How to return to Thailand with COVID recovery certificate

[treetops]

On 12/24/2021 at 9:25 AM, jojothai said:

Hi treetops. Thanks.

You are correct the recover certificate is accepted and it is  on Thai airways guidance.
Please can you clarify where you found that on IATA with the link address.
I have searched hard and not found it. 

Click on Thailand on the map displayed here:

 

https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/world.php

 

or follow the step by step path here:

 

https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/passport-visa-health-travel-document-requirements.htm#

 

[Albert Zweistein]

13 hours ago, jojothai said:

In my opinion not precisely. You are referring to the use of the recovery certificate in case of a positive test.
From what i have found in the last 2 days, even if it is actually a negative test (as demanded by the airline),

they may require a recovery certificate also if you have recently recovered. People may not think of it that way.
 

IMHO, i now consider the recovery certificate important to get whether the PCR test is positive or negative.
I will get one regardless of the test result.

My daughter in law and granddaughter were both found infected when they tested to fly home and had to remain in quarantine 2 weeks. After this period they still tested positive and were not allowed to fly. One week later they still tested positive but obtained a recovery certificate and were allowed to fly, 3 1/2 weeks after they were found infected.

I realize that there are different rules in different countries and I think it also depends sometimes on the person at the check in.

Anyway it's a good idea to get this certificate and hope you will make it and have a pleasant and HEALTHY flight.

 

Albert 2stein.

[jojothai]

4 hours ago, treetops said:

Click on Thailand on the map displayed here:

 

https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/world.php

 

or follow the step by step path here:

 

https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/passport-visa-health-travel-document-requirements.htm#

 

 

Thanks treetops

But Clause 2 in the map states that  a negative PCR test is required. There are no exceptions

the rest of the text only deal with sandbox or AQ. The Thailnd Pass has been removed - presumably because it is suspended.

Then the clause 3 referring to recovery certificate only relates to vaccination certificate / status see below.

The second link only gets me to Sandbox or AQ.

 

This is the problem I have with the airline. They insist on a negative PCR test according to IATA.

Its incomplete and false information from IATA.
I have made  complaint. no response yet

 

3 d. have a COVID-19 vaccination certificate showing that they were fully vaccinated with AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria), Covaxin, Covishield, Janssen, Moderna (Spikevax), Pfizer-BioNTech (Comirnaty), Sinopharm, Sinovac or Sputnik V at least 14 days before departure;
- This does not apply to:
- passengers younger than 11 years;
- nationals of Thailand between 12 and 17 years with a COVID-19 vaccination certificate showing that they received one dose of AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria), Covaxin, Covishield, Janssen, Moderna (Spikevax), Pfizer-BioNTech (Comirnaty), Sinopharm, Sinovac or Sputnik V;
- passengers with a recovery certificate and a COVID-19 vaccination certificate showing that they received at least one dose of AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria), Covaxin, Covishield, Janssen, Moderna (Spikevax), Pfizer-BioNTech (Comirnaty), Sinopharm, Sinovac or Sputnik V at most 3 months after the infection and at least 14 days before departure.

 

 

 

 

[treetops]

36 minutes ago, jojothai said:

Thanks treetops

But Clause 2 in the map states that  a negative PCR test is required. There are no exceptions

the rest of the text only deal with sandbox or AQ. The Thailnd Pass has been removed - presumably because it is suspended.

Then the clause 3 referring to recovery certificate only relates to vaccination certificate / status see below.

The second link only gets me to Sandbox or AQ.

Clause 2 is only about transit passengers the way I read it, not sure about the rest:

 

[jojothai]

9 minutes ago, treetops said:

Clause 2 is only about transit passengers the way I read it, not sure about the rest:

 

Correct and good.

My mistake, they have removed thai pass. The article is dated 23 December and has the previous rules removed.

I was checking earlier when the Thai pass was there, that's when the airline was pointing out the requirement

I have seen it then but cannot verify now.

There is still nothing in the rules stated to allow the recovery certificate with positive PCR. So that may still be a problem.

I note that I reported the problem to IATA on the 23 December and I am sure that it was there,

and this new version is dated 23 also.        Could it be that  . . . . .  .

 

Its great that you have alerted me to the change thanks, and i potentially have more reason to dispute what the airline says.

