My main gripe with Thailand. Why I am so <deleted> at the Thais and why I ultimately left.

[NanaSomchai]

So there we are, I am what you could call a quite prolific poster on these forums and while it is all fun and games, it is time for me to admit and publicly acknowledge that the very large majority of my posts have an underlying negative tone when it comes to anything Thai.

 

People are quick to judge, people are quick to jump the bandwagon, the hate train or whatever you want to call it, so I feel it is now time for me to share the reasons why I have left the Kingdom just as the pandemic blew up, apologies for the poor choice of vocabulary/messed up grammar, not a native English speaker, you'll have to bear with me.

 

My first Thai wife and I, as she was from a rural issan village of course she asked me to buy her a chunk of land and build her a home, to which back then, I felt obligated to do, so I did.

 

As we slowly settled in the village life, at first we (even though I should say, I) became the village's curiosity, many of the older villagers having never met a farang in real life, etc, so for a couple of months, we became quite a curiosity, neighbors would pay us visits from time to time and everything was for the best, we were the new attraction everyone was talking about in the village.

 

I did my best to do friends with everyone and really thought that at some point things would eventually "work out", people would stop seeing me as a "farang".

 

Anyway fast forward to about roughly 6 months after settling in, in the village there were a few roaming abandoned dogs that every villagers knew, including this very old mangy female dog nicknamed by everyone "nan", every villagers in the village knew "nan" but no one cared, that poor dog was covered in mange, fleas all over her body and no one cared, not one single villager would either take "nan" in during storms, feed her, or anything, villagers just didn't care, as far as I'm concerned that dog could have died yesterday, tomorrow or the next day, it would have made zero differences to the ongoing village life.

 

Now, I'm not much of an animal person, I'm more of a cat person, I like petting them once in a while but certainly not to the point I would care for them or "own" one (although I'm against the idea of "owning" an animal, any animals, but that's another debate and that's for another day), so dogs are really not my thing, let alone the fact I was bitten by one at a very young age, so anyways, not a dog person.

 

However after settling in the village for a couple of months and seeing that abused, beaten, fleabag poorly roaming the village and passing by "my" house everyday, I started to feel bad for "nan" and anger inside of me started to slowly build up towards the other villagers, as far as I'm concerned even the youngest village kids knew "nan" for the entirety of their life in this World, yet no one cared, when I asked the wife "why don't the villagers take care of that sick old dog?" she kept shrugging at the whole ordeal and was like "what is going on you and this dog???" which later turned to be a very heated topic in our relationship.

 

I don't know why but I eventually got emotionally attached to that poor dog and at the same time could not understand, fathom or comprehend why no one in the village would even care? Are Thai people this selfish I thought to myself?

 

Just outside our house we had a large water pipe coming into our house with a very tiny leak, so tiny that it barely leaks 1 liter per day, it was at a point where it would have cost us more money to pay a "qualified plumber" to fix it rather than letting it leak, so the wife and I, decided to let it leak, then an idea sprung into my mind, since it's leaking anyway... why not buy a cheap dog bowl and let the leak go to good use?

 

The bowl cost me a whopping 45 baht at the local supermarket, the wife got upset. She really did. "Why are you spending our money on useless things like this plastic dog bowl??? It's not even our dog??? It's not our business!!!" she kept screaming and arguing at me, to which I replied "fine, it's not our business? okay then tell me, who's business it is then? who does this old dog belong to? how can people do this to their own animals?" more arguing ensued.

 

Anyway as we got back to the village, I installed the newly bought bowl under the pipe leak and "nan" the old dog noticed it, the poor animal kept coming back to our house regularly to quench it's thirst, then the next week I bought a second plastic bowl and added food to it, not dog food but just leftovers that we had sometimes, the wife got even more mad at me and told me "you see what you did? do you understand?", I was confused and puzzled at why was it such a big deal? In my mind all I had done was buying two plastic bowls and throwing food and water at it a couple of times per week, I could not see any wrongdoings or any mishaps.

 

The wife then argued and told me "Now that you are officially feeding this dog food and water and that the entire village has caught on, they are considering it is YOUR dog, so if that dog goes biting anyone in the village or causes a motorbike accident or anything, it will be OUR problem! People will come to see us! Kick the dog outside of our yard and close the gate" she said to me.

 

I was shocked at how selfish and so centric people could be? I thought to myself.

 

From that point, days passed, days eventually became weeks, weeks would become months and so forth, not a single incident with "nan" the dog... or should I say... "our" dog at this point? Read on...

