Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital

[ozimoron]

This sounds like someone is backed into a corner...

------------------------------------------------------------

A Russian airstrike ripped apart a theater where hundreds of people have been living in the besieged city of Mariupol, Ukrainian officials said, as Russian President Vladimir Putin called for a “self-purification” to rid his country of anyone who questions his invasion.

 

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-putin-kyiv-europe-world-news-303fbd14ea7d3f131abc9b3d5739123f

Edited March 17, 2022 by ozimoron

[Hellfire]

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

The "cleansing of society" phrase he use's sounds like something coming out of Germany in 1941. The first person that needs to be purged is him, he's evil incarnate

 Even more so it reminds the rhetorics of the Great Purge in 1937-1938 in USSR when millions of innocent people were named the “Enemies of the People” and then killed and imprisoned. My two great-grandfathers were killed by NKVD (a precursor of KGB) during those times and I refuse to believe that something similar can happen again in the 21 century’s Russia. 
 

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by Hellfire

[ozimoron]

Doing business in a country without the rule of law can be pretty risky — as aircraft leasing companies are finding out.

The companies, many based in Ireland, leased 515 airplanes worth about $10 billion to Russian airlines. They may never get them back. On Monday, Russian President Vladimir Putin approved a law switching the jets over to the Russian airplane registry, making their return very difficult.

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-steal-billion-lease-aircraft-eu/

[Hellfire]

1 hour ago, Saanim said:

In all fairness, he also said:

“I want to say this for the first time: at the very beginning of the operation in Donbass, to avoid bloodshed, we asked the Kiev authorities through various channels to not engage in hostilities but simply withdraw their troops from Donbass. They didn’t want to,”  

WOW… This alone makes him the main candidate for the Nobel peace prize this year.

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by Hellfire

[Hummin]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Yes NATO can rather easily beat Putin if they choose with conventional warfare, but then will Putin use nukes? A very good chance. I've felt WW3 has already started a while back already. 

Three possibilities

 

Russians overtrow Putin 

Nato gamble on Putin will not use 

Ukraine continue the war against the russians until the end, and end up like Chechnya. Those who know their history, know how that will be. 

They could have chosen the Georgia solution, thats to late now! The Georgia solution is not right either, but as I have advocated before, based on civilian casualties, who can say that is an bad option. Like it or not, it saves lives.. 
 

Sometime you have to think a little bit further than right here and now! 
 

But the hard desktop warriors, doesnt think that was an option at all. What about now? Could it been an better solution after what we have experienced so far? Was it worth it for Chechnya? 
 

Chechnya Have a population of 1,4 million, Ukraine have a population of 40 million, 300 000 people died in Chechnya. How many will die in Ukraine?
 

We know Putin do not care, he will continue. There will not be a second chance for Ukraine, to much blood on both side already, there is no back for any of them. 
 

Sorry about the naming Hard core desk top warriors, but thats how it sounds to me. No one of you, or me have ever had to go to war, and been in a war as far i know. If some of you have been in the battlefield, tell me what you think based on your experience. I know people who have served in Libanon, Kosovo, and Afghanistan, and some special troopers many other places they never mentioned by name. All of them say you can not trust the media, and war is not how you think it is. It is much much worse then you ever can imagine. These guys is trained for it, they should know. 

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by Hummin

[Chris.B]

1 hour ago, Danderman123 said:

Zero about Russians in occupied areas being killed by insurgents. 

That's because, when the Russians see someone pointing a gun at them, their hands shoot up so fast there isn't time to kill them. 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Three possibilities

 

Russians overtrow Putin 

Nato gamble on Putin will not use 

Ukraine continue the war against the russians until the end, and end up like Chechnya. Those who know their history, know how that will be. 

They could have chosen the Georgia solution, thats to late now! The Georgia solution is not right either, but as I have advocated before, based on civilian casualties, who can say that is an bad option. Like it or not, it saves lives.. 
 

Sometime you have to think a little bit further than right here and now! 
 

But the hard desktop warriors, doesnt think that was an option at all. What about now? Could it been an better solution after what we have experienced so far? Was it worth it for Chechnya? 
 

Chechnya Have a population of 1,4 million, Ukraine have a population of 40 million, 300 000 people died in Chechnya. How many will die in Ukraine?
 

We know Putin do not care, he will continue. There will not be a second chance for Ukraine, to much blood on both side already, there is no back for any of them. 
 

Sorry about the naming Hard core desk top warriors, but thats how it sounds to me. No one of you, or me have ever had to go to war, and been in a war as far i know. If some of you have been in the battlefield, tell me what you think based on your experience. I know people who have served in Libanon, Kosovo, and Afghanistan, and some special troopers many other places they never mentioned by name. All of them say you can not trust the media, and war is not how you think it is. It is much much worse then you ever can imagine. These guys is trained for it, they should know. 

 

Putin is openly talking about ‘cleansing’ Russian society.

 

Perhaps Ukrainians don’t want to suffer the same fate.

