll try and persevere. I'd rather not put more chemicals into my body unless totally necessary. I already take medication for high BP and gout, rather not add any more to the mix.

lol I take gout medicine too, Allopurinol. my post wasn't intended to discourage you from trying the "natural" remedies first. I hope it works out for you.

 

I was just trying to make the point that pills aren't as evil as some are making them out to be IF you can get the right ones for your brain chemistry. it's also not a sign of weakness or laziness if you take them. I thought that for years before I went and saw the doc, would have saved myself a whole lot of anxiety and pain if I'd done it earlier.

[giddyup]

22 minutes ago, Lemsta69 said:

lol I take gout medicine too, Allopurinol. my post wasn't intended to discourage you from trying the "natural" remedies first. I hope it works out for you.

 

I was just trying to make the point that pills aren't as evil as some are making them out to be IF you can get the right ones for your brain chemistry. it's also not a sign of weakness or laziness if you take them. I thought that for years before I went and saw the doc, would have saved myself a whole lot of anxiety and pain if I'd done it earlier.

I didn't take your post as trying to discourage me, but I just want to try an alternative first. I've always been a lazy sod and other than a bit of walking avoided exercise like the plague. It's pretty hard to start lifestyle changes at 79, but I'll give it a try with more walking, more sun, and the meditation.

[YaiJung]

Every person I have met, and I have met many, who are taking anti-depressants for depression/anxiety are people who for whatever reason have circumstances in their life which are causing them this immense suffering.  It can be relationship issues, physical health issues, personality issues, financial, lifestyle (ie, excessive drinking, eating, whoring, etc).  The possibilities are endless. 

 

This is extremely daunting for doctors to deal with and takes many therapy sessions and hard work from all involved.  Many cases are nonstarters.  The people refuse to look at or change the issues that are causing the problem.  Much easier to just prescribe some pills and write it off as "chemical imbalance".   Not nearly as much money in the therapy business.   One hr of therapy = $200 or so, vs $400+ for ten min with psychiatrist who doles out expensive pills (USA prices approx).  Winner, winner, chicken dinner!  Happy pills = happy doctor = happy patient...maybe??

 

The side-effects of these medications(SSRIs) should not be minimized.  Search the internet for long-term patient's stories of withdrawal...not fun to say the least.  Any medication that makes people OK with their <deleted>ty life situation needs some serious questioning IMHO.   

 

 One thing is certain, meditation doesn't work effectively if you are taking pills that directly effect your mind and thought processes. 

 

I think you are on the right path, seeking improvement without taking medications.   Enjoy the sunshine, outdoors, healthy food.  Try to focus on the present moment and remember that nothing is permanent.  Including life.  Make the most of every day.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[giddyup]

5 minutes ago, YaiJung said:

Every person I have met, and I have met many, who are taking anti-depressants for depression/anxiety are people who for whatever reason have circumstances in their life which are causing them this immense suffering.  It can be relationship issues, physical health issues, personality issues, financial, lifestyle (ie, excessive drinking, eating, whoring, etc).  The possibilities are endless. 

 

This is extremely daunting for doctors to deal with and takes many therapy sessions and hard work from all involved.  Many cases are nonstarters.  The people refuse to look at or change the issues that are causing the problem.  Much easier to just prescribe some pills and write it off as "chemical imbalance".   Not nearly as much money in the therapy business.   One hr of therapy = $200 or so, vs $400+ for ten min with psychiatrist who doles out expensive pills (USA prices approx).  Winner, winner, chicken dinner!  Happy pills = happy doctor = happy patient...maybe??

 

The side-effects of these medications(SSRIs) should not be minimized.  Search the internet for long-term patient's stories of withdrawal...not fun to say the least.  Any medication that makes people OK with their <deleted>ty life situation needs some serious questioning IMHO.   

 

 One thing is certain, meditation doesn't work effectively if you are taking pills that directly effect your mind and thought processes. 

 

I think you are on the right path, seeking improvement without taking medications.   Enjoy the sunshine, outdoors, healthy food.  Try to focus on the present moment and remember that nothing is permanent.  Including life.  Make the most of every day.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Making the most of every day isn't so easy when you have that big black cloud hanging over your head. It can take away your sense of enjoyment. Winston Churchill who suffered with depression called it his "black dog". He must have learned to live with it though, he lived to a ripe old age.

[Sheryl]

20 hours ago, orchidfan said:

Where can you buy St John's wort here ?

I used to take it in Hong Kong where it was easily available. 

But just haven't seen it here in pharmacies. 

Worked like a charm btw. Although tended to wear off over time. 

 

Lazada or iherb. Same for most supplements.

[kingstonkid]

1 hour ago, YaiJung said:

Every person I have met, and I have met many, who are taking anti-depressants for depression/anxiety are people who for whatever reason have circumstances in their life which are causing them this immense suffering.  It can be relationship issues, physical health issues, personality issues, financial, lifestyle (ie, excessive drinking, eating, whoring, etc).  The possibilities are endless. 

 

This is extremely daunting for doctors to deal with and takes many therapy sessions and hard work from all involved.  Many cases are nonstarters.  The people refuse to look at or change the issues that are causing the problem.  Much easier to just prescribe some pills and write it off as "chemical imbalance".   Not nearly as much money in the therapy business.   One hr of therapy = $200 or so, vs $400+ for ten min with psychiatrist who doles out expensive pills (USA prices approx).  Winner, winner, chicken dinner!  Happy pills = happy doctor = happy patient...maybe??