 

Fast forward to about a year and half later, the wife got used to the dog but wouldn't approach her, no one in the village cared, "nan" the dog was weak and would stay hidden under one of our cement tables in our yard as if it was it's kennel.

 

We received a call from our lawyer from Pattaya, we had to leave the village and travel to Pattaya for about two weeks to sign documents related to the sale of one of our rental homes and eventually prospect for a condominium, so these two weeks were so to speak "incompressible", we just had to be in Pattaya for roughly two weeks, there was no way I would bring the dog with us, so I filled the bowls myself to the brim and we left for Pattaya.

 

As we arrived in Pattaya, the next evening, the wife received a call on LINE from one of her relatives and friends in the village informing us that "our" dog had passed away, I was saddened that I wasn't there to live it's last moments but at the same time, again, this never was officially my dog, so it felt like I was sitting between two chairs, but still it did sting (and again I'm the opposite of a dog lover, I'm just a guy trying to do the right thing).

 

When the wife asked how did the dog pass away? The person on LINE replied "oh well nothing, it died in your yard right next to the bowls, the leaking water pipe and the "pi baan", the house ghost" so nothing has happened to the dog, it only died of age.

 

Then I told the wife, fine "tell them to pick up the corpse, go to the very back of our land, near that big tree and tell them to bury the corpse there", the wife apparently relayed the message just fine, then the other person on LINE replied "sure, for 3,000 baht I'll do it".

 

And that was it, I was in shock, I could not believe what I had just been told, the wife turned to me looked at me straight in the eyes and said the most cruel thing I have ever heard in my life "You killed this dog. You were responsible for it. I told you not to care about that old dog, you just wouldn't listen, now the entire village says it's OUR dog and that we have to PAY for it, plus it died in our yard! This is your fault.".

 

I was shocked, not only I was saddened like you would imagine,  but then on top of that my Thai wife who should have been my main support was instead stabbing me playing the "I told you so card", she was obsessed with the fact she was being asked 3,000 baht to bury the body of "our" deceased dog which wasn't even ours to begin with much more so than the death of animal itself.

 

I looked at her straight in the eyes and said "Look at this face, there is no way, NO WAY I will ever pay to get that dog buried, it's inhumane and it's just not happening, not in this lifetime, not in the next one for something that should essentially be FREE".

 

We hang up and kept asking through LINE to other relatives and villagers if someone would do it for free? No one felt like doing it unless I was willing to pay for said favor, we even reached out to the head of the village, he essentially said "that was your dog, it died on your property, it's your problem", to after insisting and insisting and insisting someone finally had the nerve to tell me "farang must pay".

 

Basically I was being asked to pay money to burry a dog which wasn't mine to begin with and I was expected to be the one to pay simply because I was a farang.

 

I felt ashamed that villagers that I thought I knew, people that I had esteem for, people that were our friends, our family, our neighbors would be willing to pull such a nasty trick on us or should I say on me, simply because I am a farang and the "farang must pay" must prevail above all else.

 

So, we were stuck in Pattaya in the middle of real estate affairs, there was no way we were either flying or driving back to the village just to bury that dog so we stayed in Pattaya and rushed the lawyers appointments and the signatures and whatnot, what initially would be a 14 days trip business trip to Pattaya was done under 9 days, as we were driving back to the village, the wife and I did not exchange a single word, the atmosphere in the car was extremely strange, during the entire time I thought to myself "we've been gone for 9 days, the dog has been dead for 8 days surely someone must have taken the task to himself, right?".

 

Boy I was wrong, as we arrived and I opened the gate, I was met with a true vision of horror, as if losing "your" dog isn't harsh enough as it is... imagine having to deal with the corpse of your dead dog decaying for at least 8 days... I will not get into specifics here, but everything is a vision of horror. I... carried... the decaying remnants of that dog and buried it the best I could in the back of our house against my wife's will.

 

The very same evening I rushed to 7/11, I bought alcohol and drank more than I should have (I'm not a drinker, I never drink), that night I roamed the entire village completely drunk to boot yelling at the entire village "f-word you", "f-word you", "f-word you", I gave them all the middle finger, almost ended up exchanging fists with one of the villagers, thankfully it didn't go that far, it would have been very bad for me, I think.

 

The next day I left the wife, I left the village, about a week later I filled for divorce and I didn't even wait for court or anything, I flew out of the Kingdom.

 

To me, the selfishness I had witnessed on that day, the anger that was boiling and building inside of me all these months seeing villagers having no mercy for a life all that while asking me to pay 3,000 baht just to bury "nan" trying to extort us of something that was not our responsibility (again remember, not officially our dog) and something that should essentially been free, tells me everything I know about the Thais in general:

 

I see them for what they truly are: Farang must pay, Not my problem, and Money, Money, Money.

