I am Done With Thai Retirement Extensions - Relocating to Ecuador or Mexico on Permanent Residency

[KarenBravo]

7 hours ago, Skallywag said:

Udonjoe the visa expert doesn't say retirement extensions have changed requirements. I have done 3 Non-imm O extensions and all were the same. 

What are the "more and more requirements" you speak of?

He won't reply to your post calling him out.

Makes stuff up so that he can feel outraged.

 

My guess is that he got the paperwork wrong one year and then the next year, got a different part wrong. To the compulsively outraged, this is called "changed requirements", or "moving the goal-posts" and it helps to justify the outrage.

 

Pity that there are people here that can cut him off at the knees........using facts.

[fredscats]

2 hours ago, Confuscious said:

I have taken the same decision, returning to Europe, for personal reasons.
Can not find which benefit paying for a "20 year THAI Elite visa" could bring for me.

I am 68 years old and I have been staying more than 20 years in Thailand now.
Although I have been hospitalized in Thailand a few times, I always paid my bill without an expensive health insurance which would be worthless anyway.

I wear a Pacemaker and it will need to be exchanged by the end of next year.
Cost for the pacemaker on Thailand (without the surgery) is about 120KBaht.
In Europe it is FREE (I am an European citizen).

At my age, travelling back and forth to Europe for every heath issue, becomes a PITA.

Also, I did got already the (bad) news that I will for 90% sure be enrolled for DIALYSE (3 times a week).
DIALYSE  every 3 days will be very expensive.
In Europe, it is FREE.

 

And I don't talk about other benefits that I would get when I would return to EUROPE.

I don't see what taking an expensive 20 year visa or an expensive health care would benefit me.

And just like me, there are thousands of aging retirees in Thailand who will take sooner or later the same decision.

Of course true,but Spain and other post brexit rules have changed too,more than a few exiting EU countries

 

Its the uncertainty now that clouds the issue in Thailand,the new insurance requirement on entry will become permanent no doubt,so anyone past 75 plus will be in trouble...will have huge effect on property selling  fact is it will wipe it out

[3NUMBAS]

they want only the very wealthy ,absured demands

[ripstanley]

19 hours ago, sam6345 said:

US and English

I thought US was English. Thank you for telling me why I cannot understand some English speakers and some yanks.

[BE88]

2 hours ago, guzzi850m2 said:

Why not Portugal summer/Thailand winter?

 

I am thinking about doing something like that.

Why return to Thailand in the winter?

Portugal has a pleasant temperature even in winter never below 16 ° C

 

 

[thailand49]

I fully understand how you feel but I kind of enjoy the reporting it keeps my old butt alert and constantly thinking keeps me sharp plus the Grass is never greener somewhere else it takes work to keep it green!???? 

[SAFETY FIRST]

20 hours ago, EricTh said:

Yes, I agree with you. Things are getting tougher and tougher every year for retirees with more and more requirements

You can pay an agency to complete your retirement extensions, it's not expensive and hassle free. 

 

[madmen]

20 hours ago, EricTh said:

@sam6345

 

Yes, I agree with you. Things are getting tougher and tougher every year for retirees with more and more requirements.

 

If I had known, I wouldn't have come to Thailand either. Unfortunately, some of us still have commitments in Thailand and can't really pack up and leave.

 

Best of luck in your new country.

Nonsense. Take your family back to first world! And give them a better life. Where their is a will there is a way 

Reality is while every man and his dog threaten to leave most never do. To much in love with Los 

[Jingthing]

42 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

He won't reply to your post calling him out.

Makes stuff up so that he can feel outraged.

 

My guess is that he got the paperwork wrong one year and then the next year, got a different part wrong. To the compulsively outraged, this is called "changed requirements", or "moving the goal-posts" and it helps to justify the outrage.

 

Pity that there are people here that can cut him off at the knees........using facts.

They have changed requirements. FACT.

[KarenBravo]

11 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

They have changed requirements. FACT.

What changes?