Its still a problem with the airline, their documented rules still now clearly state as follows:

FINNAIR world map requirements Thailand
COVID-19 TestRequired

Before arrival

All foreign passengers, regardless of their vaccination status, must comply with the following pre-departure requirement:

Negative COVID-19 RT-PCR test taken 72 hours before departure

• Test type accepted: RT-PCR 
• Time window: 72 hours before departure from the first embarkation point.
• Applicable age: not specified. 
• Languages accepted: English. 
• Exemptions:                
  • Thai nationals
• Keep in mind: Ordinary PCR tests or antigen tests are not accepted

When I go to Manchester airport on 27th for my PCR test,

I am already planning to see finnair there to dispute the requirements with them to try to resolve for my flight on 30th.

Trust that you have had  a great christmas. Its just coming to midnight now in Thailand.

[balhamred]

Is the conclusion that even with the Recovery Certificate, after landing in Thailand a positive PCR is going to mean quarantine 14 days nonetheless?

 

That would be really disappointing, when it's obvious that you can't catch it twice within quick succession.

[TorquayFan]

Balham - with respect, you can catch Covid twice in quick succession. I know of cases in my Family.

 

This is particularly true for unvaxed persons as Omicron virus can escape the immunity left behind by Delta infection.  More worryingly, fast reinfections can occur in vaxed persons too.

Edited December 26, 2021 by TorquayFan

[jojothai]

7 hours ago, balhamred said:

Is the conclusion that even with the Recovery Certificate, after landing in Thailand a positive PCR is going to mean quarantine 14 days nonetheless?

 

That would be really disappointing, when it's obvious that you can't catch it twice within quick succession.

There is nobody reporting any such experience yet.

I may then be the first to find out.

I have read somewhere a few days ago that we will not have to quarantine, and may not have to take the PCR test.

However i have so far ignored that until we know what actually happens. TIT and i expect the thais to follow the black and white.

The uk is 10 days to release after positive test, some other countries i saw 14.. dont know how the thais may consider it.

I expect they may say that i have to stay in hotel quarantine until i have pcr test negative or up to 7 / 10 days

My worst situation could be testing negative before flight, then positive when i get to BKK.

it may be best if i test positive here and have to use the recovery certificate to fly.

[jojothai]

1 hour ago, TorquayFan said:

Balham - with respect, you can catch Covid twice in quick succession. I know of cases in my Family.

 

This is particularly true for unvaxed persons as Omicron virus can escape the immunity left behind by Delta infection.  More worryingly, fast reinfections can occur in vaxed persons too.

Yes, it is possible.

As i noted, my worst situation may be testing negative here before flight, then positive in thailand. What do the thais do then?

I had my booster on 12 december and got symptoms 16th.

They say you need 14 days for booster to be effective.

Its impossible to judge what sort of a situation i am in until the pcr tests, test to fly is tomorrow.

Edited December 26, 2021 by jojothai

[balhamred]

4 hours ago, TorquayFan said:

Balham - with respect, you can catch Covid twice in quick succession. I know of cases in my Family.

 

This is particularly true for unvaxed persons as Omicron virus can escape the immunity left behind by Delta infection.  More worryingly, fast reinfections can occur in vaxed persons too.

Fair enough, I sadly take your point!

[balhamred]

3 hours ago, jojothai said:

Yes, it is possible.

As i noted, my worst situation may be testing negative here before flight, then positive in thailand. What do the thais do then?

I had my booster on 12 december and got symptoms 16th.

They say you need 14 days for booster to be effective.

Its impossible to judge what sort of a situation i am in until the pcr tests, test to fly is tomorrow.

I'm also thinking in agreement with you, although the wording is vague, it appears as though arriving with the recovery certificate and positive pcr may put you in a different process than someone arriving with a negative pcr and recovery certificate and then testing positive.

 

Edit: will thai airways let us on the flight if the recovery certificate is just 11 days since the positive pcr sample, or does the recovery certificate need to be 14 days from positive?

Edited December 26, 2021 by balhamred

[balhamred]

@jojothai

These screenshots may help:

 

I don't think the hotels are aware of this rule, that's one of the problems. I think it would be best to try and clear the situation with the hotel in advance of travelling, to maximize your chances of a good outcome.

Edited December 26, 2021 by balhamred

[jojothai]

12 hours ago, balhamred said:

I'm also thinking in agreement with you, although the wording is vague, it appears as though arriving with the recovery certificate and positive pcr may put you in a different process than someone arriving with a negative pcr and recovery certificate and then testing positive.