 

I'll probably never return to Thailand.

 

This is my story.

 

To... My... Dog.

 

Edited February 25, 2022 by NanaSomchai

[BritManToo]

Metal illness is easy for foreigners to find in rural Thai villages.

[NanaSomchai]

5 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Metal illness is easy for foreigners to find in rural Thai villages.

Excuse me?

[Thailand]

Prolific poster?

[KannikaP]

I am sure the dog incident isn't the only reason you have divorced, left Thailand. But I do sympathise with you. 12 years here is getting a bit difficult.

Thais do not see further than directly in front of them, even then not taking notice which is shown in their attitude to litter & rubbish.. 

[CharlieH]

Seems to me, the story of the dog was the "last straw" and that event became the catalyst to release many other things. It gave you the reason or excuse to vent and to leave.

 

The content doesnt surprise me at all.

Hope you find peace and happiness wherver you choose to lay your hat.

[Mutt Daeng]

If you really cared for the dog, you would have taken the time to bury it yourself and not be whining about having to pay someone to do the job for you.

<deleted> knows what you would be like if you had a REAL problem to deal with.

Have a nice day.

Edited February 25, 2022 by Mutt Daeng

[NanaSomchai]

1 minute ago, Mutt Daeng said:

If you really cared for the dog, you would have taken the time to bury it yourself and not be whining about having to pay someone to do the job for you.

Did you even read? We were not in the village when our dog passed away, we were 790km away right in the middle of a business trip?

 

How would I have possibly buried it 790km away?

 

Please...

 

[OneMoreFarang]

19 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

My first Thai wife and I, as she was from a rural issan village of course she asked me to buy her a chunk of land and build her a home, to which back then, I felt obligated to do, so I did.

 

It's sad to read your and Nan's story and I understand that is very upsetting and sad for you. It's upsetting and sad to read it.

I think by now you know that what happens when cultures clash. Thais, and especially Thai women, and especially Thai villagers have very different values from the average farang. I don't want to be judgmental about all the difference. Fact is there are huge differences and fact is that you lived in a Thai village and you were obviously not prepared to adjust your living and your values to that of the Thai villagers.

I am sure you think what they did was bad and strange. At the same time I am also sure that they think similar about you.

Who is to blame? Does it really matter?

Fact is that they and their lifestyle and not compatible to you and your lifestyle. I think you should never have settled down in that village or maybe even in Thailand.

Lots of things are very different in Thailand. Like it or not, I guess if you want to live here in peace then you/we have to adjust. After all, we are in Thailand and we can't expect that all Thais take on our values and our lifestyle.

 

All the best for you!

 

[Andre0720]

WOW.

I do share all of what you describe here. All.

I have seen the same. Dogs sick, no more hair, scratching all the time. The owner, the neighbors, all of them would not care.

And as Mahatma Gandhi expressed it:

Mahatma Gandhi acutely observed that "the greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated."

And in some countries, we could easily add: "By the way they treat their own kind".

Thanks

Regards

 

[NanaSomchai]

9 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

It's sad to read your and Nan's story and I understand that is very upsetting and sad for you. It's upsetting and sad to read it.

I think by now you know that what happens when cultures clash. Thais, and especially Thai women, and especially Thai villagers have very different values from the average farang. I don't want to be judgmental about all the difference. Fact is there are huge differences and fact is that you lived in a Thai village and you were obviously not prepared to adjust your living and your values to that of the Thai villagers.

I am sure you think what they did was bad and strange. At the same time I am also sure that they think similar about you.

Who is to blame? Does it really matter?

Fact is that they and their lifestyle and not compatible to you and your lifestyle. I think you should never have settled down in that village or maybe even in Thailand.

Lots of things are very different in Thailand. Like it or not, I guess if you want to live here in peace then you/we have to adjust. After all, we are in Thailand and we can't expect that all Thais take on our values and our lifestyle.

 

All the best for you!

 

I appreciate your post, I really sincerely do.

 

However it doesn't excuse people asking me money to do something that essentially would have been free and the right thing to do. I'm not trying to sound all righteous here and not trying to paint every Thai as a bad person but I feel like I must ask the question:

 

Where does the greed end?

 

In every countries and cultures I have visited (and back in my younger days I have extensively visited exotic places like Morocco to give you a rough example), anyone of any cultural, ethnic, religious, academic background would understand that burying a corpse for free is the right thing to do rather than letting it rot under the blistering sun.