He says every year they change, so give me two.

 

Saying "FACT" doesn't make it so.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

What changes?

He says every year they change, so give me two.

 

Saying "FACT" doesn't make it so.

They have already been mentioned. Baiting post ignored.

[Mr Dome]

Good luck to you. I can totally understand your frustration. 

The Thai's feel almost as uneasy about foreigners as the Japanese, let's face it, the rules aren't going to change in a culture that defines itself by the idea of superiority and the the importance placed on calling out the "non-Thainess" in others.

 

As for me, I wouldn't move to Central or South America without a good command of Spanish.

 

Moved to Cambodia in 2019 (lived & worked in Thailand 2001-05) and am really happy here. Not expecting permanent residency or to stay here for the rest of my life.

Edited November 6, 2021 by Mr Dome
added another thought

[KarenBravo]

12 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

They have already been mentioned. Baiting post ignored.

I'm not going through seven pages to try and find what you are talking about when you could easily tell me in a one liner.

 

If these changes are real, they would have been posted in the Royal Gazette and ALL immigration offices would comply.

As Phuket immigration hasn't changed their requirements in years, then I doubt very much whether these so called changes are actual requirements. Sounds like the whim of an individual immigration office. Official requirements have not changed which is supported by our forum resident visa expert.

 

Calling my posts "baiting" is such a lame way to not answer my question and just makes you look evasive.

Edited November 6, 2021 by KarenBravo

[Jingthing]

10 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

I'm not going through seven pages to try and find what you are talking about when you could easily tell me in a one liner.

 

If these changes are real, they would have been posted in the Royal Gazette and ALL immigration offices would comply.

As Phuket immigration hasn't changed their requirements in years, then I doubt very much whether these so called changes are actual requirements. Sounds like the whim of an individual immigration office. Official requirements have not changed which is supported by our forum resident visa expert.

 

Calling my posts "baiting" is such a lame way to not answer my question and just makes you look evasive.

Too lazy to read but not too lazy to post unfounded insults  Impressive!

[KarenBravo]

Just now, Jingthing said:

Too lazy to read but not too lazy to post unfounded insults  Impressive!

Yeah.....I thought so. Can't actually support what you say, can you?

Don't need to spend an hour going through all the posts when I know that it's BS for the reasons I have already posted.

Big enough for sarcastic comments, but not big enough to support your own statement. Impressive!

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

Yeah.....I thought so. Can't actually support what you say, can you?

Don't need to spend an hour going through all the posts when I know that it's BS for the reasons I have already posted.

Big enough for sarcastic comments, but not big enough to support your own statement. Impressive!

You're just wrong. But I refuse to be bullied to point you to the relevant posts or repost. You're not that special.

 

READ.

Edited November 6, 2021 by Jingthing

[LoeiI]

3 hours ago, RafPinto said:

Sh..... I'm already over 50.

Never mind. Always fancied a trip to Cambodia and Laos as I have never been there.

I'll definitely try and do the Cambodian first just hope the Mrs doesn't find out ????

[Dumbfounded]

The rules are always changing (especially now with covid) so who knows, in the future the govt may announce that medical insurance is compulsory with a cover of US$1-3mil. If they want to get rid of long termers and just go for short stayers they've got plenty of options. Nobody really likes change to their comfort zone, and we all like stability, but constant uncertainty is worse especially with this govt

[Mike Teavee]

4 hours ago, Confuscious said:

I have taken the same decision, returning to Europe, for personal reasons.
Can not find which benefit paying for a "20 year THAI Elite visa" could bring for me.

I am 68 years old and I have been staying more than 20 years in Thailand now.
Although I have been hospitalized in Thailand a few times, I always paid my bill without an expensive health insurance which would be worthless anyway.

I wear a Pacemaker and it will need to be exchanged by the end of next year.
Cost for the pacemaker on Thailand (without the surgery) is about 120KBaht.
In Europe it is FREE (I am an European citizen).

At my age, travelling back and forth to Europe for every heath issue, becomes a PITA.