 

The side-effects of these medications(SSRIs) should not be minimized.  Search the internet for long-term patient's stories of withdrawal...not fun to say the least.  Any medication that makes people OK with their <deleted>ty life situation needs some serious questioning IMHO.   

 

 One thing is certain, meditation doesn't work effectively if you are taking pills that directly effect your mind and thought processes. 

 

I think you are on the right path, seeking improvement without taking medications.   Enjoy the sunshine, outdoors, healthy food.  Try to focus on the present moment and remember that nothing is permanent.  Including life.  Make the most of every day.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

YOu are right that medication itself does not work however with therapy and using meditation which does in fact work even if you are using meds you can fight things.  

 

I came here with PTSD and mod swings that went from great heights to severe lows.  If I went into a restaurant and there was an issue I went ballistic.

 

I had to keep to places that I knew and knew me that way I could guard against a lot of issue.

 

After 9 years and counting the PTSD is resolved the mood swings still happen and I am still on meds although drastically reduced 

 

The big thing is learning the signs of depression when it is starting so that you can switch to other activities to get away from it.  

 

Not always an easy thing.

 

For me one of my things is tutoring students because they always bring a smile to my face.

 

 

 

[thecyclist]

20 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Tell us more, please. Either my endocrine system failed or mirtazapine burned-out. How is citalopram for sleep? I get very, very little. Even when I do get a rare night's rest, still feel exhausted & unrefreshed. Thx.

Have you tried a micro dose of Trazodone for sleep? 

[Bruno123]

On 11/1/2021 at 12:58 AM, giddyup said:

Antidepressant meds will be a last resort for me. I'll start with trying meditation, which I've never done before, more exercising, more sun, and see how that goes first.

and be nicer and more tolerant. Do you have access to a swimming pool? Another great place for relaxing the mind and body. Should be a daily thing for you; come rain or come shine. Floating, breathing, working out where the tensions lie and learning how to relax them.

Devote time for your good health. Rebuild your confidence. You might think that this is all about you, but you are much the same as the rest of us; so the advice is true for all. 

Remember "no man is an island...". One might think they don't need anyone; but in fact we need everyone. 

Be good to yourself and everyone else, as far as you can do so. If you cannot, work on that. Continue to be better at all that you do. 

Negativity is like a slide downhill; super easy for it to overtake your life if you let it. Positivity is a slow uphill climb. The more you do it, the easy it becomes. Until it is like breathing; totally normal.

You talk about being eighty as if it is a negative thing. I try to tell you that you should not think that way; even if you feel that way right now. If you believe that it only goes one way from there, then that is where you will take yourself.

Regenerate, rather than degenerate. Don't be afraid of yourself. Tackle a difficult hill a bit at a time until you can take it in your stride, breathing deeply and calmly. Don't try to run; walk....until you feel your mind and body working in concert and then apply a little more pressure. Keep the breathing deep and steady. 

You aren't there to prove anything to anyone. It's for you. You know how you feel inside.

Don't tell yourself that you cannot. Tell yourself that you can do anything; it will just take practice. Don't give up. Stop, relax and continue on.

All the aches and pains of 'old age' that you think are permanent, aren't necessarily. They are often just the result of repetitive movement in a single direction, out of habit. But our bodies are multidirectional. When you relax your mind and body enough, you will realise that and perhaps subsequently realise that there is a lot more life in the old dog than you initially imagined.

It doesn't matter if I describe you exactly or not. It's not about you. It's about us....humans. 

The fact that you get angry about what I write is a symptom of the stress in your body; so you snap.

I don't take it to heart; because I know what I do is good. So I feel good no matter what you write.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[fredwiggy]

Have a lot of history involving depression, including my own family (ex-girlfriend has it, and our daughter has it, her both parents had it, one hung himself, and also the grandmother),my cousin, on medication after suffering for years and doing well. My best friend killed himself way back when there were few meds available (1987), and had everything going well in his life. My now ex wife has it and it is a main reason we are divorced. My girlfriend here has had it for years, and after I lead her to seeing a doctor, and bolstered her low self esteem, is taking Lorazapam and Prozac, and doing much better. Her doctor told her he wanted to get her off the meds, and that isn't a good idea, as you might really need them .One potential biological cause of depression is an imbalance in the neurotransmitters which are involved in mood regulation.  Certain neurotransmitters, including dopamine, serotonin, and norepinephrine, play an important role in mood. Meaning meds can work, along with therapy, exercise, good diet, and a good environment. My girlfriend has been controlled by family for years, and this of course leads to bad feelings about oneself. Exercise, good diet and environment can help a lot, but a chemical imbalance cannot be changed naturally. The wrong meds can hurt more, and it sometimes takes quite awhile to find the right one or combination. Some get environmental depression that passes, and life changes can cause temporary depression also. Everyone gets depressed, but some get it to the extreme. Back when my friend took his life, he had a great wife, pets, house,job, played drums, was a class clown (symptom sometimes,like Robin Williams), and had many friends. He was losing his hair, and some, including his wife, thought that was the reason he went into his van, put the exhaust with a pipe into it, closed the doors and fell asleep. Back then, before I experienced the problems with my little girls mom, read three books and many articles, and tried to help her, I didn't understand why my friend died. I remembered when we were hanging out, he liked to sleep a lot during the day (major symptom), always was joking around, (to deflect pain), and self medicated. If I had known then what I do now, along with everyone else, he might still be with us. I would definitely see a competent doctor, and try what they suggest, along with doing things naturally by yourself.

Edited November 2, 2021 by fredwiggy