 

As is their unequivocal right.

[Bkk Brian]

22 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Three possibilities

 

Russians overtrow Putin 

Nato gamble on Putin will not use 

Ukraine continue the war against the russians until the end, and end up like Chechnya. Those who know their history, know how that will be. 

They could have chosen the Georgia solution, thats to late now! The Georgia solution is not right either, but as I have advocated before, based on civilian casualties, who can say that is an bad option. Like it or not, it saves lives.. 
 

Sometime you have to think a little bit further than right here and now! 
 

But the hard desktop warriors, doesnt think that was an option at all. What about now? Could it been an better solution after what we have experienced so far? Was it worth it for Chechnya? 
 

Chechnya Have a population of 1,4 million, Ukraine have a population of 40 million, 300 000 people died in Chechnya. How many will die in Ukraine?
 

We know Putin do not care, he will continue. There will not be a second chance for Ukraine, to much blood on both side already, there is no back for any of them. 
 

Sorry about the naming Hard core desk top warriors, but thats how it sounds to me. No one of you, or me have ever had to go to war, and been in a war as far i know. If some of you have been in the battlefield, tell me what you think based on your experience. I know people who have served in Libanon, Kosovo, and Afghanistan, and some special troopers many other places they never mentioned by name. All of them say you can not trust the media, and war is not how you think it is. It is much much worse then you ever can imagine. These guys is trained for it, they should know. 

 

What a presumptuous post. As for your name calling and backhanded apology about it while still leaving it there ????

 

You also forgot a fourth option..............a negotiated settlement. However while Ukraine and the majority that want to stay there and fight for their land and freedom, anybody with any morals should be behind them all the way.

 

 

[sammieuk1]

2 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

3 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

Zero about Russians in occupied areas being killed by insurgents. 

Zero about Russians in occupied areas being killed by insurgents. 

There wont be they are indigenous ???? 

[Rimmer]

Off topic unattributed post also replies have been removed

[Hellfire]

3 hours ago, Saanim said:

In all fairness, he also said:

“I want to say this for the first time: at the very beginning of the operation in Donbass, to avoid bloodshed, we asked the Kiev authorities through various channels to not engage in hostilities but simply withdraw their troops from Donbass. They didn’t want to,”  

 I find some logical flaws in Putin’s words. If it was enough for him to de occupy Donbas only (the East part of the country) - then why did he start a full scale attack on the North and South of Ukraine? And what about his words right at the start of the aggression that his purpose is to demilitarize the whole Ukraine? Putin and his endless KGB-style lies. 
 

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by Hellfire

[tgw]

2 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Doing business in a country without the rule of law can be pretty risky — as aircraft leasing companies are finding out.

The companies, many based in Ireland, leased 515 airplanes worth about $10 billion to Russian airlines. They may never get them back. On Monday, Russian President Vladimir Putin approved a law switching the jets over to the Russian airplane registry, making their return very difficult.

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-steal-billion-lease-aircraft-eu/

anyway, covid will still impede normal airline operations in future and oil prices wont help either. 

what i see is useless planes being stolen, and which will then be repaid in gold from Russia's seized gold reserves. 

good luck maintaining the planes, btw. 

[JetsetBkk]

3 hours ago, Hummin said:

All of them say you can not trust the media, and war is not how you think it is

"The first casualty of war is the truth."

 

Often said, and never so obvious as when reading this thread.

[rudi49jr]

The Russian invasion of Ukraine has 'largely stalled on all fronts,' the UK Ministry of Defence has said.

 

https://www.gbnews.uk/news/russian-invasion-of-ukraine-has-largely-stalled-on-all-fronts-ministry-of-defence-says/249678

 

Apparently Putin is now also targeting scapegoats to blame this fiasco on, and a purge in the upper echelons of the FSB has started. 

[RJRS1301]

5 hours ago, Saanim said:

In all fairness, he also said:

“I want to say this for the first time: at the very beginning of the operation in Donbass, to avoid bloodshed, we asked the Kiev authorities through various channels to not engage in hostilities but simply withdraw their troops from Donbass. They didn’t want to,”  

So we will break rules of engagement on as many levels as well as we possibly can, start with hospitals , kindergartens, refugee convoys, civilians lining up for food, and the civilian residential complexes.

We not negotiate as we want to control seaports for our goods, and we will destroy your agriculture.

 

[metisdead]

An off topic post about Afghanistan has been removed.

[tgw]

About the Donetsk missile:

The missile strike on the centre of Donetsk was carried out from the territory of the Russian Federation - Conflict Intelligence Team

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/03/15/7331707/

 

 

 

[nauseus]

18 hours ago, Virt said:

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2022/03/russian-navy-landing-ships-seen-approaching-ukrainian-coast-near-odessa/

 

Hopefully the peace talks leads to something positive, before these Russian ships start to use whatever they might have in their arsenal.

 

Does Ukraine have something left for naval warfare?