Also, I did got already the (bad) news that I will for 90% sure be enrolled for DIALYSE (3 times a week).
DIALYSE  every 3 days will be very expensive.
In Europe, it is FREE.

 

And I don't talk about other benefits that I would get when I would return to EUROPE.

I don't see what taking an expensive 20 year visa or an expensive health care would benefit me.

And just like me, there are thousands of aging retirees in Thailand who will take sooner or later the same decision.

I can see why you & a lot of other guys (especially us UK/EU guys who get "Free" health care) return to our home countries as we get older & develop medical issues, but the OP was saying he was moving back because of Immigrations issues so I was suggesting a couple of options that can help make those issues a lot easier to deal with. 

 

I'm 55 & (touch wood) have no medical issues so if I'm in the same situation when I'm 65 I can see a 1 Million THB 20 year visa taking me to 85 at which point if I still live in Thailand (or am alive even) I'd worry about it then,  but the chances are that I will also have chosen to return back to the UK before then due to medical concerns. 

 

 

I understand what you're saying about paying 1 Million for a 20 year "Visa" at 65 and then having to return back at 69 but if you did not know then that you would have these problems you would have enjoyed 4 years of the Visa + you'd have another 16 years to enjoy any future trips to Thailand if you can (Appreciate regular dialysis treatment would make this very difficult if not impossible but in the cases of guys who have gone back for heart operations of cancer treatment, there is always an option to come back after a couple of years).

Edited November 6, 2021 by Mike Teavee

[Tony125]

Better re-think moving to Mexico. Yes more Americans live there than in any other country because it's cheap and close, can drive back in no nead to fly but it is getting highly dangerous for gringos.

 

Two Cancúns collide as masked gunmen storm Yucatán beach

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/two-cancúns-collide-as-masked-gunmen-storm-yucatán-beach/ar-AAQnWDI?li=BBnb7Kz

[cardinalblue]

Look at Panama…

 

 

[Jingthing]

42 minutes ago, Tony125 said:

Better re-think moving to Mexico. Yes more Americans live there than in any other country because it's cheap and close, can drive back in no nead to fly but it is getting highly dangerous for gringos.

 

Two Cancúns collide as masked gunmen storm Yucatán beach

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/two-cancúns-collide-as-masked-gunmen-storm-yucatán-beach/ar-AAQnWDI?li=BBnb7Kz

Thats kind of out of context. There are safe areas in Mexico. Cartel.violence in the Riviera Maya isn't new.

Btw, its not that cheap anymore.

.

Edited November 6, 2021 by Jingthing

[sam6345]

4 hours ago, Jingthing said:

800 dollars a month pension.

There are two additional options along with the above to get PR for Ecuador:

1. Investment option: $40K USD interest paying Bank deposit in a local bank (Leads to PR for a family of four). This deposit can be withdrawn on acquiring citizenship after 5 years.

2. Surprisingly just a verified 4 year college degree by the education ministry can land you a PR as well. I believe this is targeting the relatively younger digital nomad group.

 

Three important points to note:

1. Ecuador uses the USD as its official currency so no exchange fees for US citizens.

2. Individuals over 65 years are excused from appearing for the naturalization oral and written test to qualify for citizenship.

3. All PR holders are eligible for Health care cover under the National Medical Insurance Plan.

 

Hope this helps.

Edited November 6, 2021 by sam6345

[KhunLA]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

They have changed requirements. FACT.

No they haven't, please tell me what has changed.  Just read, you're not saying / posting again.  I'll search ... curious

 

Done searching, and you did not post / list any retirement extension changes in any of your post, after stating 'they changed'.

 

As I stated earlier, and Jack quoted me, which you quoted Jack (pg 3), stating they 'changed', but nothing after.

 

One person did list changes 'to the country'; inflation, congestion bla bla bla, same as in every country.

 

Imm ret. visa extension is the same as 20 yrs ago; prove address, prove income / financials.  That's 4 different offices I've use, all the same.  No scamming, no agent, it really is too easy.