 

Instead they deliberately chose willing fully to leave a corpse to rot under the sun for the entire duration of our trip, (I often asked myself; what if we had gone for a whopping month?) without caring because we wouldn't pay for it.

 

And again I am 100% convinced here the only reason why they have asked us to pay money instead of doing it for free is because I'm a farang and therefore they assume I have money.

 

Where does the greed end? Where? Just tell me where?

 

Edited February 25, 2022 by NanaSomchai

[NanaSomchai]

6 minutes ago, Andre0720 said:

And as Mahatma Gandhi expressed it:

Mahatma Gandhi acutely observed that "the greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated."

And in some countries, we could easily add: "By the way they treat their own kind".

Thank you so much for your post. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[Golden Triangle]

Lesson number one, never get involved in anything to do with animal welfare, we have a Soi dog that lives in our soi, it's noisy, scabby, and a bloody nuisance, I ignore it, hopefully it will die very soon

Edited February 25, 2022 by onthedarkside
trolling comment removed

[mikebike]

Before I comment I need some clarification: in your 3rd paragraph you said, "My first Thai wife..." then, at the end of the story you say, "The next day I left the wife, I left the village, about a week later I filled for divorce and I didn't even wait for court or anything, I flew out of the Kingdom."

 

I know English is not your first language, how could you have a "first Thai wife" without ever having a second?

[G Rex]

OP , I understand your sorrow and despair with regards to 'Nan' - and the whole issue.

However I do feel your reaction to this matter seems somewhat extreme.

I think you must have had numerous triggers bugging you - but 'Nan' was the outlet.

As OMF said above - it would seem that you were not 'flexible' enough to have a rural Thai lifestyle.

[NanaSomchai]

Just now, mikebike said:

Before I comment I need some clarification: in your 3rd paragraph you said, "My first Thai wife..." then, at the end of the story you say, "The next day I left the wife, I left the village, about a week later I filled for divorce and I didn't even wait for court or anything, I flew out of the Kingdom."

 

I know English is not your first language, how could you have a "first Thai wife" without ever having a second?

The second one we talk on LINE everyday. We were together my last week in Thailand. She wants to get married and come to Europe (which I'm against). Now you know.

[Sparktrader]

Its a dog. Sure sad but adults have to deal with death. I read 10%. Such drama.

 

Find another town.

[KannikaP]

5 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

The second one we talk on LINE everyday. We were together my last week in Thailand. She wants to get married and come to Europe (which I'm against). Now you know.

LINE does not a relationship make. She wants to get married....but DO YOU? Dog or no dog.

[OneMoreFarang]

6 minutes ago, NanaSomchai said:

I appreciate your post, I really sincerely do.

 

However it doesn't excuse people asking me money to do something that essentially would have been free and the right thing to do. I'm not trying to sound all righteous here and not trying to paint every Thai as a bad person but I feel like I must ask the question:

 

Where does the greed end?

 

In every countries and cultures I have visited (and back in my younger days I have extensively visited exotic places like Morocco to give you a rough example), anyone of any cultural, ethnic, religious, academic background would understand that burying a corpse for free is the right thing to do rather than letting it rot under the blistering sun.

 

Instead they deliberately chose willing fully to leave a corpse to rot under the sun for the entire duration of our trip, (I often asked myself; what if we had gone for a whopping month?) without caring because we wouldn't pay for it.

 

And again I am 100% convinced here the only reason why they have asked us to pay money instead of doing it for free is because I'm a farang and therefore they assume I have money.

 

Where does the greed end? Where? Just tell me where?

 

I understand what you write and basically I agree with you.

But what I learned over the years in Thailand is that there are many things which every Thai person just knows. Some of these things can be explained to farangs, some not.

 

The following is just me making up a story to give you an example of what I mean. Maybe, just maybe the whole village was convinced that Nan the dog was an incarnation of maybe a murderer in that village. Maybe the murderer hanged himself and was reborn as a dog. And obviously nobody liked that murderer/dog. And it would be useless to even try to explain that to that ignorant farang. Everybody knows it and he will never understand it. 

So they let the dog die and they didn't care. And nobody wanted to have anything to do with that incarnated murderer.

Is this story true? Very likely it's not true. But it could be true. And it would be one of those typical Thai stories which only Thais understand.

I am pretty sure they had some kind of reasoning why they did what they did. But apparently they didn't think you would understand.

It's sad but after all, TiT!

 

 

[The Hammer2021]

We adopted an old pregnant bitch, a desert dog, a pie dog in Libya on the oil refinery and it had puppies which we fed mother and all. One time when we were all leave we came back to find all the pups gone and the mother pretty depressed. It soon became apparent that the pups had been taken, killed cooked and eaten by the Philippino workers. They had just been waiting for us to fatten up the pups.