Nothing in the Ukrainian fleet to be a match for the Russian Black Sea Fleet really. I didn't see any news of the corvette or small patrol boats being part of any action.

[rudi49jr]

7 hours ago, Saanim said:

In all fairness, he also said:

“I want to say this for the first time: at the very beginning of the operation in Donbass, to avoid bloodshed, we asked the Kiev authorities through various channels to not engage in hostilities but simply withdraw their troops from Donbass. They didn’t want to,”  

You’re having a laugh, right? Are you seriously trying to tell me it would be okay if your neighbor came to your house and asked you to vacate your living room because he wanted to occupy it? And then afterwards the neighbor can defend his action by saying that he did come to your house to ask you to withdraw from the living room, and you didn’t want to, so he had no choice but to use force.
That’s a very special kind of insane logic, don’t you think?

[nauseus]

17 hours ago, Virt said:

Not only landing ships according to the article.

Also some Slava class cruise ship and that's definitely not just a landing ship.

 

https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/02/meet-the-slava-class-the-russian-navys-most-powerful-cruisers/

 

 

Cruiser. This is a cruise ship:

 

[nauseus]

12 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Russia is not the only country which makes quality vodka, and have not drunk Russian Vodka for years

Yep. Thanks be to Latvia for my Stoli.

[sammieuk1]

Beware of any peace now or ever with pathological liars ????

 

The "peace talks" is a tool of choice for Moscow when conducting offensives. The negotiations can last as long as possible while regrouping forces and building a wartime administration in areas of control. The Kremlin has no intention of withdrawing or giving concessions. 

[Saanim]

6 hours ago, Hellfire said:

WOW… This alone makes him the main candidate for the Nobel peace prize this year.

What's so strange? Hasn 't Obama been also decorated before he started 7 wars? 

And another laureate Ahmed Abiy, Ethiopia's PM is also permanently involved in a war,  what's the problem?

[JetsetBkk]

1 hour ago, rudi49jr said:

Are you seriously trying to tell me it would be okay if your neighbor came to your house and asked you to vacate your living room because he wanted to occupy it? And then afterwards the neighbor can defend his action by saying that he did come to your house to ask you to withdraw from the living room, and you didn’t want to, so he had no choice but to use force.

Depends if my neighbour had 3.6 million of his relatives already living there.

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, sammieuk1 said:

Beware of any peace now or ever with pathological liars ????

 

The "peace talks" is a tool of choice for Moscow when conducting offensives. The negotiations can last as long as possible while regrouping forces and building a wartime administration in areas of control. The Kremlin has no intention of withdrawing or giving concessions. 

Re group and bring in the Syrian terrorists.............

 

Ukraine’s military intelligence: Syria to provide Russia with 40,000 mercenaries. Some 150 Syrians were transferred to Russia to take part in its war against Ukraine on March 15; up to 300 are ordered to be sent to Ukraine every day.

 

More weapons and military equipment are planned to be transferred from Syria to Russia and Belarus soon, Ukraine’s military intelligence reports. According to the report, some Syrian mercenaries see this as an opportunity for illegal immigration to the EU.

Edited March 17, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[jollyhangmon]

Zelenskyy against Putin: Whose truth is stronger? | To the Point - DW News

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rge9Bd6fsb0

 

[Bkk Brian]

5 hours ago, JetsetBkk said:

"The first casualty of war is the truth."

 

Often said, and never so obvious as when reading this thread.

Let me add one to the list for you:

 

At todays Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs Briefing, Russian thinking it can create a new reality........

 

"Russian armed forces do not bombard Ukrainian cities and everybody knows this"

[impulse]

8 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Doing business in a country without the rule of law can be pretty risky — as aircraft leasing companies are finding out.

The companies, many based in Ireland, leased 515 airplanes worth about $10 billion to Russian airlines. They may never get them back. On Monday, Russian President Vladimir Putin approved a law switching the jets over to the Russian airplane registry, making their return very difficult.

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-steal-billion-lease-aircraft-eu/

Which rule of law allows EU nations to steal $600million yachts from private citizens?

 

Can't have it both ways.

[ozimoron]

25 minutes ago, impulse said:

Which rule of law allows EU nations to steal $600million yachts from private citizens?

 

Can't have it both ways.

Private citizens? Or accomplices in war crimes?

 

Russians have up to $213 billion stashed offshore in Swiss banks

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russians-have-up-213-billion-stashed-offshore-swiss-banks-2022-03-17/

Edited March 17, 2022 by ozimoron

[ozimoron]

Russian forces in Ukraine are blasting cities and killing civilians but no longer making progress on the ground

 

Putin, who ordered Russia's invasion on Feb. 24, showed little sign of relenting.

In a vituperative televised speech, he inveighed against "traitors and scum" at home who helped the West, and said the Russian people would spit them out like gnats.

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/shells-hit-theatre-sheltering-ukraine-civilians-biden-calls-putin-war-criminal-2022-03-17/

Edited March 17, 2022 by ozimoron