Edited November 6, 2021 by KhunLA

[Jingthing]

13 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

No they haven't, please tell me what has changed.  Just read, you're saying / posting again.  I'll search ... curious

OA extensions changed to require health insurance.

 

Pressured embassies about income letters and now some major embassies stopped issuing them at all caving to the pressure

 

Money seasoning for 800K method.

Before -- three months before. Then you could spend to one baht.

Now two months before at 800K. Three months after at 800K. Then you can spend down to 400K. Not one baht. 400K. Some offices including major retirement haven of Pattaya require check in after three months to prove the three months after 800K.

 

ALSO -- now combo method applications are harder to do and not even accepted at all in some offices.

[Mike Teavee]

23 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

No they haven't, please tell me what has changed.  Just read, you're saying / posting again.  I'll search ... curious

I agree that things haven't changed for me, but you cannot deny that they haven't changed for other guys in the past 3-5 years:-

1. No Income Certificates for guys from Aus, US & UK - Makes it harder for people to prove they meet the 65K pm income threshold.
2. (For guys using the Income pm method) Need to transfer 65K pm into Thailand every month (NB the difference here in the fact that the income certificates were done on gross income so any tax or expensies in your home country could be ignored, the fact that you have to transfer over 65K every month means these now affect how much "Income" you have for extension purposes). 
3. The 800K now needs to stay in your bank account for at least 3 months after the extension, cannot drop below 400K during the year & needs to be back at 800K for 2 months (slight relief here as it used to be 3 months) before your next extension.
4. [The real Biggie] Non-Imm OA Visa Holders (irrespective of how long they;ve had the visa) now need Health Insurance of at least 400K outpatients & 40K inpatients. 

 

... Again none of these changes impact me (I'm on a Non-Imm O so don't need the insurance & always planned to tie the 800K up all year round) but you can't say they haven't chnged & as such impacted some people (especially the Non-Imm OA Insurance requirements). 

 

 

Edit: Sorry, Posted same time as @Jingthingbut I think our posts align. 

 

Edited November 6, 2021 by Mike Teavee

[KhunLA]

I was under the impression the OP was extending a non -O- ret visa.

If OA visa, then things may have changed, due to scammer abusing it.

 

No changes on the non -O- ret visa, that I've ever been asked for.  Just tightening of the rules, more scrutiny of the paperwork, due to all you scammers, using agents to file a bunch a BS.

 

Som naa na

 

In reference to the 'income letters', Thai Imm didn't change anything.  Embassies stopped issuing, because they weren't verifying the info (USA), which the Thai Imm finally realized, so asked them to.

Since that actually involve work, hitting a couple keys on computer, or simply reading our official income documents, they simply stopped issuing them.  Your embassies' fault, not Thai Imm.

 

But nothing really changed, you simply had to verify you had the fund, by deposit (show me the money), monthly or lump in bank, available to live on in Thailand.  Those that didn't, couldn't ....  oh well.  Same requirement 65k / 800k, but actually had to have, no more BS.

 

Or continue scamming Imm by using agents.  

 

If using the seasoning 800k lump sum, 3 month (first time) 2 months (ext), and can withdrawal all after visa approval. For non -O- ret

 

Edited November 6, 2021 by KhunLA

[Confuscious]

4 hours ago, fredscats said:

Of course true,but Spain and other post brexit rules have changed too,more than a few exiting EU countries

 

Its the uncertainty now that clouds the issue in Thailand,the new insurance requirement on entry will become permanent no doubt,so anyone past 75 plus will be in trouble...will have huge effect on property selling  fact is it will wipe it out

I have been collecting information on the rules already, and I can relocate to Spain without any problem.

I can not post links to websites, but I have addresses of real estate companies, and for 25k Euro I can buy already a nice apartment in Alicante.
Alicante has the whole year almost the same temperature as Thailand.
I have the double nationality (Belgian/Spanish) and I speak both languages.