We didn't dwell on it. The OP's story seems to be about inappropriate behaviour and obsession with a dog. He should have listened to his wife and not interfered in the natural order of things in the village. He is right to return home. He seems to have learned nothing by his experience except confirmation of his own prejudices. I believe  the dog was an 'unlucky' dog and the villagers knew it as did his wife. Has the OP read any Somerset Maughan or Christopher Moore?

[Mutt Daeng]

When you live in a small village in Isaan, if you feed and water a Soi dog, as far as the locals are concerned, that is now YOUR dog. This is what your wife was trying to tell you. That's probably why no one else lifted a finger. I'm not making excuses or trying to be nasty, thats just the way it is. You are clearly not suited to Isaan village life, not many people are.

[FritsSikkink]

Don't know why you are moaning about others not taking care. According to your story you never did a proper job on it yourself.

[clivebaxter]

Dogs again, nothing but trouble all round ????

[The Hammer2021]

9 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I understand what you write and basically I agree with you.

But what I learned over the years in Thailand is that there are many things which every Thai person just knows. Some of these things can be explained to farangs, some not.

 

The following is just me making up a story to give you an example of what I mean. Maybe, just maybe the whole village was convinced that Nan the dog was an incarnation of maybe a murderer in that village. Maybe the murderer hanged himself and was reborn as a dog. And obviously nobody liked that murderer/dog. And it would be useless to even try to explain that to that ignorant farang. Everybody knows it and he will never understand it. 

So they let the dog die and they didn't care. And nobody wanted to have anything to do with that incarnated murderer.

Is this story true? Very likely it's not true. But it could be true. And it would be one of those typical Thai stories which only Thais understand.

I am pretty sure they had some kind of reasoning why they did what they did. But apparently they didn't think you would understand.

It's sad but after all, TiT!

 

 

I read the story and immediately knew this was dog had bad luck and the villagers knew this. They were right.

[NanaSomchai]

2 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

When you live in a small village in Isaan, if you feed and water a Soi dog, as far as the locals are concerned, that is now YOUR dog.

But it wasn't OUR dog back then.

 

2 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

This is what your wife was trying to tell you. That's probably why no one else lifted a finger.

So what you are saying is that by Thai issan standards it's deemed perfectly acceptable not to lift a finger, not get involved and let a roaming animal, starve to death.

 

3 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

That's probably why no one else lifted a finger. I'm not making excuses or trying to be nasty, thats just the way it is. You are clearly not suited to Isaan village life, not many people are.

I believe this isn't limited to the Issan village life based on the hordes of dogs roaming medium sized Thai cities and Thai beaches too roaming in large pack.

 

I guess you somehow must be right hence why I have left the Kingdom in the end.

 

[Andre0720]

35 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

If you really cared for the dog, you would have taken the time to bury it yourself and not be whining about having to pay someone to do the job for you.

<deleted> knows what you would be like if you had a REAL problem to deal with.

Have a nice day.

Hehe. Must be careful how you word your thoughts on this one.

Perhaps you would not want readers thinking that you share the same genetic flaws as these people as described above.

You would not want that now would you?

[NanaSomchai]

6 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Don't know why you are moaning about others not taking care. According to your story you never did a proper job on it yourself.

Did what I could... against my wife's will and much better than the entire village at least. That has to count for something.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

I think in relationships and in life we have our ' I am as mad as hell and I aren't going to take it anymore' moments. 

I wouldn't have minded that someone tried to get the 3000, that's human nature, but then for them to just leave the dog there to rot, and for the wife not to support you at all, shows a lack of respect. 

If there is some backstory about ghosts or whatever couldn't she just tell you. Even if it made no sense to her couldn't she see it was important to you. Life's too short. It sounds like you weren't happy with her out there and maybe she wasn't happy too.

I think it would take a special woman well suited to you to make life out there happy. 

[Mutt Daeng]

Just now, Andre0720 said:

Hehe. Must be careful how you word your thoughts on this one.

Perhaps you would not want readers thinking that you share the same genetic flaws as these people as described above.

You would not want that now would you?

Not sure what you mean. I believe in plain speaking. Please elaborate.

[EVENKEEL]

To the OP - I ordinarily wouldn't read a long post as yours, but I read every word and it was an awesomely sad story. I'm happy I no longer live in a small isaan village, I moved. 

 

I'm surprised your wife's family wouldn't take care of the dog while you were gone. Anyway, good luck.