 

Edit: will thai airways let us on the flight if the recovery certificate is just 11 days since the positive pcr sample, or does the recovery certificate need to be 14 days from positive?

I have not seen anything to say there is a limit on the number of days for Thailand for recovery.
However Qatar airways verbally said 14 but wanted negative PCR also.

In the UK the private providers state that they will give you the certificate 11 days after the test that was positive.
That must be because UK is 10 days self isolation after testing positive

[jojothai]

5 hours ago, balhamred said:

@jojothai

These screenshots may help:

 

I don't think the hotels are aware of this rule, that's one of the problems. I think it would be best to try and clear the situation with the hotel in advance of travelling, to maximize your chances of a good outcome.

Thank you kindly for posting this.
What happens in Thailand is just as important as getting on the flight, I think that this may help get things resolved more quickly.

Because its new years holiday when I get back, I expect that if I test positive it will take until midweek to get this addressed.
I don't mind if I have to do 7 days quarantine. Getting back is more important.

 

I do not want to say anything about being infected to the hotel in advance. Remember TIT.

The person doing bookings will almost certainly not know anything about this, may panic and cancel my booking,

they can say they are full or whatever to avoid having anybody that may have covid.

[jojothai]

19 minutes ago, jojothai said:

I have not seen anything to say there is a limit on the number of days for Thailand for recovery.
However Qatar airways verbally said 14 but wanted negative PCR also.

In the UK the private providers state that they will give you the certificate 11 days after the test that was positive.
That must be because UK is 10 days self isolation after testing positive

I forgot, after being tested positive in Thailand, how long do you need quarantined?

If its 14 days then they are within their rights to say that I have to meet the same, so that would be in my case 17th + 14 = 31 last day
I may land on 31 so I have an argument to say I am ok then.

 

It may not help anybody sat near me on the plane. I will tell the flight staff that I should be isolated at the back.

Edited December 26, 2021 by jojothai
add info

[internationalism]

Get also antibody test, they are cheap, around 30gbp with certificate. It will show your recent infection. It will also be high after recent vax. 
Most probably you will get them also in thailand after positive. Insist on doing so. 
they prove your viral infection is very low, residue from the recent infection. 
get yourself throat lozenges containing cetylopiridinium chloride. They are in thailand under name cepecol original. Possibly similar name in the uk. 
there are also mouthwash, toothpaste, sirups or any other form. 
its antibacterial, but also new research shows antiviral.  You can search the net for other medicines containing it or ask pharmacist to check on computer if they stock it. They might even order for you one for the next day. 
you might still have traces of virus in the nose and throat, but not in the body. 
also use nasal inhalers with menthol,  camphor, eucalyptus and the other essential oils. I think in the UK under name vix. 
use it all the time to clear airways. I do even lick them to clean mouth and throat. 
you can do home inhalations with salt, essential oils or anything available over the counter. Even room diffusers with antimicrobial essential oils - menthol, eucalyptus, pine and many others
 

Edited December 27, 2021 by internationalism

[jojothai]

2 hours ago, internationalism said:

Get also antibody test, they are cheap, around 30gbp with certificate. It will show your recent infection. It will also be high after recent vax. 
Most probably you will get them also in thailand after positive. Insist on doing so. 
they prove your viral infection is very low, residue from the recent infection. 
get yourself throat lozenges containing cetylopiridinium chloride. They are in thailand under name cepecol original. Possibly similar name in the uk. 
there are also mouthwash, toothpaste, sirups or any other form. 
its antibacterial, but also new research shows antiviral.  You can search the net for other medicines containing it or ask pharmacist to check on computer if they stock it. They might even order for you one for the next day. 
you might still have traces of virus in the nose and throat, but not in the body. 
also use nasal inhalers with menthol,  camphor, eucalyptus and the other essential oils. I think in the UK under name vix. 
use it all the time to clear airways. I do even lick them to clean mouth and throat. 
you can do home inhalations with salt, essential oils or anything available over the counter. Even room diffusers with antimicrobial essential oils - menthol, eucalyptus, pine and many others
 

Thanks. my PCR tes here in UK is in 6 hours.

[TorquayFan]

Jojo, 'Inter' has some good ideas -  in the UK, in most Pharmacies, you'll find a range of 'Sterimar' sprays (salt and water), about GBP 8. You can spray into the upper cavities of the nose and this may help. You can use it 5 times a day or more. 'Inter's' ideas for the throat are good too. Do as much as you can to help yourself - if you are no longer infected, this may help clear 'expired' virus. Antibody tests are interesting of course but in similar circumstances, I was led to believe that they were not decisive in the way you need.