On the issue of Thailand, I have lived here the past 20 years and almost every year someone came up with a new rule for the expats.
Increasing of the funds; Change the income rules; Requiring crazy documents (TM30, Marriage certificate from the place where you had your marriage, Proof of income, etc.)
The health insurance for elder people was "the final drip which started the bucket to overflow".

I just pity the expats who invested all their money in a house, 1 or more luxury cars, etc.

 

[Mike Teavee]

17 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I was under the impression the OP was extending a non -O- ret visa.

If OA visa, then things may have changed, due to scammer abusing it.

 

No changes on the non -O- ret visa, that I've ever been asked for.  Just tightening of the rules, more scrutiny of the paperwork, due to all you scammers, using agents to file a bunch a BS.

 

Som naa na

 

In reference to the 'income letters', Thai Imm didn't change anything.  Embassies stopped issuing, because they weren't verifying the info (USA), which the Thai Imm finally realized, so asked them to.

Since that actually involve work, hitting a couple keys on computer, or simply reading our official income documents, they simply stopped issuing them.  Your embassies' fault, not Thai Imm.

 

But nothing really changed, you simply had to verify you had the fund, by deposit (show me the money), monthly or lump in bank, available to live on in Thailand.  Those that didn't, couldn't ....  oh well.  Same requirement 65k / 800k, but actually had to have, no more BS.

 

Or continue scamming Imm by using agents.  

 

If using the seasoning 800k lump sum, 3 month (first time) 2 months (ext), and can withdrawal all after visa approval. For non -O- ret

 

But you can see that there is a difference between getting a legitimate income certificate that says you have 65K pm income Gross & being able to transfer 65K pm Nett don't you?

 

 

Added to that people are now forced to transfer at least 65k pm over to Thailand whereas they may only need 1/2 of that to live on (granted they can send it back but you cannot say that things haven't changed if you're forced to do that). 

 

 

Again, I'm not affected by any of these rule changes but I can see how some guys may have been. 

 

Edit 

"If using the seasoning 800k lump sum, 3 month (first time) 2 months (ext), and can withdrawal all after visa approval. For non -O- ret"

 

You are very mistaken if you believe that you can spend the 800K below 400K at any point during the year... 

Edited November 6, 2021 by Mike Teavee

[Confuscious]

2 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

I can see why you & a lot of other guys (especially us UK/EU guys who get "Free" health care) return to our home countries as we get older & develop medical issues, but the OP was saying he was moving back because of Immigrations issues so I was suggesting a couple of options that can help make those issues a lot easier to deal with. 

 

I'm 55 & (touch wood) have no medical issues so if I'm in the same situation when I'm 65 I can see a 1 Million THB 20 year visa taking me to 85 at which point if I still live in Thailand (or am alive even) I'd worry about it then,  but the chances are that I will also have chosen to return back to the UK before then due to medical concerns. 

 

 

I understand what you're saying about paying 1 Million for a 20 year "Visa" at 65 and then having to return back at 69 but if you did not know then that you would have these problems you would have enjoyed 4 years of the Visa + you'd have another 16 years to enjoy any future trips to Thailand if you can (Appreciate regular dialysis treatment would make this very difficult if not impossible but in the cases of guys who have gone back for heart operations of cancer treatment, there is always an option to come back after a couple of years).

In the '90's, I was working daily my shift.
After my shift, I was every day (including the weekends 4 hours in the gym).
I had a very strong body and nothing could stop me.
Until December '95, when I suffered a stroke and I was initially completly paralyzed.
Fortunatly, due to my strong body, I was back on my roots 6 months later.
I lost several movement at my right side forever (could not write clear anymore and could not run> , but the was OK.

I went back to work and a few months later back to the gym.
Until December '97, when I suffered several heart attacks in a short time and went into a Coma.

I recovered, but I had a Pacemaker and several Bypasses.
I was not allowed to work anymore, go to the gym, etc..

Take care about what you say.
Your health can change from one day to the other.