 

I cannot understand why you have not done regular LF tests - even though a PCR test may give you a different result, if you had returned 7 daily negative LF's in the last week that would surely help give you a level of comfort ?

 

I do wish you well and hopefully, your PCR test today, will show that you are now clear . . . . IF your test comes back 'not detected' or 'negative' then hooray ! I'm sure when you arrive in BKK the result will be the same - obviously, this is the best outcome by far !

 

BUT if the virus is detected in today's PCR, whatever you've found in the rules about this, I think it might be very difficult for you, both boarding and arrival.

 

In your last post you noted this, "It may not help anybody sat near me on the plane. I will tell the flight staff that I should be isolated at the back''. I found that concerning - why ? Do you think you might still be infectious ? In which case, I know it's important for you to get back but ???

 

It seems a matter life or death to you that you get on that plane - good for you if it happens. I have to tell you that myself, I would be very angry with an airline that boarded a PAX with a positive PCR.

 

ATB and I hope it goes well for you.

Edited December 27, 2021 by TorquayFan

[jojothai]

7 hours ago, TorquayFan said:

Jojo, 'Inter' has some good ideas -  in the UK, in most Pharmacies, you'll find a range of 'Sterimar' sprays (salt and water), about GBP 8. You can spray into the upper cavities of the nose and this may help. You can use it 5 times a day or more. 'Inter's' ideas for the throat are good too. Do as much as you can to help yourself - if you are no longer infected, this may help clear 'expired' virus. Antibody tests are interesting of course but in similar circumstances, I was led to believe that they were not decisive in the way you need.

 

I cannot understand why you have not done regular LF tests - even though a PCR test may give you a different result, if you had returned 7 daily negative LF's in the last week that would surely help give you a level of comfort ?

 

I do wish you well and hopefully, your PCR test today, will show that you are now clear . . . . IF your test comes back 'not detected' or 'negative' then hooray ! I'm sure when you arrive in BKK the result will be the same - obviously, this is the best outcome by far !

 

BUT if the virus is detected in today's PCR, whatever you've found in the rules about this, I think it might be very difficult for you, both boarding and arrival.

 

In your last post you noted this, "It may not help anybody sat near me on the plane. I will tell the flight staff that I should be isolated at the back''. I found that concerning - why ? Do you think you might still be infectious ? In which case, I know it's important for you to get back but ???

 

It seems a matter life or death to you that you get on that plane - good for you if it happens. I have to tell you that myself, I would be very angry with an airline that boarded a PAX with a positive PCR.

 

ATB and I hope it goes well for you.

Thanks

I have been taking LF tests regularly , despite the NHS saying 5 to 6  days Ago that we should not do so.

Then the govt suddenly say they Are valid!!!
All LF tests were positive until this morning. So it is touch And go.

Waiting for test result now.

 

I have checked all the relevant airlines this morning in Manchester airport And will report later.

I currently have Thai airways And Emirates As options to fly back.

 

for the sitting at the back its nothing to do with whether I am infectious.
If I test positive in BKK you must surely know that people sitting around me will be quarantined ?
I want to get back but would be very upset if other people will get quarantined. They will be more upset than me.

I consider its imperative to consider others as well and I wil do my best to ensure the airline keeps me isolated.

Now I have negative LF tests here its most likely I m no longer infectious,

but if my PCR test is now positive here,  then it my be tested positive when I land. 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2021 by jojothai

[jojothai]

Positive, so my homework is now important.

LF tests now negative.

Thai airways most likely the safest to ensure i can get back,

And so that i can request they put me in the back seats to keep separated from others.

Edited December 27, 2021 by jojothai

[TorquayFan]

Jojo, sorry to hear the PCR was positive. You've a couple of days to work hard on the nose and throat and maybe squeeze in another PCR ?

 

By far the best to go direct if Thai will take you - to avoid any hassle at Dubai etc.

 

Good luck at BKK - but if you are prepared to quarantine, that's OK. I take my hat off to you for determination at least ! ATB

[jojothai]

Thanks

I can get another PCR but i doubt it will help.
I already planned to do what was suggested by inter.
Problem is that all the local pharmacies are still closed. I have to go into town to find one open.

My focus should be also on possible effect on other passengers, so THai airways must be first priority.
Now looking at how that works. 

[jojothai]

For any people that need to know

Following my checks  at Manchester airport this morning I can advise the following

Question : will they accept  recovery cert with positive PCR at check in desks

 

finnair NO

Air France were not sure. I do not think they will.

Lufthansa NO

Singapore airlines NO. Transit Changi not permitted

QATAR Airways: They have to send request to QR BKK to confirm ok, but not acceptable until at least 14 days after positive test

Emirates said it will be ok.

SAS with connection through CPH to thai AIRWYS said ok. But their flights are very expensive. also, the Man-CPH was cancelled today.

Turkish. NO, has to Be 28 days before they will accept.

 

I still understand that THAI airwys will be ok

 

[jojothai]

TIT, but I am not even there

In order to get back i wish i could book on the thai airways booking site.

It will not work. will not accept name.

<deleted>

no wonder they cannot survive

[internationalism]

Use kitchen salt. 
probably you have some essential oils. Ask neighbours. Vix inhaler probably can be bought in convenience stores - in thailand 7/11 have it. 
you can do inhalations mixing oils and salt in a kettle and covering head with large towel. Or in a small room, bathroom (and having hot bath with water infused with sold and oils). 
those lozenges i have bought on lazada, so probably ebay also has. Same with toothpaste, mouthwash or any other. 

candy/sweets with strong menthol, eucaliptus. 
You can also rinse your nose cavity with salt and wash your tonsils with salt (use cotton wool on a pencil). Both for self-administration or ask somebody experienced for help. Probably instructional videos on youtube. 

Edited December 28, 2021 by internationalism

[jojothai]

UPDATE

i have the recovery certificate

been in Manchester Airport half the day. Telephone Also many hours.

QATAR AIRWAYS advise certificate is not being accepted

I thought SWISS may accept. They were good on THAI rules but still need negative PCR.

 

So finally except for Thai airways there is only 1 airline that I tried and said ok. That was emirates 

 

There is another option i found for routing from MAN. Go to CPH on easyJet and connect to thai airways there,

EasyJet appear to accept the recovery certificate,

but that route is no better than going to LHR for Thai airways.

 

while i was at MAN airport, I did another PCR.
Last throw of the dice. Get result about 2 am 29th UK time here

If positive I go to LHR early 29th morning to try get on TG911 

[TorquayFan]

Well Jojo - you get 4 x 10's from the judges for trying . . . .

 

TG911 direct is by far your best option IMO.

 

Good luck and wish you the best journey.

 

Let us know eh ?

[jojothai]

Totally new rules at thai check in.

With PCR positive they require 14 days after the date of recovery.

I rang thai airways a few days ago in bangkok and was assured i was ok.

The thai supervisor here was most helpful spoke to embassy and to the people dealing with it in thailand.

Second pcr test was positive.

I may have to try see if i can  try another PCR if i can get one in time.

Most are fully booked. I will check.

However it may be futile.

If i cannot fly tomorrow then i lose thailand pass. Then would have to apply for sandbox from flight on 11th january.

 

Edited December 29, 2021 by jojothai

[jojothai]

Thanks for the posts. Nightmare situation.
I am fully recovered, 4 days negative LF Tests but still was positive PCR.
using sprays for nose and mouth thanks Intl.

Its bad enough with all the rules for covid, but nonsense when organisations make up their own unpublished rules.
So i travelled down to heathrow from manchester only to have my hopes wrecked.
Despite all my effort checking i was totally FCKU'd,
Knackered as well from the stress and endless hours on telephone waiting to speak to airlines, and getting nowhere until i went to the check- ins and pushed the issue.

But, just when all was lost . .  .
I have managed to fly

I will update in a day or two after i land late on 30th and find out what happens when i get to bangkok.

[TorquayFan]

That's great for you Jojo - was that TG911 in the end ?

 

I was about to post some commiseration when I read of your triumph.

 

I have a Friend who application for the 'Pass' was rejected at the last moment because his expensive 'Insurance' didn't mention Covid on the front page ! He should have been flying now too but has deferred to Jan 5th coming now via Sandbox in Phuket and will arrive 'home' on Jan 15th ! More than 100 skiers were returned by Austria to the UK on arrival because their PCR's were -72 hours not the -48 hours they require. A poster here is stranded in RSA by the 'Red list'. It goes on and on. It's a bad time for most travellers.

 

You have been tenacious for sure and I wish you well on arrival.